[Vision2020] RE: [Vision2020]...call me a Fool
Mark Seman
FCS@Moscow.com
Mon, 2 Feb 2004 23:55:44 -0800
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Ted,
Thanks for your response to my post. I must tell you, and anyone else
reading them, that my posts are not the message, but the messenger. I do
not write in anticipation of tomorrow's response, they are intended to
inform of things to come. I know where I want to be positioned in 3 or 4
months from now and if I'm not, then I have a contingency to be elsewhere.
One of my intentions is to turn against what I perceive as a negative pallor
in V2020 and Moscow. Since I'm as stubborn as anyone else, I don't plan on
changing my perspective or beliefs, but rather the events around me.
I appreciate your concern and empathy for what is happening elsewhere in the
world. I probably share many of your views about this tragic time in which
we live. I agree that what is going on in Moscow during this period is a
relatively calm tea and crumpet picnic. It is almost unfathomable to me,
what it would mean to actually be in Iraq. What does it mean to those
adults and children that do live there - the conditions are hardly anything
I will ever experience ... and those in Afganistan seem even worse-off. How
will foreign nations ever be able to put an entire government into place,
without a glitch? I can imagine a scenario in which the Iraqi war was a
corporate or U.S. effort to control the region's oil. I believe that as a
true reason for our involvement. I also know that another true reason the
U.S. began a war with Iraqi war is because I want to drive a GMC SUV, VW, PU
or PWC. Another true reason was to get rid of Saddam Husein. I've never
been able to explain the world and I never will. I perceive it as I do and
I go from there.
I admire your perception of the mentality of war and your distain for its
existence. I empathize with how you feel about the plight of those
overseas, and understand your questioning of its psychological impact on the
people of Moscow. How can we not feel the impact of knowing what is going
on in the Middle East, but feeling so unempowered to do much about it. I
applaud the vigilant few, whom I do not know, but I see standing at
Friendship Square during their regular candlelight vigil. I admire the
commitment of Moscow's Richard Wekerle to demonstrate at the School of the
Americas and face imprisonment. Am I willing to stick my neck out that far?
No, I'm no fool - but I admire it and I envy his commitment. Some will see
this as a weakness on my part; I have that very same perception, but I can
also focus beyond that. No matter what the issue, we are all impacted by it
or insulated from it to varying degrees and we make our decisions.
What I am trying to accomplish is change through constructive criticism.
Sometimes a slap in the face would be an effective attention getter, I tend
to not operate that way. Sometimes I wish I could do that, but it is
against my nature. At times I will go against my nature or test my comfort
zone, but to do so requires a strong sense of injustice or wrong. There are
certain injustices that have been occurring in Moscow that significantly
impact me personally and I'm out to try and change that. Some of these
issues have been long-standing mindsets and others have come to my awareness
more recently. For my own selfish reasons, I am putting my energies into
struggles here in Moscow. And my focus will be on select issues that I will
prioritize in some manner that will make sense to me.
We - you & me and everyone else, come from different backgrounds and
experiences and have developed different beliefs. There are many beliefs
out there that I just don't buy into, but I'm not temped to belittle someone
for their perceptions and beliefs. Anyone who doesn't agree with me has
every right to do so, but I don't expect to be belittled over them either.
At times I may be more concerned about what others think about my thoughts,
but for me now, that's not it.
To me, Moscow has serious issues that are not about slavery, christian right
DA's, liberal ex-hippies, the presidential primary, or the Iraqi war. I
don't mean to suggest that these not be discussed & debated on V2020; I am
aware that these are very real and serious issues, but without a moderator
they often go on and on and on and on and ... For me now, it's about
groundwater, rock crushing, local economic development, art, and improving
the community. Obviously, my priorities are not everyone's and some will
call me foolish, but even so, they are issues that have meaning for me.
What I also see & hear from V2020 is not so much the message within the
posts, but the message they are sending. As an example, I personally know
of a significant number of people that have de-listed from V2020 because of
they perceived negative and monotonous content. Maybe it's their problem
for not interjecting other subject matter. No matter what people may think
my words say, they are not meant to suggest that certain people stop posting
to V2020. I enjoy the wit of select authors, I value some of their content
and I respect those who post with good reason.
My sense of dis-enchantment with V2020 content is my problem and my efforts
to change it have little to do with my posts, but rather my actions within
the community. The main concept behind my approach is to provide more
reasons for positive input on-line. I know Moscow can regain it's balance
and get back on it's feet, I'm just trying to offer constructive criticism,
other insight, and solutions ... just like everyone else.
