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<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial",sans-serif;color:#002060">Dear Dave:<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial",sans-serif;color:#002060">Thanks for the heads-up and for the details of your experience. Your recollection was sufficient to put us all on notice.<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="margin-bottom:12.0pt"><b><span style="font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial",sans-serif;color:#002060;mso-ligatures:standardcontextual">Mark B. Anderson<br>
</span></b><span style="font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial",sans-serif;color:#002060;mso-ligatures:standardcontextual">ANDERSON LAW FIRM PLLC<br>
821 Dock Street, Suite 209, PMB 4-12<br>
Tacoma, Washington 98402<br>
+1 253-327-1750<br>
+1 253-327-1751 (fax)<br>
<a href="mailto:marka@mbaesq.com"><span style="color:#002060;border:none">marka@mbaesq.com</span></a><br>
<a href="http://www.mbaesq.com/"><span style="color:#002060;border:none">www.mbaesq.com</span></a><b><o:p></o:p></b></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="margin-bottom:12.0pt"><b><span style="font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial Narrow",sans-serif;color:#002060;mso-ligatures:standardcontextual">CONFIDENTIALITY NOTICE<br>
</span></b><span style="font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial Narrow",sans-serif;color:#002060;mso-ligatures:standardcontextual">This transmission is confidential and is intended solely for the use of the individual named recipient. It may be protected by the
attorney-client privilege, work product doctrine, or other confidentiality protection. If you are not the intended recipient, or the person responsible to deliver it to the intended recipient, be advised that any dissemination, distribution, or copying of
this communication is prohibited. If you have received this transmission in error, please immediately notify the sender via e-mail or by telephone at (253) 327-1750 that you have received the message in error, and then delete it. Thank you.<o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial",sans-serif;color:#002060"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
<div>
<div style="border:none;border-top:solid #E1E1E1 1.0pt;padding:3.0pt 0in 0in 0in">
<p class="MsoNormal" style="margin-bottom:0in"><b><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif">From:</span></b><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif"> wsbapt-bounces@lists.wsbarppt.com <wsbapt-bounces@lists.wsbarppt.com>
<b>On Behalf Of </b>Dave Culbertson<br>
<b>Sent:</b> Tuesday, August 5, 2025 10:58 AM<br>
<b>To:</b> solo-and-small-practice-section@list.wsba.org; creditor-debtor-section@list.wsba.org; wsbapt@lists.wsbarppt.com; wsbarp@lists.wsbarppt.com<br>
<b>Subject:</b> [WSBAPT] AI...is that YOU?<o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
</div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><o:p> </o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><a name="_Hlk52442782">Hi, Listmates.<o:p></o:p></a></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="mso-bookmark:_Hlk52442782">Apologies for my 2<sup>nd</sup> long-winded yammering e-mail today. But I had an interesting phishing attack last week that I thought I should spread the word about because it was extremely elaborate
and feigned authenticity very well. It makes me wonder if it was my first AI-generated scam experience. If so, I’m scared for me in the future.<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="mso-bookmark:_Hlk52442782">Here’s what happened:<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="Bullet--NumberFirst--Indent" style="margin-left:.5in;mso-list:l1 level1 lfo3">
<span style="mso-bookmark:_Hlk52442782"><![if !supportLists]><span style="mso-list:Ignore">1.<span style="font:7.0pt "Times New Roman"">
</span></span><![endif]>I got an e-mail from an attorney that I knew from the list-serv. The subject line was their firm name. Maybe that odd subject line should have been a flag, but since I’d posted a question jsut before, an incoming e-mail didn’t seem surprising.
