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Phil, would you feel the same were a client to endorse such a check as “executor”?
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<div>Your cite: </div>
<div><span style="caret-color: rgb(51, 51, 51); color: rgb(51, 51, 51); font-family: "Open Sans", "Sohne Buch", Verdana, sans-serif; font-size: 19.200001px; font-weight: 700; -webkit-tap-highlight-color: rgba(0, 0, 0, 0); -webkit-text-size-adjust: 100%; background-color: rgb(255, 255, 255);">26
CFR § 20.2203-1 Definition of </span><a aria-label="Definitions - executor" class="colorbox-load definedterm" href="https://www.law.cornell.edu/definitions/index.php?width=840&height=800&iframe=true&def_id=81afc5f66947a71c56a5decb678db11f&term_occur=999&term_src=Title:26:Chapter:I:Subchapter:B:Part:20:Subjgrp:9:20.2203-1" style="box-sizing: border-box; color: rgb(0, 28, 114); text-decoration: none; font-family: "Open Sans", "Sohne Buch", Verdana, sans-serif; cursor: pointer; border-bottom-width: 1px; border-bottom-style: solid; border-bottom-color: rgb(0, 28, 114); font-size: 19.200001px; font-weight: 700; -webkit-tap-highlight-color: rgba(0, 0, 0, 0); -webkit-text-size-adjust: 100%;">executor</a><span style="caret-color: rgb(51, 51, 51); color: rgb(51, 51, 51); font-family: "Open Sans", "Sohne Buch", Verdana, sans-serif; font-size: 19.200001px; font-weight: 700; -webkit-tap-highlight-color: rgba(0, 0, 0, 0); -webkit-text-size-adjust: 100%; background-color: rgb(255, 255, 255);">.</span></div>
<div><span style="background-color: rgb(255, 255, 255); caret-color: rgb(51, 51, 51); color: rgb(51, 51, 51); font-family: "Open Sans", "Sohne Buch", Verdana, sans-serif; font-size: 16px; -webkit-tap-highlight-color: rgba(0, 0, 0, 0); -webkit-text-size-adjust: 100%;">The
term</span><span style="background-color: rgb(255, 255, 255); caret-color: rgb(51, 51, 51); color: rgb(51, 51, 51); font-family: "Open Sans", "Sohne Buch", Verdana, sans-serif; font-size: 16px; -webkit-tap-highlight-color: rgba(0, 0, 0, 0); -webkit-text-size-adjust: 100%;"> </span><span class="et03" style="caret-color: rgb(51, 51, 51); color: rgb(51, 51, 51); font-family: "Open Sans", "Sohne Buch", Verdana, sans-serif; font-size: 16px; -webkit-tap-highlight-color: rgba(0, 0, 0, 0); -webkit-text-size-adjust: 100%; box-sizing: border-box; font-style: italic;">executor</span><span style="background-color: rgb(255, 255, 255); caret-color: rgb(51, 51, 51); color: rgb(51, 51, 51); font-family: "Open Sans", "Sohne Buch", Verdana, sans-serif; font-size: 16px; -webkit-tap-highlight-color: rgba(0, 0, 0, 0); -webkit-text-size-adjust: 100%;"> </span><span style="background-color: rgb(255, 255, 255); caret-color: rgb(51, 51, 51); color: rgb(51, 51, 51); font-family: "Open Sans", "Sohne Buch", Verdana, sans-serif; font-size: 16px; -webkit-tap-highlight-color: rgba(0, 0, 0, 0); -webkit-text-size-adjust: 100%;">means
the</span><span style="background-color: rgb(255, 255, 255); caret-color: rgb(51, 51, 51); color: rgb(51, 51, 51); font-family: "Open Sans", "Sohne Buch", Verdana, sans-serif; font-size: 16px; -webkit-tap-highlight-color: rgba(0, 0, 0, 0); -webkit-text-size-adjust: 100%;"> </span><a aria-label="Definitions - executor" class="colorbox-load definedterm" href="https://www.law.cornell.edu/definitions/index.php?width=840&height=800&iframe=true&def_id=81afc5f66947a71c56a5decb678db11f&term_occur=999&term_src=Title:26:Chapter:I:Subchapter:B:Part:20:Subjgrp:9:20.2203-1" style="caret-color: rgb(51, 51, 51); font-family: "Open Sans", "Sohne Buch", Verdana, sans-serif; font-size: 16px; -webkit-tap-highlight-color: rgba(0, 0, 0, 0); -webkit-text-size-adjust: 100%; box-sizing: border-box; color: rgb(0, 28, 114); text-decoration: none; cursor: pointer; border-bottom-width: 1px; border-bottom-style: solid; border-bottom-color: rgb(0, 28, 114);">executor</a><span style="background-color: rgb(255, 255, 255); caret-color: rgb(51, 51, 51); color: rgb(51, 51, 51); font-family: "Open Sans", "Sohne Buch", Verdana, sans-serif; font-size: 16px; -webkit-tap-highlight-color: rgba(0, 0, 0, 0); -webkit-text-size-adjust: 100%;"> </span><span style="background-color: rgb(255, 255, 255); caret-color: rgb(51, 51, 51); color: rgb(51, 51, 51); font-family: "Open Sans", "Sohne Buch", Verdana, sans-serif; font-size: 16px; -webkit-tap-highlight-color: rgba(0, 0, 0, 0); -webkit-text-size-adjust: 100%;">or
