<div dir="ltr">Thanks everyone - these responses are all extremely helpful.<div><br clear="all"><div><div dir="ltr" class="gmail_signature" data-smartmail="gmail_signature"><div dir="ltr"><div><div dir="ltr"><div style="color:rgb(80,0,80)"><div>Sincerely, </div><div><br></div><div>Suzanne Lieberman</div></div><div style="color:rgb(80,0,80)"><a href="http://cmslawfirm.com/" style="color:rgb(17,85,204)" target="_blank">CMS Law Firm LLC</a></div><div style="color:rgb(80,0,80)"><b>811 Kirkland Ave. Suite 201 </b>(please note new address!)<br></div><div style="color:rgb(80,0,80)">Kirkland, WA 98033</div><div style="color:rgb(80,0,80)">206-383-6484 (Cell Phone)</div><div style="color:rgb(80,0,80)">206-659-1512 (Main Office)</div><div style="color:rgb(80,0,80)"><br></div><div style="color:rgb(80,0,80)"><br></div><div style="color:rgb(80,0,80)">Legal stuff I have to put in... <i>To ensure compliance with Treasury Department and IRS regulations, we inform you that, unless expressly indicated otherwise, any federal tax advice contained in this communication (including any attachments) is not intended or written by CMS Law Firm LLC to be used, and cannot be used by the taxpayer, for the purpose of: (i) avoiding penalties that may be imposed on the taxpayer under the Internal Revenue Code; or (ii) promoting, marketing, or recommending to another party any transaction or matter addressed herein (or any attachments).</i></div></div></div></div></div></div><br></div></div><br><div class="gmail_quote"><div dir="ltr" class="gmail_attr">On Tue, Sep 7, 2021 at 12:00 PM <<a href="mailto:wsbapt-request@lists.wsbarppt.com">wsbapt-request@lists.wsbarppt.com</a>> wrote:<br></div><blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0px 0px 0px 0.8ex;border-left:1px solid rgb(204,204,204);padding-left:1ex">Send WSBAPT mailing list submissions to<br>
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When replying, please edit your Subject line so it is more specific<br>
than "Re: Contents of WSBAPT digest..."<br>
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Today's Topics:<br>
<br>
1. Re: "Ascertainable creditor"? (Mark Vohr)<br>
2. Re: "Ascertainable creditor"? (Bryce Dille)<br>
3. Re: "Ascertainable creditor"? (Doug Schafer)<br>
4. Re: "Ascertainable creditor"? (Stephen Brandli)<br>
5. Re: "Ascertainable creditor"? (Roger Hawkes)<br>
6. probate for two (Maren Benedetti)<br>
7. Snohomish probate for two (Dalynne Singleton)<br>
8. Re: probate for two (Josh Grant)<br>
9. Re: "Ascertainable creditor"? (Mark Vohr)<br>
10. North Alabama referral? (<a href="mailto:betsy@bwattorney.com" target="_blank">betsy@bwattorney.com</a>)<br>
<br>
<br>
----------------------------------------------------------------------<br>
<br>
Message: 1<br>
Date: Mon, 6 Sep 2021 20:49:44 +0000<br>
From: Mark Vohr <<a href="mailto:mcv@ohanafc.com" target="_blank">mcv@ohanafc.com</a>><br>
To: WSBA Probate & Trust Listserv <<a href="mailto:wsbapt@lists.wsbarppt.com" target="_blank">wsbapt@lists.wsbarppt.com</a>><br>
Subject: Re: [WSBAPT] "Ascertainable creditor"?<br>
Message-ID:<br>
<<a href="mailto:MW3PR13MB4107E098AFD06AEFC27F1628A1D29@MW3PR13MB4107.namprd13.prod.outlook.com" target="_blank">MW3PR13MB4107E098AFD06AEFC27F1628A1D29@MW3PR13MB4107.namprd13.prod.outlook.com</a>><br>
<br>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="windows-1252"<br>
<br>
Agree with Roger.<br>
<br>
Mark Vohr<br>
Principal, Ohana Fiduciary Corporation<br>
(206) 782-1189<br>
<a href="mailto:Mcv@ohanafc.com" target="_blank">Mcv@ohanafc.com</a><br>
________________________________<br>
From: <a href="mailto:wsbapt-bounces@lists.wsbarppt.com" target="_blank">wsbapt-bounces@lists.wsbarppt.com</a> <<a href="mailto:wsbapt-bounces@lists.wsbarppt.com" target="_blank">wsbapt-bounces@lists.wsbarppt.com</a>> on behalf of Roger Hawkes <<a href="mailto:Roger@law-hawks.com" target="_blank">Roger@law-hawks.com</a>><br>
Sent: Monday, September 6, 2021 11:48:36 AM<br>
To: WSBA Probate & Trust Listserv <<a href="mailto:wsbapt@lists.wsbarppt.com" target="_blank">wsbapt@lists.wsbarppt.com</a>><br>
Subject: Re: [WSBAPT] "Ascertainable creditor"?<br>
<br>
<br>
I vote ?yes?. Seems to me that ?ascertainable? includes situations like this where liability is not clear.<br>
<br>
<br>
<br>
Roger Hawkes, WSBA # 5173<br>
<br>
<br>
<br>
Sultan Office: 423 Main (physical office)<br>
<br>
Box 351, Sultan, WA 98294 (incoming mail)<br>
<br>
Sultan, WA 98294<br>
<br>
<br>
<br>
Other offices: we are scheduling in person meetings at various law offices in<br>
<br>
North King and South Snohomish counties. Virginia will be the person coordinating<br>
<br>
Where and When and with Whom a meeting will be held. Stay Safe!! Our phone, fax and email addresses are the same as they have been for twenty five years??<br>
<br>
<br>
<br>
Phone: 206 367 5000; fax: 206 367 4005<br>
<br>
Email: <a href="mailto:roger@law-hawks.com" target="_blank">roger@law-hawks.com</a><mailto:<a href="mailto:roger@law-hawks.com" target="_blank">roger@law-hawks.com</a>><br>
<br>
Web site: <a href="http://www.hawkeslawfirm.com" rel="noreferrer" target="_blank">www.hawkeslawfirm.com</a><<a href="https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=http-3A__www.hawkeslawfirm.com_&d=DwMGaQ&c=euGZstcaTDllvimEN8b7jXrwqOf-v5A_CdpgnVfiiMM&r=K1mLMC1eFjwfeeMM-AC6zQ&m=PvdfB5OKiTA8EBc7UBW5iWVPUM08e_Pd2SKLWHzaE5M&s=_KWiWxoGhsS6f6KZ_GTKw27rQp8IYuM3j_XLoNv_iRQ&e=" rel="noreferrer" target="_blank">https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=http-3A__www.hawkeslawfirm.com_&d=DwMGaQ&c=euGZstcaTDllvimEN8b7jXrwqOf-v5A_CdpgnVfiiMM&r=K1mLMC1eFjwfeeMM-AC6zQ&m=PvdfB5OKiTA8EBc7UBW5iWVPUM08e_Pd2SKLWHzaE5M&s=_KWiWxoGhsS6f6KZ_GTKw27rQp8IYuM3j_XLoNv_iRQ&e=</a>><br>
<br>
[cid:image001.jpg@01D7A315.20604620]<br>
<br>
<br>
<br>
From: <a href="mailto:wsbapt-bounces@lists.wsbarppt.com" target="_blank">wsbapt-bounces@lists.wsbarppt.com</a> <<a href="mailto:wsbapt-bounces@lists.wsbarppt.com" target="_blank">wsbapt-bounces@lists.wsbarppt.com</a>> On Behalf Of Suzanne Lieberman<br>
Sent: Monday, September 6, 2021 11:08 AM<br>
To: <a href="mailto:wsbapt@lists.wsbarppt.com" target="_blank">wsbapt@lists.wsbarppt.com</a><br>
Subject: [WSBAPT] "Ascertainable creditor"?<br>
<br>
<br>
<br>
Hello,<br>
<br>
<br>
<br>
One more question.<br>
<br>
<br>
<br>
Client is uncertain whether she is required to give notice to a creditor that has sent a billing statement made out to the decedent's condominium management company, but not to decedent or to decedent's estate directly, and which charges she disputes. The bill references decedent's unit number. The bill is for water mitigation damages that allegedly took place during our heat wave in June but which client did not authorize (client paid other water-damage bills related to her uncle's property prior to the sale of the house, with invoices made out to the estate). Client is not sure whether the condo association is covering these charges and doesn't want to volunteer information during the notice period if it's not required. Of course, she does if it is required.<br>
<br>
<br>
<br>
Is the creditor considered "ascertainable" if Administrator is in receipt of the bill, regardless of whether the bill is made out to the estate?<br>
