[Vision2020] Correct Rent for my House

Tue May 1 20:57:06 PDT 2007

If there IS a housing shortage, why is it that the reality companies are 
showing anywhere from 15-30% vacancy rate?

Again, your figures are not supported by anything but your own words.  
Suppose for you that's good enough, but for most folks it just isn't.

J  :]

>From: Donovan Arnold <donovanjarnold2005 at yahoo.com>
>To: Tom Hansen <thansen at moscow.com>, "'Nick Gier'" <ngier at uidaho.edu>
>CC: vision2020 at moscow.com
>Subject: Re: [Vision2020] Correct Rent for my House
>Date: Tue, 1 May 2007 18:57:43 -0700 (PDT)
>
>Tom,
>
>   You are confusing fair market rate with affordable. We do not have 
>enough formation to ascertain the value of Nick Gier's particular rental 
>property or your apartment. We do however, know what is affordable housing 
>and we can fairly access that $1500 a month is well beyond an affordable 
>rate for families where one or more parent is a full time student.
>
>   Affordable housing is about 30% of a person's income, including w,s, and 
>g.
>
>   Fair market rate is what the market will bear.
>
>   These are totally different criteria. We are not debating fair market 
>values, but if the market is affordable for college families.
>
>   Moscow has artificially inflated housing prices because of the college 
>and community leaders unwillingness to build enough houses. Moscow has the 
>least number of housing units per resident in the state.
>
>   Best,
>
>   Donovan
>
>   "Why doesn't the Co-Op have a psycho welcome guy?" --Tom Hansen, April 
>27, 2007
>
>Tom Hansen <thansen at moscow.com> wrote:
>         v\:* {behavior:url(#default#VML);}  o\:* 
>{behavior:url(#default#VML);}  w\:* {behavior:url(#default#VML);}  .shape 
>{behavior:url(#default#VML);}        st1\:*{behavior:url(#default#ieooui) } 
>                Well, Arnold, if you are going to combine the rent 
>payments, you might as well combine the living space (of the HOUSE), as 
>well.
>
>   That would amount to a 5 bedroom, 3 bath HOUSE for $1,500 per month.
>
>   Question, Arnold:  What are the going rent rates for a comparable house?
>
>   Tom “living in a 2-bedroom, 1-bath, $500 a month apartment” Hansen
>   Moscow, Idaho
>
>       “Anyone that buys something at Wal-Mart or Target expecting it to 
>last doesn't know how to spend money.”
>
>- Donovan Arnold (October 3, 2006)
>
>
>
>---------------------------------
>
>   From: vision2020-bounces at moscow.com 
>[mailto:vision2020-bounces at moscow.com] On Behalf Of Donovan Arnold
>Sent: Tuesday, May 01, 2007 2:29 PM
>To: Nick Gier
>Cc: vision2020 at moscow.com
>Subject: Re: [Vision2020] Correct Rent for my House
>
>
>     Nick,
>
>
>
>     As I understand it, $600 a month for part of the house, $750 for the 
>other half of the house is $1350 a month. Is my math off?
>
>
>
>     Count in w,s,g, utilities, and it is easily over $1500 a month for a 
>house rental.
>
>
>
>     A couple with a child or two going to college cannot afford $1500 a 
>month.
>
>
>
>     When everyone, including you, divides their homes up into apartments 
>to raise the rental value of a home to $1500 a month, you make it 
>impossible for single families to rent an entire home.
>
>
>
>     You have to rent to 4 to 8 people because it is not affordable for a 
>one income family.
>
>
>
>     In order for $750 a month to be affordable, that would be $9,000 a 
>year. Someone would have to net $30,000 a year in order for that to be only 
>30% of their income.
>
>
>
>     No statistics in Moscow support the claim that the average college 
>student with children does not make $30,000 a year after taxes.
>
>
>
>     The math is pretty concrete. $750 a month is NOT affordable housing 
>for a family in Moscow.
>
>     Want more math. If a college student works 25 hrs a week at $10 an 
>hour. That is about $1000 a month net income. They get the maximum of 
>$12,000 in loans, grants, and scholarships. That is still only $24,000 a 