administrator of the decedent's estate. However, if there is no</span><span style="background-color: rgb(255, 255, 255); caret-color: rgb(51, 51, 51); color: rgb(51, 51, 51); font-family: "Open Sans", "Sohne Buch", Verdana, sans-serif; font-size: 16px; -webkit-tap-highlight-color: rgba(0, 0, 0, 0); -webkit-text-size-adjust: 100%;"> </span><span style="background-color: rgb(255, 255, 255); caret-color: rgb(51, 51, 51); color: rgb(51, 51, 51); font-family: "Open Sans", "Sohne Buch", Verdana, sans-serif; font-size: 16px; -webkit-tap-highlight-color: rgba(0, 0, 0, 0); -webkit-text-size-adjust: 100%;"> </span><a aria-label="Definitions - executor" class="colorbox-load definedterm" href="https://www.law.cornell.edu/definitions/index.php?width=840&height=800&iframe=true&def_id=81afc5f66947a71c56a5decb678db11f&term_occur=999&term_src=Title:26:Chapter:I:Subchapter:B:Part:20:Subjgrp:9:20.2203-1" style="caret-color: rgb(51, 51, 51); font-family: "Open Sans", "Sohne Buch", Verdana, sans-serif; font-size: 16px; -webkit-tap-highlight-color: rgba(0, 0, 0, 0); -webkit-text-size-adjust: 100%; box-sizing: border-box; color: rgb(0, 28, 114); text-decoration: none; cursor: pointer; border-bottom-width: 1px; border-bottom-style: solid; border-bottom-color: rgb(0, 28, 114);">executor</a><span style="background-color: rgb(255, 255, 255); caret-color: rgb(51, 51, 51); color: rgb(51, 51, 51); font-family: "Open Sans", "Sohne Buch", Verdana, sans-serif; font-size: 16px; -webkit-tap-highlight-color: rgba(0, 0, 0, 0); -webkit-text-size-adjust: 100%;"> </span><span style="background-color: rgb(255, 255, 255); caret-color: rgb(51, 51, 51); color: rgb(51, 51, 51); font-family: "Open Sans", "Sohne Buch", Verdana, sans-serif; font-size: 16px; -webkit-tap-highlight-color: rgba(0, 0, 0, 0); -webkit-text-size-adjust: 100%;">or
administrator appointed, qualified and acting within the United States, the term means any</span><span style="background-color: rgb(255, 255, 255); caret-color: rgb(51, 51, 51); color: rgb(51, 51, 51); font-family: "Open Sans", "Sohne Buch", Verdana, sans-serif; font-size: 16px; -webkit-tap-highlight-color: rgba(0, 0, 0, 0); -webkit-text-size-adjust: 100%;"> </span><a aria-label="Definitions - person" class="colorbox-load definedterm" href="https://www.law.cornell.edu/definitions/index.php?width=840&height=800&iframe=true&def_id=5b6e6898a41e8926772a727414713269&term_occur=999&term_src=Title:26:Chapter:I:Subchapter:B:Part:20:Subjgrp:9:20.2203-1" style="caret-color: rgb(51, 51, 51); font-family: "Open Sans", "Sohne Buch", Verdana, sans-serif; font-size: 16px; -webkit-tap-highlight-color: rgba(0, 0, 0, 0); -webkit-text-size-adjust: 100%; box-sizing: border-box; color: rgb(0, 28, 114); text-decoration: none; cursor: pointer; border-bottom-width: 1px; border-bottom-style: solid; border-bottom-color: rgb(0, 28, 114);">person</a><span style="background-color: rgb(255, 255, 255); caret-color: rgb(51, 51, 51); color: rgb(51, 51, 51); font-family: "Open Sans", "Sohne Buch", Verdana, sans-serif; font-size: 16px; -webkit-tap-highlight-color: rgba(0, 0, 0, 0); -webkit-text-size-adjust: 100%;"> </span><span style="background-color: rgb(255, 255, 255); caret-color: rgb(51, 51, 51); color: rgb(51, 51, 51); font-family: "Open Sans", "Sohne Buch", Verdana, sans-serif; font-size: 16px; -webkit-tap-highlight-color: rgba(0, 0, 0, 0); -webkit-text-size-adjust: 100%;">in
actual or constructive possession of any property of the decedent. </span></div>
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<p class="MsoNormal" style="margin: 0in;"><o:p style="background-color: rgba(255, 255, 255, 0);"> </o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="margin: 0in;"><span style="background-color: rgba(255, 255, 255, 0);">--------<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="margin: 0in;"><span style="background-color: rgba(255, 255, 255, 0);"><b>Terry J. Tassin, Jr.</b><o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="margin: 0in;"><span style="background-color: rgba(255, 255, 255, 0);">Scarborough McNeese Oelke & Kilkenny, P.C.<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="margin: 0in;"><span style="background-color: rgba(255, 255, 255, 0);">Five Centerpointe Drive, Suite 240<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="margin: 0in;"><font color="#ffffff"><span style="caret-color: rgb(255, 255, 255); background-color: rgba(255, 255, 255, 0);"><a href="x-apple-data-detectors://1/0">Lake Oswego, Oregon 97035-8682</a><o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="margin: 0in;"><span style="background-color: rgba(255, 255, 255, 0);">Phone: <a href="tel:503.601.3698">503.601.3698</a><o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="margin: 0in;"><span style="background-color: rgba(255, 255, 255, 0);">Fax: <a href="tel:503.601.3699">503.601.3699</a><br>
<i><a href="mailto:tjt@smoklaw.com">tjt@smoklaw.com</a><o:p></o:p></i></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="margin: 0in;"><i style="background-color: rgba(255, 255, 255, 0);"> </i></p>
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<blockquote type="cite">On Apr 21, 2023, at 9:52 PM, Philip N. Jones <pjones@duffykekel.com> wrote:<br>
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<div>Three questions:</div>
<div>Will a bank accept an unendorsed check being deposited to an IOLTA account? That would greatly surprise me.</div>
<div dir="ltr">Can an attorney ethically advise a client to endorse a check as PR when the client has not been appointed PR? That would greatly surprise me.</div>