Call me a Fool,
Mark Seman
*** ***** ***
Full Circle Studios
828 South Washington, Suite B
Moscow, Idaho 83843
v 208-883-3276
f 208-883-0112
FCS@Moscow.com
-----Original Message-----
From: vision2020-admin@moscow.com [mailto:vision2020-admin@moscow.com]On
Behalf Of Aldoussoma@aol.com
Sent: Saturday, January 31, 2004 4:31 PM
To: FCS@moscow.com; vision2020@moscow.com
Subject: Re: [Vision2020] as a whole...
Mark wrote:
"Even in all it's initially venomous
intent, good can be derived from bigotry, slavery, intolerance, deceit and
V2020, if there is effort applied in that direction."
V2020 has "initially venomous intent?" Maybe you did not mean this.
Really though, considering that tens of thousands of people have been
injured or killed in wars that the US has recently been conducting for US
citizens who pay the taxes for the bombs and bombers, etc., doing the
slaughter, our cultural and value disagreements in Moscow are a tea party in
a pleasant summer meadow with a few polite arguments, though a few drinking
spiked tea broke a tea set or two.
Is it possible the mentality of war that our whole nation is expected to
buy into is infecting and impacting the psychology of how we see each other
here in Moscow? Can we in Moscow really insulate ourselves from the death
and injury and pain of tens of thousands, from the hatreds and passions
involved in our war on terror?
Yeah, I know, let's not think about it too vividly or empathetically.
But comparing what can happen in intense cultural/religious conflicts
makes the cultural wars in Moscow seem mild and peaceful, really, and
hopefully it will stay that way. I think some people are over dramatizing
the conflicts in our little hamlet, not that there are not real issues
involved that require confrontation.
Ted
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<DIV><SPAN class=3D742184205-01022004><FONT face=3DTahoma =
color=3D#000080=20
size=3D2>Ted,</FONT></SPAN></DIV>
<DIV><SPAN class=3D742184205-01022004><FONT face=3DTahoma =
color=3D#000080=20
size=3D2>Thanks for your response to my post. I must tell =
you, and=20
anyone else reading them, that my posts are not the message, but the=20
messenger. I do not write in anticipation of tomorrow's response, =
they are=20
intended to inform of things to come. I know where I want to =
be=20
positioned in 3 or 4 months from now and if I'm not, then I have a =
contingency=20
to be elsewhere. One of my intentions is to turn =
against what I=20
perceive as a negative pallor in V2020 and Moscow. Since I'm =
as=20
stubborn as anyone else, I don't plan on changing my perspective or =
beliefs, but=20
rather the events around me.</FONT></SPAN></DIV>
<DIV><SPAN class=3D742184205-01022004><FONT face=3DTahoma =
color=3D#000080=20
size=3D2></FONT></SPAN> </DIV>
<DIV><SPAN class=3D742184205-01022004><FONT face=3DTahoma =
color=3D#000080 size=3D2>I=20
appreciate your concern and empathy for what is happening elsewhere in =
the=20
world. I probably share many of your views about this tragic =
time in=20
which we live. I agree that what is going on in Moscow during this =
period=20
is a relatively calm tea and crumpet picnic. It is almost=20
unfathomable to me, what it would <U>mean</U> to actually be in =
Iraq. What=20
does it mean to those adults and children that do live there - the =
conditions=20
are hardly anything I will ever experience ... and those in =
Afganistan seem=20
even worse-off. How will foreign nations ever be able to put an =
entire=20
government into place, without a glitch? I can imagine a scenario in =
which the=20
Iraqi war was a corporate or U.S. effort to control the region's =
oil. =20
I believe that as a true reason for our involvement. I also know =
that=20
another true reason the U.S. began a war with Iraqi war is because =
I want=20
to drive a GMC SUV, VW, PU or PWC. Another true reason was to get =
rid of=20
Saddam Husein. I've never been able to explain the world and I =
never=20
will. I perceive it as I do and I go from =
there.</FONT></SPAN></DIV>
<DIV><SPAN class=3D742184205-01022004><FONT face=3DTahoma =
color=3D#000080=20
size=3D2></FONT></SPAN> </DIV>
<DIV><SPAN class=3D742184205-01022004><FONT face=3DTahoma =
color=3D#000080 size=3D2>I=20
