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<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:12.0pt;font-family:"Times New Roman",serif">Definitely agreed, and don’t see the harm in making this easy on everyone looking at the deed 10-20 years later. (We are often the ones trying to make sense of 30 year old
deeds, remember.) <o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:12.0pt;font-family:"Times New Roman",serif"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:12.0pt;font-family:"Times New Roman",serif">I reference the will date, because I want a person looking at it years later to know the will they “find” and refer to is the correct one, and the easiest/most sure way
is by reference to the date on the will itself, not its date of probate, etc. The date of death can be found elsewhere if ever relevant (in the probate record, etc.). So here is what I just used recently after conferring with title company and county assessor,
and I would use same on the Washington side of the river here, too:<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:12.0pt;font-family:"Times New Roman",serif"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:12.0pt;font-family:"Times New Roman",serif">. . . FIRST M. LAST, trustee, or his successor in interest, of the FIRST LAST TRUST created under the Last Will and Testament of First M. Last dated December 21, 2016, and
admitted to probate by an order dated January 21, 2020 in Case No. CV35-19-2063 in the District Court of the Second Judicial District of the State of Idaho in and for the County of Nez Perce . . .<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:12.0pt;font-family:"Times New Roman",serif"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:12.0pt;font-family:"Times New Roman",serif">For obtaining EIN and naming bank accounts, I have no problem with simply FIRST LAST TRUST, but I also do a simple trust certification for the trustee to sign that recites
the facts and makes it easy for everyone, even attaching excerpts of the will containing trust provisions as exhibit to certification if helpful to a bank or other third party we’re doing business with.<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:12.0pt;font-family:"Times New Roman",serif"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:12.0pt;font-family:"Times New Roman",serif">Best, Josh<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:12.0pt;font-family:"Times New Roman",serif"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:12.0pt;font-family:"Times New Roman",serif">Joshua D. McKarcher<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:12.0pt;font-family:"Times New Roman",serif">McKarcher Law PLLC<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:12.0pt;font-family:"Times New Roman",serif">537 6th Street<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:12.0pt;font-family:"Times New Roman",serif">Clarkston, WA 99403<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:12.0pt;font-family:"Times New Roman",serif">(509) 758-3345<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:12.0pt;font-family:"Times New Roman",serif">(509) 758-3314 (fax)<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:12.0pt;font-family:"Times New Roman",serif"><a href="mailto:josh@mckarcherlaw.com">josh@mckarcherlaw.com</a><o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:12.0pt;font-family:"Times New Roman",serif"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><b>From:</b> wsbapt-bounces@lists.wsbarppt.com <wsbapt-bounces@lists.wsbarppt.com>
<b>On Behalf Of </b>Philip N. Jones<br>
<b>Sent:</b> Wednesday, November 25, 2020 4:47 PM<br>
<b>To:</b> WSBA Probate & Trust Listserv <wsbapt@lists.wsbarppt.com><br>
<b>Subject:</b> Re: [WSBAPT] Date Needed for Testamentary Trust?<o:p></o:p></p>
</div>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><o:p> </o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:14.0pt;font-family:"Times New Roman",serif">I vote with Heather. The deed should tell the full story.<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:14.0pt;font-family:"Times New Roman",serif">Phil Jones<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:14.0pt;font-family:"Times New Roman",serif"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:14.0pt;font-family:"Times New Roman",serif">Philip N. Jones<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:14.0pt;font-family:"Times New Roman",serif">Duffy Kekel LLP<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:14.0pt;font-family:"Times New Roman",serif">900 S.W. Fifth Ave. Suite 2500<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:14.0pt;font-family:"Times New Roman",serif">Portland, OR 97204<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:14.0pt;font-family:"Times New Roman",serif"><a href="mailto:pjones@duffykekel.com">pjones@duffykekel.com</a><o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:14.0pt;font-family:"Times New Roman",serif">(503) 226-1371 – office<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:14.0pt;font-family:"Times New Roman",serif">(503) 853-1482 – cell<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:14.0pt;font-family:"Times New Roman",serif">(503) 226-3574 - fax<o:p></o:p></span></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:14.0pt;font-family:"Times New Roman",serif"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><b>From:</b> <a href="mailto:wsbapt-bounces@lists.wsbarppt.com">