<br>
<br>
<br>
Best,<br>
<br>
<br>
<br>
Suzanne Lieberman<br>
<br>
CMS Law Firm LLC<<a href="https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=http-3A__cmslawfirm.com_&d=DwMGaQ&c=euGZstcaTDllvimEN8b7jXrwqOf-v5A_CdpgnVfiiMM&r=K1mLMC1eFjwfeeMM-AC6zQ&m=PvdfB5OKiTA8EBc7UBW5iWVPUM08e_Pd2SKLWHzaE5M&s=sa5qfh4De6j_oIk072AT7IUpILrjvAbESkamELhekKw&e=" rel="noreferrer" target="_blank">https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=http-3A__cmslawfirm.com_&d=DwMGaQ&c=euGZstcaTDllvimEN8b7jXrwqOf-v5A_CdpgnVfiiMM&r=K1mLMC1eFjwfeeMM-AC6zQ&m=PvdfB5OKiTA8EBc7UBW5iWVPUM08e_Pd2SKLWHzaE5M&s=sa5qfh4De6j_oIk072AT7IUpILrjvAbESkamELhekKw&e=</a>><br>
<br>
811 Kirkland Ave. Suite 201 (please note new address!)<br>
<br>
Kirkland, WA 98033<br>
<br>
206-383-6484 (Cell Phone)<br>
<br>
206-659-1512 (Main Office)<br>
<br>
<br>
<br>
<br>
<br>
Legal stuff I have to put in... To ensure compliance with Treasury Department and IRS regulations, we inform you that, unless expressly indicated otherwise, any federal tax advice contained in this communication (including any attachments) is not intended or written by CMS Law Firm LLC to be used, and cannot be used by the taxpayer, for the purpose of: (i) avoiding penalties that may be imposed on the taxpayer under the Internal Revenue Code; or (ii) promoting, marketing, or recommending to another party any transaction or matter addressed herein (or any attachments).<br>
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<br>
Message: 2<br>
Date: Mon, 6 Sep 2021 21:04:25 +0000<br>
From: Bryce Dille <<a href="mailto:Bryce@dillelaw.com" target="_blank">Bryce@dillelaw.com</a>><br>
To: WSBA Probate & Trust Listserv <<a href="mailto:wsbapt@lists.wsbarppt.com" target="_blank">wsbapt@lists.wsbarppt.com</a>><br>
Subject: Re: [WSBAPT] "Ascertainable creditor"?<br>
Message-ID:<br>
<<a href="mailto:SJ0PR11MB489323F6CE105811074EF8D3C8D29@SJ0PR11MB4893.namprd11.prod.outlook.com" target="_blank">SJ0PR11MB489323F6CE105811074EF8D3C8D29@SJ0PR11MB4893.namprd11.prod.outlook.com</a>><br>
<br>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8"<br>
<br>
I litigated this issue and the superior court held any known party who has a possible claim against the estate of which you have knowledge and is known must be given notice even though a claim per se wasn?t made against the decedent during his or her lifetime.<br>
<br>
Bryce H. Dille<br>
Dille Law, PLLC<br>
2010 Caton Way SW Ste. 101<br>
Olympia, WA 98502<br>
Office: 360-350-0270<br>
Cell: 253-579-5561<br>
<br>
** Please note that I use the dictation feature of my iPhone and that sometimes everything I say does not get properly translated**<br>
<br>
This transmission contains confidential attorney-client communications and may not be disclosed to any person but the intended recipient(s). If this matter is transmitted to you in error, please notify the sender immediately.<br>
<br>
Business Entity Creation and Management, Business, Government and Tax Law, Real Estate and Land Use, Residential, Commercial and Condominium Development Real Estate and Commercial Transactions & Closings, Including Performing Services as IRS Section 1031 Exchange Facilitator Estate Planning, including Wills and Trusts, and Probate Administration Representation Homeowners/Condominium Association Real Estate Developments Real Property Foreclosures and Forfeitures.<br>
<br>
From: <a href="mailto:wsbapt-bounces@lists.wsbarppt.com" target="_blank">wsbapt-bounces@lists.wsbarppt.com</a> <<a href="mailto:wsbapt-bounces@lists.wsbarppt.com" target="_blank">wsbapt-bounces@lists.wsbarppt.com</a>> On Behalf Of Mark Vohr<br>
Sent: Monday, September 6, 2021 1:50 PM<br>
To: WSBA Probate & Trust Listserv <<a href="mailto:wsbapt@lists.wsbarppt.com" target="_blank">wsbapt@lists.wsbarppt.com</a>><br>
Subject: Re: [WSBAPT] "Ascertainable creditor"?<br>
<br>
Agree with Roger.<br>
<br>
Mark Vohr<br>
Principal, Ohana Fiduciary Corporation<br>
(206) 782-1189<br>
<a href="mailto:Mcv@ohanafc.com" target="_blank">Mcv@ohanafc.com</a><mailto:<a href="mailto:Mcv@ohanafc.com" target="_blank">Mcv@ohanafc.com</a>><br>
________________________________<br>
From: <a href="mailto:wsbapt-bounces@lists.wsbarppt.com" target="_blank">wsbapt-bounces@lists.wsbarppt.com</a><mailto:<a href="mailto:wsbapt-bounces@lists.wsbarppt.com" target="_blank">wsbapt-bounces@lists.wsbarppt.com</a>> <<a href="mailto:wsbapt-bounces@lists.wsbarppt.com" target="_blank">wsbapt-bounces@lists.wsbarppt.com</a><mailto:<a href="mailto:wsbapt-bounces@lists.wsbarppt.com" target="_blank">wsbapt-bounces@lists.wsbarppt.com</a>>> on behalf of Roger Hawkes <<a href="mailto:Roger@law-hawks.com" target="_blank">Roger@law-hawks.com</a><mailto:<a href="mailto:Roger@law-hawks.com" target="_blank">Roger@law-hawks.com</a>>><br>
Sent: Monday, September 6, 2021 11:48:36 AM<br>
To: WSBA Probate & Trust Listserv <<a href="mailto:wsbapt@lists.wsbarppt.com" target="_blank">wsbapt@lists.wsbarppt.com</a><mailto:<a href="mailto:wsbapt@lists.wsbarppt.com" target="_blank">wsbapt@lists.wsbarppt.com</a>>><br>
Subject: Re: [WSBAPT] "Ascertainable creditor"?<br>
<br>
<br>
I vote ?yes?. Seems to me that ?ascertainable? includes situations like this where liability is not clear.<br>
<br>
<br>
<br>
Roger Hawkes, WSBA # 5173<br>
<br>
<br>
<br>
Sultan Office: 423 Main (physical office)<br>
<br>
Box 351, Sultan, WA 98294 (incoming mail)<br>
<br>
Sultan, WA 98294<br>
<br>
<br>
<br>
Other offices: we are scheduling in person meetings at various law offices in<br>
<br>
North King and South Snohomish counties. Virginia will be the person coordinating<br>
<br>
Where and When and with Whom a meeting will be held. Stay Safe!! Our phone, fax and email addresses are the same as they have been for twenty five years?<br>
<br>
<br>
<br>
Phone: 206 367 5000; fax: 206 367 4005<br>
<br>
Email: <a href="mailto:roger@law-hawks.com" target="_blank">roger@law-hawks.com</a><mailto:<a href="mailto:roger@law-hawks.com" target="_blank">roger@law-hawks.com</a>><br>
<br>
Web site: <a href="http://www.hawkeslawfirm.com" rel="noreferrer" target="_blank">www.hawkeslawfirm.com</a><<a href="https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=http-3A__www.hawkeslawfirm.com_&d=DwMGaQ&c=euGZstcaTDllvimEN8b7jXrwqOf-v5A_CdpgnVfiiMM&r=K1mLMC1eFjwfeeMM-AC6zQ&m=PvdfB5OKiTA8EBc7UBW5iWVPUM08e_Pd2SKLWHzaE5M&s=_KWiWxoGhsS6f6KZ_GTKw27rQp8IYuM3j_XLoNv_iRQ&e=" rel="noreferrer" target="_blank">https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=http-3A__www.hawkeslawfirm.com_&d=DwMGaQ&c=euGZstcaTDllvimEN8b7jXrwqOf-v5A_CdpgnVfiiMM&r=K1mLMC1eFjwfeeMM-AC6zQ&m=PvdfB5OKiTA8EBc7UBW5iWVPUM08e_Pd2SKLWHzaE5M&s=_KWiWxoGhsS6f6KZ_GTKw27rQp8IYuM3j_XLoNv_iRQ&e=</a>><br>
<br>
[cid:image003.jpg@01D7A328.18D48840]<br>
<br>
<br>
<br>
From: <a href="mailto:wsbapt-bounces@lists.wsbarppt.com" target="_blank">wsbapt-bounces@lists.wsbarppt.com</a><mailto:<a href="mailto:wsbapt-bounces@lists.wsbarppt.com" target="_blank">wsbapt-bounces@lists.wsbarppt.com</a>> <<a href="mailto:wsbapt-bounces@lists.wsbarppt.com" target="_blank">wsbapt-bounces@lists.wsbarppt.com</a><mailto:<a href="mailto:wsbapt-bounces@lists.wsbarppt.com" target="_blank">wsbapt-bounces@lists.wsbarppt.com</a>>> On Behalf Of Suzanne Lieberman<br>
