[Vision2020] Dispel the anti-growth myth
Paul Rumelhart
godshatter at yahoo.com
Thu Nov 1 21:52:49 PDT 2007
Donovan,
I'm glad to hear that. I, too, think that taking food, medicine, and
educational supplies is wrong. I would have to modify that a little to
cover basic necessities, as I think that taxing take-out pizza or exotic
luxury foods is fine, as is taxing computers even though they may be
considered an "educational supply".
I would also like to hear more about Mr. Ament's reasons for changing
his mind on this issue. What was it, specifically, that made him change
his views? If anyone knows or can point us in that direction, that would
be great.
Paul
Donovan Arnold wrote:
> Paul,
> I change my mind all the time. When I was in student government I
> remember changing my mind on an important issue, the support of the 1
> cent increase on sales tax. Almost all of my colleagues supported it
> because we were told the money would help the UI. When I ran for
> office, I said I supported it because it was a 1% tax and it would
> increase UI revenue because the state government gives 15% of its
> income to college.
> I later changed my mind because I realized two important things, the
> highest cost to students is daily living costs. Every penny you take
> out in a loan, you got to repay with interest. Taxing people on food
> and needed items is wrong.
> The second reason was that I found out the State Legislature might not
> give us our 15% but use the taxes for a tax cut for others. So I voted
> against the Student body resolution. It didn't stop the resolution,
> but it kept the UI and ASUI Presidents from going to the Governor and
> saying the student representatives are unanimously in support of the
> tax increase, which was the plan. I thought for sure some students
> would be mad at me. But instead I was actually thanked by many
> students, and one even wrote a letter to the Argonaut. My vote was
> later vindicated because the State legislature did pass the tax and
> cut the funding for education, hurting students financial, as I
> suspected they would. I still oppose that tax on food, medicine, and
> educational supplies.
> So I understand that. But I didn't do it for political reasons. I did
> it because it was right, and the majority of the other Senators and
> the UI administration at the time were opposed to my vote.
> My concern here is that it seems really politically convenient for
> this switch about something he was so strongly opposed to just short a
> while ago.
> Perhaps Aaron can give us the reasons why he was opposed and now
> supports the Alturas project. That I think is key to understand the
> validity of his conversion.
> Best,
> Donovan
>
> */Paul Rumelhart <godshatter at yahoo.com>/* wrote:
>
> Donovan,
>
> I think it all depends on why he changed his mind. I wouldn't want a
> candidate that changed their views every time they wanted to impress
> someone or every time the wind changed direction, and I wouldn't
> want a
> candidate who can't ever understand the impacts well enough not to
> have
> to contradict themselves every so often when they learn some new fact.
>
> However, people are human. If you hold a view based on a certain
> level
> of research and with certain values in mind, what do you do when you
> learn more about it and come across something that you hadn't
> considered
> before that changes your view on it? I think it takes a certain
> amount
> of courage to admit that your earlier stance was wrong, and that you
> have changed your mind based on the following reasons, blah, blah,
> blah.
>
> The flip side of that is: I wouldn't want to elect a candidate that
> stuck to their earlier beliefs even when they know they are wrong
> simply
> because they don't want to look like a candidate that "waffles".
> Damn,
> now I'm hungry.
>
> I would lay some of our current woes as a country at the feet of a
> President that refuses to rethink his position. Of course, that's
> just
> my opinion.
>
> Paul
>
> Donovan Arnold wrote:
> > BJ,
> > So he was elected holding one view, then changed his mind after
> > getting elected. Are you certain he won't change his mind later
> after
> > being surrounded by people that are opposed to it?
> > Would you support his campaign if he changed his mind again on
> the issue?
> > Best,
> > Donovan
> >
> > */"B. J. Swanson" /* wrote:
> >
> > Donovan,
> >
> > Aaron Ament does not oppose Alturas Technology Park and wants to
> > explore the possibility of expanding into a Phase III.
> >
> > After first opposing Alturas, Aaron voluntarily attended several
> > Latah Economic Development Council meetings and talked with many
> > people. With an open mind, he learned what a valuable resource
> > Alturas was to the community.
> >
> > Here's a great example of a City Councilman willing to take the
> > time to listen, learn and make well informed decisions.
