[Vision2020] A Short Look at Phil Nisbet and the Truth
Phil Nisbet
pcnisbet1 at hotmail.com
Tue May 31 20:43:11 PDT 2005
Wayne writes
"Are you the author of the items labeled Exhibit 11a and 11b in the IDWR
Preliminary Order?
>This calls for a simple "Yes." or "No." answer."
Wayne, how many meanings can you attribute to " No, I did not prepare a
report for the Naylors."?
Was the no in Yiddish or perhaps I had Ivrit script up?
>From: "Art Deco" <deco at moscow.com>
>To: "Vision 2020" <vision2020 at moscow.com>
>Subject: Re: [Vision2020] A Short Look at Phil Nisbet and the Truth
>Date: Tue, 31 May 2005 19:27:30 -0700
>
>Phil,
>
>You are avoiding the question.
>
>Here it is again, only simpler:
>
>Are you the author of the items labeled Exhibit 11a and 11b in the IDWR
>Preliminary Order?
>
>
>
>This calls for a simple "Yes." or "No." answer.
>
>Avoiding directly answering this question will certainly destroy any
>credibility you may have on Vision 2020.
>
>Art Deco (Wayne A. Fox)
>deco at moscow.com
>
>
>
>
>----- Original Message -----
>From: "Phil Nisbet" <pcnisbet1 at hotmail.com>
>To: <vision2020 at moscow.com>
>Sent: Tuesday, May 31, 2005 4:55 PM
>Subject: Re: [Vision2020] A Short Look at Phil Nisbet and the Truth
>
>
> > Wayne
> >
> > And which part of "You have not read anything I have written" was not
> > comprhendible?
> >
> > If, for example, somebody else posts an article on the web titled "How I
> > Love Hitler" by Wayne Fox, should we assume that you are a Nazi Wayne?
> >
> > Yes there is something with my name on it that is part of the Naylors
>report
> > of 500 pages. No, I did not prepare a report for the Naylors.
> >
> > Phil Nisbet
> >
> >>From: "Art Deco" <deco at moscow.com>
> >>To: "Vision 2020" <vision2020 at moscow.com>
> >>Subject: Re: [Vision2020] Geeh melynda
> >>Date: Mon, 30 May 2005 15:40:45 -0700
> >>
> >>Phil,
> >>
> >>This is like pissing in the wind.
> >>
> >>Phil quotes me and responds:
> >>
> >>[Wayne writes
> >>
> >>"Only the dribble you wrote, was made part of the public record in the
> >>Naylor Farms water permit application, and was submitted by Naylor Farms
>to
> >>the IDWR attempting to demonstrate there was no connection between the
> >>water to be drawn from the Naylor Farms property and water drawn from
> >>Moscow wells."
> >>
> >>As I previously stated, you have never read anything that I have written
>on
> >>the subject.]
> >>
> >>Is this an admission that you did not write the material submitted under
> >>your name by Naylor Farms under oath in the first IDWR hearing on this
> >>matter?
> >>
> >>
> >>Phil writes:
> >>
> >>[What claims would those be Wayne? Because I have read all the
>testimony
> >>and all the relevant documents and see no evidence that anything that I
> >>have actually written or given testimony to has ever been refuted.]
> >>
> >>We must live in different universes.
> >>
> >>Here is a Conclusion of Law from the IDWR Preliminary Order in this
>matter
> >>that was drawn from your testimony and written material submitted under
> >>your name:
> >>
> >>-------------------------------------------------
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >>-------------------------------------------------
> >>
> >>
> >>In rebuttal, here is an excerpt from the Bush, et al letter referenced
> >>before. Notice the accusation of plagiarism in 4) below.
> >>
> >>----------------------------------------
> >>1) The sequence of sediments the Naylor wells will be
> >>pumping from is laterally equivalent to the upper Grande Ronde Basalt
>flows
> >>in Pullman and to a 200 ft thick sequence of sediments beneath the
>Wanapum
> >>Basalt in Moscow. Groundwater connection has not been proven, but
> >>conversely no evidence exists to indicate there is not a connection.
