[WSBAPT] Opening a Probate where there may be a committed intimate relationship and community property claims

Thu Mar 17 06:50:59 PDT 2022

I understand the issue about ownership of assets.  I will let you know how this works as I am bringing an ejectment action to remove the CIR who paid nothing for the house (it was inherited by the decedent) but is claiming it and the contents.  He refuses to talk and in fact called the police on the PR.   The communication issue works both ways!

Jeff

W. Jeff Davis

BELL & DAVIS PLLC
P.O. Box 510

720 E. Washington Street, Suite 105
Sequim WA 98382
Phone: (360) 683.1129 
Fax: (360) 683.1258 
email:  <mailto:jeff at bellanddavispllc.com> jeff at bellanddavispllc.com
 <http://www.bellanddavispllc.com/> www.bellanddavispllc.com

The information contained in this e-mail message may be privileged, confidential, and protected from disclosure. If you are not the intended recipient, any dissemination, distribution, or copying is strictly prohibited. If you think that you have received this e-mail message in error, please e-mail the sender at  <mailto:info at bellanddavispllc.com> info at bellanddavispllc.com  or call 360.683.1129.

From: wsbapt-bounces at lists.wsbarppt.com <wsbapt-bounces at lists.wsbarppt.com> On Behalf Of Eric Nelsen
Sent: Wednesday, March 16, 2022 4:37 PM
To: WSBA Probate & Trust Listserv <wsbapt at lists.wsbarppt.com>
Subject: Re: [WSBAPT] Opening a Probate where there may be a committed intimate relationship and community property claims

Definitely agree with Carmen.

Sincerely,

Eric

Eric C. Nelsen

Sayre Law Offices, PLLC

1417 31st Ave South

Seattle WA 98144-3909

206-625-0092

 <mailto:eric at sayrelawoffices.com> eric at sayrelawoffices.com

Covid-19 Update - All attorneys are working remotely during regular business hours and are available via email and by phone. Videoconferencing also is available. Signing of estate planning documents can be completed and will be handled on a case-by-case basis. Please direct mail and deliveries to the Seattle office.

From: wsbapt-bounces at lists.wsbarppt.com <wsbapt-bounces at lists.wsbarppt.com> On Behalf Of Carmen Rowe
Sent: Wednesday, March 16, 2022 4:18 PM
To: wsbapt at lists.wsbarppt.com
Subject: Re: [WSBAPT] Opening a Probate where there may be a committed intimate relationship and community property claims

Responding to Eric's post below & others' comments regarding CIR rights (or, not) as an heir, I will add one thought:

In addition to some of the niceties of communication that Eric mentions going a long way towards avoiding a fight, the assets discussion is what squarely comes within the probate issue. The personal representative is going to have to ascertain what is - or may not be - the decedent's assets at the home and in that process these issues have a direct bearing if there were assets acquired during any CIR, any belongings that may be hers, or improvements she may have made to the property, etc.

So communication is SUPER huge in that you are walking a fine line in not suggesting she inherits, but at the same time, there is a duty to be sure you are resolving issues of asset ownership without creating a claim by the ex-spouse that you got rid of/sold/gave to a family member something that was entirely or partially hers, whether because she brought it with her, paid for it, says was a gift to her, or a CIR-flavored claim. And obviously the more that's done cooperatively the better. 

I suspect since she was living there that she still is? so you'll likely go through most of these issues as she moves out and so you'll be facing this out of the gate. Which is its own delicate situation, you really want someone inventorying what's there as soon as possible after the death/she starts packing up, and making sure you track what she takes or intends to take. It's decidedly awkward as you don't want to seem unkind or unsympathetic to her loss either, but bottom line is you simply have to watch what is happening and find hopefully some cooperative way to do it and be prepared to approach issues of possible assets that there is a question over who really owned it/had rights to it.

Carmen Rowe, Attorney/Owner

Phone: (360) 669-3576 (direct cell)

Email:  Carmen at GryphonLawGroup.com <mailto:Carmen at GryphonLawGroup.com> 

Olympia/Lacey and primary mailing office:

1415 College Street SE, Lacey, WA 98503

Seattle office: 2611 NE 113th St. Suite 300, Seattle, WA 98125

NOTICE REGARDING OPERATIONS AND COVID-19: We see our community as working together to address COVID and its impact on our lives, health, and business. The nature of our practice lends itself well to virtual operation and we offer a range of flexible solutions to best work with your needs and preferences. For issues requiring physical presence we will work with you on applicable guidelines. We are here to support you. 

Privileged and confidential: This message is confidential. If you receive this message in error, please let us know, and please delete and disregard any information it contains. We thank you for your respect in not sharing this email with anyone.  

If we are communicating with you regarding a debt or monies owed, THIS MAY BE AN ATTEMPT TO COLLECT A DEBT, AND ANY INFORMATION WILL BE USED FOR THAT PURPOSE. You have the right to seek legal advice from an attorney. To the extent that the Federal Fair Debt Collection Practices Act applies, this firm is acting as a debt collector for the firm's client named above. Any information obtained will be used for collection purposes.

****

Date: Wed, 16 Mar 2022 16:53:00 +0000

From: Eric Nelsen <eric at sayrelawoffices.com <mailto:eric at sayrelawoffices.com> >
To: WSBA Probate & Trust Listserv <wsbapt at lists.wsbarppt.com <mailto:wsbapt at lists.wsbarppt.com> >

Subject: Re: [WSBAPT] Opening a Probate where there may be a    committed
        intimate        relationship and community property claims
Message-ID:
        <098D0346993E6A48B0D5F184C0AB002E8EA35E at SBS2011.sayrelawoffices.local <mailto:098D0346993E6A48B0D5F184C0AB002E8EA35E at SBS2011.sayrelawoffices.local> >
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"

I agree with Jeff-same analysis. A CIR just doesn't rise to the level of a legal marriage, in the context of a probate, and case law is clear it has no rights derived from probate and inheritance statutes. By definition a CIR is not inheritance of any kind; it is an equitable claim to part ownership of assets accumulated during the relationship, and it can only be pursued by a lawsuit against the Estate.

So from a procedural standpoint the estate should ignore the CIR partner. That said, I'd talk with the PR about how to handle it. A little bit of friendly communication at the outset, courtesy copies of some paperwork, accommodation of their own grief and fears about the future, can go a long way toward avoiding a fight.

But be very careful and work through the implications before conceding that a CIR existed. Better to acknowledge the validity of their relationship and the reality of their loss, without getting into whether it really qualified as a CIR that would entitle them to an equitable division of assets accumulated during their post-divorce cohabitation.

Sincerely,

Eric

Eric C. Nelsen
Sayre Law Offices, PLLC
1417 31st Ave South
Seattle WA 98144-3909
206-625-0092
eric at sayrelawoffices.com <mailto:eric at sayrelawoffices.com> <mailto:eric at sayrelawoffices.com <mailto:eric at sayrelawoffices.com> >

-------------- next part --------------
An HTML attachment was scrubbed...
URL: <http://mailman.fsr.com/pipermail/wsbapt/attachments/20220317/ef6ea09d/attachment.html>
-------------- next part --------------
A non-text attachment was scrubbed...
Name: image002.jpg
Type: image/jpeg
Size: 500 bytes
Desc: not available
URL: <http://mailman.fsr.com/pipermail/wsbapt/attachments/20220317/ef6ea09d/image002.jpg>