[Vision2020] Jesus did NOT say it

[J Ford]

First of all, Dougie has not only said those words but encouraged others in 
your church to do likewise.  Since when does he not read and re-read 
anything that is sent to CA, to HH meetings, or any speeches that any of you 
give?  You may be the "editor" but he is the chief of that rag and you know 
it.  If it doesn't pass the mustard with him, it doesn't get published.  And 
since Greg very clearly stated that Dougie had read his piece about killing 
a segment of our population, and Dougie acknowledges he read it but refuses 
to refute it or even accept responsibility for what has been 
said/printed/published, that pretty much seals that bottle.

Secondly, JESUS never once said homosexuals should be shunned, killed, or 
otherwise hurt or dismissed.  Those words come from people who, in an age of 
"manliness", felt threatened or simply did not wish to understand people of 
a difference.  In all of His personal and private teachings and stories, not 
once did Jesus even mention homosexuals much less condone their death or 
mistreatment.

Jesus, howbeit, did have plenty to say about false witnessing, false 
pastors, false teachers.  I'd think Dougie and your bunch would want to pay 
closer attention to those writings, but apparently that is not the case.



J  :]





>From: "Taro Tanaka" <taro_tanaka at hotmail.com>
>To: vision2020 at moscow.com
>Subject: Re: [Vision2020] Missing the point
>Date: Tue, 15 Aug 2006 11:46:22 +0000
>
>Joe Campbell <joekc at adelphia.net> wrote:
>
>[[ The whole damn debate started when Wilson tried to suggest (a) that
>slavery wasn't as bad as we thought that it was, (b) that some instances of
>slavery were justified (as long as the Master was "Christian" and the slave
>was Non-"Christian"), (c) and that persons deserved death on the basis of
>their sexual orientation. That sounds pretty intolerant to me . . . If he
>ever took it upon himself to stop saying such nonsense and to apologize to
>those in the community that he's offended we'd be well beyond this mess. ]]
>
>Joe, I can't speak for Wilson, but I agree it sounds intolerant because it
>is intolerant, although I must point out one of your distortions of 
>Wilson's
>teachings: he has NEVER said that anyone deserves the death penalty on the
>basis of their sexual orientation. In any case, what he did actually say is
>plenty offensive enough to those who find the Bible offensive. The
>likelihood of Wilson ever ceasing from saying that or of him apologizing to
>people in the community that were offended by that would seem to be zero,
>because that is what the Bible itself teaches, and the church has 
>recognized
>that for millennia, and there is no need to apologize for to be embarrassed
>by anything that is in the Bible. You will note, for example, that by no
>stretch of the imagination has he has ever advocated vigilante violence
>against anyone. Rather, he is working (including praying and preaching) for
>society to return to a consistently biblical foundation. Presumably when
>that happens, the penal system will be reformed through the governmental
>system currently available to us, and, among other things, homosexual
>perversions will once again be recognized as criminal behavior rather than
>protected behavior. If that does happen, it will be through the work of the
>Holy Spirit convicting enough individual people so that as a net result
>society ends up being transformed. It will not be the result of some sort 
>of
>a coup d'etat by Doug Wilson and like-minded men who then impose some sort
>of a perverse "theonomic" martial law, Nick Gier's sick comparisons to the
>Taliban notwithstanding.
>
>[[ Criticism of intolerance is not itself a display of intolerance. ]]
>
>Actually, in your case that is exactly what it is. You can tolerate 
>anything
>except an absolutist position, because you have absolutized your radical
>relativism. You speak in praise of diversity until you encounter someone 
>who
>really is different from you, and then you can't handle that. The fact of
>the matter is that your much-vaunted commitments to tolerance and diversity
>are a sham -- a ruse aimed at silencing the voice of orthodox Christianity
>in the public square. When I say "sham," "ruse," and "aimed," I don't mean
>that you personally -- or for that matter necessarily anyone on V2020 -- is
>self-consciously aware of that. But that is exactly the case at a certain
>spiritual level. The great engine motivating all this is a deep-seated
>hostility to God's biblical revelation and to biblical revelation's God.
>
>-- Princesss Sushitushi
>
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