wsbapt-bounces@lists.wsbarppt.com</a> <<a href="mailto:wsbapt-bounces@lists.wsbarppt.com">wsbapt-bounces@lists.wsbarppt.com</a>>
<b>On Behalf Of </b>Heather de Vrieze<br>
<b>Sent:</b> Wednesday, November 25, 2020 1:32 PM<br>
<b>To:</b> WSBA Probate & Trust Listserv <<a href="mailto:wsbapt@lists.wsbarppt.com">wsbapt@lists.wsbarppt.com</a>><br>
<b>Subject:</b> Re: [WSBAPT] Date Needed for Testamentary Trust?<o:p></o:p></p>
</div>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><o:p> </o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:12.0pt">I agree with what other folks have said about identifying that the trust was created under a will. I’ll add that if that will has been probated, I will usually reference the cause number as well. In fact anytime
I am deeding property out of an estate I will generally identify the Personal Representative, under authority granted by the court xx date and the cause number. This makes is super easy for the title company to look up the probate and find the order of solvency,
the order appointing Personal Representative, see if the estate is open or closed, and review the Will should they so choose.<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:12.0pt"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:12.0pt">Heather<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:12.0pt"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:16.0pt;font-family:"Vladimir Script";color:#1F497D">Heather S. de Vrieze</span><b><span style="font-size:16.0pt;color:#1F497D"><br>
</span></b><i><span style="font-family:"Garamond",serif;color:#1F497D">Attorney-at-Law<o:p></o:p></span></i></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><i><span style="font-family:"Garamond",serif;color:#1F497D"><img border="0" width="189" height="105" style="width:1.9687in;height:1.0937in" id="Picture_x0020_5" src="cid:image001.jpg@01D6C350.9F239E80"></span></i><i><span style="font-size:12.0pt;font-family:"Garamond",serif;color:#1F497D"><o:p></o:p></span></i></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Nyala;color:#44524E">3909 California Avenue SW<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Nyala;color:#44524E">Seattle, WA 98116-3705
<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Nyala;color:#44524E">(206)938-5500
<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><a href="mailto:heatherd@westseattlelaw.com"><span style="font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Nyala;color:#44524E">heatherd@westseattlelaw.com</span></a><span style="font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Nyala;color:#44524E">
<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><a href="http://www.westseattlelaw.com/"><span style="font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Nyala;color:#44524E">www.westseattlelaw.com</span></a><span style="font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Nyala;color:#44524E">
<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><b><span style="font-size:9.0pt;font-family:"Arial",sans-serif;color:#002E8A">Click here to connect with de Vrieze | Carney on Facebook:
</span><span style="color:#1F497D"> </span></b><a href="https://www.facebook.com/DeVriezeCarney"><b><span style="color:blue;text-decoration:none"><img border="0" width="72" height="21" style="width:.75in;height:.2187in" id="Picture_x0020_6" src="cid:image002.png@01D6C350.9F239E80" alt="FB Logo"></span></b></a><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:8.0pt;color:#A6A6A6"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="color:#C00000">For the latest information regarding firm operations and to see precautions we are taking in light of the Coronavirus crisis please visit our firm’s website,</span><span style="color:red">
</span><a href="http://www.WestSeattleLaw.com"><span style="color:blue">www.WestSeattleLaw.com</span></a><span style="color:#C00000">.</span><span style="color:red"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:10.0pt;color:#C0504D">If I am sick, I will stay home, I ask you to do the same.<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:8.0pt;color:#7030A0"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:12.0pt"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><b>From:</b> <a href="mailto:wsbapt-bounces@lists.wsbarppt.com">
wsbapt-bounces@lists.wsbarppt.com</a> <<a href="mailto:wsbapt-bounces@lists.wsbarppt.com">wsbapt-bounces@lists.wsbarppt.com</a>>
<b>On Behalf Of </b>Jane Bitz<br>
<b>Sent:</b> Wednesday, November 25, 2020 1:17 PM<br>
<b>To:</b> WSBA Probate & Trust Listserv <<a href="mailto:wsbapt@lists.wsbarppt.com">wsbapt@lists.wsbarppt.com</a>><br>
<b>Subject:</b> Re: [WSBAPT] Date Needed for Testamentary Trust?<o:p></o:p></p>
</div>
