[Vision2020] Kerry's election to lose?
Tom Hansen
thansen@moscow.com
Sun, 9 May 2004 06:19:34 -0700
As far as " . . . who gave the orders and why it was thought they should
follow them . . . " is concerned, Ms. Kraut. It is common knowledge that
certain individuals have been charged with crimes connected to these
incidents. Don't you think that it would compromise the proceedings if this
knowledge were released?
Tom Hansen
Not On The Palouse, Not Ever
"Patriotism is not a short and frenzied outburst of emotion but the tranquil
and steady dedication of a lifetime." --Adlai E. Stevenson, Jr.
> -----Original Message-----
> From: vision2020-admin@moscow.com [mailto:vision2020-admin@moscow.com]On
> Behalf Of Pat Kraut
> Sent: Friday, May 07, 2004 3:10 PM
> To: vision2020
> Subject: Re: [Vision2020] Kerry's election to lose?
>
>
> My goodness, you can all certainly surmiss a lot from a few words!! I did
> not say nor mean in any way suggest that the soldier took the
> photos, but I
> am interested in who did and didn't know that at some point someone would
> look at them and not like it at all. The problem was already under
> investigation as I understand the committee meetings before the actions
> taken by the soldier. Kennedy was so busy getting his usual whine out that
> he asked almost no questions of any value. And if we are talking about the
> army and the chain of command, I'd like to know who gave the
> orders and why
> it was thought they should follow them.
> While I am not fully happy with Rumsfeld, Bush is making the decisions and
> at this time I am OK with his knowing of the man and the actions to be
> taken. But, I have been known to change my mind.
> I sure like the comments of Cunningham from California today. Which is
> shocking for me to say I like anything from Cal.
> PK
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "Carl Westberg" <carlwestberg846@hotmail.com>
> To: <vision2020@moscow.com>
> Sent: Friday, May 07, 2004 10:38 AM
> Subject: Re: [Vision2020] Kerry's election to lose?
>
>
> > Actually, Pat, according to the New Yorker article, Mr. Darby placed an
> > anonymous note under the door of a superior detailing the abuses. He
> didn't
> > do it to "make a name for himself". He saw horrible wrongs and reported
> > them, at no small risk to himself, hence the anonymity. As his mother
> said,
> > "I hope they put him somewhere safe."
> >
> >
> >
> > Carl Westberg Jr.
> >
> >
> > >From: "Pat Kraut" <pkraut@moscow.com>
> > >To: "vision2020" <vision2020@moscow.com>
> > >Subject: Re: [Vision2020] Kerry's election to lose?
> > >Date: Fri, 7 May 2004 10:15:51 -0700
> > >
> > >What she actually said is: "Hold on to your seats, its going to be a
> bumpy
> > >night."
> > >The soldier only told the press, as I am hearing it on the coverage of
> the
> > >committee hearings it was already under investigation. All he
> has done is
> > >make a name for himself in the news. I have so many questions
> about this
> > >and so far many of the senators are only pontificating getting their
> 'sound
> > >bite' in. I am waiting and listening till we get to more info. What I'd
> > >really like to know is who took the photos and what were they
> going to do
> > >with them if not give them to the press? Save them for their
> grandchildren?
> > >It is all seriously stupid.
> > >PK
> > > ----- Original Message -----
> > > From: Tom Hansen
> > > To: Pat Kraut ; vision2020
> > > Sent: Friday, May 07, 2004 5:51 AM
> > > Subject: RE: [Vision2020] Kerry's election to lose?
> > >
> > >
> > > Alas! Something that Ms. Kraut and I can truly agree upon.
> > >
> > > Yes. I think that the election in November is going to make the one
> in
> > >2000 look like a grade school vote for hallway monitor.
> > >
> > > Just under six months to go with virtually a dead-even race between
> Bush
> > >and Kerry with Nader's 3% to 6% in the balance, not to mention 275
> million
> > >Americans.
> > >
> > > As a famous actress once said, "Fasten your seat belts.
> It's going to
> > >get a little bumpy."
> > >
> > > Put on your raincoat, as well. The weather forecast is for isolated
> and
> > >increased muckslinging from now through October.
> > >
> > > As Don Henley put it so aptly:
> > >
> > > Dirty little secrets
> > > Dirty little lies
> > > We got our dirty little fingers in everybody's pie
> > > We love to cut you down to size
> > > We love dirty laundry
> > >
> > > Take care,
> > >
> > > Tom Hansen
> > > Just another liberal elitist loose in the Palouse
> > >
> > > "Patriotism is not a short and frenzied outburst of emotion but the
> > >tranquil and steady dedication of a lifetime."
> > > - - Adlai E. Stevenson, Jr.