Sent: Monday, September 6, 2021 11:08 AM<br>
To: <a href="mailto:wsbapt@lists.wsbarppt.com" target="_blank">wsbapt@lists.wsbarppt.com</a><mailto:<a href="mailto:wsbapt@lists.wsbarppt.com" target="_blank">wsbapt@lists.wsbarppt.com</a>><br>
Subject: [WSBAPT] "Ascertainable creditor"?<br>
<br>
<br>
<br>
Hello,<br>
<br>
<br>
<br>
One more question.<br>
<br>
<br>
<br>
Client is uncertain whether she is required to give notice to a creditor that has sent a billing statement made out to the decedent's condominium management company, but not to decedent or to decedent's estate directly, and which charges she disputes. The bill references decedent's unit number. The bill is for water mitigation damages that allegedly took place during our heat wave in June but which client did not authorize (client paid other water-damage bills related to her uncle's property prior to the sale of the house, with invoices made out to the estate). Client is not sure whether the condo association is covering these charges and doesn't want to volunteer information during the notice period if it's not required. Of course, she does if it is required.<br>
<br>
<br>
<br>
Is the creditor considered "ascertainable" if Administrator is in receipt of the bill, regardless of whether the bill is made out to the estate?<br>
<br>
<br>
<br>
Best,<br>
<br>
<br>
<br>
Suzanne Lieberman<br>
<br>
CMS Law Firm LLC<<a href="https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=http-3A__cmslawfirm.com_&d=DwMGaQ&c=euGZstcaTDllvimEN8b7jXrwqOf-v5A_CdpgnVfiiMM&r=K1mLMC1eFjwfeeMM-AC6zQ&m=PvdfB5OKiTA8EBc7UBW5iWVPUM08e_Pd2SKLWHzaE5M&s=sa5qfh4De6j_oIk072AT7IUpILrjvAbESkamELhekKw&e=" rel="noreferrer" target="_blank">https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=http-3A__cmslawfirm.com_&d=DwMGaQ&c=euGZstcaTDllvimEN8b7jXrwqOf-v5A_CdpgnVfiiMM&r=K1mLMC1eFjwfeeMM-AC6zQ&m=PvdfB5OKiTA8EBc7UBW5iWVPUM08e_Pd2SKLWHzaE5M&s=sa5qfh4De6j_oIk072AT7IUpILrjvAbESkamELhekKw&e=</a>><br>
<br>
811 Kirkland Ave. Suite 201 (please note new address!)<br>
<br>
Kirkland, WA 98033<br>
<br>
206-383-6484 (Cell Phone)<br>
<br>
206-659-1512 (Main Office)<br>
<br>
<br>
<br>
<br>
<br>
Legal stuff I have to put in... To ensure compliance with Treasury Department and IRS regulations, we inform you that, unless expressly indicated otherwise, any federal tax advice contained in this communication (including any attachments) is not intended or written by CMS Law Firm LLC to be used, and cannot be used by the taxpayer, for the purpose of: (i) avoiding penalties that may be imposed on the taxpayer under the Internal Revenue Code; or (ii) promoting, marketing, or recommending to another party any transaction or matter addressed herein (or any attachments).<br>
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<br>
Message: 3<br>
Date: Mon, 6 Sep 2021 22:48:15 -0700<br>
From: Doug Schafer <<a href="mailto:schafer@pobox.com" target="_blank">schafer@pobox.com</a>><br>
To: WSBA Probate & Trust Listserv <<a href="mailto:wsbapt@lists.wsbarppt.com" target="_blank">wsbapt@lists.wsbarppt.com</a>>, Mark<br>
Vohr <<a href="mailto:mcv@ohanafc.com" target="_blank">mcv@ohanafc.com</a>><br>
Subject: Re: [WSBAPT] "Ascertainable creditor"?<br>
Message-ID: <<a href="mailto:5a3095f3-07c3-2a27-cd49-0c6a3f3ca3f2@pobox.com" target="_blank">5a3095f3-07c3-2a27-cd49-0c6a3f3ca3f2@pobox.com</a>><br>
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<br>
Message: 4<br>
Date: Tue, 7 Sep 2021 15:49:05 +0000<br>
From: Stephen Brandli <<a href="mailto:steve@brandlilaw.com" target="_blank">steve@brandlilaw.com</a>><br>
To: WSBA Probate & Trust Listserv <<a href="mailto:wsbapt@lists.wsbarppt.com" target="_blank">wsbapt@lists.wsbarppt.com</a>><br>
Subject: Re: [WSBAPT] "Ascertainable creditor"?<br>
Message-ID:<br>
<<a href="mailto:MWHPR19MB1088260CFAD41138526BAB8DC0D39@MWHPR19MB1088.namprd19.prod.outlook.com" target="_blank">MWHPR19MB1088260CFAD41138526BAB8DC0D39@MWHPR19MB1088.namprd19.prod.outlook.com</a>><br>
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Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8"<br>
<br>
Assuming the debt was incurred before debt (see Doug?s comment), I would send notices to both the creditor and the management company. In fact, I would do this even if the debt was incurred after death.<br>
<br>
Steve<br>
<br>
From: <a href="mailto:wsbapt-bounces@lists.wsbarppt.com" target="_blank">wsbapt-bounces@lists.wsbarppt.com</a> <<a href="mailto:wsbapt-bounces@lists.wsbarppt.com" target="_blank">wsbapt-bounces@lists.wsbarppt.com</a>> On Behalf Of Bryce Dille<br>
Sent: Monday, September 6, 2021 2:04 PM<br>
To: WSBA Probate & Trust Listserv <<a href="mailto:wsbapt@lists.wsbarppt.com" target="_blank">wsbapt@lists.wsbarppt.com</a>><br>
Subject: Re: [WSBAPT] "Ascertainable creditor"?<br>
<br>
I litigated this issue and the superior court held any known party who has a possible claim against the estate of which you have knowledge and is known must be given notice even though a claim per se wasn?t made against the decedent during his or her lifetime.<br>
<br>
Bryce H. Dille<br>
Dille Law, PLLC<br>
2010 Caton Way SW Ste. 101<br>
Olympia, WA 98502<br>
Office: 360-350-0270<br>
Cell: 253-579-5561<br>
<br>
** Please note that I use the dictation feature of my iPhone and that sometimes everything I say does not get properly translated**<br>
<br>
This transmission contains confidential attorney-client communications and may not be disclosed to any person but the intended recipient(s). If this matter is transmitted to you in error, please notify the sender immediately.<br>
<br>
Business Entity Creation and Management, Business, Government and Tax Law, Real Estate and Land Use, Residential, Commercial and Condominium Development Real Estate and Commercial Transactions & Closings, Including Performing Services as IRS Section 1031 Exchange Facilitator Estate Planning, including Wills and Trusts, and Probate Administration Representation Homeowners/Condominium Association Real Estate Developments Real Property Foreclosures and Forfeitures.<br>
<br>
From: <a href="mailto:wsbapt-bounces@lists.wsbarppt.com" target="_blank">wsbapt-bounces@lists.wsbarppt.com</a><mailto:<a href="mailto:wsbapt-bounces@lists.wsbarppt.com" target="_blank">wsbapt-bounces@lists.wsbarppt.com</a>> <<a href="mailto:wsbapt-bounces@lists.wsbarppt.com" target="_blank">wsbapt-bounces@lists.wsbarppt.com</a><mailto:<a href="mailto:wsbapt-bounces@lists.wsbarppt.com" target="_blank">wsbapt-bounces@lists.wsbarppt.com</a>>> On Behalf Of Mark Vohr<br>
Sent: Monday, September 6, 2021 1:50 PM<br>
To: WSBA Probate & Trust Listserv <<a href="mailto:wsbapt@lists.wsbarppt.com" target="_blank">wsbapt@lists.wsbarppt.com</a><mailto:<a href="mailto:wsbapt@lists.wsbarppt.com" target="_blank">wsbapt@lists.wsbarppt.com</a>>><br>
Subject: Re: [WSBAPT] "Ascertainable creditor"?<br>
<br>
Agree with Roger.<br>
<br>
Mark Vohr<br>
Principal, Ohana Fiduciary Corporation<br>
(206) 782-1189<br>
<a href="mailto:Mcv@ohanafc.com" target="_blank">Mcv@ohanafc.com</a><mailto:<a href="mailto:Mcv@ohanafc.com" target="_blank">Mcv@ohanafc.com</a>><br>
