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<p class="MsoNormal">Well said Josh!<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><o:p> </o:p></p>
<font size="4" color="#777777"><span style="FONT-FAMILY: 'Calibri','sans-serif'"><font size="3"><font color="#000000"><o:p style="FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: 'Calibri','sans-serif'">
<p style="FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: 'Calibri','sans-serif'; MARGIN: 0in 0in 6pt"><span style="FONT-FAMILY: 'Calibri','sans-serif'">Amy Lewis,
Attorney<br>Pronouns she/her/hers<br></span><img style="HEIGHT: 68px; WIDTH: 211px" src="cid:Logo_fa335a1d-9f24-4802-a3dd-b58f259e3c98.png" width="211" height="68" border="0"><br></p></o:p></font></font></span><span style="FONT-SIZE: 11pt; FONT-FAMILY: 'Calibri','sans-serif'"><span style="COLOR: #000000"><span style="FONT-SIZE: 11pt; FONT-FAMILY: 'Calibri','sans-serif'">909 A Street, Suite
600 | Tacoma, WA 98402<br></span><span style="FONT-SIZE: 11pt; FONT-FAMILY: 'Calibri','sans-serif'"><strong style="COLOR: #000000"></strong>phone 253.572.4500 | fax 253.272.5732
|</span></span></span><span style="FONT-SIZE: 11pt; FONT-FAMILY: 'Calibri','sans-serif'"> </span><a href="http://www.eisenhowerlaw.com/"><span style="FONT-SIZE: 11pt; TEXT-DECORATION: none; FONT-FAMILY: 'Calibri','sans-serif'; COLOR: #c00000; text-underline: none">www.eisenhowerlaw.com</span></a></font>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><b>From:</b> wsbapt-bounces@lists.wsbarppt.com <wsbapt-bounces@lists.wsbarppt.com>
<b>On Behalf Of </b>Joshua McKarcher<br>
<b>Sent:</b> Saturday, September 10, 2022 12:07 PM<br>
<b>To:</b> WSBA Probate & Trust Listserv <wsbapt@lists.wsbarppt.com><br>
<b>Subject:</b> Re: [WSBAPT] Will Question - life estate<o:p></o:p></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal">Hi Dalynne,<o:p></o:p></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal">I'm not sure if Bruce was gently encouraging you away from a life estate solution
<span style="font-family:"Segoe UI Emoji",sans-serif">😉</span>, but I "do these" in trust with separate plain English paragraphs about what happens if wife dies first vs if husband dies first. <o:p></o:p></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><o:p> </o:p></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal">A judge can read that, hear the facts, and make a reasonable judgment if needed, if there is a problem. No overlay of decades of complex life estate case law required. <o:p></o:p></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><o:p> </o:p></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="color:black;background:white">Agreed post-signing changes require no vesting and title review and no excise tax mental gyrations. No reference to life estate rules and case law and "all of it." Agreed changes require a simple
signed paper meeting the requirements of a trust amendment or TEDRA agreement, whichever is applicable.</span><o:p></o:p></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><o:p> </o:p></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal">Well drafted trust provisions, in my mind, are far better solutions than life estates. <span style="color:black;background:white">I'm guessing others out there have mastered doing this with life estates with some additional language on
the face of the deed or a side agreement or something. If so, no problem.<span class="apple-converted-space"> This is my bias.</span></span><o:p></o:p></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal">If wife survives, she can be trustee; and maybe they don't mind if she retains the right to cut son out then if he goes sideways. Most husbands in this scenario sitting in my office would say, "Of course she can change her mind! It's me
we don't want changing his mind."<o:p></o:p></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><o:p> </o:p></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal">If husband survives, he and son can be co-trustees perhaps, although husband can still be sole trustee, but with the duty to follow the trust. A duty enforceable by the son in the same superior court they'd end up in with a life estate
-- but in a simpler TEDRA action intended to instruct a trustee based on well-drafted plain English trust provisions vs life estate case law. <o:p></o:p></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><o:p> </o:p></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal">Write in plain English in each paragraph noted above what happens if one of them sells before both are dead — who gets the money? Think through the scenarios and do not leave anything to two (non-spouse) people who must unanimously agree
-- that's just begging for deadlock. Judges need simple clear language they can hopefully enforce without too much rigmarole when someone simply refuses to abide the trust agreement because they've changed their mind.<o:p></o:p></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><o:p> </o:p></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal">Then make darn sure husband knows that, if he survives wife and is sole trustee,
<span style="color:black;background:white">he has fiduciary duties </span>to FOLLOW the trust or he WILL LOSE in court if son or son’s guardian, etc., sue to enforce. Heck, have them recite in a purpose paragraph near the beginning of the trust what they intend
by the provision further down in the trust and that they expect it to be enforced as provided. There is no law against him having a companion live there, so long as he doesn't trash the place, purport to title it to the companion, sell it without abiding the
trust, etc.<o:p></o:p></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal">If I set these couples up with clear expectations and understandings about their duties to "follow this OR YOU WILL LOSE IN COURT, and you will need a different lawyer than me to 'break' this thing," then I see their mental assent and the