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >>2) The data presented for the ''D Street ridge" are weak
>at
> >>best and the presence of the structure is exceedingly speculative.
>Rocks
> >>in yards and retaining walls are hardly evidence of bedrock at shallow
> >>levels and are probably no more than ornamental stones. Even if such a
> >>ridge exists in the subsurface, both the city of Moscow and the
>University
> >>of Idaho have deep wells in the basalt and sediment sequence north of
>the
> >>purported ridge.
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >>3) Water levels are higher in the drill holes at Naylor
> >>Farms than they are in wells in Moscow, indicating that the Moscow wells
> >>are not up gradient from the Naylor Farms.
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >>4) Much of the background geologic information submitted
>by
> >>Naylor Farms, including the original of the Columbia River basalts, is
> >>either wrong or irrelevant, and does not reflect current geologic
>thinking.
> >> Much of the information was taken directly from a discredited popular
> >>book, whereas the primary literature was ignored.
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >>5) Most importantly, the applicant gave the false
>impression
> >>that work by Dr. John Bush and Dean L. Garwood, of the University of
>Idaho,
> >>independently corroborates the aquifer model developed by Naylor Farms.
> >>The work by Bush and Garwood over the past 10 years does not support the
> >>specifics of the geologic conclusions drawn in the application.
>Isolated
> >>facts were extracted from their work, placed out of context, and used to
> >>support a highly speculative model.
> >>
> >>-------------------------------------------
> >>
> >>In rebuttal, here are two excerpts from the Affidavit of Kevin Brackney:
> >>
> >>A. There is no evidence that the hydrologic sub-basins described by
> >>Phillip C. Nisbet in the Idaho Department of Water Resources Water
>Permit
> >>Application 87-10022 proceedings exist in sense that Nisbet described;
> >>there is no geologic evidence that the alleged D Street granitic ridge
> >>exists; the Moscow Pullman Basin is hydrologically, continuous because
>it
> >>is open at depth to the west. Therefore, in my professional opinion,
> >>Conclusion of Law No. 3 in the Preliminary Order issued in this matter
>is
> >>in error.
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >>B. The Idaho Department of Water Resources Preliminary Order issued
>in
> >>the 87-10022 permit proceedings dated December 1, 2004, hereinafter
> >>Preliminary Order, states that the sub-basins alleged by Nisbet were
> >>independently confirmed in a presentation given by geologist John Bush.
>I
> >>disagree with this conclusion. John Bush does describe a northwest
> >>trending topographic high in the vicinity of Pullman, Washington. There
>is
> >>some hydrologic evidence that this topographic high isolates Pullman
>Wells
> >>from Moscow Wells, but this topographic high will not isolate Moscow
>wells
> >>nor Latah County rural wells from the proposed drawdown effects at
>Naylor
> >>Farms. Therefore, in my professional opinion, this is further evidence
> >>that Conclusion of Law No. 3 in the Preliminary Order is in error.
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >>C. The Preliminary Order concludes that the Moscow City Wells are
> >>up-gradient from Naylor Farms. I disagree with this conclusion. As
> >>described above the Naylor Farms are interpreted to be wholly contained
> >>within the Moscow Basin. It is believed that the cone of depression
>created
> >>by large scale pumping of wells completed in the Wanapum Aquifer will
> >>overwhelm the natural hydraulic gradient. Because Naylor Farms is
>located
> >>in a ground water recharge zone on the margin of Moscow Mountain (the
> >>Palouse Range), it is more likely that Naylor Farms are up-gradient from
> >>the Moscow wells. Nisbet estimated that the water level in the Naylor
> >>boring was 200 ft higher than Moscow wells (Permit Proceedings, Naylor
> >>Exhibit 11a, p. 4). I have reviewed Naylor's data and estimated a
> >>hydraulic head differential of approximately 150 ft between the Naylor
> >>boring and the Wanapum Aquifer at University of Idaho Well No. 2 (See
> >>Figure 1 below). Because ground water moves from higher potential to
>lower
> >>potential the Naylor boring should be interpreted as being up-gradient
>of
> >>Moscow wells. Therefore in my professional opinion, Finding of Fact No.