________________________________<br>
From: <a href="mailto:wsbapt-bounces@lists.wsbarppt.com" target="_blank">wsbapt-bounces@lists.wsbarppt.com</a><mailto:<a href="mailto:wsbapt-bounces@lists.wsbarppt.com" target="_blank">wsbapt-bounces@lists.wsbarppt.com</a>> <<a href="mailto:wsbapt-bounces@lists.wsbarppt.com" target="_blank">wsbapt-bounces@lists.wsbarppt.com</a><mailto:<a href="mailto:wsbapt-bounces@lists.wsbarppt.com" target="_blank">wsbapt-bounces@lists.wsbarppt.com</a>>> on behalf of Roger Hawkes <<a href="mailto:Roger@law-hawks.com" target="_blank">Roger@law-hawks.com</a><mailto:<a href="mailto:Roger@law-hawks.com" target="_blank">Roger@law-hawks.com</a>>><br>
Sent: Monday, September 6, 2021 11:48:36 AM<br>
To: WSBA Probate & Trust Listserv <<a href="mailto:wsbapt@lists.wsbarppt.com" target="_blank">wsbapt@lists.wsbarppt.com</a><mailto:<a href="mailto:wsbapt@lists.wsbarppt.com" target="_blank">wsbapt@lists.wsbarppt.com</a>>><br>
Subject: Re: [WSBAPT] "Ascertainable creditor"?<br>
<br>
<br>
I vote ?yes?. Seems to me that ?ascertainable? includes situations like this where liability is not clear.<br>
<br>
<br>
<br>
Roger Hawkes, WSBA # 5173<br>
<br>
<br>
<br>
Sultan Office: 423 Main (physical office)<br>
<br>
Box 351, Sultan, WA 98294 (incoming mail)<br>
<br>
Sultan, WA 98294<br>
<br>
<br>
<br>
Other offices: we are scheduling in person meetings at various law offices in<br>
<br>
North King and South Snohomish counties. Virginia will be the person coordinating<br>
<br>
Where and When and with Whom a meeting will be held. Stay Safe!! Our phone, fax and email addresses are the same as they have been for twenty five years?<br>
<br>
<br>
<br>
Phone: 206 367 5000; fax: 206 367 4005<br>
<br>
Email: <a href="mailto:roger@law-hawks.com" target="_blank">roger@law-hawks.com</a><mailto:<a href="mailto:roger@law-hawks.com" target="_blank">roger@law-hawks.com</a>><br>
<br>
Web site: <a href="http://www.hawkeslawfirm.com" rel="noreferrer" target="_blank">www.hawkeslawfirm.com</a><<a href="https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=http-3A__www.hawkeslawfirm.com_&d=DwMGaQ&c=euGZstcaTDllvimEN8b7jXrwqOf-v5A_CdpgnVfiiMM&r=K1mLMC1eFjwfeeMM-AC6zQ&m=PvdfB5OKiTA8EBc7UBW5iWVPUM08e_Pd2SKLWHzaE5M&s=_KWiWxoGhsS6f6KZ_GTKw27rQp8IYuM3j_XLoNv_iRQ&e=" rel="noreferrer" target="_blank">https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=http-3A__www.hawkeslawfirm.com_&d=DwMGaQ&c=euGZstcaTDllvimEN8b7jXrwqOf-v5A_CdpgnVfiiMM&r=K1mLMC1eFjwfeeMM-AC6zQ&m=PvdfB5OKiTA8EBc7UBW5iWVPUM08e_Pd2SKLWHzaE5M&s=_KWiWxoGhsS6f6KZ_GTKw27rQp8IYuM3j_XLoNv_iRQ&e=</a>><br>
<br>
[cid:image001.jpg@01D7A3C5.363A8A90]<br>
<br>
<br>
<br>
From: <a href="mailto:wsbapt-bounces@lists.wsbarppt.com" target="_blank">wsbapt-bounces@lists.wsbarppt.com</a><mailto:<a href="mailto:wsbapt-bounces@lists.wsbarppt.com" target="_blank">wsbapt-bounces@lists.wsbarppt.com</a>> <<a href="mailto:wsbapt-bounces@lists.wsbarppt.com" target="_blank">wsbapt-bounces@lists.wsbarppt.com</a><mailto:<a href="mailto:wsbapt-bounces@lists.wsbarppt.com" target="_blank">wsbapt-bounces@lists.wsbarppt.com</a>>> On Behalf Of Suzanne Lieberman<br>
Sent: Monday, September 6, 2021 11:08 AM<br>
To: <a href="mailto:wsbapt@lists.wsbarppt.com" target="_blank">wsbapt@lists.wsbarppt.com</a><mailto:<a href="mailto:wsbapt@lists.wsbarppt.com" target="_blank">wsbapt@lists.wsbarppt.com</a>><br>
Subject: [WSBAPT] "Ascertainable creditor"?<br>
<br>
<br>
<br>
Hello,<br>
<br>
<br>
<br>
One more question.<br>
<br>
<br>
<br>
Client is uncertain whether she is required to give notice to a creditor that has sent a billing statement made out to the decedent's condominium management company, but not to decedent or to decedent's estate directly, and which charges she disputes. The bill references decedent's unit number. The bill is for water mitigation damages that allegedly took place during our heat wave in June but which client did not authorize (client paid other water-damage bills related to her uncle's property prior to the sale of the house, with invoices made out to the estate). Client is not sure whether the condo association is covering these charges and doesn't want to volunteer information during the notice period if it's not required. Of course, she does if it is required.<br>
<br>
<br>
<br>
Is the creditor considered "ascertainable" if Administrator is in receipt of the bill, regardless of whether the bill is made out to the estate?<br>
<br>
<br>
<br>
Best,<br>
<br>
<br>
<br>
Suzanne Lieberman<br>
<br>
CMS Law Firm LLC<<a href="https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=http-3A__cmslawfirm.com_&d=DwMGaQ&c=euGZstcaTDllvimEN8b7jXrwqOf-v5A_CdpgnVfiiMM&r=K1mLMC1eFjwfeeMM-AC6zQ&m=PvdfB5OKiTA8EBc7UBW5iWVPUM08e_Pd2SKLWHzaE5M&s=sa5qfh4De6j_oIk072AT7IUpILrjvAbESkamELhekKw&e=" rel="noreferrer" target="_blank">https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=http-3A__cmslawfirm.com_&d=DwMGaQ&c=euGZstcaTDllvimEN8b7jXrwqOf-v5A_CdpgnVfiiMM&r=K1mLMC1eFjwfeeMM-AC6zQ&m=PvdfB5OKiTA8EBc7UBW5iWVPUM08e_Pd2SKLWHzaE5M&s=sa5qfh4De6j_oIk072AT7IUpILrjvAbESkamELhekKw&e=</a>><br>
<br>
811 Kirkland Ave. Suite 201 (please note new address!)<br>
<br>
Kirkland, WA 98033<br>
<br>
206-383-6484 (Cell Phone)<br>
<br>
206-659-1512 (Main Office)<br>
<br>
<br>
<br>
<br>
<br>
Legal stuff I have to put in... To ensure compliance with Treasury Department and IRS regulations, we inform you that, unless expressly indicated otherwise, any federal tax advice contained in this communication (including any attachments) is not intended or written by CMS Law Firm LLC to be used, and cannot be used by the taxpayer, for the purpose of: (i) avoiding penalties that may be imposed on the taxpayer under the Internal Revenue Code; or (ii) promoting, marketing, or recommending to another party any transaction or matter addressed herein (or any attachments).<br>
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Message: 5<br>
Date: Tue, 7 Sep 2021 16:00:05 +0000<br>
From: Roger Hawkes <<a href="mailto:Roger@law-hawks.com" target="_blank">Roger@law-hawks.com</a>><br>
To: WSBA Probate & Trust Listserv <<a href="mailto:wsbapt@lists.wsbarppt.com" target="_blank">wsbapt@lists.wsbarppt.com</a>><br>
Subject: Re: [WSBAPT] "Ascertainable creditor"?<br>
Message-ID:<br>
<<a href="mailto:SJ0PR16MB41128AAA5888949551D35FEDE9D39@SJ0PR16MB4112.namprd16.prod.outlook.com" target="_blank">SJ0PR16MB41128AAA5888949551D35FEDE9D39@SJ0PR16MB4112.namprd16.prod.outlook.com</a>><br>
<br>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8"<br>
<br>
Ditto; I think there is no harm in sending notices that appear to be unneeded; otoh, there is harm in not sending notices to some person or entity who later proves to be a creditor.<br>
<br>
Roger Hawkes, WSBA # 5173<br>
<br>
Sultan Office: 423 Main (physical office)<br>
Box 351, Sultan, WA 98294 (incoming mail)<br>
Sultan, WA 98294<br>
<br>
Other offices: we are scheduling in person meetings at various law offices in<br>
North King and South Snohomish counties. Virginia will be the person coordinating<br>
Where and When and with Whom a meeting will be held. Stay Safe!! Our phone, fax and email addresses are the same as they have been for twenty five years?<br>
<br>
Phone: 206 367 5000; fax: 206 367 4005<br>
Email: <a href="mailto:roger@law-hawks.com" target="_blank">roger@law-hawks.com</a><mailto:<a href="mailto:roger@law-hawks.com" target="_blank">roger@law-hawks.com</a>><br>
