[WSBAPT] Naming a testamentary trust as beneficiary of non-probate

Wed Aug 16 12:11:46 PDT 2023

I name the trust in the Will: e.g.  "Jane Doe Children's Trust". 

Karen L. Cobb
Attorney at Law

(206) 486-8003

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Today's Topics:

   1. Re: Naming a testamentary trust as beneficiary of non-probate
      asset (Laura Latta)
   2. Re: Naming a testamentary trust as beneficiary of non-probate
      asset (Heather de Vrieze)
   3. Will Search - Linda Cristine Baker (Brent Williams-Ruth)
   4. Power of Appointment Equal To a Bequest in a Will?
      (Paul Neumiller)
   5. Re: Power of Appointment Equal To a Bequest in a Will?
      (Diane J. Kiepe)

----------------------------------------------------------------------

Message: 1
Date: Tue, 15 Aug 2023 13:41:28 -0700
From: Laura Latta <laura at lauralatta.com>
To: "WSBA Probate & Trust Listserv" <wsbapt at lists.wsbarppt.com>
Subject: Re: [WSBAPT] Naming a testamentary trust as beneficiary of
	non-probate asset
Message-ID:
	<CAFBiugzz1OzApZpnSHREAWe5AooyCRdWGGp9LJ2Vv7=1fgA6ZQ at mail.gmail.com>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8"

Listmates,
Tagging on to this prior discussion, I have often provided similar recommended language to that many of you suggested below (Trustee of the Children's Trust created by my last will and testament dated ...), but just recently am getting feedback from clients that the online forms won't allow for such long beneficiary designations. Do you have any suggestions for a) shorter designations; or b) workarounds (other than requesting a paper beneficiary designation form)?
I appreciate your thoughts and experience.
Warmly,
Laura

*Laura LattaLaw Office of Laura Latta PLLC*

she/her

Phone (206) 841-2344

https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=http-3A__www.LauraLatta.com&d=DwICAg&c=euGZstcaTDllvimEN8b7jXrwqOf-v5A_CdpgnVfiiMM&r=oN3JkEDGkupTWuVes3l0RZhfKP4xFyO5dcDA8kNgBps&m=tBJJdk9q8pvseDZWIazqTH0H7pfJX4DO7VYE8qzJDNQ_qA8K5mWgoZRvVEBfS6Pq&s=Ja-XniRZb8XsG2msUFjRrWLg8rcz0Ilj02n_33RRbnc&e=

4010 Lake Washington Blvd. NE Ste. 202

Kirkland, WA 98033

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On Wed, Apr 19, 2023 at 10:03?AM Jon Fritzler <FritzlerLaw at outlook.com>
wrote:

> Client?s Will provides for the share of a beneficiary be held in trust 
> for the beneficiary.  Client wants to name the trust as a beneficiary 
> of non-probate asset.  I advised client to use the following language 
> for the beneficiary designation: ?[Name of trustee] or his successor 
> as Trustee of the Trust created under section 3.1(a) of my Will dated ______, 2023.?
> Client?s financial advisor replied:  ?Do you have the legal name of 
> the trust?  We can list that as an entity in the beneficiary section 
> of the account.?
>
>
>
> Thoughts on how to reply?  Mine is to explain that it is testamentary 
> trust that doesn?t come into existence until client?s death and that 
> is not assigned a ?legal name? until that time.
>
>
>
> Sincerely,
> Jon M. Fritzler
> Attorney at Law
> 717 E. 22nd St.
> Vancouver, WA 98663
> Tel. 360.818.4431
> Eml fritzlerlaw at outlook.com
>
>
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------------------------------

Message: 2
Date: Tue, 15 Aug 2023 21:05:37 +0000
From: Heather de Vrieze <heatherd at westseattlelaw.com>
To: WSBA Probate & Trust Listserv <wsbapt at lists.wsbarppt.com>
Subject: Re: [WSBAPT] Naming a testamentary trust as beneficiary of
	non-probate asset
Message-ID:
	<MW3PR22MB2107A6C95F24B42B242C2A3CA714A at MW3PR22MB2107.namprd22.prod.outlook.com>

Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8"

Short answer . . .  NOPE. A few institutions have the option to check a box for ?testamentary trust? and then to include some information to identify (beneficiary of trust, date of will, etc.) but most require paper forms and writing over their ?first, middle, and last? or writing in ?see attached?.