>9
> >>in the Preliminary Order is in error.
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >>39. During the proceedings at issue, Phillip C. Nisbet provided a
> >>written report in which he alleged several “sub-basins.” He alleged
>that
> >>the alleged, so-called “Naylor Sub-basin” was hydrologically isolated
>from
> >>the alleged, so-called “Moscow Sub-basin” (Permit Proceedings, Naylor
> >>Exhibit 11a).
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >>40. I have reviewed the evidence for these sub-basins, looked at the
> >>“outcrops” referenced in his report, and discussed the evidence with
>John
> >>Kauffman who also reviewed the evidence (See Figure 6, Letter from Bush,
>et
> >>al, 2004 below).
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >>41. In short there is very little evidence, if any, for the
>existence
> >>of these hydrologic sub-basins.
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >>42. The Nisbet alleged, so-called “outcrops” on “D Street” in Moscow
> >>consist of retaining walls of quartzite and basalt and are believed to
>be
> >>imported along with other concrete, brick, and railroad tie retaining
>walls
> >>also in the area.
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >>43. The Nisbet alleged, so-called “D St. Ridge” is simply one of
>many
> >>eroded Palouse Hills that exist in Moscow.
> >>
> >>-----------------------------------------------
> >>
> >>
> >>You can respond to this post if you like. I could have quoted a great
>deal
> >>more from the public record and from newspaper articles featuring your
> >>statements to respond to all your points, but this is enough pissing
>into
> >>the wind.
> >>
> >>My purpose in responding in the first place was to show interested V
>2020
> >>readers that when Naylor Farms applies for further permits in Latah
>County
> >>or elsewhere, statements made by them and/or their agents are to be
>taken
> >>with a gargantuan grain of salt and examined very, very closely.
> >>
> >>Readers can decide for themselves at this point if I have demonstrated
> >>such.
> >>
> >>Art Deco (Wayne A. Fox)
> >>deco at moscow.com
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >>----- Original Message -----
> >>From: "Phil Nisbet" <pcnisbet1 at hotmail.com>
> >>To: <vision2020 at moscow.com>
> >>Sent: Sunday, May 29, 2005 7:59 PM
> >>Subject: Re: [Vision2020] Geeh melynda
> >>
> >>
> >> > Wayne writes
> >> >
> >> > "Only the dribble you wrote, was made part of the public record in
>the
> >> > Naylor Farms water permit application, and was submitted by Naylor
>Farms
> >>to
> >> > the IDWR attempting to demonstrate there was no connection between
>the
> >>water
> >> > to be drawn from the Naylor Farms property and water drawn from
>Moscow
> >> > wells."
> >> >
> >> > As I previously stated, you have never read anything that I have
>written
> >>on
> >> > the subject.
> >> >
> >> > Wayne writes
> >> >
> >> > "At the last IDWR hearing all the protestants/interveners'
> >> > geologists/hydrologists demolished your claims. Even the geologist
> >>hired by
> >> > Naylor farms admitted that he was unable to verify or agree
> >>substantially
> >> > with your claims."
> >> >
> >> > What claims would those be Wayne? Because I have read all the
>testimony
> >>and
> >> > all the relevant documents and see no evidence that anything that I
>have
> >> > actually written or given testimony to has ever been refuted. As a
> >>matter
> >> > of fact, Wayne, testing currently on going north of town is proving
>my
> >> > point. The real and very interesting question that did come out of
> >>those
> >> > testimonies is how flawed the operational model is.
> >> >
> >> >
> >> > Wayne goes on
> >> >
> >> > "Why don't you tell us exactly how many shares the Naylor Farms
> >>principals
> >> > own in I-Minerals? And what percentage of total I-Mineral stock that
> >>is?
