[Vision2020] Another excuse for bad behavior

Sun Aug 13 17:59:37 PDT 2006

Jackie,

 Most of the links you gave were outdated, and as such  were  vague,  in sometimes  inaccurate. Here  is a  couple of better links that I think are more useful in a practical  sense to the common person:

      http://www.npr.org/templates/story/story.php?storyId=5488463
        http://www.unc.edu/~cory/autism-info/autism.html#Behavior

  I don't think it is any of your business when exactly I was diagnosed  with ASD, but obviously it was in the last 12 years like everybody  else. Since it is genetic, found on chromosome part 17Q21, everyone  with ASD is born with it, so timing of diagnosis is pointless to any  logical or valid argument you may be trying to make with that question.  

 It doesn't matter if you approve of it or accept it or not,  or like Wayne Fox, think that we or doctor's manipulate our genetics to  make up an illness is some government conspiracy theory of his. It is  definable, observable, measurable, and testable. Therefore it exists  and is  just real scientifically as the water you drink, air you  breath , or the earth you are standing on. 

 No, ASD doesn't  not directly force someone to be rude back to a handful or people that  disapprove and attack others. A scientific explanation:

  "Asperger  syndrome does not have direct implications for aggressive behavior, but  such behavior may be a secondary issue arising from frustration, or  from negative interactions with other. . .people who themselves have  been irritated by the apparently  provocative or self-centered style of the individual with Asperger syndrome." <-----(Sound familiar)

  You also misunderstand ASD as demonstrated when you stated:

  "What you are describing is what happens face-to-face.  YOU, OTOH, are doing 
  things via a reading medium - much easier for a person with Asperger's to 
  deal with.  No one is sending you pictures facial expressions or body 
  language and then asking you to deal with it.  Your words are very clearly 
  nasty, meant to hurt and show no remorse.  THAT is nae Asperger's.  Sorry, 
  but that just dosenae wash."

  Sorry but. . .
      "e.g.,  impaired comprehension of questions, open-ended questions and  nonliteral language such as irony, sarcasm, and jokes; word-retrieval  problems and unusual, pedantic word choices; echolalia; difficulty  formulating coherent discourse; narrow range of topics"

  Email makes it even more difficult to discern if someone is being  ironic, sarcastic etc. then in person. Even people with generally good  social skills have difficultly sometimes with that vis email. You are  making the error that asperger's is not recognizing social ques because  they are physically blind, not because they don't understand social  structure and human emotional responses. That is different.

  Naturally,  I assume  that everything you say Jackie, along with Joan Opyr,  Rose Huskey, Wayne Fox, Tom Hansen, Keely Mix, and a few others on  here,  is meant to be as destructive, hurtful, and nonfriendly as  possible because that is all I know that you do and see you do, call  people names, yells at them in public, file made up complaints against  people, and send nasty emails about them repeatedly, and there is a  good deal of vandalized property of people that disagree with you guys  as well. 

  So when I write  anything to response to you, it generally is returned in the same tone  as I read and interpret it, unpleasant and hurtful. Now, it may be  possible that you are not intending to be cruel and derogatory in your  emails to me and others, however, since that seems to be the only thing  I see you guys do, I assume it is what you are doing.

  For example, you wrote:

  "If  you truly have AS, get the help that is out there for it. If you have  constructive, helpful, community-minded ideas, offer them. But get off  the "pity potty" that seems so easy for you and your "big daddy figure"  to sit on; it stinks! And it hurts people who really do have those  problems by putting a bad light on them they donnae deserve."

  That  is a cruel, sick, mean and an insensitive thing to say. It is ironic  stating to being positive and productive, but saying it in the most  unproductive, kewl and nasty way possible. So I think you cannot be  serious. Especially coming from someone that seeks revenge on people  and has many enemies with destroyed property. 

 If  you are truly offended by mean, accusatory, self centered, unproductive  emails, as you state, why do you and your friends produce so many of  them? 

  Best,

  _DJA

J Ford <privatejf32 at hotmail.com> wrote:  This is rot.  Just when were you diagnosed with AS?

Asperger's is a disorder that, like Autism, affects people who, for the most 
part,  are very bright but over loaded.  Their senses are just too bombarded 
and they have trouble dealing with things.  There are many, many ways to 
teach these people how to survive on their own but most find they have to be 
with a care giver to some degree or another.

What you are describing is what happens face-to-face.  YOU, OTOH, are doing 
things via a reading medium - much easier for a person with Asperger's to 
deal with.  No one is sending you pictures facial expressions or body 
language and then asking you to deal with it.  Your words are very clearly 
nasty, meant to hurt and show no remorse.  THAT is nae Asperger's.  Sorry, 
but that just dosenae wash.

"Although there is no single feature that all people with AS share, 
difficulties with social behavior are nearly universal and are one of the 
most important defining criteria. People with AS lack the natural ability to 
see the subtexts of social interaction, and may lack the ability to 
communicate their own emotional state, resulting in well-meaning remarks 
that may offend, or finding it hard to know what is "acceptable". The 
unwritten rules of social behavior that mystify so many with AS have been 
termed the "hidden curriculum".  People with AS must learn these social 
skills intellectually rather than intuitively.  A person with AS has trouble 
understanding the emotions of other people: the messages that are conveyed 
by facial expression, eye contact and body language are often missed.  They 
also might have trouble showing empathy with other people."