I didn’t consider the oddness till hindsight-time. <o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="Bullet--NumberFirst--Indent" style="margin-left:.5in;mso-list:l1 level1 lfo3">
<span style="mso-bookmark:_Hlk52442782"><![if !supportLists]><span style="mso-list:Ignore">2.<span style="font:7.0pt "Times New Roman"">
</span></span><![endif]>On opening the e-mail, it presented itself as one of the increasingly common “document transfer” systems: “New secure message from [Name of the attorney sending the e-mail].” It was from an outfit named “Zivver”. Had a button for “open
message”.<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="Bullet--NumberFirst--Indent" style="margin-left:.5in;mso-list:l1 level1 lfo3">
<span style="mso-bookmark:_Hlk52442782"><![if !supportLists]><span style="mso-list:Ignore">3.<span style="font:7.0pt "Times New Roman"">
</span></span><![endif]>I decided to check Zivver out first. Found a website: </span>
<a href="https://www.zivver.com/"><span style="mso-bookmark:_Hlk52442782">https://www.zivver.com/</span><span style="mso-bookmark:_Hlk52442782"></span></a><span style="mso-bookmark:_Hlk52442782">. It looks legit, though somewhat cluttered. So, I clicked on
the open message button. Here is where it got uncannily elaborate. The button opened some kind of a module (or was it a webpage?) that had a two-step process. It said something about “enter a code” or maybe it was “click here for security code”. Had some friendly
graphics, like a cartoon figure of some kind. Whatever it was, when I clicked for the next step, another module popped up that said something like “see your e-mail for code”. The little cartoon figure changed in some way that seemed polished and professionally
done—I think it actually did some kind of animated walk. <o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="Bullet--NumberFirst--Indent--L2" style="margin-left:.75in;mso-list:l1 level2 lfo3">
<span style="mso-bookmark:_Hlk52442782"><![if !supportLists]><span style="font-family:Symbol"><span style="mso-list:Ignore">·<span style="font:7.0pt "Times New Roman"">
</span></span></span><![endif]>(Why does my description sound so vague, like I’m trying to recount a dream? Because I only did it the one time and wasn’t paying close attention. Everything was seeming legit: no tell-tale misspellings or Nigerian names. And
I’m not gonna click on the button again to give a more precise description. So the exact details are now a little fuzzy. The residual fear remains pretty clear, though.)<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="Bullet--NumberFirst--Indent" style="margin-left:.5in;mso-list:l1 level1 lfo3">
<span style="mso-bookmark:_Hlk52442782"><![if !supportLists]><span style="mso-list:Ignore">4.<span style="font:7.0pt "Times New Roman"">
</span></span><![endif]>Right away there was an e-mail in my inbox from “Zivver.com”. Looked kind of like the first e-mail, with an “open message” button, but also had a code to “cut and paste”. I think maybe the module or webpage from earlier had a place to
enter the code, and I think that was what I did (as opposed to clicking on the new e-mail’s button).
<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="Bullet--NumberFirst--Indent" style="margin-left:.5in;mso-list:l1 level1 lfo3">
<span style="mso-bookmark:_Hlk52442782"><![if !supportLists]><span style="mso-list:Ignore">5.<span style="font:7.0pt "Times New Roman"">
</span></span><![endif]>This all seemed unnecessarily elaborate up to this point, and a little tedious. That only made it seem in the vein of a “secure documents system”. But the first unmistakably skeezy stuff started to happen once I clicked or entered the
code or whatever it was I did:<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="Bullet--NumberFirst--Indent--L2" style="margin-left:.75in;mso-list:l1 level2 lfo3">
<span style="mso-bookmark:_Hlk52442782"><![if !supportLists]><span style="font-family:Symbol"><span style="mso-list:Ignore">·<span style="font:7.0pt "Times New Roman"">
</span></span></span><![endif]>A webpage from Target.com opened up in my browser.<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="Bullet--NumberFirst--Indent--L2" style="margin-left:.75in;mso-list:l1 level2 lfo3">
<span style="mso-bookmark:_Hlk52442782"><![if !supportLists]><span style="font-family:Symbol"><span style="mso-list:Ignore">·<span style="font:7.0pt "Times New Roman"">
</span></span></span><![endif]>At the same time, my Malwarebytes software popped up a module: “Unsafe page has been blocked”.<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="Bullet--NumberFirst--Indent--L2" style="margin-left:.75in;mso-list:l1 level2 lfo3">