> >> > Let's see how honest you are."
> >> >
> >> > Its public record Wayne, they own about 10% of the company. 10% of
>the
> >> > company is not a control block Wayne and they do not have a seat on
>the
> >> > board. The company is controled (Over 50% of the shares fully
>diluted)
> >>by
> >> > one very large shareholder, who does have a seat on the board. He is
> >>not
> >> > related to the Naylors and does not have any interest in their farm.
> >> >
> >> > Then Wayne asserts
> >> >
> >> > "As there being no connection between Naylor Farms, others will
>conclude
> >> > quite differently from your no-connection-assertion once they see the
> >> > figures about holdings requested above, which you can easily
>present."
> >> >
> >> > Well Wayne, the Naylor family owning a 10% stake in a firm seems
>pretty
> >> > straight forward as a sign that they do not control the company i
> >>minerals
> >> > inc. They have no seat on its board of directors and not one of the
> >> > officers or employees of i minerals inc has any financial or family
>tie
> >>to
> >> > Naylor Farms.
> >> >
> >> > Wayne then writes
> >> >
> >> > "John Bush and two other geologists wrote a scathing letter to the
>IDWR
> >> > about how you misused their data. [For those interested, I can
>supply a
> >> > copy of this document -- a large PDF file.] Comments were also made
>by
> >> > other geologists about the uselessness of your core samples because
>of
> >>the
> >> > methods and lack of proper/standard documentation/labeling."
> >> >
> >> > Wayne, I seriously doubt that you have any statements that the core
>was
> >> > mislabeled. All core blocks are in their proper places. The trouble
>is
> >> > that no other geologist has ever bothered to drop by, largely due to
>the
> >> > controversy you provided, and actually look at the core. The quick
>logs
> >> > were properly done for what the hole was, a geological and not a
>water
> >>hole.
> >> >
> >> > You confuse the issue, Wayne, since the objections you reference were
> >>that
> >> > water well drilling forms that your hydrologists are used to were not
> >>used.
> >> > That should amaze nobody, since the holes were geological core holes
>and
> >> > never meant to be water wells.
> >> >
> >> > John had previously mapped the area in question as granite. Its not.
> >>If
> >> > you look at John's revised maps and his plots, the data I developed
>is
> >> > clearly shown. Prior to the holes being drilled and the information
> >>being
> >> > logged, sections for the area showed granite below a thin veneer of
> >>Palouse
> >> > Formation. Now we know that Sediment of Bovill, Wanapum Basalt and
> >>Vantage
> >> > member of the Latah Formation all occur in a 470 foot thick package
> >>below
> >> > section 29. Since holes drilled south of Naylor Farms at the
>Junction
> >>of
> >> > Foothills Road and Highway 95 hit Granite at a depth of 190-200 feet,
> >>that
> >> > is pretty clearly a geological barrier to water flow between Moscow
>and
> >>the
> >> > Northern area. If you had bothered to look at even Your expert Dr
> >>Elliots
> >> > testimony, you would have seen that I am not the only person who
>noted
> >>the
> >> > presence of a buried ridge.
> >> >
> >> > As for the letter John put forward, you might consider what he was
> >>replying
> >> > to and if anything he was replying to had anything to do with me.
>The
> >> > concept of an E-W ridge below D Street is not mine and I find the
>idea
> >>of
> >> > its presence doubtful. However, there is a channel similar to the
> >>Moscow
> >> > Channel which shows up in well logs and outcrops north of the Moscow
>and
> >> > which is paralell to the Moscow Channel. Those rwo channels are
> >>seperated
> >> > by a well documented ridge line. It has no effect on movement of
>water
> >> > within the Sediment of Bovill and its four established water bearing
> >> > horizons, but does impact what happens within the upper and lower
> >>Vantage
> >> > member sands.
