[Vision2020] Moscow is Being Used - Yeah, but by whom is thetrue question

[J Ford]

Ok, you need to try reading that enrire chapter.

Deborah was a prophetis and a "judge of Israel" and at the time of this 
particular passage, "And she would sit under the palm tree of Deborah 
between Ramah and Bethel in the mountains of Ephraim.  And the children of 
Israel came up to her for judgement." (Judges 4:5)

She states to Israel what was going to happen at God's hand in regards to a 
battle with Sisera (a MALE leader, BTW) and how Sisera will be delivered up 
to Israel: "Up! For this is the day in which the Lord has delivered Sisera 
into your hand. Has not the Lord gone out before you?" (Judges 4:14)  The 
passage clearly states Barak's resistance to go into battle without Deborah; 
she goes with him but it was not what God had wanted to have happen - and 
not because she was a woman.

To end that chapter of the Bible, Israel won the battle and Israel "rested 
for forty years" afterwards...with Deborah in their midst.  In fact, "Then 
Deborah and Barak sang on that day." (Judges 5:1)

The WHOLE Bible needs to be read as a WHOLE, not just parts that say what 
you want it to.

J  ;)



>From: "New man" <1564_2 at mail.com>
>To: vision2020 at moscow.com
>Subject: RE: [Vision2020] Moscow is Being Used - Yeah, but by whom is 
>thetrue question
>Date: Thu, 07 Jul 2005 02:22:50 -0500
>
>JFord,
>
>You seem to think there is something wrong with promoting men to
>positions of leadership, as opposed to women. You should consider
>Deborah, in the Bible:
>
>"And she said, I will surely go with thee: notwithstanding the journey
>that thou takest shall not be for thine honour; for the LORD shall sell
>Sisera into the hand of a woman. And Deborah arose, and went with Barak
>to Kedesh" (Judges 4:9).
>
>Deborah knew that being led by a woman was something to be ashamed of,
>even though she was a woman.
>
>   ----- Original Message -----
>   From: "J Ford"
>   To: vision2020 at moscow.com
>   Subject: RE: [Vision2020] Moscow is Being Used - Yeah, but by whom is
>   the true question
>   Date: Wed, 06 Jul 2005 23:28:13 -0700
>
>   >
>   > Not sure who you think is listening, but obviously you don't listen
>   > very well. Not only is Wilson elbow deep in politics, he is
>   > encouraging and promoting members of CC to get into the political
>   > arena in Moscow. Paul Kimmell is a prime example of Doug
>   > supporting the political ambitions of his men CC members.
>   >
>   > Maybe what you meant is that he is not encouraging everyone in CC
>   > to join the political field - he does seem to be continuing to
>   > groom certain men vs. others.
>   >
>   > And your name is GOD is it? that you can declare someone a
>   > God-hater as well as irreligious? People can and do disagree on
>   > many things including God's will, but that does not mean they hate
>   > God or are not faithful to Him. Calling someone a God hater
>   > without knowing them in person is irresponsible and risky.
>   >
>   > Innocents are those free of blame, guiltless, above suspicion, in
>   > the clear, etc. Since Adam and Eve were the originators of sin and
>   > our sin comes from them, we - none of us - are guiltless or "in the
>   > clear...including you and Doug W.
>   >
>   > Seems to me being intolerant can and does flow in two directions.
>   >
>   > J ;)
>   >
>   >
>   >
>   > > From: "the man" <1564 at mail.com>
>   > > To: vision2020 at moscow.com
>   > > Subject: [Vision2020] Moscow is Being Used
>   > > Date: Wed, 06 Jul 2005 18:16:07 -0500
>   >
>   > >
>   > > Citizens of Moscow,
>   > >
>   > > Some people revile Pastor Doug Wilson for encouraging us to stay
>   out of
>   > > politics. They don’t understand: Politics will never save us.
>   > > Politics is not a panacea. This was made very clear last night
>   when our
>   > > elected city officials decided to delay fixing the zoning fiasco
>   until
>   > > October 1st!
>   > >
>   > > Moscow! Look how you’re being used! Look how you’ve become
>   > > the instrument of persecution for a handful of irreligious God
>   haters.
>   > >
>   > > Moscow! Look how the intoloristas have made you their weapon to
>   strike
>   > > the innocent!
>   > >
>   > > Moscow! Your children weep for your lack of discernment!
>   > >
>   > > --
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