[Vision2020] public schools & indoctrination
Donovan Arnold
donovanarnold@hotmail.com
Wed, 12 Nov 2003 03:14:44 -0800
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<P>Joshua,</P></DIV>
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<P>You never fail to astound me with your viewpoints being, while not totally diametrically opposed to that of Christ, but one of more of an existentialist. </P>
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<P>For one that is so strongly against handouts, how many handouts have you given back? Did you give back the land that was taken from the people that were here first? Did you give back the food and shelter that your parents gave you? Did you give back the roads and sidewalks that were built for you? Did you give back the blood to the soldiers that fought for you? Did you give back the air you took, or the water you drank, or the national security you enjoy? No, of course not! To you, as someone else pointed out, it is about "mine, mine, mine". </P>
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<P>Who are you talking about that gets handouts Joshua? Is it the poor naked child standing barefoot in city sewer that doesn't deserve a handout? Is the homeless veteran on the streets of DC? Is it the single mother that works three jobs for $5.15 an hour and never gets to see her child? Or maybe it is the immigrant that picks a barrel of tomatoes in the farms of Florida for $2 for a 55 gallon barrel? Or maybe you think that the old lady down road that gave up a brother in WWII and a husband in Vietnam that doesn't deserve a "handout"? Or just maybe it is the farmer that plows all his life to afford just enough seeds for next season that doesn't afford a "handout"? </P>
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<P>Which of these people, these children of God, are the ones that don't deserve food, shelter and medical care? These are the real people that welfare, social security, public schools, and food stamps help out. Which of them do you wish to ostracize for the sake of you enforcing you religious beliefs? Which ones do you think Christ would toss?</P>
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<P>You are so stuck with this concept that it is fat Black people with 8 children that refuse to work as being on welfare. The bottom line is, this is false. Almost everybody that gets government "handouts" works, and the people on food stamps work about 40-60 hours a week. And most of them are single moms with only one child struggling to make ends meet on a measly pay check of $5.15 an hour. The people that are truly getting handouts are the people that live off the stock market or make profits off cheap labor of those struggling to make ends meet. They are the 10% of the population that have 90% of the nations wealth. This is the standard that you wish to uphold and consider the virtue of humanity.</P>
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<P>Christ himself said, surrender unto Caesar's that which is Caesar's. That means if the government wants it back, give it to them. </P>
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<P>Joshua, what did you do to deserve to get your education, food, and shelter? What did you do to get access to clean drinking water, medical care, and to live in the most prosperous nation in the world that does not see war, famine, and massive sweeping deadly plagues?</P>
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<P>I will tell what you did, you were born. That is all you did. You just happen to be born in a nation that had jobs, food, wealth, security, and opportunity. Face it, you, like me, and most the people born in the United States are lucky. We were lucky to be born at the right time, right place, and with the right parents. We were born better off than 95% of the people in the world. You could be suffering in misery like 5.5 billion people are right now. Doesn't your tax burden seem a little petty in comparison to those that have so much more to deal with?</P>
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<P>A true Christian would be asking, "What can I give so others may live?" Not asking, "What can I take so I can live better?" Nor would a Christian be ever be whining about the Government giving to the poor and needy.</P>
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<P>You state: </P>
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<P>"Finally, I would just point out that the most important things aren't "inside" the person, they are outside the person."</P>
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<P>If you belief this than Christ was nothing to you. He owned nothing but his robe on the outside. </P>
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<P>You come into this world naked, helpless, and with no property. You will leave it the same way. I highly advise that you store your most important treasures where you can keep them forever, in heaven.</P>
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<P>Donovan</P>
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<DIV></DIV>>From: Joshua Nieuwsma <JOSHUAHENDRIK@YAHOO.COM>
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<DIV></DIV>>To: Donovan Arnold <DONOVANARNOLD@HOTMAIL.COM>, vision <VISION2020@MOSCOW.COM>
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<DIV></DIV>>Subject: RE: [Vision2020] public schools & indoctrination
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<DIV></DIV>>Date: Wed, 12 Nov 2003 01:18:03 -0800 (PST)
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<DIV></DIV>>Donovan,
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<DIV></DIV>>I find it interesting that you wish to paint me as "frightened" of the concept of a child sharing with a poorer child their gold colored crayon. The question shouldn't be who owns it, though, the question is what do you do with what you own? Do you honor God- which includes lending or giving freely of what you have, thanking Him for the things He has given you as you honor Him by giving? Or do you deny God exists, declare that these underprivileged people over here somehow "deserve" that gold colored crayon since their crayon box didn't have one, and redistribute wealth? The situation seems petty, and it is, but small lies lead to big ones, and so do small principles. No one "deserves" anything, except justice. That is the whole point. Justice doesn't allow for giving, for mercy, for kindness. Justice comes down with the razor edge and divides the "haves"-those who obey from the "have nots"-those who don't. No one does. So we all need reconciling. God's mercy !
reconciles us in the
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<DIV></DIV>> right way, His way. And that way doesn't include big vats of school supplies redistributed equally among every student. God blesses some more than others. Some students have more than others. It is the way the world is and no amount of equal sharing will change it.
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<DIV></DIV>>Mr. Arnold, all this rests upon two presuppositions. Either people are basically good, and so they naturally, directed in the right way, move from crayons to clothing the naked. Or they are basically evil, and will misunderstand the principle behind the giving of the crayon and, if on the giving end, will be angry because the teacher stole from them under the poor excuse of "sharing", while if on the receiving end, they will develop the idea that because they are poor they deserve handouts. Look at much of america today. Government handouts are thought to be a right.
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<DIV></DIV>>Finally, I would just point out that the most important things aren't "inside" the person, they are outside the person. External standards, not internal.
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<DIV></DIV>>sincerely,
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<DIV></DIV>>Joshua Nieuwsma
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<DIV></DIV>>---------------------------------
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