<span style="mso-bookmark:_Hlk52442782"><![if !supportLists]><span style="font-family:Symbol"><span style="mso-list:Ignore">·<span style="font:7.0pt "Times New Roman"">
</span></span></span><![endif]>And a moment or two later, the MS Office 365 sign-in module popped up as well asking me to sign in.<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="Bullet--NumberFirst--Indent--L2" style="margin-left:.75in;mso-list:l1 level2 lfo3">
<span style="mso-bookmark:_Hlk52442782"><![if !supportLists]><span style="font-family:Symbol"><span style="mso-list:Ignore">·<span style="font:7.0pt "Times New Roman"">
</span></span></span><![endif]>My immediate sophisticated thought process was something like this: NOOOOOOO....!!!.<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="Bullet--NumberFirst--Indent" style="margin-left:.5in;mso-list:l1 level1 lfo3">
<span style="mso-bookmark:_Hlk52442782"><![if !supportLists]><span style="mso-list:Ignore">6.<span style="font:7.0pt "Times New Roman"">
</span></span><![endif]>But then:<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="Bullet--NumberFirst--Indent--L2" style="margin-left:.75in;mso-list:l1 level2 lfo3">
<span style="mso-bookmark:_Hlk52442782"><![if !supportLists]><span style="font-family:Symbol"><span style="mso-list:Ignore">·<span style="font:7.0pt "Times New Roman"">
</span></span></span><![endif]>I did not re-log into MS Office.<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="Bullet--NumberFirst--Indent--L2" style="margin-left:.75in;mso-list:l1 level2 lfo3">
<span style="mso-bookmark:_Hlk52442782"><![if !supportLists]><span style="font-family:Symbol"><span style="mso-list:Ignore">·<span style="font:7.0pt "Times New Roman"">
</span></span></span><![endif]>I closed all the things to do with the e-mail.<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="Bullet--NumberFirst--Indent--L2" style="margin-left:.75in;mso-list:l1 level2 lfo3">
<span style="mso-bookmark:_Hlk52442782"><![if !supportLists]><span style="font-family:Symbol"><span style="mso-list:Ignore">·<span style="font:7.0pt "Times New Roman"">
</span></span></span><![endif]>I re-set my MS Office log-in by going directly to their site.<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="Bullet--NumberFirst--Indent--L2" style="margin-left:.75in;mso-list:l1 level2 lfo3">
<span style="mso-bookmark:_Hlk52442782"><![if !supportLists]><span style="font-family:Symbol"><span style="mso-list:Ignore">·<span style="font:7.0pt "Times New Roman"">
</span></span></span><![endif]>I declined the Malwarebytes option of proceeding to the unsafe page.<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="Bullet--NumberFirst--Indent" style="margin-left:.5in;mso-list:l1 level1 lfo3">
<span style="mso-bookmark:_Hlk52442782"><![if !supportLists]><span style="mso-list:Ignore">7.<span style="font:7.0pt "Times New Roman"">
</span></span><![endif]>Here is the aftermath:<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="Bullet--NumberFirst--Indent--L2" style="margin-left:.75in;mso-list:l1 level2 lfo3">
<span style="mso-bookmark:_Hlk52442782"><![if !supportLists]><span style="font-family:Symbol"><span style="mso-list:Ignore">·<span style="font:7.0pt "Times New Roman"">
</span></span></span><![endif]>I think I was protected by Malwarebytes before the attack got something. I didn’t take the next step of entering any log-in, or going to the unsafe site. Hoping that was sufficient.<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="Bullet--NumberFirst--Indent--L2" style="margin-left:.75in;mso-list:l1 level2 lfo3">
<span style="mso-bookmark:_Hlk52442782"><![if !supportLists]><span style="font-family:Symbol"><span style="mso-list:Ignore">·<span style="font:7.0pt "Times New Roman"">
</span></span></span><![endif]>I reached out to the attorney, who confirmed they’d had some kind of hack happen to them.<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="Bullet--NumberFirst--Indent--L2" style="margin-left:.75in;mso-list:l1 level2 lfo3">
<span style="mso-bookmark:_Hlk52442782"><![if !supportLists]><span style="font-family:Symbol"><span style="mso-list:Ignore">·<span style="font:7.0pt "Times New Roman"">
</span></span></span><![endif]>I told the WSBA tech team, who was responsive and helpful and tried to get some answer from “Zivver.com”, but didn’t hear anything back from them. Also, the dodgy e-mail I forwarded to the WSBA team was blocked by their filter.
