[Vision2020] You might be a real American
g. crabtree
jampot at adelphia.net
Thu Aug 10 19:48:29 PDT 2006
All of creation the result of a sudden "big bang," the result of nobody
knows what or everything the result of an omnipotent Creator. Both seem
improbable but if I have to pick one, I like the idea of a benevolent, if
somewhat inscrutable God. I know for an absolute fact from youthful
experimentation that large explosions don't love me. (I'm mighty fond of
them, however. Talk about your unrequited affection.)
gc
----- Original Message -----
From: "Matt Decker" <mattd2107 at hotmail.com>
To: <deco at moscow.com>; <vision2020 at moscow.com>
Sent: Thursday, August 10, 2006 7:21 PM
Subject: Re: [Vision2020] You might be a real American
>
> W,
>
> So according to you, anyone who has a tiny bit of religous faith in them
> is
> pathetically weak? Man I guess the billions that live in this world who
> have
> that faith are weak. Heck I tend to think one who can live their life
> with
> that belief of an unproven higher being as their creator, as more stronger
> than one who can't even fathom that maybe, just maybe something is out
> there.
>
> Matt
>
>>From: "Art Deco" <deco at moscow.com>
>>To: "Vision 2020" <vision2020 at moscow.com>
>>Subject: Re: [Vision2020] You might be a real American
>>Date: Thu, 10 Aug 2006 16:46:03 -0700
>>
>>Dick,
>>
>>Again your ignorance is appalling.
>>
>>I am a nonbeliever (not an atheist) which means that I believe the
>>evidence
>>purporting to establish supernatural claims including religious ones is
>>such that the probability of the truth of any such claim is very close to
>>zero. I remain open to new, verifiable evidence on the subject. The
>>evidence given by the state of the world today is greatly against the
>>existence of a benevolent, powerful deity. If such a state is evidence of
>>a deity, it is evidence of a sadistic, bumbling one. Any fool who reads
>>the news can see this. But you are not just any fool, you are a special
>>one.
>>
>>I am sorry that you are so pathetically weak that you cannot live
>>comfortably without your religious fantasies -- some of which appear to be
>>crueler than those of Hitler.
>>
>>W.
>>
>>----- Original Message -----
>>From: Dick Sherwin
>>To: Vision2020 ; Art Deco
>>Sent: Thursday, August 10, 2006 3:57 PM
>>Subject: Re: [Vision2020] You might be a real American
>>
>>
>>What is appaling to me is your total loyalty to the cult of atheism which
>>is little more than a religion of rejection of God.
>> ----- Original Message -----
>> From: Art Deco
>> To: Vision 2020
>> Sent: Thursday, August 10, 2006 3:21 PM
>> Subject: Re: [Vision2020] You might be a real American
>>
>>
>> Your ignorance is appalling.
>>
>> W.
>> ----- Original Message -----
>> From: Dick Sherwin
>> To: Art Deco
>> Sent: Thursday, August 10, 2006 1:32 PM
>> Subject: Re: [Vision2020] You might be a real American
>>
>>
>> I do not condem Christianity, or consider it a cult. You have quoted
>>from the Old Testament law, which was mitigated by Jesus through
>>atonement.
>>
>> Christians believe all sins not reiterated from the Old Testament to
>> the
>>New Testament were atoned for through the blood of Christ.
>>
>> Sorry, your little rouse was for no effect, unless you can quote to me
>>from the New Testament where these laws were carried forth from the OT.
>>
>> Dick S.
>>
>> ----- Original Message -----
>> From: Art Deco
>> To: Vision 2020
>> Sent: Thursday, August 10, 2006 9:24 AM
>> Subject: Re: [Vision2020] You might be a real American
>>
>>
>> Dick,
>>
>> You write:
>>
>> "I agree, everyone should have the right to worship as they believe,
>>so long as their religion does not preach death and destruction on others
>>because of their beliefs. "
>>
>> Do you then roundly and unequivocally condemn the religious cult that
>>holds the following views?
>>
>> W.
>>
>> http://www.credenda.org/old/issues/vol3/magi3-9.htm
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> "The civil magistrate is the minister of God to execute wrath on the
>>wrongdoer (Rom. 13:4). God has not left his civil minister without
>>guidance
>>on how to exercise his office. The Scriptures set forth clear standards of
>>judgment for many offenses. Capital crimes, for example, include
>>premeditated killing (murder), kidnapping, sorcery, bestiality, adultery,
>>homosexuality, and cursing one's parents..."
>>
>>
>>
>> "In contemporary American jurisprudence, none of these offenses is
>>punishable by death, with the occasional exception of murder. The
>>magistrates have dispensed with God's standards of justice. Some
>>Christians
>>believe this is an improvement. They would be horrified to think that the
>>"harsh" penalties of the law should still be applied. Sometimes this is
>>the
>>result of the mistaken belief that the Old Testament has no further
>>application after the advent of Christ. This is an exegetical problem. Too
>>often, it is the result of a sinful view of the criminal. This sin is
>>called pity."
>>
>> "If your brother, the son of your mother, your son or your daughter,
>>the wife of your bosom, or your friend who is as your own soul, secretly
>>entices you, saying, "Let us go and serve other gods,". . . you shall not
>>consent to him or listen to him, nor shall your eye pity him, nor shall
>>you
>>spare him or conceal him; but you shall surely kill him..." [Heresy:
>>Beware, ye not of the cult (including unconverted Jews)!]