<div dir="ltr">Can an attorney accept and deposit such a check? That would greatly surprise me.</div>
<div dir="ltr">Phil Jones</div>
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<div id="divRplyFwdMsg" dir="ltr"><font face="Calibri, sans-serif" style="font-size:11pt" color="#000000"><b>From:</b> wsbapt-bounces@lists.wsbarppt.com <wsbapt-bounces@lists.wsbarppt.com> on behalf of Joshua McKarcher <josh@mckarcherlaw.com><br>
<b>Sent:</b> Friday, April 21, 2023 6:24:09 PM<br>
<b>To:</b> WSBA Probate & Trust Listserv <wsbapt@lists.wsbarppt.com><br>
<b>Subject:</b> Re: [WSBAPT] Living Trust issue</font>
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<p class="x_MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:12.0pt; font-family:"Times New Roman",serif">I owe an update on this thread (which I have been working on), but, given this quick exchange today and the word “fruadulent,” I feel compelled to respond to say I cannot
see how it is <u>fraudulent</u> NOT to endorse a check and for the depositor’s bank simply to
<u>accept</u> that check for deposit to their lawyer-client’s IOLTA account – so long as the bank and its client (i.e., my firm, if I’m the lawyer depositing to my IOLTA) are (as the bank and I
<b><u>must</u></b>) <b><u>accept all liability</u></b> resulting from the wrongful
<u>receipt</u> or <u>application</u> of the funds. </span></p>
<p class="x_MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:12.0pt; font-family:"Times New Roman",serif"> </span></p>
<p class="x_MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:12.0pt; font-family:"Times New Roman",serif">But every IOLTA deposit is theoretically subject to dispute. And we have very clear rules about how to handle that if a dispute arises.
</span></p>
<p class="x_MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:12.0pt; font-family:"Times New Roman",serif"> </span></p>
<p class="x_MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:12.0pt; font-family:"Times New Roman",serif">And IOLTA funds are often (entirely?), as the rules contemplate, third-party property. This is an issue, in my view, of the lawyer’s judgment, knowledge of his client
and the matter, the bank’s comfort and trust of their lawyer-client, the kind and size of check, and other relevant factors that are mostly “risk analysis” factors we all deal with every day.</span></p>
<p class="x_MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:12.0pt; font-family:"Times New Roman",serif"> </span></p>
<p class="x_MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:12.0pt; font-family:"Times New Roman",serif">But if all heirs-at-law are beneficiaries of the trust to which the unprobated will pours over, and the one serving as trustee and nominated PR under the will is also
my client (on a “matter”) and has a check payable to <b>Estate of Decedent</b> or even simply
<b>Decedent</b> – but does not otherwise have need to probate the pour-over will – then I have found nothing in IOLTA rules or ethical rules (at least so far this week) that makes it wrong in any way for the lawyer to deposit the check to his or her IOLTA account
(<b><u>if</u></b> the bank agrees to accept it, which the bank is 100% <b><u>not</u></b> obligated to do;
<i>see, e.g.</i>, Heather’s bank’s change of heart). </span></p>
<p class="x_MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:12.0pt; font-family:"Times New Roman",serif"> </span></p>
<p class="x_MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:12.0pt; font-family:"Times New Roman",serif">It is then the lawyer’s (and his client’s) obligation to account for the receipt of those funds; and then to
<u>apply</u> those funds properly. In my example that would be by ensuring the funds end up with the beneficiaries entitled to the trust’s assets by virtue of the unprobated (but perhaps
<u>filed</u>) will that nominates my client as PR and pours over to the trust of which that PR is also trustee.</span></p>
<p class="x_MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:12.0pt; font-family:"Times New Roman",serif"> </span></p>
<p class="x_MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:12.0pt; font-family:"Times New Roman",serif">(The point there: I am not depositing funds subject to administration by someone else who is not my client on a “matter.” Not at all.)</span></p>
<p class="x_MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:12.0pt; font-family:"Times New Roman",serif"> </span></p>
<p class="x_MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:12.0pt; font-family:"Times New Roman",serif">I can expand more later re my position that Western law supports the idea that a decedent’s gross, worldwide, generic, lowercase “e”
<u>estate</u> consists of all property worldwide that is individually titled and subject to various jurisdictions’ individual probate or administration statutes.
