<html><body><span style="font-family:Times New Roman; color:#000000; font-size:12pt;"><div><span style="">Hi Heather -John: </span></div><div><span style="">So client has an adult child who is a spendthrift and he and his X currently fund a bank account that pays for child's mortgage, utilities, etc. He is trying to get X, who has an eight figure estate, to amend X's estate plan to make sure child's inheritance from X isn't given to child. He would like to have the trust also take advantage of the annual gift exclusion too. </span></div><div><span style="">Thanks </span></div><div><span style="">Mike</span></div><div><br></div><div><img id="sigimg0" title="signature image" src="cid:sigimg0@a9c060411474b76bd521b0cc6800a60f" border="0" alt=""></div><div><br><br></div>
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-------- Original Message --------<br>
Subject: Re: [WSBAPT] Irrevocable Trusts<br>
From: John Creahan <<a href="mailto:john@cairn-law.com">john@cairn-law.com</a>><br>
Date: Thu, December 17, 2020 6:15 pm<br>
To: WSBA Probate & Trust Listserv <<a href="mailto:wsbapt@lists.wsbarppt.com">wsbapt@lists.wsbarppt.com</a>><br>
<br>
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</style><![endif]--> <div class="WordSection1"> <div class="MsoNormal" style="font-size:12pt;margin-bottom:6.0pt"><span style="font-size:12.0pt;font-family:"Times New Roman",serif;color:#595959">I agree with Heather.<o:p></o:p></span></div> <div class="MsoNormal" style="font-size:12pt;margin-bottom:6.0pt"><span style="font-size:12.0pt;font-family:"Times New Roman",serif;color:#595959">There are very significant differences between an irrevocable trust and an <span class="SpellE">RLT</span> and administration can be expensive. <o:p></o:p></span></div> <div class="MsoNormal" style="font-size:12pt;margin-bottom:6.0pt"><span style="font-size:12.0pt;font-family:"Times New Roman",serif;color:#595959">For instance, an irrevocable trust is a separate taxpayer – so it needs its own EIN and will typically be subject to higher income taxes than an individual. In addition, I <span class="GramE">generally recommend</span> naming a professional trustee.<o:p></o:p></span></div> <div class="MsoNormal" style="font-size:12pt;margin-bottom:6.0pt"><span style="font-size:12.0pt;font-family:"Times New Roman",serif;color:#595959">I’m not aware of any relevant <span class="SpellE">CLEs</span>, but it is worth exploring why the client wants to do this and whether the costs outweigh the benefits.<o:p></o:p></span></div> <div class="MsoNormal" style="font-size:12pt;margin-bottom:6.0pt"><span style="font-size:12.0pt;font-family:"Times New Roman",serif;color:#595959">I would be happy to chat for a few minutes if it would help.<o:p></o:p></span></div> <div class="MsoNormal" style="font-size:12pt;margin-bottom:6.0pt"><span style="font-size:12.0pt;font-family:"Times New Roman",serif;color:#595959">Hope this helps,<o:p></o:p></span></div> <div class="MsoNormal" style="font-size:12pt;margin-bottom:6.0pt"><span style="font-size:12.0pt;font-family:"Times New Roman",serif;color:#595959">John<o:p></o:p></span></div> <div class="MsoNormal" style="font-size:12pt;margin-bottom:6.0pt"><span style="font-size:12.0pt;font-family:"Times New Roman",serif;color:#595959"><o:p> </o:p></span></div> <div class="MsoNormal" style="font-size:12pt;"><span style="font-size:12.0pt;font-family:"Times New Roman",serif;color:#595959"><o:p> </o:p></span></div> <div> <div class="MsoNormal" style="font-size:12pt;"><span style="font-size:14.0pt;font-family:"Tw Cen MT",sans-serif;mso-fareast-font-family:"Times New Roman";mso-bidi-font-family:"Times New Roman";color:#595959;mso-no-proof:yes">John Creahan</span><span style="font-size:12.0pt;font-family:"Tw Cen MT",sans-serif;mso-fareast-font-family:"Times New Roman";mso-bidi-font-family:"Times New Roman";color:#595959;mso-no-proof:yes"><o:p></o:p></span></div> <div class="MsoNormal" style="font-size:12pt;margin-bottom:12.0pt"><span style="font-size:12.0pt;font-family:"Tw Cen