[Vision2020] African Americans and Fetuses

Thu Jan 25 08:59:41 PST 2007

Greetings:

The traditional view of moral and legal persons, 
coming from our combined religious, moral, and 
legal histories, eventually won out with regard 
to recognizing African Americans as full moral 
and legal persons.  In my article on abortion 
I've applied the same definition to the early 
fetus and the logic of the definition does not 
fit.  To force fit a definition is simple intellectual dishonesty.

Therefore, there is no moral equivalence between 
recognizing people of color as persons and fetuses before 25 weeks.

Just being a good conservative by preserving good traditions,

Nick Gier

At 07:25 AM 1/25/2007, you wrote:
>Yes Nick, and under our laws in 1850, black 
>folks could be held as slaves.  The point is 
>professor, that it is high time the rights the 
>rest of us enjoy are extended to today's 
>disenfranchised: the unborn.  How disappointing 
>to see you on the wrong side of history this 
>time.  Would you have rationalized the Dred Scott decision in its day?
>
>Tragic.
>
>-T
>----- Original Message -----
>From: <mailto:ngier at uidaho.edu>Nick Gier
>To: <mailto:tonytime at clearwire.net>Tony
>Sent: Wednesday, January 24, 2007 9:31 AM
>Subject: Re: [Vision2020] One More "Killer" Released Because of DNA
>
>Greetings:
>
>Under our laws the crime of murder can happen 
>only against moral and legal persons.  Our 
>religious, moral, and legal tradition does not 
>recognize first and second trimester fetuses as 
>persons.  Once again I provide the link for my 
>essay on abortion: www.class.uidaho.edu/ngier/abortion.htm.
>
>Fetuses are of course biological human beings 
>from conception on, but so are thousands of 
>other animal species.  As a vegetarian I'm quite 
>willing to shift to a consistent pro-life 
>position, but I believe that most people are not 
>willing to do this.  The moral ball is in their court, and it's their serve.
>
>Veggie Burgers Forever!
>
>Nick Gier
>
>At 09:22 AM 1/24/2007, you wrote:
>>Nick, I was heartened to see you change your 
>>mind with regard to abortion. You are 
>>absolutely correct that the state should not be 
>>in the business of premeditated murder, 
>>especially in the case of those who are 
>>innocent in EVERY case. It is such a joy to see 
>>reason and compassion prevail. Best,   -T ----- 
>>Original Message ----- From: 
>><nickgier at adelphia.net> To: 
>><vision2020 at moscow.com> Sent: Wednesday, 
>>January 24, 2007 8:57 AM Subject: [Vision2020] 
>>One More "Killer" Released Because of DNA > 
>>Greetings: > > Fortunately, most DNA 
>>exonerations are happening with prisoners who 
>>are > still alive.  The real injustice, 
>>however, is those, now over 100, who > were 
>>executed before the tests could be done. > > 
>>The state should not be in the business of 
>>premeditated murder, especially > if it cannot 
>>be sure of that its victims are guilty. > > 
>>Nick Gier > > January 24, 2007, NY Times > With 
>>DNA From Exhumed Body, Man Finally Wins 
>>Freedom > By FERNANDA SANTOS > > AUBURN, N.Y., 
>>Jan. 23 — Roy Brown, who spent 15 yeears in 
>>prison on a > murder conviction and uncovered 
>>evidence while there that linked another > man 
>>to the crime, was released from prison on 
>>Tuesday after DNA tests on > the other manâ€™s 
>>exhumed body matched saliva on a nightshirt at 
>>the crime > scene. > > After 15 years behind 
>>bars, Mr. Brown stepped out of court into a 
>>light > snowfall and gently pushed his way 
>>through a cluster of relatives who vied > for 
>>his attention. The reception was fine, he said, 
>>but he is too sick > with liver disease to 
>>stand on his feet for long. > > â€œChanges have 
>>got to be made, man,â€ Mr. Brown said later at 
>>a lawyerâ€™s > office across the street, 
>>answering questions in a monotone as he 
>>rested > awkwardly in a black swivel chair. 
>>â€œThey say the wheels of justice move > 
>>slowly, but you know what? The wheels of 
>>justice are flat.â€ > > Mr. Brown, 46, is the 
>>eighth person in New York State exonerated 
>>through > DNA evidence in the past 13 months, 
>>more than in any other state during > the same 
>>period. > > The DNA tests that freed him 
>>confirmed the results of his own jailhouse > 
>>investigation, in which he discovered documents 
>>that incriminated Barry > Bench, a volunteer 
>>firefighter, in the murder of Sabina 
>>Kulakowski, 49, a > social worker who had lived 
>>with Mr. Benchâ€™s brother until months 
>>before > her death. Earlier DNA tests conducted 
>>by Mr. Brownâ€™s lawyers linked Mr. > Benchâ€™s 
>>daughter, Katherine Eckstadt, to the genetic 
>>code lifted from the > saliva on Ms. 
>>Kulakowskiâ€™s nightshirt. > > 
>>=======================================================  
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>>Internet, > serving the communities of the 
>>Palouse since 
>>1994. >               http://www.fsr.net > 
>>     mailto:Vision2020 at moscow.com > 
>>=======================================================  
>> > > 
>>======================================================= 
>>List services made available by First Step 
>>Internet, serving the communities of the 
>>Palouse since 
>>1994.                  http://www.fsr.net 
>>                           mailto:Vision2020 at moscow.com 
>>=======================================================
>
>"Truth is the summit of being; justice is the 
>application of it to human affairs."
>--Ralph Waldo Emerson
>
>"Abstract truth has no value unless it 
>incarnates in human beings who represent it, by 
>proving their readiness to die for it."
>  --Mohandas Gandhi
>
>"Modern physics has taught us that the nature of 
>any system cannot be discovered by dividing it 
>into its component parts and studying each part 
>by itself. . . .We must keep our attention fixed 
>on the whole and on the interconnection between 
>the parts. The same is true of our intellectual 
>life. It is impossible to make a clear cut 
>between science, religion, and art. The whole is 
>never equal simply to the sum of its various parts." --Max Planck
>
>Nicholas F. Gier
>Professor Emeritus, Department of Philosophy, University of Idaho
>1037 Colt Rd., Moscow, ID 83843
>http://users.adelphia.net/~nickgier/home.htm
>208-882-9212/FAX 885-8950
>President, Idaho Federation of Teachers, AFL-CIO
>http://users.adelphia.net/~nickgier/ift.htm

"Truth is the summit of being; justice is the 
application of it to human affairs."
--Ralph Waldo Emerson

"Abstract truth has no value unless it incarnates 
in human beings who represent it, by proving their readiness to die for it."
  --Mohandas Gandhi

"Modern physics has taught us that the nature of 
any system cannot be discovered by dividing it 
into its component parts and studying each part 
by itself. . . .We must keep our attention fixed 
on the whole and on the interconnection between 
the parts. The same is true of our intellectual 
life. It is impossible to make a clear cut 
between science, religion, and art. The whole is 
never equal simply to the sum of its various parts." --Max Planck

Nicholas F. Gier
Professor Emeritus, Department of Philosophy, University of Idaho
1037 Colt Rd., Moscow, ID 83843
http://users.adelphia.net/~nickgier/home.htm
208-882-9212/FAX 885-8950
President, Idaho Federation of Teachers, AFL-CIO
http://users.adelphia.net/~nickgier/ift.htm

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