The very fact that you call people "asses" and say other vile things about 
them clearly shows you KNOW what you are saying and that it is MEANT to be 
nasty, disrespectful, deceitful.  But, OTOH, you have shown "empathy" to the 
poor and handicapped, something an AS person would not be able to do.

In light of Mr. Hayes said earlier, I offer the following:

http://health.yahoo.com/ency/healthwise/zq1008
http://www.webmd.com/hw/mental_health/zq1009.asp
http://aacap.org/page.ww?name=Aspergers+Disorder&section=Facts+for+Families
http://www.autism-society.org/site/PageServer?pagename=Aspergers
http://www.aspergers.com/aspcrit.htm
http://www.margaretkay.com/Asperger's%20Syndrome.htm

If you truly have AS, get the help that is out there for it.  If you have 
constructive, helpful, community-minded ideas, offer them.  But get off the 
"pity potty" that seems so easy for you and your "big daddy figure" to sit 
on; it stinks!  And it hurts people who really do have those problems by 
putting a bad light on them they donnae deserve.

J  :]

>From: Donovan Arnold 
>To: donald huskey ,        "'Dan Carscallen'" 
>, vision2020 at moscow.com
>Subject: Re: [Vision2020] Another excuse for bad behavior
>Date: Fri, 11 Aug 2006 09:18:17 -0700 (PDT)
>
>Rose,
>
>  Thanks for the misinformed comments. But they are in  direct conflict 
>with Dr. Tony Atwood in Australia and researchers at  John Hopkins 
>Hospital. Asperger's cannot be overcome by simply  educating it away! Your 
>comment is like saying we can get rid of  deafness by teaching people how 
>to listen. The fact is the actual  nerves in the brain that perceive 
>nonverbal and social cues in  Asperger's and the nerves that perceive 
>sound, respectively, are  missing, not there, gone, never fully developed.
>
>  Rose,  people with Asperger's are not stupid, they are simply missing the 
>  nonverbal and social contexts because the "equipment" in the brain to  
>read and interpret those cues correctly and accurately is not there.  
>Imagine not being able to tell accurately when someone is mad, upset,  
>frustrated, confused, happy, or shy unless they actually tell you. And  at 
>the same time, people not properly reading your cues, because you  don't 
>know how to send them out properly, they think you are upset when  you are 
>not, or are being trying to be mean when you are not trying to  be, or they 
>think you are being coy,and even self centered or a know it  all. People 
>also will not disclose verbally that they are angry,  irritated, happy, OK, 
>fine, or whatever. They expect you to read it on  their body language, or 
>know it. They will also lie, and say they are  fine, when in fact they are 
>not fine. It really can be frustrating and  confusing. And not to mention 
>how irritating it is to
>  another to be  kept asking how they are feeling because that person 
>cannot properly  read their non-verbal cues.
>
>  Teaching someone with  Asperger's syndrome what to do in a social 
>situation is like teaching  someone that is color blind what to do when 
>they see a red light, green  light, or yellow light. They understand what 
>to do, they are not sure  when the light is green, yellow, or red, they 
>cannot see it.
>
>   So, to put it clearly. People with Asperger's frequently over or under  
>react to a social situation because they do not correctly perceive the  
>social situation, not because they are assholes. Not every person with  
>Asperger's incorrectly interprets every situation in the same incorrect  
>manner. Many overreact or interpret the situation as a worse  
>interpretation possible because of many experiences of being burned  (and 
>not even knowing it because they could not perceive it). Unless  someone is 
>with a person with Asperger's to tell them, that is an  incorrect or 
>correct assessment of the social situation, education will  not help them.
>
>   I hope this makes things clear. If not, well, at least I tried, but  
>there is only so much I can do an say to try and make it a little  easier 
>for you to understand.
>
>
>   Best,
>
>   _DJA
>
>
>
>donald huskey  wrote:                           
>        Donovan writes in part:
>
>
>     “HA  HA. You are a riot! I guess you get a kick out of a guy with 
>Asperger's  who tries his best not to come across in written forum as a  
>know-it-all. As anyone and everyone with Asperger's or Autism does.”
>
>     Donovan,  if your posts represent “your best” than “your best” won’t 
>do. Offering  Asperger’s as an excuse for your belligerent, perseverant, 
>and frankly  ignorant emails is a pathetic attempt to garner pity while 
>justifying  your piss poor social skills. Asperger’s Paspergers’s - 
>sometimes a  jackass is just a plain, ordinary, garden variety jackass.
>
>     And, by the way, not *every*  person with Asperger’s or Autism comes 
>across as a know-it-all, as you  claim. (I hope I am not remembering 
>correctly that you are doing  graduate work in Special Ed  if that remark 
>is a reflection of  your attitude.)  Appropriate social training from 
>family members,  teachers, and counselors contribute significantly toward 
>enabling those  with (an accurate) diagnosis of Asperger’s to become 
>successful,  contributing members of their communities.
>
>     Rose Huskey
>
>
>
>
>
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