<div dir="ltr"><div class="gmail_default" style="font-family:tahoma,sans-serif;font-size:small">I received a scam email from a potential client who contacted me several months ago --- very convincing until she begged me to buy a gift card "to give to a friend who has cancer" and promised she would pay me back. </div><div class="gmail_default" style="font-family:tahoma,sans-serif;font-size:small"><br></div><div class="gmail_default" style="font-family:tahoma,sans-serif;font-size:small">This is in addition to the emails I get weekly from poor overseas ladies whose "wealthy husband lives in my state" and owes her a couple hundred thousand on a foreign judgment WRITTEN IN ENGLISH and won't I please help her children get the money their father owes them? Oh also, he abused her.</div><div class="gmail_default" style="font-family:tahoma,sans-serif;font-size:small"><br></div><div class="gmail_default" style="font-family:tahoma,sans-serif;font-size:small">The filters do not catch all of them.</div><div class="gmail_default" style="font-family:tahoma,sans-serif;font-size:small"><br></div><div class="gmail_default" style="font-family:tahoma,sans-serif;font-size:small">Lynn Clare</div><div class="gmail_default" style="font-family:tahoma,sans-serif;font-size:small">Clare Law Firm</div></div><br><div class="gmail_quote gmail_quote_container"><div dir="ltr" class="gmail_attr">On Tue, Aug 5, 2025 at 12:37 PM Mike Zeno <<a href="mailto:mikez@zenolawfirm.com">mikez@zenolawfirm.com</a>> wrote:<br></div><blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0px 0px 0px 0.8ex;border-left:1px solid rgb(204,204,204);padding-left:1ex"><div class="msg8602993006589206046">
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<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="color:rgb(0,32,96)">I also received a scam email, purporting to be from an attorney, from “Zivver.” Note: the attorney was not on the list serve.<u></u><u></u></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="color:rgb(0,32,96)"><u></u> <u></u></span></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal" style="margin-bottom:0in"><b><span style="font-size:11pt;font-family:Calibri,sans-serif;color:rgb(31,73,125)">The Law Office of G. Michael Zeno, Jr., P.S.</span></b><span style="font-size:11pt;font-family:Calibri,sans-serif;color:black"><u></u><u></u></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="margin-bottom:0in"><span style="font-size:11pt;font-family:Calibri,sans-serif;color:rgb(31,73,125)">T: (425) 947-8050 F: (425) 947-8052</span><span style="font-size:11pt;font-family:Calibri,sans-serif;color:black"><u></u><u></u></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="margin-bottom:0in"><span style="font-size:11pt;font-family:Calibri,sans-serif;color:rgb(31,73,125)">135 Lake Street S., Suite 257</span><span style="font-size:11pt;font-family:Calibri,sans-serif;color:black"><u></u><u></u></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="margin-bottom:0in"><span style="font-size:11pt;font-family:Calibri,sans-serif;color:rgb(31,73,125)">Kirkland, WA 98033</span><span style="font-size:11pt;font-family:Calibri,sans-serif;color:black"><u></u><u></u></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="margin-bottom:0in"><span style="font-size:11pt;font-family:Calibri,sans-serif;color:rgb(31,73,125)"> </span><span style="font-size:11pt;font-family:Calibri,sans-serif;color:black"><u></u><u></u></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="margin-bottom:0in"><b><span style="font-size:11pt;font-family:Calibri,sans-serif;color:rgb(192,0,0)">Confidential/Privileged Communication:</span></b><span style="font-size:11pt;font-family:Calibri,sans-serif;color:gray"> This
email and any attachments are confidential, privileged and intended only for the intended recipient(s). Unauthorized disclosure, copying, distribution or use of this email is prohibited. If you received this email in error, please notify me immediately so
we can arrange for the message and documents to be returned and deleted. Thank you.</span><span style="font-size:11pt;font-family:Calibri,sans-serif;color:black"><u></u><u></u></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="margin-bottom:0in"><b><span style="font-size:11pt;font-family:Calibri,sans-serif;color:rgb(192,0,0)">IRS Circular 230 Disclaimer:</span></b><span style="font-size:11pt;font-family:Calibri,sans-serif;color:gray"> Any tax advice