> >> >
> >> > They Wayne writes
> >> >
> >> > "The purpose of Kevin's affidavit was to rebut your claims. [For
>those
> >> > interested, I can supply a copy of Kevin's first affidavit. It is a
> >>very
> >> > large Word document.] He even indirectly suggested in it that you
>could
> >>not
> >> > tell a geological formation from a rock dump."
> >> >
> >> > If you would like Wayne I will see if Kevin wants to put forward a
> >>letter
> >> > stating anything like that. I seriously doubt that he will.
> >> >
> >> > And of course there is this set of Wayne's world
> >> >
> >> > "Kevin's version of the telephone conversation is the opposite and
>made
> >> > under oath. Naylor Farms' attorney had notice of Kevin's testimony
>of
> >>this
> >> > before the last IDWR hearing. Is it not clear why you were not
>called
> >>by
> >> > the Naylor Farms attorney in this hearing to rebut this claim?"
> >> >
> >> > Once again, I have not changed my opinion on anything that I have
> >>actually
> >> > written or that I gave as testemony under oath. Kevin knows that and
> >>you
> >> > might be better off actually talking to him.
> >> >
> >> > Finally this from Wayne
> >> >
> >> > "Sue away. I cannot help if the Latah County Prosecutor failed to
>make
> >>a
> >> > complete investigation before he acted. But sue. But look up the
>law
> >>on
> >> > public figures so that you do not unintentionally make your attorneys
> >>much
> >> > richer. But if you sue, expect a rigorous counteraction and a very
> >> > searching discovery process. I will not make the same mistake the
> >> > prosecutor did"
> >> >
> >> > The Prosecutor did not have a case not for lack of investigation
>Wayne,
> >>but
> >> > because there was no wrong doing. The Idaho Board of Professional
> >> > Geologists stated that pretty clearly in their March letter.
>Further,
> >>the
> >> > Nez Perce County Prosecutor found no criminal act had taken place.
> >> >
> >> > On the otherhand Wayne, John Bush is not a licenced Geologist, nor
>are
> >>any
> >> > of the three geologists you mentioned having written a 'scathing'
> >>letter.
> >> > As a matter of fact Wayne, not one person currently employed by the
> >>Idaho
> >> > Geological Survey is a licenced geologist. 90% of the professors at
>the
> >>U
> >> > of I are also not licenced. Of the hundred or so geologists in the
>area
> >> > there are only 6 with licences. Heck, even CE Brockway, the high
>priced
> >> > Hydrologist hired by the county who gave testimony at the last
>hearing
> >>is
> >> > not a licenced geologist, though it is patently not legal for the
>county
> >>or
> >> > any other state agency to contract any person to do geology or
>hydrology
> >>who
> >> > is not a holder of that licence.
> >> >
> >> > I am actually one of the only people without a licence who works and
>is
> >> > exempt.
> >> >
> >> > You and a few buddies of yours went on a rampage which, had you
>looked
> >>at
> >> > it, could have put some of the very people on whom you have relied
>into
> >>deep
> >> > hot water.
> >> >
> >> >
> >> > Phil Nisbet
> >> >
> >> > _________________________________________________________________
> >> > Express yourself instantly with MSN Messenger! Download today - it's
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> >> >
> >> > _____________________________________________________
> >> > List services made available by First Step Internet,
> >> > serving the communities of the Palouse since 1994.
> >> > http://www.fsr.net
> >> > mailto:Vision2020 at moscow.com
> >> > ¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯
> >> >
> >> >
> >>_____________________________________________________
> >> List services made available by First Step Internet,
> >> serving the communities of the Palouse since 1994.
> >> http://www.fsr.net
> >> mailto:Vision2020 at moscow.com
> >>¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯
> >
> > _________________________________________________________________
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> >
> > _____________________________________________________
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> > serving the communities of the Palouse since 1994.
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> > mailto:Vision2020 at moscow.com
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> >
> >
>_____________________________________________________
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> serving the communities of the Palouse since 1994.
> http://www.fsr.net
> mailto:Vision2020 at moscow.com
>¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯
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