Web site: <a href="http://www.hawkeslawfirm.com" rel="noreferrer" target="_blank">www.hawkeslawfirm.com</a><<a href="http://www.hawkeslawfirm.com/" rel="noreferrer" target="_blank">http://www.hawkeslawfirm.com/</a>><br>
[cid:image002.jpg@01D7A3C6.C055CEA0]<br>
<br>
From: <a href="mailto:wsbapt-bounces@lists.wsbarppt.com" target="_blank">wsbapt-bounces@lists.wsbarppt.com</a> <<a href="mailto:wsbapt-bounces@lists.wsbarppt.com" target="_blank">wsbapt-bounces@lists.wsbarppt.com</a>> On Behalf Of Stephen Brandli<br>
Sent: Tuesday, September 7, 2021 8:49 AM<br>
To: WSBA Probate & Trust Listserv <<a href="mailto:wsbapt@lists.wsbarppt.com" target="_blank">wsbapt@lists.wsbarppt.com</a>><br>
Subject: Re: [WSBAPT] "Ascertainable creditor"?<br>
<br>
Assuming the debt was incurred before debt (see Doug?s comment), I would send notices to both the creditor and the management company. In fact, I would do this even if the debt was incurred after death.<br>
<br>
Steve<br>
<br>
From: <a href="mailto:wsbapt-bounces@lists.wsbarppt.com" target="_blank">wsbapt-bounces@lists.wsbarppt.com</a><mailto:<a href="mailto:wsbapt-bounces@lists.wsbarppt.com" target="_blank">wsbapt-bounces@lists.wsbarppt.com</a>> <<a href="mailto:wsbapt-bounces@lists.wsbarppt.com" target="_blank">wsbapt-bounces@lists.wsbarppt.com</a><mailto:<a href="mailto:wsbapt-bounces@lists.wsbarppt.com" target="_blank">wsbapt-bounces@lists.wsbarppt.com</a>>> On Behalf Of Bryce Dille<br>
Sent: Monday, September 6, 2021 2:04 PM<br>
To: WSBA Probate & Trust Listserv <<a href="mailto:wsbapt@lists.wsbarppt.com" target="_blank">wsbapt@lists.wsbarppt.com</a><mailto:<a href="mailto:wsbapt@lists.wsbarppt.com" target="_blank">wsbapt@lists.wsbarppt.com</a>>><br>
Subject: Re: [WSBAPT] "Ascertainable creditor"?<br>
<br>
I litigated this issue and the superior court held any known party who has a possible claim against the estate of which you have knowledge and is known must be given notice even though a claim per se wasn?t made against the decedent during his or her lifetime.<br>
<br>
Bryce H. Dille<br>
Dille Law, PLLC<br>
2010 Caton Way SW Ste. 101<br>
Olympia, WA 98502<br>
Office: 360-350-0270<br>
Cell: 253-579-5561<br>
<br>
** Please note that I use the dictation feature of my iPhone and that sometimes everything I say does not get properly translated**<br>
<br>
This transmission contains confidential attorney-client communications and may not be disclosed to any person but the intended recipient(s). If this matter is transmitted to you in error, please notify the sender immediately.<br>
<br>
Business Entity Creation and Management, Business, Government and Tax Law, Real Estate and Land Use, Residential, Commercial and Condominium Development Real Estate and Commercial Transactions & Closings, Including Performing Services as IRS Section 1031 Exchange Facilitator Estate Planning, including Wills and Trusts, and Probate Administration Representation Homeowners/Condominium Association Real Estate Developments Real Property Foreclosures and Forfeitures.<br>
<br>
From: <a href="mailto:wsbapt-bounces@lists.wsbarppt.com" target="_blank">wsbapt-bounces@lists.wsbarppt.com</a><mailto:<a href="mailto:wsbapt-bounces@lists.wsbarppt.com" target="_blank">wsbapt-bounces@lists.wsbarppt.com</a>> <<a href="mailto:wsbapt-bounces@lists.wsbarppt.com" target="_blank">wsbapt-bounces@lists.wsbarppt.com</a><mailto:<a href="mailto:wsbapt-bounces@lists.wsbarppt.com" target="_blank">wsbapt-bounces@lists.wsbarppt.com</a>>> On Behalf Of Mark Vohr<br>
Sent: Monday, September 6, 2021 1:50 PM<br>
To: WSBA Probate & Trust Listserv <<a href="mailto:wsbapt@lists.wsbarppt.com" target="_blank">wsbapt@lists.wsbarppt.com</a><mailto:<a href="mailto:wsbapt@lists.wsbarppt.com" target="_blank">wsbapt@lists.wsbarppt.com</a>>><br>
Subject: Re: [WSBAPT] "Ascertainable creditor"?<br>
<br>
Agree with Roger.<br>
<br>
Mark Vohr<br>
Principal, Ohana Fiduciary Corporation<br>
(206) 782-1189<br>
<a href="mailto:Mcv@ohanafc.com" target="_blank">Mcv@ohanafc.com</a><mailto:<a href="mailto:Mcv@ohanafc.com" target="_blank">Mcv@ohanafc.com</a>><br>
________________________________<br>
From: <a href="mailto:wsbapt-bounces@lists.wsbarppt.com" target="_blank">wsbapt-bounces@lists.wsbarppt.com</a><mailto:<a href="mailto:wsbapt-bounces@lists.wsbarppt.com" target="_blank">wsbapt-bounces@lists.wsbarppt.com</a>> <<a href="mailto:wsbapt-bounces@lists.wsbarppt.com" target="_blank">wsbapt-bounces@lists.wsbarppt.com</a><mailto:<a href="mailto:wsbapt-bounces@lists.wsbarppt.com" target="_blank">wsbapt-bounces@lists.wsbarppt.com</a>>> on behalf of Roger Hawkes <<a href="mailto:Roger@law-hawks.com" target="_blank">Roger@law-hawks.com</a><mailto:<a href="mailto:Roger@law-hawks.com" target="_blank">Roger@law-hawks.com</a>>><br>
Sent: Monday, September 6, 2021 11:48:36 AM<br>
To: WSBA Probate & Trust Listserv <<a href="mailto:wsbapt@lists.wsbarppt.com" target="_blank">wsbapt@lists.wsbarppt.com</a><mailto:<a href="mailto:wsbapt@lists.wsbarppt.com" target="_blank">wsbapt@lists.wsbarppt.com</a>>><br>
Subject: Re: [WSBAPT] "Ascertainable creditor"?<br>
<br>
<br>
I vote ?yes?. Seems to me that ?ascertainable? includes situations like this where liability is not clear.<br>
<br>
<br>
<br>
Roger Hawkes, WSBA # 5173<br>
<br>
<br>
<br>
Sultan Office: 423 Main (physical office)<br>
<br>
Box 351, Sultan, WA 98294 (incoming mail)<br>
<br>
Sultan, WA 98294<br>
<br>
<br>
<br>
Other offices: we are scheduling in person meetings at various law offices in<br>
<br>
North King and South Snohomish counties. Virginia will be the person coordinating<br>
<br>
Where and When and with Whom a meeting will be held. Stay Safe!! Our phone, fax and email addresses are the same as they have been for twenty five years?<br>
<br>
<br>
<br>
Phone: 206 367 5000; fax: 206 367 4005<br>
<br>
Email: <a href="mailto:roger@law-hawks.com" target="_blank">roger@law-hawks.com</a><mailto:<a href="mailto:roger@law-hawks.com" target="_blank">roger@law-hawks.com</a>><br>
<br>
Web site: <a href="http://www.hawkeslawfirm.com" rel="noreferrer" target="_blank">www.hawkeslawfirm.com</a><<a href="https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=http-3A__www.hawkeslawfirm.com_&d=DwMGaQ&c=euGZstcaTDllvimEN8b7jXrwqOf-v5A_CdpgnVfiiMM&r=K1mLMC1eFjwfeeMM-AC6zQ&m=PvdfB5OKiTA8EBc7UBW5iWVPUM08e_Pd2SKLWHzaE5M&s=_KWiWxoGhsS6f6KZ_GTKw27rQp8IYuM3j_XLoNv_iRQ&e=" rel="noreferrer" target="_blank">https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=http-3A__www.hawkeslawfirm.com_&d=DwMGaQ&c=euGZstcaTDllvimEN8b7jXrwqOf-v5A_CdpgnVfiiMM&r=K1mLMC1eFjwfeeMM-AC6zQ&m=PvdfB5OKiTA8EBc7UBW5iWVPUM08e_Pd2SKLWHzaE5M&s=_KWiWxoGhsS6f6KZ_GTKw27rQp8IYuM3j_XLoNv_iRQ&e=</a>><br>
<br>
[cid:image003.jpg@01D7A3C6.C055CEA0]<br>
<br>
<br>
<br>
From: <a href="mailto:wsbapt-bounces@lists.wsbarppt.com" target="_blank">wsbapt-bounces@lists.wsbarppt.com</a><mailto:<a href="mailto:wsbapt-bounces@lists.wsbarppt.com" target="_blank">wsbapt-bounces@lists.wsbarppt.com</a>> <<a href="mailto:wsbapt-bounces@lists.wsbarppt.com" target="_blank">wsbapt-bounces@lists.wsbarppt.com</a><mailto:<a href="mailto:wsbapt-bounces@lists.wsbarppt.com" target="_blank">wsbapt-bounces@lists.wsbarppt.com</a>>> On Behalf Of Suzanne Lieberman<br>
