[CLC-Discussion] Notice of Contest of Lien question

RPPTL CLC-Discussion clc-discussion at lists.flabarrpptl.org
Wed Sep 6 09:55:54 PDT 2023 

The title company should remove the exception.  At a minimum, they likely will with an affidavit by the seller that no suit was filed within the statutory time limit.

R.J. Haughey II
Sivyer Barlow Watson & Haughey, P.A.
Truist Place
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Suite 2225
Tampa, Florida 33602
www.sbwhlegal.com<http://www.sbwhlegal.com/>
Main - 813.221.4242
Fax - 813.227.8598
rhaughey at sbwhlegal.com<mailto:rhaughey at sbwhlegal.com>

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From: clc-discussion-bounces at lists.flabarrpptl.org <clc-discussion-bounces at lists.flabarrpptl.org> On Behalf Of RPPTL CLC-Discussion
Sent: Wednesday, September 6, 2023 12:38 PM
To: clc-discussion at lists.flabarrpptl.org
Subject: Re: [CLC-Discussion] Notice of Contest of Lien question

Our experience is that title examiners are a cross between the oracle in "The Matrix" and the "precogs" in "Minority Report," and that their conclusions and concerns are both untethered from the Florida Construction Lien Law and, therefore, immune from divination by mere mortals (i.e., construction lawyers). Just our $0.02...

Bryan L. Capps, Esq.
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Board Certified in Construction Law by The Florida Bar
The Construction Law Firm
P.O. Box 560693
Orlando, FL 32856
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(407) 674-0674

(407) 808-0098
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bcapps at theconstructionlawfirm.com<mailto:bcapps at theconstructionlawfirm.com>
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Offices: Orlando

From: clc-discussion-bounces at lists.flabarrpptl.org<mailto:clc-discussion-bounces at lists.flabarrpptl.org> <clc-discussion-bounces at lists.flabarrpptl.org<mailto:clc-discussion-bounces at lists.flabarrpptl.org>> On Behalf Of RPPTL CLC-Discussion
Sent: Wednesday, September 6, 2023 10:49 AM
To: clc-discussion at lists.flabarrpptl.org<mailto:clc-discussion at lists.flabarrpptl.org>
Subject: Re: [CLC-Discussion] Notice of Contest of Lien question


Having the trial judge enter an order discharging the lien is the best way to proceed since title insurers are unlikely to trust the potential non-existence of an event as a basis to underwrite title.  Trusting that a title company will proceed simply by showing the existence of the lawsuit and lienor's failure to file a counterclaim within 20 days will, in my experience, result in a delayed closing.  I would take the extra step and make sure the transaction is not scuttled.





Chip Bachara

Managing Partner - Board Certified in Construction Law

BACHARA CONSTRUCTION LAW GROUP

One Independent Dr., Ste. 1800, Jacksonville, FL 32202

Phone: 904.562.1060 | Direct Line: 904.562.1066

Website | Biography | Download vCard



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-----Original Message-----
From: clc-discussion-bounces at lists.flabarrpptl.org<mailto:clc-discussion-bounces at lists.flabarrpptl.org> <clc-discussion-bounces at lists.flabarrpptl.org<mailto:clc-discussion-bounces at lists.flabarrpptl.org>> On Behalf Of RPPTL CLC-Discussion
Sent: Wednesday, September 6, 2023 10:39 AM
To: clc-discussion at lists.flabarrpptl.org<mailto:clc-discussion at lists.flabarrpptl.org>
Subject: Re: [CLC-Discussion] Notice of Contest of Lien question



There is a recent case in Fla L. Weekly that was remanded to the trial court for other reasons, but instructed the trial judge to enter an order discharging the  lien.

For what its worth.