</span></p>
<p class="x_MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:12.0pt; font-family:"Times New Roman",serif"> </span></p>
<p class="x_MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:12.0pt; font-family:"Times New Roman",serif">That (generic, worldwide, lowercase “e”) “estate” property is all the decedent’s property (1)
<u>not</u> titled to a trust and (2) <u>not</u> subject to nonprobate transfer under contract and other applicable law (such as IRAs, TODs/PODs, life insurance with beneficiary designations).</span></p>
<p class="x_MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:12.0pt; font-family:"Times New Roman",serif"> </span></p>
<p class="x_MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:12.0pt; font-family:"Times New Roman",serif">Assets that comprise that generic, worldwide “estate” could be subject to 15 different jurisdictions’ probate laws. Imagine real property parcels in 15 different states
(and poor planning, ha ha!). That could result in 15 state probate court proceedings technically “titled”
<i>In re Estate of Decedent</i>, but that simply creates 15 separate “sub-estates,” each consisting of the property subject to each separate state’s probate laws.
</span></p>
<p class="x_MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:12.0pt; font-family:"Times New Roman",serif"> </span></p>
<p class="x_MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:12.0pt; font-family:"Times New Roman",serif">But what if the HOME state has no real property and NOTHING requiring Letters Testamentary for administration? Is there really no estate in the home state? Until this
exchange, I never would have dreamed our profession would argue, “Yes, there is no estate in that home state until a PR is appointed there or a small estate affidavit is signed and filed there.”</span></p>
<p class="x_MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:12.0pt; font-family:"Times New Roman",serif"> </span></p>
<p class="x_MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:12.0pt; font-family:"Times New Roman",serif">I respectfully suggest that Western law generally (and Washington law specifically) will not likely bear out that there is simply “no estate” anywhere until a court-appointed
PR is appointed somewhere. There is indeed no “Estate of Decedent under Case No. XYZ123 in Washington Superior Court for County ABC,” but there is an “estate” – property that belongs to someone deceased that needs to be received and applied properly and efficiently
and sensibly.</span></p>
<p class="x_MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:12.0pt; font-family:"Times New Roman",serif"> </span></p>
<p class="x_MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:12.0pt; font-family:"Times New Roman",serif">Of course the will
<u>could</u> be probated, or a small estate affidavit <u>could</u> be presented, but if a payor of $35 in insurance premium refunds (payable to
<b>Estate of Decedent</b>) or $75 of federal income tax refund money (payable to <b>
Decedent</b>) does not WANT the protection/indemnity provided to them by acceptance and retention of the small estate affidavit, then I just do not believe lawyers are committing fraud by depositing either check to their IOLTA accounts with
<u>no endorsement</u> by anyone.</span></p>
<p class="x_MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:12.0pt; font-family:"Times New Roman",serif"> </span></p>
<p class="x_MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:12.0pt; font-family:"Times New Roman",serif">And the following is NOT a “justification” in any way, so proving this wrong does not prove my assertions wrong, but test the assertion against what IOLTA rules are about:
a lawyer could use his IOLTA account all day long to deposit checks properly endorsed by his/her client respecting a matter on which the lawyer advises the client -- and NOT APPLY THE FUNDS correctly. Or perhaps he knows/suspects the client-endorser RECEIVED
the funds improperly. I believe the law would support the position that it is the
<u>receipt</u> and <u>application</u> of client trust/IOLTA funds, not the <u>endorsement of checks</u>, that the law regulates or intends to regulate.</span></p>
<p class="x_MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:12.0pt; font-family:"Times New Roman",serif"> </span></p>
<p class="x_MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:12.0pt; font-family:"Times New Roman",serif">And, please do not forget:
<u>nothing</u> I’m advocating relieves anyone involved of <u>liability</u> and <u>
accountability</u> – or even <u>documentation</u> obligation – for the <u>receipt</u> and
<u>application</u> of those funds. I maintain 100% obligation and accountability for every little check like this. And I have 0% problem with that, because of how I screen and choose my clients.</span></p>