provided in this communication (including attachments) is not intended or written to be used, and it cannot be used, by the recipient or any other taxpayer (i) for the purpose of avoiding penalties that may be imposed on the recipient or any other taxpayer,
or (ii) in promoting, marketing or recommending to another party a partnership or other entity, investment plan, arrangement or other transaction. You should seek advice based on your particular circumstances from an independent tax advisor.</span><span style="font-size:11pt;font-family:Calibri,sans-serif;color:black"><u></u><u></u></span></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="color:rgb(0,32,96)"><u></u> <u></u></span></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal" style="margin-bottom:0in"><b><span style="font-size:11pt;font-family:Calibri,sans-serif">From:</span></b><span style="font-size:11pt;font-family:Calibri,sans-serif"> <a href="mailto:wsbarp-bounces@lists.wsbarppt.com" target="_blank">wsbarp-bounces@lists.wsbarppt.com</a> <<a href="mailto:wsbarp-bounces@lists.wsbarppt.com" target="_blank">wsbarp-bounces@lists.wsbarppt.com</a>>
<b>On Behalf Of </b>Mark Anderson<br>
<b>Sent:</b> Tuesday, August 5, 2025 12:04 PM<br>
<b>To:</b> WSBA Probate & Trust Listserv <<a href="mailto:wsbapt@lists.wsbarppt.com" target="_blank">wsbapt@lists.wsbarppt.com</a>>; <a href="mailto:solo-and-small-practice-section@list.wsba.org" target="_blank">solo-and-small-practice-section@list.wsba.org</a>; <a href="mailto:wsbarp@lists.wsbarppt.com" target="_blank">wsbarp@lists.wsbarppt.com</a><br>
<b>Subject:</b> Re: [WSBARP] AI...is that YOU?<u></u><u></u></span></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><u></u> <u></u></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:10pt;font-family:Arial,sans-serif;color:rgb(0,32,96)">Dear Dave:<u></u><u></u></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:10pt;font-family:Arial,sans-serif;color:rgb(0,32,96)">Thanks for the heads-up and for the details of your experience. Your recollection was sufficient to put us all on notice.<u></u><u></u></span></p>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="margin-bottom:12pt"><b><span style="font-size:10pt;font-family:Arial,sans-serif;color:rgb(0,32,96)">Mark B. Anderson<br>
</span></b><span style="font-size:10pt;font-family:Arial,sans-serif;color:rgb(0,32,96)">ANDERSON LAW FIRM PLLC<br>
821 Dock Street, Suite 209, PMB 4-12<br>
Tacoma, Washington 98402<br>
+1 253-327-1750<br>
+1 253-327-1751 (fax)<br>
<a href="mailto:marka@mbaesq.com" target="_blank"><span style="color:rgb(0,32,96)">marka@mbaesq.com</span></a><br>
<a href="http://www.mbaesq.com/" target="_blank"><span style="color:rgb(0,32,96)">www.mbaesq.com</span></a><b><u></u><u></u></b></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="margin-bottom:12pt"><b><span style="font-size:10pt;font-family:"Arial Narrow",sans-serif;color:rgb(0,32,96)">CONFIDENTIALITY NOTICE<br>
</span></b><span style="font-size:10pt;font-family:"Arial Narrow",sans-serif;color:rgb(0,32,96)">This transmission is confidential and is intended solely for the use of the individual named recipient. It may be protected by the
attorney-client privilege, work product doctrine, or other confidentiality protection. If you are not the intended recipient, or the person responsible to deliver it to the intended recipient, be advised that any dissemination, distribution, or copying of
this communication is prohibited. If you have received this transmission in error, please immediately notify the sender via e-mail or by telephone at (253) 327-1750 that you have received the message in error, and then delete it. Thank you.<u></u><u></u></span></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:10pt;font-family:Arial,sans-serif;color:rgb(0,32,96)"><u></u> <u></u></span></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal" style="margin-bottom:0in"><b><span style="font-size:11pt;font-family:Calibri,sans-serif">From:</span></b><span style="font-size:11pt;font-family:Calibri,sans-serif">
<a href="mailto:wsbapt-bounces@lists.wsbarppt.com" target="_blank"><span style="border:none">wsbapt-bounces@lists.wsbarppt.com</span></a> <<a href="mailto:wsbapt-bounces@lists.wsbarppt.com" target="_blank"><span style="border:none">wsbapt-bounces@lists.wsbarppt.com</span></a>>
<b>On Behalf Of </b>Dave Culbertson<br>
<b>Sent:</b> Tuesday, August 5, 2025 10:58 AM<br>