</div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><o:p> </o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:14.0pt">Thank you to all who weighed in on this. It is good to know the way I draft a deed can help to keep things orderly in the future.<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:14.0pt">Jane Bitz.<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:14.0pt"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
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<div style="border:none;border-top:solid #E1E1E1 1.0pt;padding:3.0pt 0in 0in 0in">
<p class="MsoNormal"><b>From:</b> <a href="mailto:wsbapt-bounces@lists.wsbarppt.com">
wsbapt-bounces@lists.wsbarppt.com</a> <<a href="mailto:wsbapt-bounces@lists.wsbarppt.com">wsbapt-bounces@lists.wsbarppt.com</a>>
<b>On Behalf Of </b>John McCrady<br>
<b>Sent:</b> Wednesday, November 25, 2020 12:50 PM<br>
<b>To:</b> WSBA Probate & Trust Listserv <<a href="mailto:wsbapt@lists.wsbarppt.com">wsbapt@lists.wsbarppt.com</a>><br>
<b>Subject:</b> Re: [WSBAPT] Date Needed for Testamentary Trust?<o:p></o:p></p>
</div>
</div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><o:p> </o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="color:#1F497D">I agree with Mr. Grant, except that I do prefer to see “under the will of…” since it helps identify the source of the trust.<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="color:#1F497D"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="color:#1F497D">John McCrady<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="color:#1F497D">Counsel<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="color:#1F497D">Puget Sound Title Company<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="color:#1F497D">5350 Orchard Street West<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="color:#1F497D">University Place WA 98467<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="color:#1F497D">253-476-5721<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="color:#1F497D"><a href="mailto:j.mccrady@pstitle.com">j.mccrady@pstitle.com</a><o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="margin-top:6.0pt"><b><span style="font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial",sans-serif;color:#1F497D">WARNING-FRAUDULENT FUNDING INSTRUCTIONS
</span></b><b><span style="font-size:4.0pt;font-family:"Arial",sans-serif;color:#1F497D"><o:p></o:p></span></b></p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="margin-top:6.0pt"><span style="font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial",sans-serif;color:#1F497D">Email hacking and fraud are on the rise to fraudulently misdirect funds. Please call your escrow officer immediately using contact information
found from an independent source, such as the sales contract or internet, to verify any funding instructions received. We are not responsible for any wire sent by you to an incorrect bank account.<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="color:#1F497D"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="margin-bottom:12.0pt"><span style="font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Verdana",sans-serif;color:#2E74B5">***Due to the Covid 19 outbreak and with concern for the health and safety of our employees and community; our
<b>University Place</b> lobby will remain locked during normal business hours. </span><b><span style="font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Verdana",sans-serif;color:#0066CC">If you need to make an appointment or have any questions or concerns, please contact us at
our main office at 253-474-4747.</span></b><span style="font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Verdana",sans-serif;color:#0070C0">
</span><span style="font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Verdana",sans-serif;color:#2E74B5">We appreciate your patience during these uncertain times and look forward to consistently exceeding your expectations.***<o:p></o:p></span></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="color:#1F497D"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><b>From:</b> <a href="mailto:wsbapt-bounces@lists.wsbarppt.com">
wsbapt-bounces@lists.wsbarppt.com</a> [<a href="mailto:wsbapt-bounces@lists.wsbarppt.com">mailto:wsbapt-bounces@lists.wsbarppt.com</a>]
<b>On Behalf Of </b>Josh Grant<br>
<b>Sent:</b> Wednesday, November 25, 2020 11:35 AM<br>
<b>To:</b> WSBA Probate & Trust Listserv <<a href="mailto:wsbapt@lists.wsbarppt.com">wsbapt@lists.wsbarppt.com</a>><br>
<b>Subject:</b> Re: [WSBAPT] Date Needed for Testamentary Trust?<o:p></o:p></p>
</div>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><o:p> </o:p></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:13.5pt;color:black">I think our title companies prefer “To ______ Trustee of the Jones Family Testamentary Trust ” and maybe add “under Will of _____” but I don’t. I believe a date is not needed for a testamentary