>year, assuming no missed work and they can find a job for twice the minimum 
>wage.
>
>
>
>     Moscow has no affordable housing for college family units. Dividing 
>housing to maximize rental income is the main reason why.
>
>
>
>     Best,
>
>
>
>     Donovan
>
>
>
>
>
>
>Nick Gier <ngier at uidaho.edu> wrote:
>
>     Dear Donovan,
>
>You are not remembering my rent figures very well.  Families who have 
>rented my 3-bedroom upstairs have found the $750 rent very reasonable, and 
>students who have 3 bedrooms and 2 baths downstairs for $600 believe that 
>they have died and gone to heaven.
>
>By the way, the upstairs will be available for Fall semester and the 
>downstairs will be available July 1.  Please spread the word and give 
>anyone interested my e-mail address.
>
>Nick Gier
>
>At 09:33 AM 5/1/2007, you wrote:
>
>
>   Nick,
>
>I didn't attack your house. I was disagreeing with you charging $1500 to 
>rent a house in Moscow. In order for that to be considered affordable 
>housing a family would have to make $4,500 a month in net income. Those 
>types of jobs are just not available in Moscow. Nor does a person get that 
>much money in students loans, grants and scholarships.
>
>What you seem to not comprehend is that when you make rent prices so 
>outrageous you make life very difficult, if not impossible for couples with 
>children that would like to get out of poverty by getting a degree at UI.
>
>Sure, $1500 is affordable for 5 or 6 college students. But single families 
>have to pay that same market rate. This was my biggest challenge as a 
>student body senator, was trying to find adequate low income housing for 
>single families. It doesn't exist. The UI family housing is full, and the 
>buildings are falling apart, not entirely safe, and have mold and health 
>issues.
>
>That was my point, and why I am angry about the situation. It is completely 
>unfair.
>
>Best,
>
>Donovan
>
>Nick Gier <ngier at uidaho.edu> wrote:
>   Good Morning Visionaries:
>   I'm just as fed with Donovan's tirades as anyone on this list.  (My 
>favorite attack was the one on my house.  I can defend myself, but house 
>cannot.)  Objecting to his insults and bad manners is one thing, but 
>diagnosing his mental state complete with labels is another thing, even if 
>he has given his own diagnosis.
>   I would very much like this thread to cease immediately.
>   Nick Gier
>     "Truth is the summit of being; justice is the application of it to 
>human affairs."
>--Ralph Waldo Emerson
>
>"Abstract truth has no value unless it incarnates in human beings who 
>represent it, by proving their readiness to die for it."
>  --Mohandas Gandhi
>
>"Modern physics has taught us that the nature of any system cannot be 
>discovered by dividing it into its component parts and studying each part 
>by itself. . . .We must keep our attention fixed on the whole and on the 
>interconnection between the parts. The same is true of our intellectual 
>life. It is impossible to make a clear cut between science, religion, and 
>art. The whole is never equal simply to the sum of its various parts." 
>--Max Planck
>
>Nicholas F. Gier
>Professor Emeritus, Department of Philosophy, University of Idaho
>1037 Colt Rd., Moscow, ID 83843
>http://users.adelphia.net/~nickgier/home.htm
>208-882-9212/FAX 885-8950
>President, Idaho Federation of Teachers, AFL-CIO
>http://users.adelphia.net/~nickgier/ift.htm
>
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>
>---------------------------------
>
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>
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>http://www.fsr.net
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>
>---------------------------------
>Ahhh...imagining that irresistible "new car" smell?
>  Check outnew cars at Yahoo! Autos.

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>  serving the communities of the Palouse since 1994.
>                http://www.fsr.net
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