So that seems as far as they can go.<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="mso-bookmark:_Hlk52442782"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="mso-bookmark:_Hlk52442782">And now I’m telling the brethren. And the sistren. This one was unusually deceptive: the graphics were slick; it had a multi-step process that lulled me with the familiar; the grammar, spelling and
presentation mirrored normality and professionalism.<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<ul style="margin-top:0in" type="disc">
<li class="MsoListParagraphCxSpFirst" style="margin-top:6.0pt;margin-left:0in;mso-add-space:auto;mso-list:l2 level1 lfo6">
<span style="mso-bookmark:_Hlk52442782">It has the peculiar effect of making quote marks seem appropriate on every detail. Should I say Zivver.com.or “Zivver.com”? Was it Target.com, or “Target.com”? Did I receive a code, or a “code”?
<o:p></o:p></span></li><li class="MsoListParagraphCxSpMiddle" style="margin-top:6.0pt;margin-left:0in;mso-add-space:auto;mso-list:l2 level1 lfo6">
<span style="mso-bookmark:_Hlk52442782">There does seem to be a Zivver.com—at least, Google pops up tech reviews, and their site seems substantial. So maybe the scam was piggybacking on them...or maybe the page that popped up was AI generated to mimic them.<o:p></o:p></span></li><li class="MsoListParagraphCxSpLast" style="margin-top:6.0pt;margin-left:0in;mso-add-space:auto;mso-list:l2 level1 lfo6">
<span style="mso-bookmark:_Hlk52442782">If this is the level of authenticity at an early phase of AI, it’s gonna get impossible. My prediction: as a society we are going to have to go back to old ways of doing things that were slower but hard to fake. Like
more face-to-face time, in 3-D. That will become the only truly reliable scenario. Might end up making us a little less alienated, though, out of necessity.<o:p></o:p></span></li></ul>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="mso-bookmark:_Hlk52442782"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="mso-bookmark:_Hlk52442782"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="margin-bottom:0in"><span style="mso-bookmark:_Hlk52442782">Best Regards,<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="margin-bottom:0in"><span style="mso-bookmark:_Hlk52442782"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="margin-bottom:0in"><span style="mso-bookmark:_Hlk52442782"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="margin-bottom:0in"><span style="mso-bookmark:_Hlk52442782">Dave Culbertson<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="margin-bottom:0in"><span style="mso-bookmark:_Hlk52442782"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="margin-bottom:0in"><span style="mso-bookmark:_Hlk52442782"><b>The Law Office of Davisson Culbertson</b><o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="margin-bottom:0in"><span style="mso-bookmark:_Hlk52442782">PO 20403<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="margin-bottom:0in"><span style="mso-bookmark:_Hlk52442782">Seattle, WA 98102<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="margin-bottom:0in"><span style="mso-bookmark:_Hlk52442782"><i><o:p> </o:p></i></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="margin-bottom:0in"><span style="mso-bookmark:_Hlk52442782"><i>Phone:
</i>(206) 478-8134<i><o:p></o:p></i></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="margin-bottom:0in"><span style="mso-bookmark:_Hlk52442782"><i>FAX:
</i>(866) 867-7796<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="margin-bottom:0in"><span style="mso-bookmark:_Hlk52442782"><i><o:p> </o:p></i></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="margin-bottom:0in"><span style="mso-bookmark:_Hlk52442782"></span><a href="mailto:dculbertson@culbertsonlawoffice.com" target="_blank"><span style="mso-bookmark:_Hlk52442782"><i>dculbertson@culbertsonlawoffice.com</i></span><span style="mso-bookmark:_Hlk52442782"></span></a><span style="mso-bookmark:_Hlk52442782"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
<span style="mso-bookmark:_Hlk52442782"></span>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="margin-bottom:0in"><o:p> </o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><o:p> </o:p></p>
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