"click" in their brain. Then they read the plain English "rule book" in the trust provisions re the house. They "get it" and sign it -- and then I've had zero problems when it comes time for it to "work."<o:p></o:p></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal">Good luck! All the best, Josh<o:p></o:p></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal">Joshua D. McKarcher<o:p></o:p></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal">McKarcher Law PLLC<o:p></o:p></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal">537 6th Street<o:p></o:p></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal">Clarkston, WA 99403<o:p></o:p></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal">(509) 758-3345<o:p></o:p></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal">(509) 758-3314 (fax)<o:p></o:p></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><a href="mailto:josh@mckarcherlaw.com">josh@mckarcherlaw.com</a><o:p></o:p></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><a href="http://www.mckarcherlaw.com">www.mckarcherlaw.com</a><o:p></o:p></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><b>From:</b> <a href="mailto:wsbapt-bounces@lists.wsbarppt.com">
wsbapt-bounces@lists.wsbarppt.com</a> <<a href="mailto:wsbapt-bounces@lists.wsbarppt.com">wsbapt-bounces@lists.wsbarppt.com</a>> on behalf of Bruce Moen <<a href="mailto:brm@moenlaw.com">brm@moenlaw.com</a>><br>
<b>Sent:</b> Saturday, September 10, 2022 12:22 PM<br>
<b>To:</b> WSBA Probate & Trust Listserv <<a href="mailto:wsbapt@lists.wsbarppt.com">wsbapt@lists.wsbarppt.com</a>><br>
<b>Subject:</b> Re: [WSBAPT] Will Question - life estate <o:p></o:p></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"> <o:p></o:p></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal">Hi Dalynne,<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"> <o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal">You are not overthinking this. The life estate is a simple concept, but are the subject of many issues we which arise in the years following the conveyance.
<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"> <o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal">If you decide to create the life estate for your client(s), then I suggest that you survey the case law of litigation between life estate holders and the persons with a remainder interest. Organize the litigation into subdivisions such
as economic waste (failure to maintain the property), damages (house burns down and the life tenant and the remainderman each mistakenly thought that the other had it insured), allocation of short-term vs long term repairs for an elderly life tenant, many
other issues. After you have catalogued the areas of disputes, then review each area with the client and what to draft for each area. I think that's the best that we as lawyers can do.<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"> <o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal">Important caveat: When the client says "Oh, my [spouse], [issue], [others] would never do that." Remind the client that that any of the players may change and have no control over the issue. An example would be that a trusted family person
has a stroke or a head injury and ends up with a Conservator or a GAL who is ready to litigate over some past event. The client's focus during the consultation should be shifted from the trusted family member to strangers who may stand in their shoes at some
point. <o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"> <o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal">Good luck!<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"> <o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"> Bruce Moen<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"> <o:p></o:p></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><b>From:</b> <a href="mailto:wsbapt-bounces@lists.wsbarppt.com">
wsbapt-bounces@lists.wsbarppt.com</a> <<a href="mailto:wsbapt-bounces@lists.wsbarppt.com">wsbapt-bounces@lists.wsbarppt.com</a>>
<b>On Behalf Of </b>Dalynne Singleton<br>
<b>Sent:</b> Saturday, September 10, 2022 10:24 AM<br>
<b>To:</b> 'WSBA Probate & Trust Listserv' <<a href="mailto:wsbapt@lists.wsbarppt.com">wsbapt@lists.wsbarppt.com</a>><br>
<b>Subject:</b> [WSBAPT] Will Question - life estate<o:p></o:p></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"> <o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:14.0pt">I have some Wills I am preparing and wanted to see how others might approach this situation.</span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:14.0pt">Clients are married (wife 4th marriage, husband 1<sup>st</sup>). Wife has one grown son, Husband had no children.</span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:14.0pt">H/W own a home on Camano Island jointly. They both want son to receive home when second spouse dies. But, when first spouse dies, H or W will continue to reside in home until they move or die, or house is
sold.</span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:14.0pt"> </span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:14.0pt">I am considering recommending a life estate transfer of the home to the son with life estate in H/W. Both H/W in their 60s and health is good.</span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:14.0pt">This seems better than placing the CP interest of the first spouse into a trust for the benefit of the surviving spouse where upon the 2<sup>nd</sup> spouse to die death, the house goes to son.</span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:14.0pt">If house is sold before 2<sup>nd</sup> spouse dies, CP interest monies will be paid to the son.</span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:14.0pt"> </span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:14.0pt">The fear is from the wife if she dies first, her husband will remarry and not provide son with her share of CP home – doesn’t life estate to both H/W with deed to son handle this issue?</span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:14.0pt">What if after deed with life estate, H/W sell home? Will the son then be entitled to any monies from sale? How to protect the H/W in this case?</span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:14.0pt">Am I overthinking this?</span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:14.0pt"> </span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><b><i><span style="font-size:12.0pt;font-family:"Arial",sans-serif;color:#1F497D">Dalynne Singleton</span></i></b><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><b><span style="font-size:12.0pt;font-family:"Arial",sans-serif;color:#1F497D">Gourley Law Group</span></b><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><b><span style="font-size:12.0pt;font-family:"Arial",sans-serif;color:#1F497D">Snohomish Escrow</span></b><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><b><span style="font-size:12.0pt;font-family:"Arial",sans-serif;color:#1F497D">The Exchange Connection</span></b><o:p></o:p></p>
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