admire your perception of the mentality of war and your distain for its=20
existence. I empathize with how you feel about the plight of =
those=20
overseas, and understand your questioning of its psychological impact on =
the=20
people of Moscow. How can we not feel the impact of knowing what =
is going=20
on in the Middle East, but feeling so unempowered to do much about =
it. I=20
applaud the vigilant few, whom I do not know, but I see standing at =
Friendship Square during their regular candlelight vigil. I admire =
the=20
commitment of Moscow's Richard Wekerle to demonstrate at the School of =
the=20
Americas and face imprisonment. Am I willing to stick my neck out =
that=20
far? No, I'm no fool - but I admire it and I envy his =
commitment. =20
Some will see this as a weakness on my part; I have that very same =
perception,=20
but I can also focus beyond that. No matter what the issue, we are =
all=20
impacted by it or insulated from it to varying degrees and we make our=20
decisions.</FONT></SPAN></DIV>
<DIV><SPAN class=3D742184205-01022004><FONT face=3DTahoma =
color=3D#000080=20
size=3D2></FONT></SPAN> </DIV>
<DIV><SPAN class=3D742184205-01022004><FONT face=3DTahoma =
color=3D#000080 size=3D2>What=20
I am trying to accomplish is change through constructive =
criticism. =20
Sometimes a slap in the face would be an effective attention getter, I =
tend to=20
not operate that way. Sometimes I wish I could do that, but it is =
against=20
my nature. At times I will go against my nature or test my comfort =
zone,=20
but to do so requires a strong sense of injustice or wrong. <SPAN=20
class=3D742184205-01022004><FONT face=3DTahoma color=3D#000080 =
size=3D2>There are=20
certain injustices that have been occurring in Moscow that significantly =
impact=20
me personally and I'm out to try and change that. Some of these =
issues=20
have been long-standing mindsets and others have come to my awareness =
more=20
recently. For my own selfish reasons, I am putting my =
energies into=20
struggles here in Moscow. And my focus will be on select issues =
that I=20
will prioritize in some </FONT></SPAN><SPAN =
class=3D742184205-01022004><FONT=20
face=3DTahoma color=3D#000080 size=3D2>manner that will make sense to=20
me.</FONT></SPAN></FONT></SPAN></DIV>
<DIV><SPAN class=3D742184205-01022004><FONT face=3DTahoma =
color=3D#000080=20
size=3D2></FONT></SPAN> </DIV><SPAN =
class=3D742184205-01022004><FONT=20
color=3D#000080 size=3D2>
<DIV><SPAN class=3D742184205-01022004><FONT face=3DTahoma>We - you =
& me and=20
everyone else, come from different backgrounds and experiences and have=20
developed different beliefs. There are many beliefs out there that =
I=20
just don't buy into, but I'm not temped to belittle someone for =
their=20
perceptions and beliefs. Anyone who doesn't agree with me has =
every right=20
to do so, but I don't expect to be belittled over them either. At =
times I=20
may be more concerned about what others think about my thoughts, but for =
me now,=20
that's not it.</FONT></SPAN></DIV>
<DIV><SPAN class=3D742184205-01022004><FONT =
face=3DTahoma></FONT></SPAN> </DIV>
<DIV><SPAN class=3D742184205-01022004><FONT face=3DTahoma>To me, Moscow =
has serious=20
issues that are not about slavery, christian right DA's, liberal=20
ex-hippies, the presidential primary, or the Iraqi war. I =
don't mean=20
to suggest that these not be discussed & debated on V2020; I am =
aware that=20
these are very real and serious issues, but without a moderator they =
often go on=20
and on and on and on and ... For me now, it's about groundwater, =
rock=20
crushing, local economic development, art, and improving the =
community. =20
Obviously, my priorities are not everyone's and some will call me =
foolish, but=20
even so, they are issues that have meaning for me.</FONT></SPAN></DIV>
<DIV><SPAN class=3D742184205-01022004><FONT =
face=3DTahoma></FONT></SPAN> </DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=3DTahoma>What I also see & hear from V2020 is not so =
much the=20
message within the posts, but the message they are =
sending. As=20
an example, I personally know of a significant number of people that =
have=20
de-listed from V2020 because of <SPAN =
class=3D742184205-01022004>they=20
