[WSBAPT] RLT question (David King)
Kim Hammit
kim at gsjoneslaw.com
Tue Sep 25 12:21:50 PDT 2018
Thank you Marvin and David, - David, to answer your question as to who holds
interest in the LLC and Inc., it is both the husband and wife. I read your
message to mean that it makes sense to do away with the RLT and just do a
new will dividing property as they wish?
Or are you saying they would have to own the LLC/Inc. interests as "Trustees
of the ABC Trust" rather than individually as they do now? That seems like
more unnecessary work and I'm not understanding what benefit they would gain
from that.
I certainly don't want to imply the prior attorney did anything wrong here
but I cannot wrap my head around the way it was done and the clients are
clueless - they just know they don't understand it.
Kim
Message: 10
Date: Tue, 25 Sep 2018 10:35:52 -0700
From: Marvin Benson <marvinbensonlaw at gmail.com>
To: "WSBA Probate & Trust Listserv" <wsbapt at lists.wsbarppt.com>
Subject: Re: [WSBAPT] RLT question
Message-ID:
<CACodssrjGhMSRkDSFVHAUA5RyEM_ZmpDdSok6A24iLYrsY9DYw at mail.gmail.com>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8"
I also do not see that the RLT is doing them any good with properties
outside the trust. Since they are not interested in probate avoidance, it
might be better to redo the will so it is not a pour over will.
Marvin Benson
On Tue, Sep 25, 2018 at 10:22 AM Kim Hammit <kim at gsjoneslaw.com> wrote:
> I was presented with an estate package that clients want to revise.
> There is a RLT, pour over will, reciprocal POA, separate general
> durable POA (not sure why separate), HC Directives. They have several
> properties ? some are in LLC, some in INC, some individually and one
> is joint with child (they want this to stay out of estate and just go
> to daughter since they are just cosigners on the loan. The trust
> schedule shows all properties under each business but they were not
> deeded to the trust, in fact none of the properties were ever deeded
> to the trust. Wouldn?t that require a probate of the pour over will to
get those properties into the trust at death?
> What is the point of a trust in this scenario? I don?t want to run up
> a big bill for the clients redoing everything but I don?t see a real
> need or benefit of the RLT if the properties are in the individual
> businesses, not the trust. Total NET value of estate is around $1.7M
> and there are no out of state properties. Neither client particularly
> cares to avoid probate nor are they terribly concerned about
> post-death disputes. Since none of the properties were transferred to
> the trust, is there any potential harm in simply doing away with the
> trust and providing for potential tax concerns in testamentary trusts?
>
>
>
>
>
> Kimberly S. Hammit
>
> Associate Attorney
>
>
>
> GSJONES LAW GROUP, P.S.
>
> 1155 Bethel Avenue
>
> Port Orchard, WA 98366
>
> Tel: (360) 876-9221
>
> Fax: (360) 876-5097
>
>
>
>
>
> GSJONES LAW GROUP, P.S. - The information in this email message may be
> privileged, confidential, or otherwise protected from disclosure. Any
> review, dissemination or use of this transmission or its contents by
> persons other than the addressee(s) is strictly prohibited and this
> transmission does not constitute a waiver. If you have received this
> transmission in error, please delete this email and respond to sender
> via kim at gsjoneslaw.com or call our office at (360) 876-9221.
>
>
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Message: 11
Date: Tue, 25 Sep 2018 10:52:43 -0700
From: David King <david at soundadvocates.com>
To: "WSBA Probate & Trust Listserv" <wsbapt at lists.wsbarppt.com>
Subject: Re: [WSBAPT] RLT question
Message-ID:
<CANs35_=rdD_2yKH1sPm+gkiaz+28RiDEoujBzBFAnkVT98yjNA at mail.gmail.com>
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Who are the members or shareholders of the entities holding the properties?
That seems to me to be the most pertinent question re: trust funding and RLT
usefulness here. If Trustee / Trust holds the business interests, this can
work. Trustee would not be the outright owner of the properties if they are
held by business entities but can control the properties through the
business ownership.
On Tue, Sep 25, 2018 at 10:49 AM Marvin Benson <marvinbensonlaw at gmail.com>
wrote:
> I also do not see that the RLT is doing them any good with properties
> outside the trust. Since they are not interested in probate
> avoidance, it might be better to redo the will so it is not a pour over
will.
>
> Marvin Benson
>
> On Tue, Sep 25, 2018 at 10:22 AM Kim Hammit <kim at gsjoneslaw.com> wrote:
>
>> I was presented with an estate package that clients want to revise.
>> There is a RLT, pour over will, reciprocal POA, separate general
>> durable POA (not sure why separate), HC Directives. They have several
properties ?
>> some are in LLC, some in INC, some individually and one is joint with
>> child (they want this to stay out of estate and just go to daughter
>> since they are just cosigners on the loan. The trust schedule shows
>> all properties under each business but they were not deeded to the
>> trust, in fact none of the properties were ever deeded to the trust.
>> Wouldn?t that require a probate of the pour over will to get those
>> properties into the trust at death? What is the point of a trust in
>> this scenario? I don?t want to run up a big bill for the clients
>> redoing everything but I don?t see a real need or benefit of the RLT
>> if the properties are in the individual businesses, not the trust.
>> Total NET value of estate is around $1.7M and there are no out of
>> state properties. Neither client particularly cares to avoid probate nor
are they terribly concerned about post-death disputes.
>> Since none of the properties were transferred to the trust, is there
>> any potential harm in simply doing away with the trust and providing
>> for potential tax concerns in testamentary trusts?
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> Kimberly S. Hammit
>>
>> Associate Attorney
>>
>>
>>
>> GSJONES LAW GROUP, P.S.
>>
>> 1155 Bethel Avenue
>>
>> Port Orchard, WA 98366
>>
>> Tel: (360) 876-9221
>>
>> Fax: (360) 876-5097
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> GSJONES LAW GROUP, P.S. - The information in this email message may
>> be privileged, confidential, or otherwise protected from disclosure.
>> Any review, dissemination or use of this transmission or its contents
>> by persons other than the addressee(s) is strictly prohibited and
>> this transmission does not constitute a waiver. If you have received
>> this transmission in error, please delete this email and respond to
>> sender via kim at gsjoneslaw.com or call our office at (360) 876-9221.
>>
>>
>> _______________________________________________
>> WSBAPT mailing list
>> WSBAPT at lists.wsbarppt.com
>> http://mailman.fsr.com/mailman/listinfo/wsbapt
>
> _______________________________________________
> WSBAPT mailing list
> WSBAPT at lists.wsbarppt.com
> http://mailman.fsr.com/mailman/listinfo/wsbapt
--
David M. King, Attorney
707 E Harrison Street
Seattle, WA 98102
Phone: 206-420-8710
Fax: 206-973-3034
This electronic message contains information from the law firm of Sound
Advocates Law Group PLLC. The contents may be privileged and confidential
and are intended for the use of the intended addressee(s) only. If you are
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or use of the contents of this message is prohibited. If you have received
this e-mail in error, please contact me at david at soundadvocates.com.
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