Sent: Monday, September 6, 2021 11:08 AM<br>
To: <a href="mailto:wsbapt@lists.wsbarppt.com" target="_blank">wsbapt@lists.wsbarppt.com</a><mailto:<a href="mailto:wsbapt@lists.wsbarppt.com" target="_blank">wsbapt@lists.wsbarppt.com</a>><br>
Subject: [WSBAPT] "Ascertainable creditor"?<br>
<br>
<br>
<br>
Hello,<br>
<br>
<br>
<br>
One more question.<br>
<br>
<br>
<br>
Client is uncertain whether she is required to give notice to a creditor that has sent a billing statement made out to the decedent's condominium management company, but not to decedent or to decedent's estate directly, and which charges she disputes. The bill references decedent's unit number. The bill is for water mitigation damages that allegedly took place during our heat wave in June but which client did not authorize (client paid other water-damage bills related to her uncle's property prior to the sale of the house, with invoices made out to the estate). Client is not sure whether the condo association is covering these charges and doesn't want to volunteer information during the notice period if it's not required. Of course, she does if it is required.<br>
<br>
<br>
<br>
Is the creditor considered "ascertainable" if Administrator is in receipt of the bill, regardless of whether the bill is made out to the estate?<br>
<br>
<br>
<br>
Best,<br>
<br>
<br>
<br>
Suzanne Lieberman<br>
<br>
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<br>
Message: 6<br>
Date: Tue, 7 Sep 2021 17:19:55 +0000<br>
From: Maren Benedetti <<a href="mailto:Maren.Benedetti@adamslawyers.com" target="_blank">Maren.Benedetti@adamslawyers.com</a>><br>
To: "<a href="mailto:wsbapt@lists.wsbarppt.com" target="_blank">wsbapt@lists.wsbarppt.com</a>" <<a href="mailto:wsbapt@lists.wsbarppt.com" target="_blank">wsbapt@lists.wsbarppt.com</a>><br>
Subject: [WSBAPT] probate for two<br>
Message-ID:<br>
<<a href="mailto:BN0PR13MB51984BD9920127255CD3B84497D39@BN0PR13MB5198.namprd13.prod.outlook.com" target="_blank">BN0PR13MB51984BD9920127255CD3B84497D39@BN0PR13MB5198.namprd13.prod.outlook.com</a>><br>
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Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"<br>
<br>
Hi all,<br>
<br>
Thought I had seen this addressed previously but can't find the thread.<br>
<br>
I have a new probate, not opened yet, where husband predeceased wife several years ago. Now, wife has died but there was no community property agreement and husband is still on title on the house. I know some people use a lack of probate affidavit, but I question whether that passes good title. PR of wife's estate intends to sell the house.<br>
<br>
I read somewhere about probate with both spouses in the same caption in this circumstance. Not sure whether Snohomish county commissioners would like that, but would rather not open two probates just to transfer things to wife's estate.<br>
<br>
Thoughts?<br>
<br>
Maren Benedetti<br>
Attorney<br>
<br>
ADAMS & DUNCAN, INC., P.S.<br>
LAWYERS<br>
3128 Colby Avenue<br>
Everett, WA 98201<br>
Office Tel: (425) 339-8556<br>
Dir. Tel: (425) 740-3306<br>
Fax: (425) 740-3326<br>
<a href="mailto:Maren.Benedetti@adamslawyers.com" target="_blank">Maren.Benedetti@adamslawyers.com</a><mailto:<a href="mailto:Chris.Adams@adamslawyers.com" target="_blank">Chris.Adams@adamslawyers.com</a>><br>
<a href="http://www.AdamsLawyers.com" rel="noreferrer" target="_blank">www.AdamsLawyers.com</a><<a href="http://www.adamslawyers.com/" rel="noreferrer" target="_blank">http://www.adamslawyers.com/</a>><br>
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CIRCULAR 230 DISCLAIMER: Pursuant to recently-enacted U.S. Treasury Department Regulations, we are now required to advise you that, unless otherwise expressly indicated, any federal tax advice contained in this communication, including attachments and enclosures, is not intended or written to be used, and may not be used, for the purpose of (i) avoiding tax-related penalties under the Internal Revenue Code or (ii) promoting, marketing or recommending to another party any tax-related matters addressed herein.<br>
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<br>
Message: 7<br>
Date: Tue, 7 Sep 2021 17:25:09 +0000<br>
From: Dalynne Singleton <<a href="mailto:dalynne@glgmail.com" target="_blank">dalynne@glgmail.com</a>><br>
To: WSBA Probate & Trust Listserv <<a href="mailto:wsbapt@lists.wsbarppt.com" target="_blank">wsbapt@lists.wsbarppt.com</a>><br>
Subject: [WSBAPT] Snohomish probate for two<br>
Message-ID:<br>
<<a href="mailto:BY5PR12MB5542916573AF05B82B190649A5D39@BY5PR12MB5542.namprd12.prod.outlook.com" target="_blank">BY5PR12MB5542916573AF05B82B190649A5D39@BY5PR12MB5542.namprd12.prod.outlook.com</a>><br>
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Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"<br>
<br>
I have done this and Snohomish county superior will accept it as well.<br>
I can share my petition with you if you want to email me directly.<br>
<br>
Dalynne Singleton<br>
Gourley Law Group<br>
Snohomish Escrow<br>
The Exchange Connection<br>
1002 10th Street / PO Box 1091<br>
Snohomish, WA 98291<br>
360.568.5065<br>
360.568.8092 fax<br>
<a href="mailto:dalynne@glgmail.com" target="_blank">dalynne@glgmail.com</a><mailto:<a href="mailto:dalynne@glgmail.com" target="_blank">dalynne@glgmail.com</a>><br>
Website: <a href="http://www.glglawgroup.com" rel="noreferrer" target="_blank">www.glglawgroup.com</a><<a href="http://www.glglawgroup.com/" rel="noreferrer" target="_blank">http://www.glglawgroup.com/</a>><br>
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From: <a href="mailto:wsbapt-bounces@lists.wsbarppt.com" target="_blank">wsbapt-bounces@lists.wsbarppt.com</a> <<a href="mailto:wsbapt-bounces@lists.wsbarppt.com" target="_blank">wsbapt-bounces@lists.wsbarppt.com</a>> On Behalf Of Maren Benedetti<br>
Sent: Tuesday, September 7, 2021 10:20 AM<br>
To: <a href="mailto:wsbapt@lists.wsbarppt.com" target="_blank">wsbapt@lists.wsbarppt.com</a><br>
Subject: [WSBAPT] probate for two<br>
<br>
Hi all,<br>
<br>
Thought I had seen this addressed previously but can't find the thread.<br>
<br>
I have a new probate, not opened yet, where husband predeceased wife several years ago. Now, wife has died but there was no community property agreement and husband is still on title on the house. I know some people use a lack of probate affidavit, but I question whether that passes good title. PR of wife's estate intends to sell the house.<br>
<br>
I read somewhere about probate with both spouses in the same caption in this circumstance. Not sure whether Snohomish county commissioners would like that, but would rather not open two probates just to transfer things to wife's estate.<br>
<br>
Thoughts?<br>
<br>
Maren Benedetti<br>
Attorney<br>
<br>
ADAMS & DUNCAN, INC., P.S.<br>
LAWYERS<br>
3128 Colby Avenue<br>
Everett, WA 98201<br>
Office Tel: (425) 339-8556<br>
Dir. Tel: (425) 740-3306<br>
Fax: (425) 740-3326<br>
<a href="mailto:Maren.Benedetti@adamslawyers.com" target="_blank">Maren.Benedetti@adamslawyers.com</a><mailto:<a href="mailto:Chris.Adams@adamslawyers.com" target="_blank">Chris.Adams@adamslawyers.com</a>><br>
