[Vision2020] Christ's message (was Fantasy vs. Reality IV)

[keely emerinemix]

I agree completely that Christ's message of love, forgiveness, tolerance, 
kindness and mercy has been hijacked by many throughout history who have 
used his name to do unspeakably awful things.  I also know that I, too, have 
failed to always act in a way that's consistent with both his message and 
his character.

But his message was not just about love and forgiveness between people, or 
even primarily about it.  Christians believe that Christ came to reconcile 
sinners to God through his sacrifice on the cross and subsequent 
resurrection -- and only by humbling ourselves to accept his gift of 
righteousness and the change of heart that comes with it can we truly embody 
the other parts of his message as his disciples.

It is and always has been a tough sell.  No one enjoys being called a 
sinner, even by God, and no one enjoys being treated badly by people who 
take his name.  It would be great if no believer ever acted like an ass 
toward anyone, especially unbelievers.  It would be great if all of us, 
regardless of religious or spiritual persuasion, treated each other as Jesus 
taught, and it would be really great if I could lead the way in my own life. 
  But I don't.  I get angry at bad drivers, snap at my kids, occasionally 
curse like a sailor and treat the temple of my body like an amusement park 
in terms of nutrition, exercise, media intake and discipline.  If 
Christianity had me as its primary ambassador, the angels would cringe.

I'm a nice person, but a sinful one; I'm a Christian because, having come to 
believe that about myself, I've come to believe in the One who rescues me, 
renews me, restores me, and refreshes me.  Without the power to forgive 
sins, Jesus would be just another wonderful moral teacher, and I'd be just 
another pretty decent person still falling way short of goodness.

keely


From: "Art Deco" <deco at moscow.com>
To: "Vision 2020" <vision2020 at moscow.com>
Subject: Re: [Vision2020] [Bulk] Re: Fantasy vs. Reality Fourth Installment
Date: Fri, 9 Mar 2007 08:40:03 -0800

Paul writes:

"Isn't it frightening how many similarities there are between radical 
fundamentalists of Islam and Christianity?  If love and kindness won't work 
for us, then what was Jesus blathering on about?"

Bingo!!!!

The material that Paul responds to posted by the Cultmaster's attack mouse 
is another example of egomaniacs, megalomaniacs, delusionals, etc. hijacking 
the original teachings of Christ for their own purposes and agendas.

As a nonbeliever, I am painfully amused by some of those that allege they 
fervently believe in Jesus failing to understand the place of Christ in 
his/their religious tradition -- love replacing the culture of Old Testament 
driven hate and alienation, help/compassion replacing the culture of Old 
Testament scorn and cruelty.  But Christ's message was corrupted even before 
those who lived in his time were long dead.  Just contrast the later books 
of the New Testament with the simple, direct words of Christ found in the 
synoptic gospels (the first three books of the New Testament).


Human religious folly is a source of painful amusement because it generally 
leads to more cruelty, greed, corruption, and loss of civil liberties.  This 
is not necessarily true of all religious groups, but it certainly is true of 
fundamentalists in Christianity and Islam.  We have a laboratory specimen in 
our local midst of this classic phenomenon, the Wilson & Family's Christless 
Cult & Cash Machine -- (You must tolerate us since we do not tolerate anyone 
else).

Cultmaster Wilson has hijacked/transformed the simple love/compassion/be 
careful to judge others messages of Christ to one completely counter to 
Christ's original teachings.  And his gain of wealth, influence, and power 
does not lead to the spiritual elevation of his flock by their helping the 
unfortuantes and/or their gaining credibility by goods works and exhibiting 
agape.  Instead they are exhorted to smite their detractors and to waste 
their money building the Cultmaster's empire rather than helping the 
unfortunate and their helping practically to solve the problems of 
humankind.  Worse yet, his brand of virulent, unverifiable, charisma, 
authority-driven superstition is of the kind that prevents humankind from 
attempting to solve the huge problems of deadly human conflict, gross, 
worldwide environmental damage, and part of its main cause, overpopulation.

When you deal in unverifiable superstition, you can sell any crackpot theory 
if you are charismatic and well organized enough, especially since you are 
not subject to the plodding detailed work of demonstrating your assertions 
by observation and experimentation subject to the observation and 
verification by others.