> >
> > B. J. Swanson
> >
> > ------------
> >
> > On Nov 1, 2007, at 11:36 AM, Donovan Arnold
> >
> > > wrote:
> >
> >> Tom I,
> >> The composition of members of the City Council changes almost
> >> monthly, if not yearly. I don't think it is so much the
> >> individuals as it is the policies. The current City Council
> >> members that are running again strongly support economic policies
> >> that have stifled growth in Moscow and opposed ones that would
> >> significantly improve it. Aaron Ament, for example, strongly
> >> opposed the Alturas Project and expansion.
> >> Do you agree of disagree with his position? If you agree, why do
> >> you think this project should be stopped from expanding?
> >> You cannot have change if we keep electing the same people over
> >> and over again that keep enforcing the same bad policies over and
> >> over again.
> >> Remember;
> >> “The definition of insanity is doing the same thing over and
> >> over again and expecting different resultsâ€. -----Albert Einstein
> >> Best,
> >> Donovan
> >>
> >> */Tom Ivie >/*
> >> wrote:
> >>
> >> ...and just over 2 yrs ago was a different city council and Mayor
> >>
> >> */baukunst at moscow.com /* wrote:
> >>
> >> My wife & I left Moscow just over 2 years ago because of
> >> the business
> >> climate, limited available opportunities, and looking for
> >> a change of
> >> scenery. I understand Moscow businesses to operate just
> >> fine if your
> >> clientele are UI student, staff, or faculty; or are out
> >> of the area - there
> >> is a very limited population to find a maket niche in
> >> otherwise. To depend
> >> upon the local pop. is too limiting for very many. Others
> >> followed suit
> >> and left the Palouse around the same time we did because
> >> of its
> >> self-imposed limits. It could be more, but...
> >>
> >> Moscow development seems to limit itself to supplying
> >> current resident
> >> needs. It does not want to draw attention to itself and
> >> attract others to
> >> the area. In the 27 years I witnessed, it has done so
> >> because of a
> >> "mentality" of "do the minimum to get by." Its agrarian
> >> background is
> >> strong and will subside, but it is still highly
> >> ingrained. Frugality is
> >> too progressive. The Palouse is progressive in thought -
> >> actions say the
> >> opposite.
> >>
> >> Looking towards the future, Moscow will not want to
> >> change from its past.
> >> It will not seek to build upon the UI resource(s) to
> >> attract more people
> >> and attention. High-tech jobs maytrickle in because of
> >> the quality of
> >> life, but it is tightly controlled by the forces the
> >> above subject line
> >> means to rebuke. Why move there when other places are
> >> more well known?
> >> What does it have to offer that CO, AZ, or OR & WA don't?
> >> Most would
> >> likely head to Boise first anyway, unless only the UI had it.
> >>
> >> "Free market" forces bring Moscow's slow growth rate.
> >> Christ Church
> >> results from the free market and the willing buyers of
> >> belivers. Condos
> >> along the UI golf course will come when the 'boomer
> >> market demands. "Free
> >> market" forces will bring a pedestrian overpass at 3rd &
> >> TriState.
> >> Building upon the available creative resources has as
> >> more common sense
> >> than the no-brainer "attract high-tech."
> >>
> >> I don't belive the "free market" is wise, nor do I trust
> >> it. The "free
> >> market" is part of a larger system and as such it is
> >> influenced by forces
> >> beyond the local market. What happens in Moscow, ID is
> >> not totally out of
> >> control, but it is beyond local influence only. The local
> >> political
> >> election changes people, it does not change the system.
> >>
> >> As long as there is gravity, water will seek equilibrium.
> >> It might
> >> overshoot past being sustainable, but it will find a
> >> usable level.
> >> Development levels will follow water too. Although
> >> development can be
> >> retrofitted to fit consumption levels that should have
> >> been implemented
> >> initially.
> >>
> >> Anyway, I hope the UI condos are in-place in 5 years so I
> >> can move back and
> >> retire in comfort; not having to be concerned about
> >> making a living in
> >> Moscow, ID. As long as there are students serving up
> >> lattes & bagles or
> >> crumpets and tea, I should be just fine, then, cheerio.
> >>
> >> Mark Seman, Architect
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >> ---------------------------------------------
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> >>
> >> Tom & Liz Ivie
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