MT",sans-serif;mso-fareast-font-family:"Times New Roman";mso-bidi-font-family:"Times New Roman";color:#595959;mso-no-proof:yes"><a target="_blank" href="http://www.cairn-law.com/"><span style="color:#595959">www.cairn-law.com</span></a><br> 206-578-5877<o:p></o:p></span></div> <div class="MsoNormal" style="font-size:12pt;"><span style="font-family:"Tw Cen MT",sans-serif;mso-fareast-font-family:"Times New Roman";mso-bidi-font-family:"Times New Roman";color:#595959;mso-no-proof:yes">Fremont office:<o:p></o:p></span></div> <div class="MsoNormal" style="font-size:12pt;"><span style="font-family:"Tw Cen MT",sans-serif;mso-fareast-font-family:"Times New Roman";mso-bidi-font-family:"Times New Roman";color:#595959;mso-no-proof:yes">3417 Evanston Ave. N, Suite 312<br> Seattle, WA 98103</span><span style="font-size:12.0pt;font-family:"Tw Cen MT",sans-serif;mso-fareast-font-family:"Times New Roman";mso-bidi-font-family:"Times New Roman";color:#4F6228;mso-no-proof:yes"><o:p></o:p></span></div> <div class="MsoNormal" style="font-size:12pt;"><span style="font-size:12.0pt;font-family:"Times New Roman",serif;mso-fareast-font-family:"Times New Roman";color:#595959;mso-no-proof:yes"><o:p> </o:p></span></div> </div> <div class="MsoNormal" style="font-size:12pt;"><span style="font-size:12.0pt;font-family:"Times New Roman",serif;color:#595959"><o:p> </o:p></span></div> <div> <div style="border:none;border-top:solid #E1E1E1 1.0pt;padding:3.0pt 0in 0in 0in"> <div class="MsoNormal" style="font-size:12pt;"><b><span style="mso-fareast-font-family:"Times New Roman"">From:</span></b><span style="mso-fareast-font-family:"Times New Roman""> <a href="mailto:wsbapt-bounces@lists.wsbarppt.com">wsbapt-bounces@lists.wsbarppt.com</a> <<a href="mailto:wsbapt-bounces@lists.wsbarppt.com">wsbapt-bounces@lists.wsbarppt.com</a>> <b>On Behalf Of </b>Heather de Vrieze<br> <b>Sent:</b> Thursday, December 17, 2020 4:33 PM<br> <b>To:</b> WSBA Probate & Trust Listserv <<a href="mailto:wsbapt@lists.wsbarppt.com">wsbapt@lists.wsbarppt.com</a>><br> <b>Subject:</b> Re: [WSBAPT] Irrevocable Trusts<o:p></o:p></span></div> </div> </div> <div class="MsoNormal" style="font-size:12pt;"><o:p> </o:p></div> <div class="MsoNormal" style="font-size:12pt;"><span style="font-size:12.0pt">A lot depends on the purpose of the trust. Is it a trust established for a special needs beneficiary, for annual gift exclusion transfers, or something else?<o:p></o:p></span></div> <div class="MsoNormal" style="font-size:12pt;"><span style="font-size:12.0pt"><o:p> </o:p></span></div> <div class="MsoNormal" style="font-size:12pt;"><span style="font-size:12.0pt">The language you describe will work to make it irrevocable, but sometimes there is a need to include specific authority to modify to account for changes in the law.<o:p></o:p></span></div> <div class="MsoNormal" style="font-size:12pt;"><span style="font-size:12.0pt"><o:p> </o:p></span></div> <div class="MsoNormal" style="font-size:12pt;"><span style="font-size:12.0pt">Heather<o:p></o:p></span></div> <div class="MsoNormal" style="font-size:12pt;"><span style="font-size:12.0pt"><o:p> </o:p></span></div> <div> <div class="MsoNormal" style="font-size:12pt;"><span style="font-size:16.0pt;font-family:"Vladimir Script";color:#1F497D">Heather S. de Vrieze</span><b><span style="font-size:16.0pt;color:#1F497D"><br> </span></b><i><span style="font-family:"Garamond",serif;color:#1F497D">Attorney-at-Law<o:p></o:p></span></i></div> <div class="MsoNormal" style="font-size:12pt;"><i style="mso-bidi-font-style:normal"><span style="font-family:"Garamond",serif;color:#1F497D;mso-no-proof:yes"><img border="0" width="189" height="105" id="Picture_x0020_3" src="cid:image001.jpg@01D6D4A0.991897F0" wbeuser="michael@westseattleattorney.com"></span></i><i><span style="font-size:12.0pt;font-family:"Garamond",serif;color:#1F497D"><o:p></o:p></span></i></div> <div class="MsoNormal" style="font-size:12pt;"><span style="font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Nyala;color:#44524E">3909 