Dealing in unverifiable superstition is simpler than dealing in truth for 
another reason clearly stated by P. T. Barnum:  "There's one [fool/sucker] 
born every minute."  Religious con artistry and secular con artistry prey on 
the same human emotion -- the desire of the fool/sucker to get something 
free or at a greatly reduced price, or to get something that has an 
extremely low probability of being attainable.

W.

----- Original Message -----
From: "Paul Rumelhart" <godshatter at yahoo.com>
To: <vision2020 at moscow.com>
Sent: Thursday, March 08, 2007 6:44 PM
Subject: Re: [Vision2020] [Bulk] Re: Fantasy vs. Reality Fourth Installment


 > heirdoug at netscape.net wrote:
 >
 >>Imprecatory Prayer: The Intercessor’s Elephant Gun
 >>By Doug Giles
 >>
 >>
 >
 > Don't know if this is you or not, but thought I'd answer anyway...
 >
 >>One: Back President Bush and his aggressive armed attitude against
 >>terrorists and terror supporting nations.
 >>
 >>
 >
 > Can't do that.  If he was trying to use the power of the law to track
 > these guys down instead of trying to clean up a mess in Iraq that had
 > little to do with 9/11, maybe I'd go for it.  If I thought it was an
 > honest mistake and we weren't torturing suspects without trials and
 > using "extraordinary rendition", maybe I could get behind him to do what
 > we can to clean up our mess.  I can back this man on Afghanistan, as
 > long as he's not doing things unilaterally, but not Iraq.  Just remember
 > that it could be argued that we are a "terror supporting" nation.  We
 > sold arms to Iran.  Our CIA trained Bin Laden.  Who knows how many other
 > dirty secrets we have hidden somewhere?
 >
 >>Two: Push for cinching our borders tighter than a fat guy's belt after
 >>an ‘All-You-Can-Eat’ beef rib blow out at Tony Roma’s.
 >>
 >>
 >
 > I'm afraid I can't do this one, either.  Our polyglot of cultures and
 > attitudes and beliefs is our crowning strength, not a weakness.  Sure,
 > tighten security to help stop further terror attacks (while respecting
 > people's rights in the process), but don't turn us insular.  The world
 > is an interconnected global system.  we turn our backs on it at our own
 > risk.
 >
 >>Three: Aggressively support the rooting out of the multitudinous
 >>terrorist cells that are concocting their villainous crap in our very
 >>own cul de sacs.
 >>
 >>
 >
 > I can get behind this one.  We already have systems in place to handle
 > this.  No new scary rights-removing laws needed.  Let the system work.
 >
 >>Four: Make it ridiculously impossible for a pro-radical Islamic
 >>professor to pee in one of our university’s bathrooms, much less teach
 >>in one of our classrooms.
 >>
 >>
 >
 > Freedom of religion.  If you can't live with it, get the fuck out.  If
 > said professor commits a crime, throw him or her in prison.  Otherwise
 > ignore their religion.  Is there some kind of a flood of radical Islamic
 > professors applying for teaching jobs I haven't heard about?
 >
 >>Five: As people of faith, dust off and use what’s afforded to the
 >>believer within the Old and New Testaments, namely the imprecatory
 >>prayers.
 >>
 >>
 >
 > Can't do this one, either.  For one, I'm not Christian.  For another, I
 > believe that if you have a beef with someone, you should tell them to
 > their face, not try to implore some possibly-real (probably-imaginary)
 > phantom to do your dirty work for you.
 >
 > Since I haven't seen anything on the news about radical Muslims, local
 > philosophy professors, or "intoleristas" being inexplicably burned to a
 > crisp by bolts of lightning, I'm assuming your God is thinking along the
 > same lines I am.
 >
 > Paul
 >
 > P.S.  Isn't it frightening how many similarities there are between
 > radical fundamentalists of Islam and Christianity?  If love and kindness
 > won't work for us, then what was Jesus blathering on about?
 >
 > =======================================================
 > List services made available by First Step Internet,
 > serving the communities of the Palouse since 1994.
 >               http://www.fsr.net
 >          mailto:Vision2020 at moscow.com
 > =======================================================
 >


=======================================================
  List services made available by First Step Internet,
  serving the communities of the Palouse since 1994.
                http://www.fsr.net
           mailto:Vision2020 at moscow.com
=======================================================

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