<p class="x_MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:12.0pt; font-family:"Times New Roman",serif"> </span></p>
<p class="x_MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:12.0pt; font-family:"Times New Roman",serif">All my very best regards, and have a great weekend everyone! Best, Josh</span></p>
<p class="x_MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:12.0pt; font-family:"Times New Roman",serif"> </span></p>
<p class="x_MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:12.0pt; font-family:"Times New Roman",serif">Joshua D. McKarcher</span></p>
<p class="x_MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:12.0pt; font-family:"Times New Roman",serif">McKarcher Law PLLC</span></p>
<p class="x_MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:12.0pt; font-family:"Times New Roman",serif">537 6th Street</span></p>
<p class="x_MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:12.0pt; font-family:"Times New Roman",serif">Clarkston, WA 99403</span></p>
<p class="x_MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:12.0pt; font-family:"Times New Roman",serif">(509) 758-3345</span></p>
<p class="x_MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:12.0pt; font-family:"Times New Roman",serif">(509) 758-3314 (fax)</span></p>
<p class="x_MsoNormal"><a href="mailto:josh@mckarcherlaw.com"><span style="font-size:12.0pt; font-family:"Times New Roman",serif; color:#0086F0">josh@mckarcherlaw.com</span></a><span style="font-size:12.0pt; font-family:"Times New Roman",serif"></span></p>
<p class="x_MsoNormal"><a href="http://www.mckarcherlaw.com/" originalsrc="http://www.mckarcherlaw.com/" shash="tV1EUZ84HidRPQ9luQWmc6wLarp4ObOW2H3vr+rrkVo1BmYs+CYD5YmgfVJRIjOmGKHHlCtV2+ZQWQUIdKhveIm8jzOQLaTUBIio4Q/z56f1j6LkPcnUuXzR6usqm3HJibL8M1SRvU9sP3oitLBEm1TwQoqTPq45k0zkQIG6F1c="><span style="font-size:12.0pt; font-family:"Times New Roman",serif; color:#0086F0">www.mckarcherlaw.com</span></a><span style="font-size:12.0pt; font-family:"Times New Roman",serif"></span></p>
<p class="x_MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:12.0pt; font-family:"Times New Roman",serif"> </span></p>
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<p class="x_MsoNormal"><b><span style="">From:</span></b><span style=""> <a href="mailto:wsbapt-bounces@lists.wsbarppt.com">
wsbapt-bounces@lists.wsbarppt.com</a> <<a href="mailto:wsbapt-bounces@lists.wsbarppt.com">wsbapt-bounces@lists.wsbarppt.com</a>>
<b>On Behalf Of </b>Philip N. Jones<br>
<b>Sent:</b> Friday, April 21, 2023 12:29 PM<br>
<b>To:</b> WSBA Probate & Trust Listserv <<a href="mailto:wsbapt@lists.wsbarppt.com">wsbapt@lists.wsbarppt.com</a>><br>
<b>Subject:</b> Re: [WSBAPT] Living Trust issue</span></p>
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<p class="x_MsoNormal"> </p>
<p class="x_MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:14.0pt; font-family:"Times New Roman",serif">I don’t see any ethical issues, except one:</span></p>
<p class="x_MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:14.0pt; font-family:"Times New Roman",serif">Who is going to endorse the check, and how are they going to endorse it? We can’t ethically advise our client to sign as PR when the client is not a PR.</span></p>
<p class="x_MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:14.0pt; font-family:"Times New Roman",serif">Some attorneys say to their clients, “I can’t ethically advise you to do X. Wink. Wink.” Knowing full well that the attorney just gave the client an idea of what to
do. And the attorney can then use “plausible deniability” to claim that he/she did not advise the client to do X.</span></p>
<p class="x_MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:14.0pt; font-family:"Times New Roman",serif">But in this case, the attorney will be placing the funds in his/her IOLTA account. Difficult to plausibly deny that the attorney participated in an action that might
be viewed as fraudulent.</span></p>
<p class="x_MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:14.0pt; font-family:"Times New Roman",serif">Phil Jones</span></p>
<p class="x_MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:14.0pt; font-family:"Times New Roman",serif"> </span></p>
<div>
<p class="x_MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:14.0pt; font-family:"Times New Roman",serif">Philip N. Jones</span></p>
<p class="x_MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:14.0pt; font-family:"Times New Roman",serif">Duffy Kekel LLP</span></p>
<p class="x_MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:14.0pt; font-family:"Times New Roman",serif">900 S.W. Fifth Ave. Suite 2500</span></p>
