[Vision2020] Re: Schizophrenic

[Donovan Arnold]

Ms. Kraut,

I am afraid you are missing the argument being made
here. I am not talking about THE terms used to
describe people. What I am talking about is referring
to people by their disability or a problem that they
have.

Just as people do not like to be referred to by their
color of their hair, people with disabilities do not
like to be referred to by their disability.

If someone is in a wheel chair they do not like it
when people refer to them as the wheelchair person, or
the person with no legs, or the lady that cannot walk.
No, they, like you and me, liked to be called by their
name. People do not like to be referred to and defined
by their problems, disabilities, or a situation that
they are in. Reducing people and defining people to
their problems is insulting and disrespectful. 

Referring to everybody by their name except people
with a disability is a form of social exclusion. 

People are not their hair color, weight, skin color,
problems and disabilities. People are more then this. 

Take Care,

Donovan J Arnold

--- Pat Kraut <pkraut at moscow.com> wrote:

> You are taking this much too personally. People can
> say all sorts of things
> and it does not demean all mentally ill people. It
> is a term...just another
> thing to call people. Relax, take deep breathes it
> isn't that important. My
> mother was certain communitys 'crazy lady' and the
> only mentally ill person
> that many people knew. She took college classes and
> expanded her sphere of
> influence for 'crazy' actions. Mentally ill people
> say and do things that
> are talked about and held up to ridicule because
> they are 'crazy'. It has
> nothing to do with who you or I are.
> PK
> 
> ----- Original Message ----- 
> From: "Donovan Arnold"
> <donovanjarnold2005 at yahoo.com>
> To: "Pat Kraut" <pkraut at moscow.com>; "vision2020"
> <vision2020 at moscow.com>
> Sent: Wednesday, May 04, 2005 8:37 PM
> Subject: Re: [Vision2020] Re: Schizophrenic
> 
> 
> Pat,
> 
> I am sorry to hear that you had to go through the
> experience of watching someone close suffer from
> Schizophrenia. I have also had that experience. I
> have
> also worked with individuals that have
> schizophrenia.
> I have seen the toll and toil that it can take on a
> person and their family. It is enough to break apart
> even the strongest and most resilient of families.
> You
> are a strong person for surviving that experience.
> 
> However, referring to people as "the resident
> schizophrenic" is discriminatory and derogatory,
> even
> if the diagnosis is medically correct. People are
> not
> their disability, and communities are not assigned
> quotas of people with a mental illness. Your mother
> was not your community's schizophrenic. She was your
> mother. And a person who had a disability and
> deserved
> respect.
> 
> Take Care,
> 
> Donovan J Arnold
> 
> 
> --- Pat Kraut <pkraut at moscow.com> wrote:
> 
> > I got it from a life of living with someone
> > diagnosed as a paranoid
> > Schizophrenic. This is a term used only since the
> > 1970's or so. Before that
> > they said that the reason my mother was so much
> > trouble was because the
> > 'family had problems'. If you've ever tried to
> live
> > with someone delusional
> > it definitely can make for family problems. These
> > diagnosis were much more
> > accurate after they could really examine the brain
> > and body chemistry and
> > have changed many times through the years. Another
> > change will only confuse
> > the issues more. It was a very interesting time.
> The
> > truly mentally ill live
> > in a very lonely private world that no one else
> can
> > really get into. My
> > mother recently died still living in that very
> > private world. Doug's
> > conspiracies were his own and coldhearted logic
> > helped the rest of us on
> > Vision 2020 to see the illogical side of his
> > arguments. Yes, I would say he
> > was the resident of Vision 2020's Schizophrenic,
> > Donovan. On the other hand
> > when it comes to paranoia there are some others
> who
> > recently can certainly
> > come close.
> > Just saw an advertisement for the new 'Frontline'
> > that is going to show some
> > of the issues dealing with this issue. Should be a
> > very complicated program
> > because it is that kind of a problem.
> >
> >
> > ----- Original Message ----- 
> > From: "cjs" <cjs at turbonet.com>
> > To: "Pat Kraut" <pkraut at moscow.com>
> > Cc: <vision2020 at moscow.com>
> > Sent: Wednesday, May 04, 2005 1:32 PM
> > Subject: Re: [Vision2020] Re: Schizophrenic
> >
> >
> > Pat - where did you get your doctorate?
> >
> > Phil
> >
> >
> > -----Original message-----
> > From: "Pat Kraut" pkraut at moscow.com
> > Date: Wed,  4 May 2005 11:08:51 -0700
> > To: "vision2020" vision2020 at moscow.com
> > Subject: Re: [Vision2020] Re: Schizophrenic
> >
> > > Donovan: I thought the reference to Doug and
> this
> > illness was most
> > > appropriate. He was very delusional and paranoid
> > about certain groups and
> > > the government. His posts and what I know of him
> > away from vision 2020 fit
> > > very well in this diagnosis. Yes, way too many
> > people think it is some
> > sort
> > > of split personality because this was the term
> > many years ago but that is
> > > now called bi-polar. I am well aware of
> > Schizophrenia and what it does to
> > > families and I am also somewhat aware of Doug's
> > problems. He was very ill
> > > and I am sure that his family is struggling.
> > Thanks for the lesson.
> > > PK
> > >
> > >
> > > ----- Original Message ----- 
> > > From: "Donovan Arnold"
> > <donovanjarnold2005 at yahoo.com>
> > > To: <joanopyr at earthlink.net>;
> > <vision2020 at moscow.com>
> > > Sent: Wednesday, May 04, 2005 10:06 AM
> > > Subject: [Vision2020] Re: Schizophrenic
> > >
> > >
> > > "who was once our resident schizophrenic."--Joan
> > Opyr
> > >
> > > This is the third time in the last few months
> that
> > I
> > > have heard the term "schizophrenic" used in a
> > > derogatory manner.
> > >
> > > Let me explain something to people that do this
> > and
> > > obviously do not know people struggling with it.
> > > Schizophrenia is a REAL mental illness. It has
> > nothing
> > > to do with split personality. Nor does it strike
> > > people because they are bad people. It is caused
> > by
> > > the slow deterioration of parts of the brain.
> > There is
> > > no cure for it. It is a mental illness that is
> > very
> > > challenging to those that have it.
> > >
> > > Many thousands of families have to deal with the
> > pain
> > > and mental anguish of watching someone close to
> > them
> > > get worse and worse and not being able to do
> > anything
> > > about it. It is even worse when you watch it in
> > > children and young adults.
> > >
> > > I do not care your background, education, or
> > > experience. When you use the term schizophrenic
> in
> > a
> > > derogatory and offense term you are hurting more
> > then
> > > just the person you are targeting and publicly
> > > humiliating many people with a real disability
> > that is
> > > life threatening and challenging.
> > >
> > > I ask that people to please STOP doing this.
> > >
> > > Take Care,
> > >
> > > Donovan J Arnold
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > > --- "joanopyr at earthlink.net"
> > <joanopyr at earthlink.net>
> 
=== message truncated ===


		
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