[Vision2020] Godwin's Law Strikes Again!

Thu Feb 8 14:53:07 PST 2007

>Hi Gary,
It seems to me there is a difference between cultivating hate and expressing 
situational anger. Cultivating kindness, a higher order art. In my opinion a 
better route to an improved humanity. Not easy for a lot of us…
I don’t see you as a hate cultivator, in fact it seems you might even be 
trying to make efforts against it in concentrated areas.
In this situation and others similar to it, I think you miss-measured Sue’s 
reaction. It was situational in reaction to a clear practitioner of hate 
cultivation. Can she do better, you bet. Your knowing that, taking the grain 
of truth in her grain of fault and hyper-inflating it, is a bully’s support 
group method. This technique is not a strength for anybody.
I agree with Sunil’s response, but in light of your effort here, wonder if 
you might be amenable to exploring your examples a bit.
Recently, comedian Michael Richards made a lot of trouble for himself using 
the N word. I suspect you are familiar with that news line. Do you think 
Richard made a forgivable mistake? Is there something there that he needs to 
remediate within himself?
Dave


>Gary,
>
>So if an African-American killed the same person in the manner you 
>describe,
>the statement "That miserable nigger just cut the head off of a American
>non-combatant," would not be racist?
>
>You're right, I don't like or agree with your rationale.
>
>I think it's a mistake to link emotion with the use of racist language or
>attitudes.  Racist decisions and statements are easily made in the absence
>of emotion; I think they're the results of attitudes developed over a
>lifetime and ingrained in cultures and individual people.  I don't think 
>any
>particular 'race' or group has a monopoly on racism.  I know I've often
>heard racist statements expresses as casually as a request for a drink of
>water.  There's no requirement for actions as you suggest; statements
>express one's views quite effectively.
>
>Sunil
>
>
> >From: "g. crabtree" <jampot at adelphia.net>
> >To: "Sunil Ramalingam" <sunilramalingam at hotmail.com>
> >CC: <vision2020 at moscow.com>
> >Subject: Re: [Vision2020] Godwin's Law Strikes Again!
> >Date: Thu, 8 Feb 2007 07:12:39 -0800
> >
> >Well Sunil, since you insist on trying to chase me out onto a thin limb,
> >I'll give you my take on comments such as the one you refer to. You won't
> >like or agree with it, I suspect, but here goes. Please bare in mind that 
>I
> >speak for myself and not anyone else to who you might attribute a lack of
> >sensitivity.
> >
> >When someone makes a remark like "All ragheads are vermin and have no 
>right
> >to live" it is inexcusably racist and deserves to be denounced at every
> >possible turn.
> >
> >When someone says "That miserable raghead just cut the head off of a
> >American non-combatant," it is a minor lapse of manner(s) or tact.
> >Unfortunate but, forgivable. Not, in my opinion, an indication of racism
> >per se.
> >
> >In the first you are calmly stating your contemptible and unsupportable
> >opinion of a large group/race of people. In the second you are expressing
> >your anger and frustration at an individual or small group of proven evil
> >doers with language that is intemperate and poorly chosen.
> >
> >Racism is, in my opinion, demonstrated by actions. It is hinted at,
> >sometimes incorrectly, by individual words.
> >
> >
> >
> >I hope that this does not change your opinion of my fitness as company on
> >the list.
> >
> >g
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >----- Original Message -----
> >From: "Sunil Ramalingam" <sunilramalingam at hotmail.com>
> >Cc: <vision2020 at moscow.com>
> >Sent: Wednesday, February 07, 2007 9:31 PM
> >Subject: Re: [Vision2020] Godwin's Law Strikes Again!
> >
> >
> > > Gary,
> > >
> > > Are racist slurs minor lapses of manner or tact?
> > >
> > > I hope this question isn't considered trash talk, or 'self righteous,
> >self
> > > satisfied, school yard sputtering,' though you may well consider me an
> > > additional player; happy to have you as company on that list.
> > >
> > > Sunil
> > >
> > >
> > >>From: "g. crabtree" <jampot at adelphia.net>
> > >>To: <debismith at moscow.com>, <suehovey at moscow.com>,
> ><vision2020 at moscow.com>
> > >>CC: vision2020 at moscow.com
> > >>Subject: Re: [Vision2020] Godwin's Law Strikes Again!
> > >>Date: Wed, 7 Feb 2007 20:07:27 -0800
> > >>
> > >>Extremely interesting. Should someone from the mildly conservative 
>side
> >of
> > >>the fence have a minor lapse of manners or tact, the squealing and
> > >>castigation rises to a level at which our canine friends experience
> > >>profound and lasting aural pain.
> > >>
> > >>But on the other hand it's OK to demean the offender with a level of
> > >>calumny several orders of magnitude greater then anything originally
> >said.
> > >>I mean really, when you feel you have to resort to not so subtly 
>calling
> > >>someone's mother a bitch along with the silly BS in the post to which
> >I'm
> > >>responding, you really have to wonder If Ms. Hovey, Ms. R-S, Mr. Fox,
> >and
> > >>the rest of the usual suspects have any sense of irony at all. Double
> > >>standard risen to the power of hypocritical joke. What's even funnier 
>is
> > >>that this communication will likely raise the trash talk to the next
> >level
> > >>as well as spread it to additional players. Who needs comedy central
> >when
> > >>we've got the V.
> > >>
> > >>Commence self righteous, self satisfied, school yard sputtering,
> > >>g
> > >>
> > >
> > >
> > > =======================================================
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> > > serving the communities of the Palouse since 1994.
> > >               http://www.fsr.net
> > >          mailto:Vision2020 at moscow.com
> > > =======================================================
> > >
>
>
>=======================================================
>  List services made available by First Step Internet,
>  serving the communities of the Palouse since 1994.
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