Heather

Heather S. de Vrieze
Attorney-at-Law
[cid:image001.jpg at 01D9CF81.8F612720]
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From: wsbapt-bounces at lists.wsbarppt.com <wsbapt-bounces at lists.wsbarppt.com> On Behalf Of Laura Latta
Sent: Tuesday, August 15, 2023 1:41 PM
To: WSBA Probate & Trust Listserv <wsbapt at lists.wsbarppt.com>
Subject: Re: [WSBAPT] Naming a testamentary trust as beneficiary of non-probate asset

Listmates,
Tagging on to this prior discussion, I have often provided similar recommended language to that many of you suggested below (Trustee of the Children's Trust created by my last will and testament dated ...), but just recently am getting feedback from clients that the online forms won't allow for such long beneficiary designations. Do you have any suggestions for a) shorter designations; or b) workarounds (other than requesting a paper beneficiary designation form)?
I appreciate your thoughts and experience.
Warmly,
Laura
Laura Latta
Law Office of Laura Latta PLLC
she/her

Phone (206) 841-2344
https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=http-3A__www.LauraLatta.com&d=DwICAg&c=euGZstcaTDllvimEN8b7jXrwqOf-v5A_CdpgnVfiiMM&r=oN3JkEDGkupTWuVes3l0RZhfKP4xFyO5dcDA8kNgBps&m=tBJJdk9q8pvseDZWIazqTH0H7pfJX4DO7VYE8qzJDNQ_qA8K5mWgoZRvVEBfS6Pq&s=Ja-XniRZb8XsG2msUFjRrWLg8rcz0Ilj02n_33RRbnc&e=<https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=http-3A__www.LauraLatta.com&d=DwICAg&c=euGZstcaTDllvimEN8b7jXrwqOf-v5A_CdpgnVfiiMM&r=oN3JkEDGkupTWuVes3l0RZhfKP4xFyO5dcDA8kNgBps&m=tBJJdk9q8pvseDZWIazqTH0H7pfJX4DO7VYE8qzJDNQ_qA8K5mWgoZRvVEBfS6Pq&s=Ja-XniRZb8XsG2msUFjRrWLg8rcz0Ilj02n_33RRbnc&e=>

4010 Lake Washington Blvd. NE Ste. 202

Kirkland, WA 98033

NOTICE:  This communication may contain privileged or other confidential information. If you have received it in error, please advise the sender by replying to this email and immediately delete the message and any attachments without copying it or disclosing its contents to others.

On Wed, Apr 19, 2023 at 10:03?AM Jon Fritzler <FritzlerLaw at outlook.com<mailto:FritzlerLaw at outlook.com>> wrote:
Client?s Will provides for the share of a beneficiary be held in trust for the beneficiary.  Client wants to name the trust as a beneficiary of non-probate asset.  I advised client to use the following language for the beneficiary designation: ?[Name of trustee] or his successor as Trustee of the Trust created under section 3.1(a) of my Will dated ______, 2023.?  Client?s financial advisor replied:  ?Do you have the legal name of the trust?  We can list that as an entity in the beneficiary section of the account.?

Thoughts on how to reply?  Mine is to explain that it is testamentary trust that doesn?t come into existence until client?s death and that is not assigned a ?legal name? until that time.

Sincerely,
Jon M. Fritzler
Attorney at Law
717 E. 22nd St.
Vancouver, WA 98663
Tel. 360.818.4431
Eml fritzlerlaw at outlook.com<mailto:fritzlerlaw at outlook.com>

***Disclaimer: Please note that RPPT listserv participation is not restricted to practicing attorneys and may include non-practicing attorneys, law students, professionals working in related fields, and others.*** _______________________________________________
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------------------------------

Message: 3
Date: Tue, 15 Aug 2023 14:31:38 -0700
From: Brent Williams-Ruth <brent at williams-ruthlaw.com>
To: "WSBA Probate & Trust Listserv" <WSBAPT at lists.wsbarppt.com>
Subject: [WSBAPT] Will Search - Linda Cristine Baker
Message-ID:
	<CAMMb1JNmx68KpBLgLxrygMfQbrgbyKbNM8wKrU5QFrW-SzVQqA at mail.gmail.com>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8"

Looking for the Will for Linda Cristine Baker.....she was a resident of Pierce County when created but since moved and passed in Arizona.