<b>To:</b> <a href="mailto:solo-and-small-practice-section@list.wsba.org" target="_blank"><span style="border:none">solo-and-small-practice-section@list.wsba.org</span></a>;
<a href="mailto:creditor-debtor-section@list.wsba.org" target="_blank"><span style="border:none">creditor-debtor-section@list.wsba.org</span></a>;
<a href="mailto:wsbapt@lists.wsbarppt.com" target="_blank"><span style="border:none">wsbapt@lists.wsbarppt.com</span></a>;
<a href="mailto:wsbarp@lists.wsbarppt.com" target="_blank"><span style="border:none">wsbarp@lists.wsbarppt.com</span></a><br>
<b>Subject:</b> [WSBAPT] AI...is that YOU?<u></u><u></u></span></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><u></u> <u></u></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><a name="m_8602993006589206046__Hlk52442782">Hi, Listmates.<u></u><u></u></a></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span>Apologies for my 2<sup>nd</sup> long-winded yammering e-mail today. But I had an interesting phishing attack last week that I thought I should spread the word about because it was extremely elaborate
and feigned authenticity very well. It makes me wonder if it was my first AI-generated scam experience. If so, I’m scared for me in the future.<u></u><u></u></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span>Here’s what happened:<u></u><u></u></span></p>
<p class="m_8602993006589206046Bullet--NumberFirst--Indent" style="margin-left:0.5in">
<span><u></u><span>1.<span style="font:7pt "Times New Roman"">
</span></span><u></u>I got an e-mail from an attorney that I knew from the list-serv. The subject line was their firm name. Maybe that odd subject line should have been a flag, but since I’d posted a question jsut before, an incoming e-mail didn’t seem surprising.
I didn’t consider the oddness till hindsight-time. <u></u><u></u></span></p>
<p class="m_8602993006589206046Bullet--NumberFirst--Indent" style="margin-left:0.5in">
<span><u></u><span>2.<span style="font:7pt "Times New Roman"">
</span></span><u></u>On opening the e-mail, it presented itself as one of the increasingly common “document transfer” systems: “New secure message from [Name of the attorney sending the e-mail].” It was from an outfit named “Zivver”. Had a button for “open
message”.<u></u><u></u></span></p>
<p class="m_8602993006589206046Bullet--NumberFirst--Indent" style="margin-left:0.5in">
<span><u></u><span>3.<span style="font:7pt "Times New Roman"">
</span></span><u></u>I decided to check Zivver out first. Found a website: </span>
<a href="https://www.zivver.com/" target="_blank"><span>https://www.zivver.com/</span><span></span></a><span>. It looks legit, though somewhat cluttered. So, I clicked on
the open message button. Here is where it got uncannily elaborate. The button opened some kind of a module (or was it a webpage?) that had a two-step process. It said something about “enter a code” or maybe it was “click here for security code”. Had some friendly
graphics, like a cartoon figure of some kind. Whatever it was, when I clicked for the next step, another module popped up that said something like “see your e-mail for code”. The little cartoon figure changed in some way that seemed polished and professionally
done—I think it actually did some kind of animated walk. <u></u><u></u></span></p>
<p class="m_8602993006589206046Bullet--NumberFirst--Indent--L2" style="margin-left:0.75in">
<span><u></u><span style="font-family:Symbol"><span>·<span style="font:7pt "Times New Roman"">
</span></span></span><u></u>(Why does my description sound so vague, like I’m trying to recount a dream? Because I only did it the one time and wasn’t paying close attention. Everything was seeming legit: no tell-tale misspellings or Nigerian names. And
I’m not gonna click on the button again to give a more precise description. So the exact details are now a little fuzzy. The residual fear remains pretty clear, though.)<u></u><u></u></span></p>
<p class="m_8602993006589206046Bullet--NumberFirst--Indent" style="margin-left:0.5in">
<span><u></u><span>4.<span style="font:7pt "Times New Roman"">
</span></span><u></u>Right away there was an e-mail in my inbox from “Zivver.com”. Looked kind of like the first e-mail, with an “open message” button, but also had a code to “cut and paste”. I think maybe the module or webpage from earlier had a place to
enter the code, and I think that was what I did (as opposed to clicking on the new e-mail’s button).