<a href="http://www.AdamsLawyers.com" rel="noreferrer" target="_blank">www.AdamsLawyers.com</a><<a href="http://www.adamslawyers.com/" rel="noreferrer" target="_blank">http://www.adamslawyers.com/</a>><br>
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CIRCULAR 230 DISCLAIMER: Pursuant to recently-enacted U.S. Treasury Department Regulations, we are now required to advise you that, unless otherwise expressly indicated, any federal tax advice contained in this communication, including attachments and enclosures, is not intended or written to be used, and may not be used, for the purpose of (i) avoiding tax-related penalties under the Internal Revenue Code or (ii) promoting, marketing or recommending to another party any tax-related matters addressed herein.<br>
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<br>
------------------------------<br>
<br>
Message: 8<br>
Date: Tue, 7 Sep 2021 10:28:41 -0700<br>
From: "Josh Grant" <<a href="mailto:jgrant@accima.com" target="_blank">jgrant@accima.com</a>><br>
To: "WSBA Probate & Trust Listserv" <<a href="mailto:wsbapt@lists.wsbarppt.com" target="_blank">wsbapt@lists.wsbarppt.com</a>><br>
Subject: Re: [WSBAPT] probate for two<br>
Message-ID: <CD24512C65884D8AAC6DC8FDBA889DA2@JoshPC><br>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8"<br>
<br>
If you have to do a probate ?? then I would do both in one filing and you can do it in any county.. it is the gold standard for title companies.<br>
<br>
Joshua F. Grant<br>
<br>
P. O. Box 619<br>
Wilbur, WA 99185<br>
509 647 5578<br>
<br>
From: Maren Benedetti <br>
Sent: Tuesday, September 07, 2021 10:19 AM<br>
To: <a href="mailto:wsbapt@lists.wsbarppt.com" target="_blank">wsbapt@lists.wsbarppt.com</a> <br>
Subject: [WSBAPT] probate for two<br>
<br>
Hi all,<br>
<br>
<br>
<br>
Thought I had seen this addressed previously but can?t find the thread.<br>
<br>
<br>
<br>
I have a new probate, not opened yet, where husband predeceased wife several years ago. Now, wife has died but there was no community property agreement and husband is still on title on the house. I know some people use a lack of probate affidavit, but I question whether that passes good title. PR of wife?s estate intends to sell the house.<br>
<br>
<br>
<br>
I read somewhere about probate with both spouses in the same caption in this circumstance. Not sure whether Snohomish county commissioners would like that, but would rather not open two probates just to transfer things to wife?s estate.<br>
<br>
<br>
<br>
Thoughts?<br>
<br>
<br>
<br>
Maren Benedetti<br>
<br>
Attorney<br>
<br>
<br>
<br>
ADAMS & DUNCAN, INC., P.S.<br>
LAWYERS<br>
3128 Colby Avenue<br>
Everett, WA 98201 <br>
<br>
Office Tel: (425) 339-8556 <br>
<br>
Dir. Tel: (425) 740-3306<br>
<br>
Fax: (425) 740-3326<br>
<br>
<a href="mailto:Maren.Benedetti@adamslawyers.com" target="_blank">Maren.Benedetti@adamslawyers.com</a><br>
<br>
<a href="http://www.AdamsLawyers.com" rel="noreferrer" target="_blank">www.AdamsLawyers.com</a><br>
<br>
<br>
<br>
CAUTION! This email is covered by the Electronic Communications Privacy Act, 18 USC 2510-2521 and is legally privileged. The information contained in this electronic message is intended only for the use of the recipient named above. If you are not the intended recipient, be advised that any disclosure, copying, distribution or use of the contents of this transmission is prohibited. If you have received this electronic message transmission in error, please notify the law firm of ADAMS & DUNCAN, INC., P.S. at (425)339-8556 or by reply e-mail and delete the original message. Thank you.<br>
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<br>
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CIRCULAR 230 DISCLAIMER: Pursuant to recently-enacted U.S. Treasury Department Regulations, we are now required to advise you that, unless otherwise expressly indicated, any federal tax advice contained in this communication, including attachments and enclosures, is not intended or written to be used, and may not be used, for the purpose of (i) avoiding tax-related penalties under the Internal Revenue Code or (ii) promoting, marketing or recommending to another party any tax-related matters addressed herein.<br>
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<br>
Message: 9<br>
Date: Tue, 7 Sep 2021 18:23:25 +0000<br>
From: Mark Vohr <<a href="mailto:mcv@ohanafc.com" target="_blank">mcv@ohanafc.com</a>><br>
To: Doug Schafer <<a href="mailto:schafer@pobox.com" target="_blank">schafer@pobox.com</a>>, WSBA Probate & Trust Listserv<br>
<<a href="mailto:wsbapt@lists.wsbarppt.com" target="_blank">wsbapt@lists.wsbarppt.com</a>><br>
Subject: Re: [WSBAPT] "Ascertainable creditor"?<br>
Message-ID:<br>
<<a href="mailto:MW3PR13MB410716626A4C3387CF1D71DEA1D39@MW3PR13MB4107.namprd13.prod.outlook.com" target="_blank">MW3PR13MB410716626A4C3387CF1D71DEA1D39@MW3PR13MB4107.namprd13.prod.outlook.com</a>><br>
<br>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8"<br>
<br>
Doug makes an important distinction which is worth highlighting. Although Statutory Claims are claims against the estate, the title can be misleading. The Statutory Claims procedure applies only to claims against the decedent, which are chargeable against his estate. Under RCW 11.40.010, also called the ?nonclaim statute? provides, ?[a] person having a claim against the decedent may not maintain an action on the claim unless a personal representative has been appointed and the claimant has presented the claim as set forth in this chapter.? (Emphasis added).<br>
<br>
The important distinction here is that while the estate may be the entity liable for the claim ? the claim itself which is covered under the Statutory Claims Process must be valid against the decedent before he or she became deceased. (See also RCW 11.40.051, which applies the bar against claims only to claims against the decedent.) Otherwise it falls under an administrative claim with a different set of rules and ways to respond.<br>
<br>
A contingent claim (as it seems this is) is just as valid under the claims statute as any other claim.<br>
<br>
<br>
<br>
Regards,<br>
<br>
Mark<br>
<br>
Ohana Fiduciary Corp.<br>
<br>
A Washington Trust Company<br>
Mark C. Vohr, J.D., CPG, Principal<br>
155 NE 100th St., Suite 209 Seattle, WA 98125<br>
T: (206) 782-1189 F: (206) 782-1434<br>
<a href="mailto:mcv@ohanafc.com" target="_blank">mcv@ohanafc.com</a><mailto:<a href="mailto:mcv@ohanafc.com" target="_blank">mcv@ohanafc.com</a>> <a href="http://www.ohanafc.com" rel="noreferrer" target="_blank">www.ohanafc.com</a><<a href="http://www.ohanafc.com/" rel="noreferrer" target="_blank">http://www.ohanafc.com/</a>><br>
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From: Doug Schafer <<a href="mailto:schafer@pobox.com" target="_blank">schafer@pobox.com</a>><br>
Sent: Monday, September 6, 2021 10:48 PM<br>
To: WSBA Probate & Trust Listserv <<a href="mailto:wsbapt@lists.wsbarppt.com" target="_blank">wsbapt@lists.wsbarppt.com</a>>; Mark Vohr <<a href="mailto:mcv@ohanafc.com" target="_blank">mcv@ohanafc.com</a>><br>
Subject: Re: [WSBAPT] "Ascertainable creditor"?<br>
<br>
