[Vision2020] Merry Christmas

Wed Dec 22 00:24:34 PST 2004

Jeff,

If you bothered to read what I said, you would not need to "wonder who will 
pay for the allowances". The workers would earn them as they slave away 
working for greedy capitalists that think the world ought to thank them for 
bringing $5 hour jobs to the community.
This model is not used by North Korea, it is used the United States 
government. The Government pays many employees allowances and medical care. 
This is not done by the unpatriotic capitalists. If we were to make 
companies follow a policy that works for the military and other government 
workers, it would ensure that American workers basic needs are met. This 
would also help curb problems associated with inflation and over inflated 
housing prices that have occurred in every county in America except four in 
the last 10 years. It would also help the millions of Americans out of 
poverty, most of which are children.

Jeff, perhaps you should skip down to Book People and ask for a book on Karl 
Marx; it is clear to me that you don't understand what he is about, and the 
huge differences between what I am advocating and what he advocated.

Take Care,

Donovan J Arnold

>From: Jeff Harkins <jeffh at moscow.com>
>To: <vision2020 at moscow.com>
>Subject: Re: [Vision2020] Merry Christmas
>Date: Tue, 21 Dec 2004 21:50:52 -0800
>
>Hmmm, wonder who will pay for all those allowances.  This is very close to 
>the scheme that Marx advocated.  Sure helped the Russian economy!  One real 
>advantage - you can close most of the public schools - the lower econ 
>levels really don't need the education - because they have the rest of the 
>working class providing for a "decent standard of living" without having to 
>advance themselves.
>
>And you don't have to go to the trouble of teaching them to fish - they 
>just go to the state managed food coop for their weekly ration of lutefisk.
>
>I think Korea still uses this model - some of you might want to check it 
>out.
>
>At 09:36 PM 12/21/2004, you wrote:
>
>>Ted,
>>
>>You will find that many capitalists believe that raising the minimum wage 
>>is pointless and only causes inflation. They hold to the notion that when 
>>you raise the wages of the lower 10-25% of the population it cause a wave 
>>of pay increases to all the other workers. In order to pay for the 
>>increases businesses raise prices, and thus the gains (buying power) made 
>>by the wage increases are lost to inflation. Now, I happen to believe that 
>>this is in part true because the top wage earners in the company are also 
>>the decision makers and they are not going to take pay cuts to give decent 
>>wages to the workers.
>>
>>I suggest what we do is stop trying to argue with them and force them to 
>>admit their greed by coming up with an alternative form of paying workers. 
>>I would require companies to pay allowances on top of small wages.
>>
>>Require the company to pay housing, medical, food, clothing, and 
>>transportation. Every full time employee, working 32 hours a week or more, 
>>should get a minimum allowance for each to afford their basic needs in 
>>addition to their salary. For workers that receive less than 32 hours, pay 
>>them benefits in equal proportion, like if they work 16 hours a week, they 
>>get half the allowances as those working 32 hours. The allowances would be 
>>based on the Cost of living index for that area, within 30 miles.
>>
>>This would be the best way to ensure that people are living a decent 
>>quality of life. Housing is becoming increasing impossible to afford, and 
>>medical care already is unaffordable for those living on minimum wage.
>>
>>Take care,
>>
>>Donovan J Arnold
>>
>>>From: Tbertruss at aol.com
>>>To: kjajmix1 at msn.com, vision2020 at moscow.com, 
>>>auntiestablishment at hotmail.com
>>>Subject: Re: [Vision2020] Merry Christmas
>>>Date: Tue, 21 Dec 2004 14:48:03 EST
>>>
>>>
>>>Keely:
>>>
>>>Thanks for your reply.
>>>
>>>I considered that Christ might be a conservative thinker who though 
>>>believing
>>>fervently in helping the poor and disadvantaged, would advocate doing it
>>>without the governments involvement, by giving aid directly to those who 
>>>need it
>>>or through private charity organizations.  So taxes to help the poor 
>>>would not
>>>be the approach of a conservative altruist.  But the minimum wage issue 
>>>is
>>>different.  For those who want to earn their way and not accept charity,
>>>especially single parents, the low minimum wage as set by federal 
>>>standards (many
>>>states have already raised the minimum wage) is just too low.
>>>
>>>We are in an age of astonishing CEO salaries, bonuses and golden 
>>>parachutes,
>>>yet these same corporations will lobby against raising the minimum wage.
>>>So
>>>it is OK to pay Jane Fat Cat CEO an extra million, yet if you advocate 
>>>taking
>>>that extra million, which the CEO already making millions does not really 
>>>need
>>>to feed, clothe and house her children, and suggest giving it via a pay
>>>increase to working single parents who are at the bottom, suddenly you 
>>>are a
>>>"liberal" advocating antibusiness policies.  Why then don't we just do 
>>>away with the
>>>minimum wage, and let the wonderful "free" market place, that seems to 
>>>have
>>>acquired status as a magical solution to humanities problems, work 
>>>without
>>>nefarious government regulation?  After all, ANY minimum wage is 
>>>government
>>>regulation of business.  Many corporations would love this!  No need to 
>>>out source or
>>>move to China, just pay workers in the USA $.80 an hour.
>>>
>>>I envision Christ busting into the board meeting of a Fortune 500 
>>>corporation
>>>and raising a ruckus...
>>>
>>>I wonder....
>>>
>>>Ted Moffett
>>>_____________________________________________________
>>>  List services made available by First Step Internet,
>>>  serving the communities of the Palouse since 1994.
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>>>           mailto:Vision2020 at moscow.com
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>>
>>
>>_____________________________________________________
>>List services made available by First Step Internet, serving the 
>>communities of the Palouse since 1994.
>>               http://www.fsr.net
>>          mailto:Vision2020 at moscow.com
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>>
>
>
>_____________________________________________________
>List services made available by First Step Internet, serving the 
>communities of the Palouse since 1994.                 http://www.fsr.net   
>                              mailto:Vision2020 at moscow.com
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