<u></u><u></u></span></p>
<p class="m_8602993006589206046Bullet--NumberFirst--Indent" style="margin-left:0.5in">
<span><u></u><span>5.<span style="font:7pt "Times New Roman"">
</span></span><u></u>This all seemed unnecessarily elaborate up to this point, and a little tedious. That only made it seem in the vein of a “secure documents system”. But the first unmistakably skeezy stuff started to happen once I clicked or entered the
code or whatever it was I did:<u></u><u></u></span></p>
<p class="m_8602993006589206046Bullet--NumberFirst--Indent--L2" style="margin-left:0.75in">
<span><u></u><span style="font-family:Symbol"><span>·<span style="font:7pt "Times New Roman"">
</span></span></span><u></u>A webpage from Target.com opened up in my browser.<u></u><u></u></span></p>
<p class="m_8602993006589206046Bullet--NumberFirst--Indent--L2" style="margin-left:0.75in">
<span><u></u><span style="font-family:Symbol"><span>·<span style="font:7pt "Times New Roman"">
</span></span></span><u></u>At the same time, my Malwarebytes software popped up a module: “Unsafe page has been blocked”.<u></u><u></u></span></p>
<p class="m_8602993006589206046Bullet--NumberFirst--Indent--L2" style="margin-left:0.75in">
<span><u></u><span style="font-family:Symbol"><span>·<span style="font:7pt "Times New Roman"">
</span></span></span><u></u>And a moment or two later, the MS Office 365 sign-in module popped up as well asking me to sign in.<u></u><u></u></span></p>
<p class="m_8602993006589206046Bullet--NumberFirst--Indent--L2" style="margin-left:0.75in">
<span><u></u><span style="font-family:Symbol"><span>·<span style="font:7pt "Times New Roman"">
</span></span></span><u></u>My immediate sophisticated thought process was something like this: NOOOOOOO....!!!.<u></u><u></u></span></p>
<p class="m_8602993006589206046Bullet--NumberFirst--Indent" style="margin-left:0.5in">
<span><u></u><span>6.<span style="font:7pt "Times New Roman"">
</span></span><u></u>But then:<u></u><u></u></span></p>
<p class="m_8602993006589206046Bullet--NumberFirst--Indent--L2" style="margin-left:0.75in">
<span><u></u><span style="font-family:Symbol"><span>·<span style="font:7pt "Times New Roman"">
</span></span></span><u></u>I did not re-log into MS Office.<u></u><u></u></span></p>
<p class="m_8602993006589206046Bullet--NumberFirst--Indent--L2" style="margin-left:0.75in">
<span><u></u><span style="font-family:Symbol"><span>·<span style="font:7pt "Times New Roman"">
</span></span></span><u></u>I closed all the things to do with the e-mail.<u></u><u></u></span></p>
<p class="m_8602993006589206046Bullet--NumberFirst--Indent--L2" style="margin-left:0.75in">
<span><u></u><span style="font-family:Symbol"><span>·<span style="font:7pt "Times New Roman"">
</span></span></span><u></u>I re-set my MS Office log-in by going directly to their site.<u></u><u></u></span></p>
<p class="m_8602993006589206046Bullet--NumberFirst--Indent--L2" style="margin-left:0.75in">
<span><u></u><span style="font-family:Symbol"><span>·<span style="font:7pt "Times New Roman"">
</span></span></span><u></u>I declined the Malwarebytes option of proceeding to the unsafe page.<u></u><u></u></span></p>
<p class="m_8602993006589206046Bullet--NumberFirst--Indent" style="margin-left:0.5in">
<span><u></u><span>7.<span style="font:7pt "Times New Roman"">
</span></span><u></u>Here is the aftermath:<u></u><u></u></span></p>
<p class="m_8602993006589206046Bullet--NumberFirst--Indent--L2" style="margin-left:0.75in">
<span><u></u><span style="font-family:Symbol"><span>·<span style="font:7pt "Times New Roman"">
</span></span></span><u></u>I think I was protected by Malwarebytes before the attack got something. I didn’t take the next step of entering any log-in, or going to the unsafe site. Hoping that was sufficient.<u></u><u></u></span></p>
<p class="m_8602993006589206046Bullet--NumberFirst--Indent--L2" style="margin-left:0.75in">
<span><u></u><span style="font-family:Symbol"><span>·<span style="font:7pt "Times New Roman"">
</span></span></span><u></u>I reached out to the attorney, who confirmed they’d had some kind of hack happen to them.<u></u><u></u></span></p>