>From the question, I infer that "client" is the estate's PR. The questioner wrote, "The bill is for water mitigation damages that allegedly took place during our heat wave in June but which client did not authorize ...." If the bill is for services subsequent to the decedent's death, as it appears, the 4-month claim period for creditors existing at that death does not apply. Instead it is simply a claim against the estate or the PR and the creditor can sue the estate or the PR subject to the normal statute of limitations.<br>
<br>
Doug Schafer, in Tacoma<br>
On 9/6/2021 13:49, Mark Vohr wrote:<br>
Agree with Roger.<br>
<br>
Mark Vohr<br>
Principal, Ohana Fiduciary Corporation<br>
(206) 782-1189<br>
<a href="mailto:Mcv@ohanafc.com" target="_blank">Mcv@ohanafc.com</a><mailto:<a href="mailto:Mcv@ohanafc.com" target="_blank">Mcv@ohanafc.com</a>><br>
________________________________<br>
From: <a href="mailto:wsbapt-bounces@lists.wsbarppt.com" target="_blank">wsbapt-bounces@lists.wsbarppt.com</a><mailto:<a href="mailto:wsbapt-bounces@lists.wsbarppt.com" target="_blank">wsbapt-bounces@lists.wsbarppt.com</a>> <<a href="mailto:wsbapt-bounces@lists.wsbarppt.com" target="_blank">wsbapt-bounces@lists.wsbarppt.com</a>><mailto:<a href="mailto:wsbapt-bounces@lists.wsbarppt.com" target="_blank">wsbapt-bounces@lists.wsbarppt.com</a>> on behalf of Roger Hawkes <<a href="mailto:Roger@law-hawks.com" target="_blank">Roger@law-hawks.com</a>><mailto:<a href="mailto:Roger@law-hawks.com" target="_blank">Roger@law-hawks.com</a>><br>
Sent: Monday, September 6, 2021 11:48:36 AM<br>
To: WSBA Probate & Trust Listserv <<a href="mailto:wsbapt@lists.wsbarppt.com" target="_blank">wsbapt@lists.wsbarppt.com</a>><mailto:<a href="mailto:wsbapt@lists.wsbarppt.com" target="_blank">wsbapt@lists.wsbarppt.com</a>><br>
Subject: Re: [WSBAPT] "Ascertainable creditor"?<br>
<br>
<br>
I vote ?yes?. Seems to me that ?ascertainable? includes situations like this where liability is not clear.<br>
<br>
<br>
<br>
Roger Hawkes, WSBA # 5173<br>
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Sultan Office: 423 Main (physical office)<br>
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Where and When and with Whom a meeting will be held. Stay Safe!! Our phone, fax and email addresses are the same as they have been for twenty five years?<br>
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Phone: 206 367 5000; fax: 206 367 4005<br>
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Email: <a href="mailto:roger@law-hawks.com" target="_blank">roger@law-hawks.com</a><mailto:<a href="mailto:roger@law-hawks.com" target="_blank">roger@law-hawks.com</a>><br>
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Web site: <a href="http://www.hawkeslawfirm.com" rel="noreferrer" target="_blank">www.hawkeslawfirm.com</a><<a href="https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=http-3A__www.hawkeslawfirm.com_&d=DwMGaQ&c=euGZstcaTDllvimEN8b7jXrwqOf-v5A_CdpgnVfiiMM&r=K1mLMC1eFjwfeeMM-AC6zQ&m=PvdfB5OKiTA8EBc7UBW5iWVPUM08e_Pd2SKLWHzaE5M&s=_KWiWxoGhsS6f6KZ_GTKw27rQp8IYuM3j_XLoNv_iRQ&e=" rel="noreferrer" target="_blank">https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=http-3A__www.hawkeslawfirm.com_&d=DwMGaQ&c=euGZstcaTDllvimEN8b7jXrwqOf-v5A_CdpgnVfiiMM&r=K1mLMC1eFjwfeeMM-AC6zQ&m=PvdfB5OKiTA8EBc7UBW5iWVPUM08e_Pd2SKLWHzaE5M&s=_KWiWxoGhsS6f6KZ_GTKw27rQp8IYuM3j_XLoNv_iRQ&e=</a>><br>
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From: <a href="mailto:wsbapt-bounces@lists.wsbarppt.com" target="_blank">wsbapt-bounces@lists.wsbarppt.com</a><mailto:<a href="mailto:wsbapt-bounces@lists.wsbarppt.com" target="_blank">wsbapt-bounces@lists.wsbarppt.com</a>> <<a href="mailto:wsbapt-bounces@lists.wsbarppt.com" target="_blank">wsbapt-bounces@lists.wsbarppt.com</a>><mailto:<a href="mailto:wsbapt-bounces@lists.wsbarppt.com" target="_blank">wsbapt-bounces@lists.wsbarppt.com</a>> On Behalf Of Suzanne Lieberman<br>
Sent: Monday, September 6, 2021 11:08 AM<br>
To: <a href="mailto:wsbapt@lists.wsbarppt.com" target="_blank">wsbapt@lists.wsbarppt.com</a><mailto:<a href="mailto:wsbapt@lists.wsbarppt.com" target="_blank">wsbapt@lists.wsbarppt.com</a>><br>
Subject: [WSBAPT] "Ascertainable creditor"?<br>
<br>
<br>
<br>
Hello,<br>
<br>
<br>
<br>
One more question.<br>
<br>
<br>
<br>
Client is uncertain whether she is required to give notice to a creditor that has sent a billing statement made out to the decedent's condominium management company, but not to decedent or to decedent's estate directly, and which charges she disputes. The bill references decedent's unit number. The bill is for water mitigation damages that allegedly took place during our heat wave in June but which client did not authorize (client paid other water-damage bills related to her uncle's property prior to the sale of the house, with invoices made out to the estate). Client is not sure whether the condo association is covering these charges and doesn't want to volunteer information during the notice period if it's not required. Of course, she does if it is required.<br>
<br>
<br>
<br>
Is the creditor considered "ascertainable" if Administrator is in receipt of the bill, regardless of whether the bill is made out to the estate?<br>
<br>
<br>
<br>
Best,<br>
<br>
<br>
<br>
Suzanne Lieberman<br>
<br>
CMS Law Firm LLC<<a href="https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=http-3A__cmslawfirm.com_&d=DwMGaQ&c=euGZstcaTDllvimEN8b7jXrwqOf-v5A_CdpgnVfiiMM&r=K1mLMC1eFjwfeeMM-AC6zQ&m=PvdfB5OKiTA8EBc7UBW5iWVPUM08e_Pd2SKLWHzaE5M&s=sa5qfh4De6j_oIk072AT7IUpILrjvAbESkamELhekKw&e=" rel="noreferrer" target="_blank">https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=http-3A__cmslawfirm.com_&d=DwMGaQ&c=euGZstcaTDllvimEN8b7jXrwqOf-v5A_CdpgnVfiiMM&r=K1mLMC1eFjwfeeMM-AC6zQ&m=PvdfB5OKiTA8EBc7UBW5iWVPUM08e_Pd2SKLWHzaE5M&s=sa5qfh4De6j_oIk072AT7IUpILrjvAbESkamELhekKw&e=</a>><br>
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Message: 10<br>
Date: Tue, 7 Sep 2021 11:57:34 -0700<br>
From: <<a href="mailto:betsy@bwattorney.com" target="_blank">betsy@bwattorney.com</a>><br>
To: "'WSBA Probate & Trust Listserv'" <<a href="mailto:wsbapt@lists.wsbarppt.com" target="_blank">wsbapt@lists.wsbarppt.com</a>>,<br>
<<a href="mailto:wsbapt-bounces@lists.wsbarppt.com" target="_blank">wsbapt-bounces@lists.wsbarppt.com</a>>, "WSBAPT Listserve"<br>
<<a href="mailto:wsbapt@lists.wsbarppt.com" target="_blank">wsbapt@lists.wsbarppt.com</a>><br>
Subject: [WSBAPT] North Alabama referral?<br>
Message-ID: <06f101d7a41a$38605020$a920f060$@<a href="http://bwattorney.com" rel="noreferrer" target="_blank">bwattorney.com</a>><br>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"<br>
<br>
Hello,<br>
<br>
<br>
<br>
I am in need of a referral attorney for a client who needs a probate in<br>
Northern Alabama.<br>
<br>
<br>
<br>
Thank you!<br>
<br>
<br>
<br>
Betsy <br>
<br>
<br>
<br>
<br>
<br>
<br>
<br>
<br>
<br>
<<a href="http://www.bwattorney.com/" rel="noreferrer" target="_blank">http://www.bwattorney.com/</a>> <a href="http://www.bwattorney.com" rel="noreferrer" target="_blank">www.bwattorney.com</a> |<br>
<mailto:<a href="mailto:betsy@bwattorney.com" target="_blank">betsy@bwattorney.com</a>> <a href="mailto:betsy@bwattorney.com" target="_blank">betsy@bwattorney.com</a> | 206.705.3613 | 5608<br>
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