California Avenue SW<o:p></o:p></span></div> <div class="MsoNormal" style="font-size:12pt;"><span style="font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Nyala;color:#44524E">Seattle, WA 98116-3705 <o:p></o:p></span></div> <div class="MsoNormal" style="font-size:12pt;"><span style="font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Nyala;color:#44524E">(206)938-5500 <o:p></o:p></span></div> <div class="MsoNormal" style="font-size:12pt;"><a target="_blank" href="mailto:heatherd@westseattlelaw.com"><span style="font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Nyala;color:#44524E">heatherd@westseattlelaw.com</span></a><span style="font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Nyala;color:#44524E"> <o:p></o:p></span></div> <div class="MsoNormal" style="font-size:12pt;"><a target="_blank" href="http://www.westseattlelaw.com/"><span style="font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Nyala;color:#44524E">www.westseattlelaw.com</span></a><span style="font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Nyala;color:#44524E"> <o:p></o:p></span></div> <div class="MsoNormal" style="font-size:12pt;"><b><span style="font-size:9.0pt;font-family:"Arial",sans-serif;color:#002E8A">Click here to connect with de Vrieze | Carney on Facebook: </span><span style="color:#1F497D"> </span></b><a target="_blank" href="https://www.facebook.com/DeVriezeCarney"><b style="mso-bidi-font-weight:normal"><span style="color:blue;mso-no-proof:yes;text-decoration:none;text-underline:none"><img border="0" width="72" height="21" id="Picture_x0020_2" src="cid:image002.png@01D6D4A0.991897F0" alt="FB Logo" wbeuser="michael@westseattleattorney.com"></span></b></a><o:p></o:p></div> <div class="MsoNormal" style="font-size:12pt;"><span style="font-size:8.0pt;color:#A6A6A6"><o:p> </o:p></span></div> <div class="MsoNormal" style="font-size:12pt;"><span style="font-size:12.0pt;font-family:Nyala;color:#C00000">For your planning, our office will be closed December 24, 25 and 31 and January 1.<o:p></o:p></span></div> <div class="MsoNormal" style="font-size:12pt;"><span style="font-size:12.0pt;font-family:Nyala;color:#C00000"><o:p> </o:p></span></div> <div class="MsoNormal" style="font-size:12pt;"><span style="font-family:Nyala;color:#C00000">For the latest information regarding firm operations and precautions in light of the Coronavirus please visit our firm’s website:</span><span style="font-family:Nyala;color:red"> </span><span style="font-family:Nyala"><a target="_blank" href="http://www.westseattlelaw.com/"><span style="color:blue">www.WestSeattleLaw.com</span></a><span style="color:#C00000">.</span><span style="color:red"><o:p></o:p></span></span></div> <div class="MsoNormal" style="font-size:12pt;"><span style="font-size:8.0pt;color:#7030A0"><o:p> </o:p></span></div> <div class="MsoNormal" style="font-size:12pt;"><span style="font-size:8.0pt;color:#A6A6A6"><o:p> </o:p></span></div> <div class="MsoNormal" style="font-size:12pt;"><span style="font-size:8.0pt;color:#A6A6A6">CONFIDENTIAL & PRIVILEGED. This e-mail message may contain legally privileged and/or confidential information. If you have received this e-mail in error, please notify the sender immediately and delete all copies of this e-mail message and any attachment.</span><span style="font-size:16.0pt;font-family:"Cambria",serif;color:blue"><o:p></o:p></span></div> </div> <div class="MsoNormal" style="font-size:12pt;"><span style="font-size:12.0pt"><o:p> </o:p></span></div> <div> <div style="border:none;border-top:solid #E1E1E1 1.0pt;padding:3.0pt 0in 0in 0in"> <div class="MsoNormal" style="font-size:12pt;mso-outline-level:1"><b>From:</b> <a target="_blank" href="mailto:wsbapt-bounces@lists.wsbarppt.com"> wsbapt-bounces@lists.wsbarppt.com</a> <<a target="_blank" href="mailto:wsbapt-bounces@lists.wsbarppt.com">wsbapt-bounces@lists.wsbarppt.com</a>> <b>On Behalf Of </b><a target="_blank" href="mailto:michael@westseattleattorney.com">michael@westseattleattorney.com</a><br> <b>Sent:</b> Thursday, December 