> > >
> > > -----Original Message-----
> > > From: vision2020-admin@moscow.com
> > >[mailto:vision2020-admin@moscow.com]On Behalf Of Pat Kraut
> > > Sent: Thursday, May 06, 2004 10:23 PM
> > > To: vision2020
> > > Subject: Re: [Vision2020] Kerry's election to lose?
> > >
> > >
> > > This is most interesting. Anyone brave enough to actually make a
> > >prediction on this election is amazing. I for one would not
> make any call
> > >at all. Yes, I know how I will vote and that is probably the
> same as this
> > >state but that is not a surprise. It is the surprise states that will
> make
> > >the difference. It will make for a long night.
> > > PK
> > > ----- Original Message -----
> > > From: Joan Opyr
> > > To: Vision2020 Moscow
> > > Sent: Thursday, May 06, 2004 3:40 PM
> > > Subject: [Vision2020] Kerry's election to lose?
> > >
> > >
> > > Snipped from a piece by Paul M. Weyrich, detailing speakers and
> > >events at a recent conservative gathering, for CNSNews, 5/5/04:
> > >
> > >
> > > ". . . . But it was pollster John Zogby who gave the most
> intriguing
> > >briefing. Zogby has to be taken seriously because he got it right when
> > >almost all the pollsters had it wrong in 2000. He also caught
> the slight
> > >tilt toward the Republicans on the eve of the 2002 elections.
> > >
> > > What he told the group upset most of them -- but his
> message came
> > >through loud and clear. While most pollsters view this
> election as Bush's
> > >to lose, he believes this election is Kerry's to lose.
> > >
> > > He said that usually at this time of year, 20-25% of the
> electorate
> > >is undecided, but this year there only 5% of the electorate is
> undecided.
> > >Finding such people when polling is becoming exceedingly difficult, he
> told
> > >us. Moreover, the soft vote, that is the people who MIGHT be
> persuaded to
> > >vote for the other guy, is only 10% -- a historic low.
> > >
> > > Zogby believes that this election most resembles that
> of 1800 when
> > >John Adams was running for re-election. Thomas Jefferson was his
> opponent.
> > >He surprised the group by reciting some of the nasty things that were
> said
> > >by both sides in that election. Zogby said that when we hear
> that this is
> > >the nastiest election in history, it is not necessarily the case.
> > >
> > > Zogby went on to detail his thesis that there really are two
> > >Americas. The social and political differences between the
> "blue" states,
> > >which Al Gore carried in 2000, and the "red" states, which Bush carried
> in
> > >that election, are profound in every category and becoming more so.
> > >
> > > Thus, Bush is really trying to carry those states that
> he carried
> in
> > >2000 plus a few others while Kerry is trying to keep what Gore carried.
> If
> > >he can just add a state or two to the Gore total...Kerry wins. Zogby
> > >suggested it might be possible for Bush to carry the popular vote but
> lose
> > >the election, the reverse of what happened in 2000 when Gore had more
> than
> > >a half million votes more than Bush.
> > >
> > > Zogby told us that while this is Kerry's election to lose, he
> might
> > >just lose it. He absolutely dismissed suggestions that are
> coming up from
> > >both the left and right that Kerry is proving to be such a bad
> candidate
> he
> > >might be replaced. He thinks Kerry will rise to the occasion at the end
> of
> > >the campaign, when it counts.
> > >
> > > Zogby said to remember Gov. Bill Weld, who was thought to be the
> > >favorite against Kerry but who lost a close election when Kerry came
> alive
> > >and beat him. He said Kerry, like Bush in 2000, is constantly
> > >underestimated. He thinks veterans will be crucial in this election and
> > >right now Kerry has an edge with veterans because he has
> emphasized them
> so
> > >much and because there is some dissatisfaction with the way
> that Bush is
> > >handling the war. That however, according to Zogby, could change.
> > >
> > > While most re-election campaigns tend to be decisive,
> that is, we
> > >re-elect the incumbent overwhelmingly (think Reagan or Clinton) or we
> toss
> > >him out of office by a wide margin (think Hoover or Carter), Zogby
> believes
> > >this election, barring some unforeseen events, is going to be another
> > >nail-biter. He insists that Ohio is this year's Florida, although the
> White
> > >House disputes that. They believe they have an excellent
> chance to carry
> > >Ohio. No Republican in modern times has won the Presidency without Ohio
> > >
> > > After this daylong briefing, which began at noon and ended at 6
> p.m,
> > >we adjourned to dinner, where the buzz was all about Zogby's comments.
> The
> > >participants in the briefing were all influential people. Zogby shook
> them
> > >to the core."
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> >
> >-----------------------------------------------------------------
> ---------
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