<p class="x_MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:14.0pt; font-family:"Times New Roman",serif">Portland, OR 97204</span></p>
<p class="x_MsoNormal"><a href="mailto:pjones@duffykekel.com"><span style="font-size:14.0pt; font-family:"Times New Roman",serif">pjones@duffykekel.com</span></a><span style="font-size:14.0pt; font-family:"Times New Roman",serif"></span></p>
<p class="x_MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:14.0pt; font-family:"Times New Roman",serif">(503) 226-1371 – office</span></p>
<p class="x_MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:14.0pt; font-family:"Times New Roman",serif">(503) 853-1482 – cell</span></p>
<p class="x_MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:14.0pt; font-family:"Times New Roman",serif">(503) 226-3574 - fax</span></p>
</div>
<p class="x_MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:14.0pt; font-family:"Times New Roman",serif"> </span></p>
<div>
<div style="border:none; border-top:solid #E1E1E1 1.0pt; padding:3.0pt 0in 0in 0in">
<p class="x_MsoNormal"><b><span style="">From:</span></b><span style=""> </span><a href="mailto:wsbapt-bounces@lists.wsbarppt.com"><span style="">wsbapt-bounces@lists.wsbarppt.com</span></a><span style=""> <</span><a href="mailto:wsbapt-bounces@lists.wsbarppt.com"><span style="">wsbapt-bounces@lists.wsbarppt.com</span></a><span style="">>
<b>On Behalf Of </b>Timothy Lehr<br>
<b>Sent:</b> Friday, April 21, 2023 12:03 PM<br>
<b>To:</b> WSBA Probate & Trust Listserv <</span><a href="mailto:wsbapt@lists.wsbarppt.com"><span style="">wsbapt@lists.wsbarppt.com</span></a><span style="">><br>
<b>Subject:</b> Re: [WSBAPT] Living Trust issue</span></p>
</div>
</div>
<p class="x_MsoNormal"> </p>
<p class="x_MsoNormal">Wondering if there would be any ethical violations/issues with depositing the check in an attorney trust account and re-issuing to the trust? This was just off the top of my head and I have not looked into any issues that might be involved,
so don’t quote me on the above as a proper or ethical solution…</p>
<p class="x_MsoNormal"> </p>
<div>
<p class="x_MsoNormal"><b><span style="">Timothy C. Lehr</span></b></p>
<p class="x_MsoNormal"><span style="">Attorney & Partner</span></p>
<p class="x_MsoNormal"><span style=""> </span></p>
<p class="x_MsoNormal"><span style=""></p>
<div><image001.jpg></div>
</span><span style=""></span>
<p></p>
<p class="x_MsoNormal"><span style=""> </span></p>
<p class="x_MsoNormal"><span lang="ES-MX" style="">p: 360.855.0131</span></p>
<p class="x_MsoNormal"><span lang="ES-MX" style="">e: </span><a href="mailto:timothy@stileslaw.com"><span lang="ES-MX" style="">timothy@stileslaw.com</span></a><span lang="ES-MX" style=""></span></p>
<p class="x_MsoNormal"><span lang="ES-MX" style="">w: </span><a href="http://www.stileslaw.com/" originalsrc="http://www.stileslaw.com/" shash="ROgZV3ZTIkO35myGNrH3c64WHXhg13rAxpn0NHQeDNuf5VdJfscEcaaCxnbmnhRZKi369OHcp0A8OpKny3PsW9j7ldj2UxkVSq3EMGSU88noJL2Gyx9QEf08uUM12y1CX2XK/IVJrSYPVKlnhNx/n+c2zpGFXaXXswq9Bab7900="><span lang="ES-MX" style="">www.stileslaw.com</span></a><span lang="ES-MX" style=""></span></p>
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<p class="x_MsoNormal"><b><span style="">NOTICE</span></b><span style="">: The information contained in this email is proprietary and/or confidential and may be privileged. If you are not the intended recipient of this communication, you are hereby notified
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<div style="border:none; border-top:solid #E1E1E1 1.0pt; padding:3.0pt 0in 0in 0in">
<p class="x_MsoNormal"><b><span style="">From:</span></b><span style=""> Philip N. Jones <</span><a href="mailto:pjones@duffykekel.com"><span style="">pjones@duffykekel.com</span></a><span style="">>
<br>
<b>Sent:</b> Thursday, April 20, 2023 2:39 PM<br>
<b>To:</b> WSBA Probate & Trust Listserv <</span><a href="mailto:wsbapt@lists.wsbarppt.com"><span style="">wsbapt@lists.wsbarppt.com</span></a><span style="">><br>
<b>Subject:</b> Re: [WSBAPT] Living Trust issue</span></p>
</div>
</div>
<p class="x_MsoNormal"> </p>
<p class="x_MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:14.0pt; font-family:"Times New Roman",serif">That’s because I grew up in Lake Forest Park and drank the water (literally, out of a well).</span></p>
<p class="x_MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:14.0pt; font-family:"Times New Roman",serif">Phil Jones</span></p>
<p class="x_MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:14.0pt; font-family:"Times New Roman",serif"> </span></p>
<div>
<p class="x_MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:14.0pt; font-family:"Times New Roman",serif">Philip N. Jones</span></p>
<p class="x_MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:14.0pt; font-family:"Times New Roman",serif">Duffy Kekel LLP</span></p>