<p class="m_8602993006589206046Bullet--NumberFirst--Indent--L2" style="margin-left:0.75in">
<span><u></u><span style="font-family:Symbol"><span>·<span style="font:7pt "Times New Roman"">
</span></span></span><u></u>I told the WSBA tech team, who was responsive and helpful and tried to get some answer from “Zivver.com”, but didn’t hear anything back from them. Also, the dodgy e-mail I forwarded to the WSBA team was blocked by their filter.
So that seems as far as they can go.<u></u><u></u></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span><u></u> <u></u></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span>And now I’m telling the brethren. And the sistren. This one was unusually deceptive: the graphics were slick; it had a multi-step process that lulled me with the familiar; the grammar, spelling and
presentation mirrored normality and professionalism.<u></u><u></u></span></p>
<ul style="margin-top:0in" type="disc">
<li class="m_8602993006589206046MsoListParagraphCxSpFirst" style="margin-top:6pt;margin-left:0in">
<span>It has the peculiar effect of making quote marks seem appropriate on every detail. Should I say Zivver.com.or “Zivver.com”? Was it Target.com, or “Target.com”? Did I receive a code, or a “code”?
<u></u><u></u></span></li><li class="m_8602993006589206046MsoListParagraphCxSpMiddle" style="margin-top:6pt;margin-left:0in">
<span>There does seem to be a Zivver.com—at least, Google pops up tech reviews, and their site seems substantial. So maybe the scam was piggybacking on them...or maybe the page that popped up was AI generated to mimic them.<u></u><u></u></span></li><li class="m_8602993006589206046MsoListParagraphCxSpLast" style="margin-top:6pt;margin-left:0in">
<span>If this is the level of authenticity at an early phase of AI, it’s gonna get impossible. My prediction: as a society we are going to have to go back to old ways of doing things that were slower but hard to fake. Like
more face-to-face time, in 3-D. That will become the only truly reliable scenario. Might end up making us a little less alienated, though, out of necessity.<u></u><u></u></span></li></ul>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span><u></u> <u></u></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span><u></u> <u></u></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="margin-bottom:0in"><span>Best Regards,<u></u><u></u></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="margin-bottom:0in"><span><u></u> <u></u></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="margin-bottom:0in"><span><u></u> <u></u></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="margin-bottom:0in"><span>Dave Culbertson<u></u><u></u></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="margin-bottom:0in"><span><u></u> <u></u></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="margin-bottom:0in"><span><b>The Law Office of Davisson Culbertson</b><u></u><u></u></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="margin-bottom:0in"><span>PO 20403<u></u><u></u></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="margin-bottom:0in"><span>Seattle, WA 98102<u></u><u></u></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="margin-bottom:0in"><span><i><u></u> <u></u></i></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="margin-bottom:0in"><span><i>Phone:
</i>(206) 478-8134<i><u></u><u></u></i></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="margin-bottom:0in"><span><i>FAX:
</i>(866) 867-7796<u></u><u></u></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="margin-bottom:0in"><span><i><u></u> <u></u></i></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="margin-bottom:0in"><span></span><a href="mailto:dculbertson@culbertsonlawoffice.com" target="_blank"><span><i>dculbertson@culbertsonlawoffice.com</i></span><span></span></a><span><u></u><u></u></span></p>
<span></span>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="margin-bottom:0in"><u></u> <u></u></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><u></u> <u></u></p>
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