17, 2020 3:54 PM<br> <b>To:</b> WSBA Probate & Trust Listserve <<a target="_blank" href="mailto:wsbapt@lists.wsbarppt.com">wsbapt@lists.wsbarppt.com</a>><br> <b>Subject:</b> [WSBAPT] Irrevocable Trusts<o:p></o:p></div> </div> </div> <div class="MsoNormal" style="font-size:12pt;"><o:p> </o:p></div> <div> <div class="MsoNormal" style="font-size:12pt;"><span style="font-size:12.0pt;font-family:"Times New Roman",serif;color:black">Its been a while since I was asked to do a irrevocable trust. It seems that the primary provision is as follows: <o:p></o:p></span></div> </div> <div> <div class="MsoNormal" style="font-size:12pt;"><span style="font-size:12.0pt;font-family:"Times New Roman",serif;color:black"><o:p> </o:p></span></div> </div> <div> <div class="MsoNormal" style="font-size:12pt;"><span style="font-size:12.0pt;font-family:"Times New Roman",serif;color:black">The Trust shall be irrevocable, and the Trustor hereby </span><span style="font-size:9.0pt;font-family:"Times New Roman",serif;color:black">expressly relinquishes any right or power, whether along or in conjunction with others, in whatever capacity, to alter, amend, revoke, or terminate the Trust, or any of the terms of this Agreement, in whole or in part, or to designate the persons who shall possess or enjoy the trust property, or the income therefrom. By this instrument, the Trustor intends to and does hereby relinquish absolutely and forever all possession.</span><span style="font-size:12.0pt;font-family:"Times New Roman",serif;color:black"><o:p></o:p></span></div> </div> <div> <div class="MsoNormal" style="font-size:12pt;"><span style="font-size:12.0pt;font-family:"Times New Roman",serif;color:black"><o:p> </o:p></span></div> </div> <div> <div class="MsoNormal" style="font-size:12pt;"><span style="font-size:9.0pt;font-family:"Times New Roman",serif;color:black">Is that sufficient to create the Trust? Are there any other differences between it and a RLT? Any CLEs one could point me to as to "irrevocable trusts" so I can get up to speed? </span><span style="font-size:12.0pt;font-family:"Times New Roman",serif;color:black"><o:p></o:p></span></div> </div> <div> <div class="MsoNormal" style="font-size:12pt;"><span style="font-size:12.0pt;font-family:"Times New Roman",serif;color:black"><o:p> </o:p></span></div> </div> <div> <div class="MsoNormal" style="font-size:12pt;"><span style="font-size:9.0pt;font-family:"Times New Roman",serif;color:black">Thanks</span><span style="font-size:12.0pt;font-family:"Times New Roman",serif;color:black"><o:p></o:p></span></div> </div> <div> <div class="MsoNormal" style="font-size:12pt;"><span style="font-size:9.0pt;font-family:"Times New Roman",serif;color:black">Mike </span><span style="font-size:12.0pt;font-family:"Times New Roman",serif;color:black"><o:p></o:p></span></div> </div> <div> <div class="MsoNormal" style="font-size:12pt;"><span style="font-size:12.0pt;font-family:"Times New Roman",serif;color:black"><o:p> </o:p></span></div> </div> <div> <div class="MsoNormal" style="font-size:12pt;"><span style="font-size:12.0pt;font-family:"Times New Roman",serif;color:black"><o:p> </o:p></span></div> </div> <div> <div class="MsoNormal" style="font-size:12pt;"><span style="font-size:12.0pt;font-family:"Times New Roman",serif;color:black"><o:p> </o:p></span></div> </div> <div> <div class="MsoNormal" style="font-size:12pt;"><span style="font-size:12.0pt;font-family:"Times New Roman",serif;color:black;mso-no-proof:yes"><img border="0" width="500" height="100" id="sigimg0" src="cid:image006.png@01D6D4A0.6F1D5EE0" wbeuser="michael@westseattleattorney.com"></span><span style="font-size:12.0pt;font-family:"Times New Roman",serif;color:black"><o:p></o:p></span></div> </div> </div> <hr>***Disclaimer: Please note that RPPT listserv participation is not restricted to practicing attorneys and may include non-practicing attorneys, law students, professionals working in related fields, and others.***<br>
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