<p class="x_MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:14.0pt; font-family:"Times New Roman",serif">900 S.W. Fifth Ave. Suite 2500</span></p>
<p class="x_MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:14.0pt; font-family:"Times New Roman",serif">Portland, OR 97204</span></p>
<p class="x_MsoNormal"><a href="mailto:pjones@duffykekel.com"><span style="font-size:14.0pt; font-family:"Times New Roman",serif">pjones@duffykekel.com</span></a><span style="font-size:14.0pt; font-family:"Times New Roman",serif"></span></p>
<p class="x_MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:14.0pt; font-family:"Times New Roman",serif">(503) 226-1371 – office</span></p>
<p class="x_MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:14.0pt; font-family:"Times New Roman",serif">(503) 853-1482 – cell</span></p>
<p class="x_MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:14.0pt; font-family:"Times New Roman",serif">(503) 226-3574 - fax</span></p>
</div>
<p class="x_MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:14.0pt; font-family:"Times New Roman",serif"> </span></p>
<div>
<div style="border:none; border-top:solid #E1E1E1 1.0pt; padding:3.0pt 0in 0in 0in">
<p class="x_MsoNormal"><b><span style="">From:</span></b><span style=""> </span><a href="mailto:wsbapt-bounces@lists.wsbarppt.com"><span style="">wsbapt-bounces@lists.wsbarppt.com</span></a><span style=""> <</span><a href="mailto:wsbapt-bounces@lists.wsbarppt.com"><span style="">wsbapt-bounces@lists.wsbarppt.com</span></a><span style="">>
<b>On Behalf Of </b>Roger Hawkes<br>
<b>Sent:</b> Thursday, April 20, 2023 2:25 PM<br>
<b>To:</b> WSBA Probate & Trust Listserv <</span><a href="mailto:wsbapt@lists.wsbarppt.com"><span style="">wsbapt@lists.wsbarppt.com</span></a><span style="">><br>
<b>Subject:</b> Re: [WSBAPT] Living Trust issue</span></p>
</div>
</div>
<p class="x_MsoNormal"> </p>
<p class="x_MsoNormal">Phil; you clearly have good genes on one side at least.</p>
<p class="x_MsoNormal"> </p>
<div>
<div style="border:none; border-top:solid #E1E1E1 1.0pt; padding:3.0pt 0in 0in 0in">
<p class="x_MsoNormal"><b><span style="">From:</span></b><span style=""> </span><a href="mailto:wsbapt-bounces@lists.wsbarppt.com"><span style="">wsbapt-bounces@lists.wsbarppt.com</span></a><span style=""> <</span><a href="mailto:wsbapt-bounces@lists.wsbarppt.com"><span style="">wsbapt-bounces@lists.wsbarppt.com</span></a><span style="">>
<b>On Behalf Of </b>Philip N. Jones<br>
<b>Sent:</b> Monday, April 17, 2023 5:48 PM<br>
<b>To:</b> WSBA Probate & Trust Listserv <</span><a href="mailto:wsbapt@lists.wsbarppt.com"><span style="">wsbapt@lists.wsbarppt.com</span></a><span style="">><br>
<b>Subject:</b> Re: [WSBAPT] Living Trust issue</span></p>
</div>
</div>
<p class="x_MsoNormal"> </p>
<p class="x_MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:14.0pt; font-family:"Times New Roman",serif">This is a problem we all run into constantly.
</span></p>
<p class="x_MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:14.0pt; font-family:"Times New Roman",serif">I doubt a bank will open an estate account without Letters Testamentary.</span></p>
<p class="x_MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:14.0pt; font-family:"Times New Roman",serif">Does the client happen to have an account that is joint with Mom? Perhaps you could deposit the check to that account, but some banks will not let you do that if they
know that Mom has died (and the check, after all, is made out to her estate). Some people suggest using a night deposit slot so that there won’t be a teller to ask questions, but I am told that the banks scrutinize such deposits just like any other.</span></p>
<p class="x_MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:14.0pt; font-family:"Times New Roman",serif">Is client on good terms with a bank teller who might look the other way and deposit the check to an account in the name of the trust? Or in the name of Client/Child?</span></p>
<p class="x_MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:14.0pt; font-family:"Times New Roman",serif">This check might be particularly difficult to deposit since it is made out to the estate. Might be a little bit easier if it were made out to Mom.</span></p>
<p class="x_MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:14.0pt; font-family:"Times New Roman",serif">Be careful about advising Client to endorse the check and writing “personal representative” under her signature. Client is not a personal representative, and you don’t
want Client to do anything fraudulent.</span></p>
<p class="x_MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:14.0pt; font-family:"Times New Roman",serif">I have now run out of ideas. And none of the above ideas are very good ones.