>>
>> "If two men fight together, and the wife of one draws near to rescue
>>her husband from the hand of the one attacking him, and puts out the hand
>>and seizes him by the genitals, then you shall cut off her hand; your eye
>>shall not pity her..."
>>
>>
>>
>> God commands the judge to evaluate the crime rather than the
>> criminal.
>>If the crime is one for which God requires death, then death must be the
>>punishment. Your eye shall not pity. Neither is the repentance of the
>>accused relevant to the imposition of the sentence.
>>
>> "Thus, the Bible teaches that pity is not an option where God has
>>decided the matter. The [civil] magistrate, God's minister, is to
>>faithfully execute justice according to God's standard, not man's... This
>>means that we must return to an obedience which confines pity within the
>>bounds which God has established for us."
>>
>>
>>
>> ----- Original Message -----
>> From: Dick Sherwin
>> To: Vision2020 ; Paul Rumelhart
>> Sent: Thursday, August 10, 2006 8:51 AM
>> Subject: Re: [Vision2020] You might be a real American
>>
>>
>> Paul Rumelhart wrote: "Your standards are too low. How about you
>> are
>>a True American if the ideas of freedom and liberty for all are important
>>to you? That includes the freedom to believe whatever religion you wish,
>>or none at all."
>> ___________________________________________
>>
>> Personally, I am a little weary of embracing the "whatever religion
>>you wish" syndrone. I agree, everyone should have the right to worship as
>>they believe, so long as their religion does not preach death and
>>destruction on others because of their beliefs. I am tired of the
>>so-called "Religion of Peace" and their attempts to acquire maximum kill
>>with their terrorist acts.
>>
>> As I said in my original post,
>> "I believe this is apporpriate as well as accurate. I realize there
>>are those who don't believe in any of this but to them all I have to say
>>is, "Oh well!"
>>
>> May God bless you, even if you don't believe in Him.
>>
>> Dick S.
>> ----- Original Message -----
>> From: Paul Rumelhart
>> To: Vision2020
>> Sent: Thursday, August 10, 2006 8:35 AM
>> Subject: Re: [Vision2020] You might be a real American
>>
>>
>> That's what it takes to be a True American? Not to be afraid to
>>show you are a christian? Not to burn the flag? To respect veterans and
>>your elders?
>>
>> Well, I almost made it. I'm not christian, so apparently I can't
>> be
>>a True American. Wonderful.
>>
>> Your standards are too low. How about you are a True American if
>>the ideas of freedom and liberty for all are important to you? That
>>includes the freedom to believe whatever religion you wish, or none at
>>all.
>>
>> If you support the First Amendment, I would say you are on the path
>>to being a "True American". If you care for your rights and the rights of
>>others equally, I'd say you are a True American. If you get enraged when
>>politicians "game the system", you are a True American.
>>
>> If you get angry when someone claims they are a "Patriot" when they
>>really mean that they blindly support the government or the status quo,
>>you
>>are a True American. Look up what it really means to be a Patriot
>>sometime. Start by imagining the courage it took for the Founding Fathers
>>to sign the Declaration of Independence and ponder what would have
>>happened
>>to each of them if the revolution had failed.
>>
>> The true values of this country are getting lost in this
>> "Christians
>>- the World's Only Persecuted Majority" crap. What values that have
>>managed to squeak through that mess are wantonly being pulverised by
>>Corporate America. I'd say the truest sign of whether or not you are a
>>True American is if you have had it up to here with all the crap that has
>>happened in the last couple of decades.
>>
>> Paul
>>
>> Dick Sherwin wrote:
>> I believe this is apporpriate as well as accurate. I realize
>>there are those who don't believe in any of this but to them all I have to
>>say is, "Oh well!"
>>
>> Dick S.
>>
>>
>> It is time to change from REDNECK humor to TRUE AMERICAN
>>Humor! Only I don't see it as Humor, but the correct way to LIVE YOUR
>>LIFE ! If you feel the same, pass this on to your True American
>>friends.
>> Ya'll know who ya' are...
>>
>> You might be a TRUE AMERICAN if: It never occurred to you to
>> be
>>offended by the phrase, "One nation, under God."
>>
>> You might be a TRUE AMERICAN if: You've never protested about
>>seeing the 10 Commandments posted in public places.
>>
>> You might be a TRUE AMERICAN if: You still say "Christmas"
>>instead of "Winter Festival."
>>
>> You might be a TRUE AMERICAN if: You bow your head when someone
>>prays.
>>
>> You might be a TRUE AMERICAN if: You stand and place your hand
>>over your heart when they play the National Anthem.
>>
>> You might be a TRUE AMERICAN if: You treat Viet Nam vets with
>>great respect, and always have.
>>
>> You might be a TRUE AMERICAN if: You've never burned an
>> American
>>flag.
>>
>> You might be a TRUE AMERICAN if: You know what you believe and
>>you aren't afraid to say so, no matter who is listening.
>>
>> You might be a TRUE AMERICAN if: You respect your elders and
>>expect your kids to do the same.
>>
>> You might be a TRUE AMERICAN if: You'd give your last dollar to
>>a friend.
>>
>> If you got this email from me, it is because I believe that you,
>>like me, have just enough TRUE AMERICAN in you to have the same
>>beliefs as those talked about in this email.
>>
>> God Bless the U S A ! and may the U.S.A. BEGIN TO PRAISE
>> AND
>>WORSHIP GOD the way we used to!!!
>>
>>
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