trust... probably for the reasons you state.</span><span style="font-size:14.0pt;color:black"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:13.5pt;color:black">Josh</span><span style="font-size:14.0pt;color:black"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:14.0pt;color:black"> <o:p></o:p></span></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><strong><span style="font-size:18.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:#004080">Joshua F. Grant</span></strong><span style="font-size:14.0pt;color:#004080"><br>
</span><span style="font-size:14.0pt;color:black"><img border="0" width="207" height="43" style="width:2.1562in;height:.4479in" id="_x0000_i1035" src="cid:image003.png@01D6C350.9F239E80" alt="advocates"></span><span style="font-size:14.0pt;color:black"><br>
</span><span style="color:#004080">P. O. Box 619<br>
Wilbur, WA 99185<br>
509 647 5578</span><span style="font-size:14.0pt;color:black"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Tahoma",sans-serif;color:black"> <o:p></o:p></span></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal" style="background:whitesmoke"><b><span style="font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Tahoma",sans-serif;color:black">From:</span></b><span style="font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Tahoma",sans-serif;color:black"> Jane Bitz
<o:p></o:p></span></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal" style="background:whitesmoke"><b><span style="font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Tahoma",sans-serif;color:black">Sent:</span></b><span style="font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Tahoma",sans-serif;color:black"> Wednesday, November 25, 2020 11:19 AM<o:p></o:p></span></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal" style="background:whitesmoke"><b><span style="font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Tahoma",sans-serif;color:black">To:</span></b><span style="font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Tahoma",sans-serif;color:black"> 'WSBA Probate & Trust Listserv'
<o:p></o:p></span></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal" style="background:whitesmoke"><b><span style="font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Tahoma",sans-serif;color:black">Subject:</span></b><span style="font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Tahoma",sans-serif;color:black"> [WSBAPT] Date Needed for Testamentary
Trust?<o:p></o:p></span></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:12.0pt;color:black"> <o:p></o:p></span></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:14.0pt;color:black">I am attorney for an estate where a testamentary trust is set up for grandchildren of the decedent. We are funding the Trust from the Estate and I am drafting a Deed of estate real property from
the PR to the Trustee of the Trust. Ordinarily the grant would be: “To the Trustee of the Jones Family Trust dated ________.”
<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="color:black"> </span><span style="font-size:14.0pt;color:black"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:14.0pt;color:black">Do I have to use a date for this testamentary Trust? And if yes, do I use the Grantor’s Date of Death or the date that the Will was signed or other date?<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="color:black"> </span><span style="font-size:14.0pt;color:black"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:14.0pt;color:black">What would be the best practice here?<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="color:black"> </span><span style="font-size:14.0pt;color:black"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:14.0pt;color:black">Thanks.<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:14.0pt;color:black">Jane.<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="color:black"> </span><span style="font-size:14.0pt;color:black"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="color:black">Jane G. Bitz<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="color:black">Of Counsel<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="color:black">Wolff, Hislop & Crockett, PLLC<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="color:black">12209 E. Mission Ave, Suite 5<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="color:black">Spokane Valley, WA 99206-4824<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="color:black">(509) 927-9700 x126<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="color:black">FAX: (509) 777-1800<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="color:black"> <o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:12.0pt;font-family:"Times New Roman",serif;color:#1F497D"><img border="0" width="191" height="96" style="width:1.9895in;height:1.0in" id="Picture_x0020_1" src="cid:image004.jpg@01D6C350.9F239E80" alt="image001 (4)"></span><span style="color:black"><img border="0" width="115" height="100" style="width:1.1979in;height:1.0416in" id="Picture_x0020_2" src="cid:image005.png@01D6C350.9F239E80"><img border="0" width="273" height="96" style="width:2.8437in;height:1.0in" id="Picture_x0020_3" src="cid:image006.jpg@01D6C350.9F239E80"></span><span style="color:black"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
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