J. Thomas McKeel, Esq.

J. Thomas McKeel, P.A.

303 Centre Street, Suite 103

Fernandina Beach, FL  32034

jtm at mckeellaw.com<mailto:jtm at mckeellaw.com>

904-261-9437



-----Original Message-----

From: clc-discussion-bounces at lists.flabarrpptl.org<mailto:clc-discussion-bounces at lists.flabarrpptl.org> <clc-discussion-bounces at lists.flabarrpptl.org<mailto:clc-discussion-bounces at lists.flabarrpptl.org>> On Behalf Of RPPTL CLC-Discussion

Sent: Wednesday, September 6, 2023 10:23 AM

To: clc-discussion at lists.flabarrpptl.org<mailto:clc-discussion at lists.flabarrpptl.org>

Subject: Re: [CLC-Discussion] Notice of Contest of Lien question



This is a great question from a title perspective. Scott is correct that it is self executing, but if you're trying to get clear title for either a sale or new loan, there's not an easy answer. If it were 100% guaranteed that someone filing suit would record a notice of lis pendens, then the absence of that document in the public records would clear it up, but that's not a 100% guarantee.





Sometimes a title insurer will insure after 60 days (after they probably also check the clerk's docket). But sometimes they won't. I have a couple of times in the past prepared an affidavit for recording that would recite recording and service of the notice of contest (attaching as exhibits the recorded notice and hopefully proof of service from the Clerk), and that I've reviewed the public records and there was no notice of lis pendens recorded, and that I've reviewed the docket and could find no suit that was filed. I suppose that's in theory like the "title opinions" that attorneys used to issue (although those weren't recorded). I think on the most recent one I did (which was probably several years ago) I put in the affidavit the search terms I had used for the searches for the suit and the notice of lis pendens and may have even attached copies of results. It's hard to prove a negative....





You also need to check that it was actually served by the clerk. I had one years ago where the clerk didn't serve it (despite saying they did on the face of the recorded notice of contest), and when the suit was filed, we got into a spat about it. The case ultimately settled so there was never a legal ruling, although I have in my head that there is a published opinion out there where something similar happened, but I don't recall the outcome. Perhaps someone in this august group will have that more at hand than I do.





Bruce Partington | Shareholder

bpartington at clarkpartington.com<mailto:bpartington at clarkpartington.com<mailto:bpartington at clarkpartington.com%3cmailto:bpartington at clarkpartington.com>> | (850) 432-1399<callto:(850)%20432-1399> CLARK PARTINGTON

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Bruce Partington | Shareholder

Board Certified Specialist in Construction Law bpartington at clarkpartington.com<mailto:bpartington at clarkpartington.com<mailto:bpartington at clarkpartington.com%3cmailto:bpartington at clarkpartington.com>> | (850) 432-1399



CLARK PARTINGTON

Office: (850) 434-9200 | Fax: (850) 432-7340

125 East Intendencia Street, 4th Floor

Pensacola, Florida 32502

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From: clc-discussion-bounces at lists.flabarrpptl.org<mailto:clc-discussion-bounces at lists.flabarrpptl.org> <clc-discussion-bounces at lists.flabarrpptl.org<mailto:clc-discussion-bounces at lists.flabarrpptl.org>> on behalf of RPPTL CLC-Discussion <clc-discussion at lists.flabarrpptl.org<mailto:clc-discussion at lists.flabarrpptl.org>>

Sent: Wednesday, September 6, 2023 8:50:32 AM

To: RPPTL CLC-Discussion

Subject: [CLC-Discussion] Notice of Contest of Lien question



Hello:



I have a client that recorded the Notice of Contest of Lien and the clerk served it.  No suit was filed and per 713.22 the lien is extinguished automatically.

But how do they show that in public records?  I have not had this issue before. Thank you for the help.





Best regards,



Daniel Greene

Daniel M. Greene, P.A.

Florida Board Certified in Construction Law Florida Supreme Court Certified Circuit Civil and Appellate Mediator P.O. Box 3092 Orlando, FL 32802-3092

407-448-5391

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dangreenelaw at gmail.com<mailto:dangreenelaw at gmail.com>



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