</SPAN>perceived negative and monotonous content. Maybe it's their =
problem=20
for not interjecting other subject matter. No matter what people =
may think=20
my words say, <SPAN class=3D742184205-01022004>they </SPAN>are not=20
meant to suggest that certain people stop posting to=20
V2020. I <SPAN class=3D742184205-01022004>enjoy the wit =
of select=20
authors, I </SPAN>value some of <SPAN =
class=3D742184205-01022004>their</SPAN>=20
content<SPAN class=3D742184205-01022004> and</SPAN> I <SPAN=20
class=3D742184205-01022004>respect those who post with good=20
reason.</SPAN></FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=3DTahoma color=3D#000000 size=3D3></FONT> </DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=3DTahoma><SPAN class=3D742184205-01022004>M</SPAN>y =
sense=20
</FONT></FONT></SPAN><SPAN class=3D742184205-01022004><FONT =
face=3DTahoma=20
color=3D#000080 size=3D2>of dis-enchantment with V2020 content is my =
problem and my=20
efforts to change it have little to do with my posts, but rather my =
actions=20
within the community. The main concept behind my approach is to =
provide=20
more reasons for positive input on-line. I know Moscow can regain =
it's=20
balance and get back on it's feet, I'm just trying to offer =
constructive=20
criticism, other insight, and solutions ... just like everyone=20
else.</FONT></SPAN></DIV>
<DIV><SPAN class=3D742184205-01022004></SPAN><SPAN =
class=3D742184205-01022004><SPAN=20
class=3D742184205-01022004></SPAN></SPAN><SPAN=20
class=3D742184205-01022004></SPAN><SPAN class=3D742184205-01022004><FONT =
face=3DTahoma=20
color=3D#000080 size=3D2></FONT></SPAN> </DIV>
<DIV><SPAN class=3D742184205-01022004><FONT face=3DTahoma =
color=3D#000080 size=3D2>Call=20
me a Fool,</FONT></SPAN></DIV>
<DIV><SPAN class=3D742184205-01022004></SPAN><FONT face=3DTahoma><FONT =
size=3D2><FONT=20
color=3D#000080><SPAN class=3D742184205-01022004>M</SPAN>ark=20
Seman<BR>*** ***** ***<BR>Full Circle =
Studios<BR>828=20
South Washington, Suite B<BR>Moscow, Idaho 83843<BR>v 208-883-3276<BR>f=20
208-883-0112<BR>FCS@Moscow.com</FONT></FONT></FONT> </DIV>
<BLOCKQUOTE>
<DIV class=3DOutlookMessageHeader dir=3Dltr align=3Dleft><FONT =
face=3DTahoma=20
size=3D2>-----Original Message-----<BR><B>From:</B> =
vision2020-admin@moscow.com=20
[mailto:vision2020-admin@moscow.com]<B>On Behalf Of=20
</B>Aldoussoma@aol.com<BR><B>Sent:</B> Saturday, January 31, 2004 4:31 =
PM<BR><B>To:</B> FCS@moscow.com; =
vision2020@moscow.com<BR><B>Subject:</B> Re:=20
[Vision2020] as a whole...<BR><BR></FONT></DIV><FONT=20
face=3Darial,helvetica><FONT size=3D2 PTSIZE=3D"10"><BR>Mark wrote: =
<BR><BR>"Even in=20
all it's initially venomous <BR>intent, good can be derived from =
bigotry,=20
slavery, intolerance, deceit and <BR>V2020, if there is effort applied =
in that=20
direction." <BR><BR>V2020 has "initially venomous intent?" Maybe =
you did=20
not mean this. <BR><BR>Really though, considering that tens of =
thousands of=20
people have been injured or killed in wars that the US has recently =
been=20
conducting for US citizens who pay the taxes for the bombs and =
bombers, etc.,=20
doing the slaughter, our cultural and value disagreements in Moscow =
are a tea=20
party in a pleasant summer meadow with a few polite arguments, though =
a few=20
drinking spiked tea broke a tea set or two. <BR><BR>Is it possible the =
mentality of war that our whole nation is expected to buy into is =
infecting=20
and impacting the psychology of how we see each other here in Moscow?=20
Can we in Moscow really insulate ourselves from the death and =
injury and=20
pain of tens of thousands, from the hatreds and passions involved in =
our war=20
on terror? <BR><BR>Yeah, I know, let's not think about it too vividly =
or=20
empathetically. <BR><BR>But comparing what can happen in =
intense=20
cultural/religious conflicts makes the cultural wars in Moscow seem =
mild and=20
peaceful, really, and hopefully it will stay that way. I think =
some=20
people are over dramatizing the conflicts in our little hamlet, not =
that there=20
are not real issues involved that require confrontation. <BR><BR>Ted=20
<BR><BR><BR><BR></BLOCKQUOTE></FONT></FONT></BODY></HTML>
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