[Vision2020] Crazy train

[Ed]

Finally, we agree on something, Joe. However, I don't use the word "gay" when referring to homosexuals...
  ----- Original Message ----- 
  From: joekc at adelphia.net 
  To: Ed 
  Cc: Michael ; vision 2020 
  Sent: Saturday, April 22, 2006 6:19 PM
  Subject: Re: [Vision2020] Crazy train


  God did create Adam and Steve. He created human beings (at least you and I believe this) and like it or not some human beings are gay.

  --
  Joe Campbell

  ---- Ed <ecooper at turbonet.com> wrote: 

  =============
  Regarding sexuality being biologically determined...hmmm, I remember the gene theory, but it was disproved a couple years back. I'm sure more research is in the works though. With the cases of hermaphrodites, it's quite possible that they have mixed feelings..However, from testimonies of recent converts to heterosexuality, they said it was a conscious choice...a choice that is made to look better and better all the time from Hollywood, accepted norms, etc.. If God endorsed homosexuality, he would have created Adam and Steve, not Adam and Eve... How about the destruction of Sodom and Gomorrah?
    ----- Original Message ----- 
    From: joekc at adelphia.net 
    To: Michael 
    Cc: vision 2020 
    Sent: Saturday, April 22, 2006 1:05 PM
    Subject: Re: [Vision2020] Crazy train


    There is some interesting data suggesting that sexual orientation is biologically determined. A colleague of mine pointed out that this thesis was more likely to be advanced by a man than by a woman. (The author of the study was male -- I have his name in my notes but I can't remember it -- and it was a study of males.)

    Another friend -- who happens to be a lesbian -- told me that her conversion was a matter of conscious choice. She had it with men -- the lying, the cheating, the lack of commitment -- and decided to switch teams. She is a lesbian to this day, though I did try to tell her that her argument was an instance of the fallacy of small sample.

    --
    Joe Campbell

    ---- Michael <metzler at moscow.com> wrote: 

    =============
     

    >From Fallwell.com: "Not a single mainstream psychological, psychiatric or
    medical organization believes that changing one's sexual orientation is
    possible."

     

    I'm not sure how helpful this sort of claim is, in part due to what seems
    like an implied over-simplification of the issues. Compare, for example,
    what the likely percentage of successfully heterosexual males were in 1930
    in America with the percentage of successfully homosexual males in Sparta
    500 B.C.  Human sexuality is a wildly complex and mysterious phenomenon that
    is organically connected to physiology (that is the product of both 'nurture
    and nature') as well as broad cultural context and moral experience of the
    individual.  Apparently entire civilizations can to some degree 'change
    sexual orientation,' which is what I took Ed's argument to be.  In Sparta,
    the men typically wanted to settle down with women and have children when
    they were older, but this did not stop institutionalized homosexuality the
    permeated the sexual experience of Spartan men.  Given the way our culture
    is going, perhaps 40 years from now 60% of all men will be somewhat
    bi-sexual within their overall sexual experience.  If that was to happen,
    how would we even make sense out of the analysis above from Fallwell.com?
    Almost all Spartan men changed their sexual orientation at some point in
    their life. Or am I missing something?

     

    Michael Metzler     


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