[Vision2020] Who Has More Influence in the Media? Was: Active Troops by and large

[g. crabtree]

The people on the list that I provided in my most recent post are celebrity 
liberals which I chose for their being in 180 degree opposition to the 
conservative radio personalities that you mentioned on your list. The fact 
that you haven't heard of them  really makes no difference. Each and every 
one of them is syndicated in  major media markets. The fact that they have a 
rather anemic audience can be attributed, in my opinion, to the reasons I 
have stated previously. For each and every conservative voice you can come 
up with I dare say I can come up with two liberal ones to counter.

Now, lets put away this petty and largely irrelevant aspect of the 
discussion and cut to the real meat and 'taters. Are you really trying to 
make me and two or three other poor souls who might be following this sorry 
discussion believe   that conservative talk radio + FOX news = the lion's 
share of media influence? That their voice overpowers that of ALL the major 
networks, all the rest of the cable news channels, MTV, VH1, NPR, Pacifica, 
all the rest of the, admittedly, relatively insignificant talk radio market, 
and at a minimum 80% (a very conservative estimate) of all major newspapers 
and news magazines? And I'm the guy who's desperate to score a win? My 
amusement and incredulity know no bounds.

Now, on a more or less unrelated note. When you took your little hiatus and 
achieved remarkable success in creating a rival forum to V2020, I though 
that you offered up as a reason that this list had become a breeding ground 
for incivility and was causing you no small amount of distress. Now that you 
have made your triumphant return, coarseness and contempt has become a 
regular feature in a great many of your posts. Particularly when it come to 
Ms. Kraut but to a lesser extent most anybody who has the temerity to 
disagree with you. (I'm guessing most shrug it off, Pat in particular. She 
strikes me as resilient) None the less, are you, perhaps, past due for 
taking another little time out? Perhaps you could create another internet 
ghost town like the last, a restful place where no one will be able to 
challenge your questionable assertions? A place where you can rant and rail, 
duck and dodge, all without the messy complication of having someone to call 
you on your, shall we charitably say questionable, assertions.
gc


----- Original Message ----- 
From: "Chasuk" <chasuk at gmail.com>
To: "g. crabtree" <jampot at adelphia.net>
Cc: <vision2020 at moscow.com>
Sent: Saturday, November 04, 2006 1:16 PM
Subject: Re: Who Has More Influence in the Media? Was: Active Troops by and 
large


> This is a repost.  It contains the same content,  but with a few typo
> corrections.
>
> *******************************************************************************************
>
> I will walk you through the relevant excerpts.  The thread began properly
> with this post from Chuck Kovis:
>
>> You guys control the three branches of the federal goverment.  You 
>> control
>> the three branches of Idaho government.    You control the media.  And 
>> you
>> guys still bitch about liberals.  What the hell is the matter?
>
> Matt Decker responded:
>
>> Us guys control the media? Have you checked your stations lately?
>
> The thread meandered for a bit until Art Deco wrote:
>
>> CNN's answer to Bill O'Reily is Glenn Beck,  Beck is just as conservative 
>> as
>> O'Reily only not such an asshole about it.
>
> Matt responded:
>
>> Wow, golly, Gee Art. Your so right, and how could I think that the media 
>> has
>> no spin. With all of the posts against my opinion, I have to believe that
>> Air America, ABC,NBC,CBS, and CNN are all conservative driven. What on
>> Darwins green earth was I thinking.
>
> The thread is no longer about active troops supporting Bush; the title
> really should have been changed.  Mea partially culpa.  I rectify that
> in this post.  The tangent has clearly now devolved/evolved into a
> discussion of who has more influence in the media, the conservatives
> or the liberals.
>
> I posted a list of conservative celebrities, "celebrities [known] for
> their impassioned espousal of conservative values, not celebrities who
> happen to be conservative."
>
> Here is the relevant excerpt:
>
>> I can name Rush Limbaugh, Ann Coulter, Glenn Beck, Sean Hannity,
>> Michael Reagan, Gordon Liddy, Bill O'Reilly, Michael Savage, Michael
>> Medved, and Laura Schlessinger.  I've probably missed a few.  All of
>> them, celebrity conservatives (.i.e,. celebrities for their
>> impassioned espousal of conservative values, not celebrities who
>> happen to be conservative).
>
> You post a list entirely dissimilar to mine, because you entirely miss
> the point.
>
> You write:
>
>> So instead of "a comparable list full of celebrity liberals who get as 
>> much
>> media exposure" that you originally asked for, the list must now be
>> comprised of celebrity liberals who have radio talk shows?
>
> Uh, you have it partially right, yes.  The discussion here is about
> who has more influence in the media, the conservatives or the
> liberals, which obviously means (as I clarified in my first post) that
> any examples need to be "celebrities [known] for their impassioned
> espousal of conservative values [or liberal], not celebrities who
> happen to be conservative [or liberal]."
>
> I don't know who most of these people are:
>
> Terry Gross
> Diane Rehm
> Al Franken
> Randi Rhoades
> Thom Hartmann
> Rachel Maddow
> Steve Earle
> Mike Newcomb
> Bernie Ward
> Mike Webb
> Guy James
> Laura Flanders
> Ray Taliaferro
> Niel Rogers
> Lynn Cullen
> Roxanne Walker
>
> You then anticipate my very real objection:
>
>> I could go on. Now, let me anticipate your next objection. 'Well jeepers
>> Gary, these folks don't have anything like the audience or the notoriety 
>> of
>> the people I had on my list.'
>
> No shit.  We are talking about which philosophy has the most influence
> in the media, conservative or liberal, so YES it makes a difference
> that the folks on your list don't have anything like the audience or
> the notoriety of the people on mine.
>
> I'll spell it out for you:
>
> Big Audience + Notoriety == Big Influence
> Small Audience + Obscurity == Small Influence
>
>
> That's a no-brainer, Gary, and you aren't stupid.  Are you really that
> desperate to score a win for the conservatives, that you have to
> resort to intellectual dishonesty?  Or are is Pat Kraut rubbing off on
> you?
>