*Brent Williams-Ruth* (pronouns: he/him)
*Attorney-At-Law*

*Law Offices of Brent Williams-Ruth, **a division of BWR Consulting, PLLC*

*Physical Address: 500 S 336th Street, Suite 214; Federal Way, WA 98003*

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------------------------------

Message: 4
Date: Tue, 15 Aug 2023 22:49:05 +0000
From: Paul Neumiller <pneumiller at hotmail.com>
To: WSBA Probate & Trust Listserv <wsbapt at lists.wsbarppt.com>
Subject: [WSBAPT] Power of Appointment Equal To a Bequest in a Will?
Message-ID:
	<MW3PR13MB3980B2B217C074CE1E4DA747D214A at MW3PR13MB3980.namprd13.prod.outlook.com>

Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"

Listmates, a client's (aka surviving spouse) CA trust says:  "On the surviving spouse's death, if and to the extent that the surviving spouse shall not have effectively disposed of all the property of the trust estate through a valid and effective exercise of a power of appointment," all trust assets go to children of a previous marriage.  The client now wants some of the trust assets go to his new wife (whom the children from a previous marriage despise).  The surviving spouse has an existing typical "pour-over" Will where everything defaults to the distribution in the Trust.  It seems like a square peg into a round hole.  How do I prepare a new Will and give the new wife a portion of the trust assets and do it "effectively...through a valid and effective exercise of a power of appointment."

[cid:image001.jpg at 01D9CF8F.02B06D50]

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------------------------------

Message: 5
Date: Tue, 15 Aug 2023 23:17:37 +0000
From: "Diane J. Kiepe" <DJKiepe at depdslaw.com>
To: WSBA Probate & Trust Listserv <wsbapt at lists.wsbarppt.com>
Subject: Re: [WSBAPT] Power of Appointment Equal To a Bequest in a
	Will?
Message-ID:
	<MW3PR18MB357930822C010DA15F7CA6F0D514A at MW3PR18MB3579.namprd18.prod.outlook.com>

Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"

Paul, there should be a paragraph in the CA Trust that specifically spells out how one exercises a power of appointment - typically the are testamentary in nature and often times limited to descendants of the first to die in any event.

I have assisted in the exercise of limited powers of appointment and would glad to help you late next week if your matter is not time sensitive.

Diane J. Kiepe
Douglas Eden, P.S.
717 W. Sprague Ave., Suite 1500
Spokane, WA  99201
djkiepe at depdslaw.com<mailto:djkiepe at depdslaw.com>
509-455-5300

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From: wsbapt-bounces at lists.wsbarppt.com <wsbapt-bounces at lists.wsbarppt.com> On Behalf Of Paul Neumiller
Sent: Tuesday, August 15, 2023 3:49 PM
To: WSBA Probate & Trust Listserv <wsbapt at lists.wsbarppt.com>
Subject: [WSBAPT] Power of Appointment Equal To a Bequest in a Will?

Listmates, a client's (aka surviving spouse) CA trust says:  "On the surviving spouse's death, if and to the extent that the surviving spouse shall not have effectively disposed of all the property of the trust estate through a valid and effective exercise of a power of appointment," all trust assets go to children of a previous marriage.  The client now wants some of the trust assets go to his new wife (whom the children from a previous marriage despise).  The surviving spouse has an existing typical "pour-over" Will where everything defaults to the distribution in the Trust.  It seems like a square peg into a round hole.  How do I prepare a new Will and give the new wife a portion of the trust assets and do it "effectively...through a valid and effective exercise of a power of appointment."

[cid:image001.jpg at 01D9CF93.C044D960]

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End of WSBAPT Digest, Vol 107, Issue 18
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