</span></p>
<p class="x_MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:14.0pt; font-family:"Times New Roman",serif">If it gives you any comfort, I had the exact same problem a couple of months ago when my Mom died. She was 101 and had covered the Roosevelt White House as a cub reporter.</span></p>
<p class="x_MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:14.0pt; font-family:"Times New Roman",serif">Welcome to modern banking,</span></p>
<p class="x_MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:14.0pt; font-family:"Times New Roman",serif">Phil Jones</span></p>
<p class="x_MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:14.0pt; font-family:"Times New Roman",serif"> </span></p>
<div>
<p class="x_MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:14.0pt; font-family:"Times New Roman",serif">Philip N. Jones</span></p>
<p class="x_MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:14.0pt; font-family:"Times New Roman",serif">Duffy Kekel LLP</span></p>
<p class="x_MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:14.0pt; font-family:"Times New Roman",serif">900 S.W. Fifth Ave. Suite 2500</span></p>
<p class="x_MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:14.0pt; font-family:"Times New Roman",serif">Portland, OR 97204</span></p>
<p class="x_MsoNormal"><a href="mailto:pjones@duffykekel.com"><span style="font-size:14.0pt; font-family:"Times New Roman",serif">pjones@duffykekel.com</span></a><span style="font-size:14.0pt; font-family:"Times New Roman",serif"></span></p>
<p class="x_MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:14.0pt; font-family:"Times New Roman",serif">(503) 226-1371 – office</span></p>
<p class="x_MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:14.0pt; font-family:"Times New Roman",serif">(503) 853-1482 – cell</span></p>
<p class="x_MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:14.0pt; font-family:"Times New Roman",serif">(503) 226-3574 - fax</span></p>
</div>
<p class="x_MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:14.0pt; font-family:"Times New Roman",serif"> </span></p>
<div>
<div style="border:none; border-top:solid #E1E1E1 1.0pt; padding:3.0pt 0in 0in 0in">
<p class="x_MsoNormal"><b><span style="">From:</span></b><span style=""> </span><a href="mailto:wsbapt-bounces@lists.wsbarppt.com"><span style="">wsbapt-bounces@lists.wsbarppt.com</span></a><span style=""> <</span><a href="mailto:wsbapt-bounces@lists.wsbarppt.com"><span style="">wsbapt-bounces@lists.wsbarppt.com</span></a><span style="">>
<b>On Behalf Of </b>Jenna Brozik<br>
<b>Sent:</b> Monday, April 17, 2023 5:30 PM<br>
<b>To:</b> WSBA Probate & Trust Listserv <</span><a href="mailto:wsbapt@lists.wsbarppt.com"><span style="">wsbapt@lists.wsbarppt.com</span></a><span style="">><br>
<b>Subject:</b> [WSBAPT] Living Trust issue</span></p>
</div>
</div>
<p class="x_MsoNormal"> </p>
<p class="x_MsoNormal">Hello list mates, </p>
<p class="x_MsoNormal"> </p>
<p class="x_MsoNormal">Client’s mother passed away and the mother had a living trust. Client is the Trustee of the Living Trust and only beneficiary. All assets were titled in the Living Trust. However, client received a check in the mail after mother passed
away. Apparently the mother overpaid her healthcare premium and the company issued her a check for the overpayment. The check is made out to the Estate. Client called to ask company to make it out to Living Trust. Company has refused. Company has refused
to reissue the check under any name. </p>
<p class="x_MsoNormal"> </p>
<p class="x_MsoNormal">Should client just open up a bank account under the Estate to get this check deposited? No probate is necessary in this case. Any suggestions would be appreciated.
</p>
<p class="x_MsoNormal"> </p>
<p class="x_MsoNormal"><span style="font-family:"Lucida Calligraphy"">Jenna Brozik</span></p>
<p class="x_MsoNormal"><i><span style="font-family:"Calibri Light",sans-serif">Managing Attorney</span></i></p>
<p class="x_MsoNormal"><b><span style="font-family:"Calibri Light",sans-serif; color:#222222">PRINZ & BROZIK PLLC</span></b><span style="font-family:"Calibri Light",sans-serif; color:#222222"><br>
445 S. Grand Avenue<br>
Pullman, WA 99163<br>
509-338-0908 Telephone<br>
509-338-3527 Facsimile</span><span style="font-family:"Calibri Light",sans-serif"></span></p>
<p class="x_MsoNormal"> </p>
</div>
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