[WSBAPT] Clients want to name children in Health Care Directive
Kate Gamble
uptownlawpt at gmail.com
Mon Mar 9 11:42:55 PDT 2015
Okay I see the distinction, thanks!
I took a closer look at the POLST form I received at a recent CLE, and it
appears that this green form gives the patient the option to choose ³DNR² as
an appropriate response for emergency responders. This is the
fridge/nightstand document.
I think my confusion has to do with the necessity of a DNR signed by a
physician in order to ³pull the plug.² In the case where a patient has not
executed a POLST form (which is voluntary) but has a valid HCD in place
expressing the patient¹s wish for DNR in certain circumstances, wouldn¹t
this be sufficient to authorize the MD to sign a necessary DNR document for
the patient? Or a valid HCPOA giving the POA the authority to sign a POLST
for the patient?
You brought up some good points for drafting language to clarify these
issues.
Thanks, Howard!
Kate Gamble
Attorney at Law
Uptown Law PLLC
(360) 379-1818
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From: hhherman2 <hhherman2 at comcast.net>
Reply-To: WSBA Probate & Trust Listserv <wsbapt at lists.wsbarppt.com>
Date: Monday, March 9, 2015 at 11:13 AM
To: 'WSBA Probate & Trust Listserv' <wsbapt at lists.wsbarppt.com>
Subject: Re: [WSBAPT] Clients want to name children in Health Care
Directive
Kate,
A do-not-resuscitate (DNR) order tells medical professionals not to perform
CPR. This means that doctors, nurses and
emergency medical personnel will not attempt emergency CPR if the patient's
breathing or heartbeat stops.
Many people have their doctor sign the DNR so they can have it where they
live. It is common practice in residential settings where the person has a
refrigerator to paste the DNR on the refrigerator door. EMS personnel are
instructed to look there for the green sheet before starting CPR.
This is different from the POLST where a person wants to continue living,
but under certain conditions.
Howard Herman
Herman Herman & Jolley PS
509.220.5810
From: wsbapt-bounces at lists.wsbarppt.com
[mailto:wsbapt-bounces at lists.wsbarppt.com] On Behalf Of Kate Gamble
Sent: Monday, March 9, 2015 10:31 AM
To: WSBA Probate & Trust Listserv
Subject: Re: [WSBAPT] Clients want to name children in Health Care Directive
The green sheet is the POLST form, correct?
My understanding of the POLST form is that it is a set of medical orders
(thus the MD signature), which does not replace a HCD. It is voluntary and
is intended for use in situations where a patient has a serious health
condition in order to direct appropriate treatment by Emergency Services
personnel.
Kate Gamble
Attorney at Law
Uptown Law PLLC
(360) 379-1818
CONFIDENTIALITY NOTICE: This email, including any attachments, is
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From: hhherman2 <hhherman2 at comcast.net>
Reply-To: WSBA Probate & Trust Listserv <wsbapt at lists.wsbarppt.com>
Date: Friday, March 6, 2015 at 3:12 PM
To: 'WSBA Probate & Trust Listserv' <wsbapt at lists.wsbarppt.com>
Subject: Re: [WSBAPT] Clients want to name children in Health Care Directive
My experience in talking to healthcare providers is that they want one
person to have the authority to say yea or nay on pulling the plug rather
than trying to get a consensus or majority among two or more persons. The
worst case scenario is when it is up to two children who will not agree. But
in any event, the plug will not get pulled without a ³Do not Resuscitate
Order² (green sheet) signed by a physician.
Howard Herman
Herman Herman & Jolley PS
509.220.5810
From: wsbapt-bounces at lists.wsbarppt.com
[mailto:wsbapt-bounces at lists.wsbarppt.com] On Behalf Of Jennifer Y. Sohn
Sent: Friday, March 6, 2015 12:11 PM
To: 'WSBA Probate & Trust Listserv'
Subject: Re: [WSBAPT] Clients want to name children in Health Care Directive
Yes, I¹m familiar with that culture, and I think their wishes can be
respected by creative drafting.
From: wsbapt-bounces at lists.wsbarppt.com
[mailto:wsbapt-bounces at lists.wsbarppt.com] On Behalf Of Maureen Wickert
Sent: Friday, March 6, 2015 11:43 AM
To: WSBA Probate & Trust Listserv
Subject: Re: [WSBAPT] Clients want to name children in Health Care Directive
The authority for a HC AIF to direct the withdrawal or application of life
sustaining treatment for someone should be cross referenced within a HCD and
a DPOA for HC and these suggestions by others are very good. The client may
have some strong cultural issues about involving their children in his or
her health care. Another important issue is what if there are multiple
children or co-AIFs for HC, what is the tie breaker for the doctor? If there
is a single AIF for HC, this would simplify HC authority.
Very truly yours,
Maureen A. Wickert, Attorney at Law
WICKERT LAW OFFICE
14900 Interurban Avenue South, Ste 255
Tukwila, WA 98168
Phone: 206-859-5502
Fax: 206-260-9005
www.wickertlawoffice.com <http://www.wickertlawoffice.com>
wickertlaw at comcast.net
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From: "Kate Gamble" <uptownlawpt at gmail.com>
To: "WSBA Probate & Trust Listserv" <wsbapt at lists.wsbarppt.com>
Sent: Friday, March 6, 2015 11:28:00 AM
Subject: Re: [WSBAPT] Clients want to name children in Health Care Directive
How about inserting language in the HealthCare POA giving the children
authority to override the HCD in certain circumstances?
"It is my intent and desire that my attorney-in-fact honor any Health Care
Directive or statement of similar nature and purpose which I have signed,
but my attorney-in-fact shall have the authority to make the final decision
regarding the withdrawal or application of life-sustaining treatment if at
any time my attorney-in-fact determines that it would not be in my best
interest to honor such Health Care Directive or statement of similar nature
and purpose which I have signed.²
Kate Gamble
Attorney at Law
Uptown Law PLLC
(360) 379-1818
CONFIDENTIALITY NOTICE: This email, including any attachments, is
confidential and subject to legal privilege. The information contained in
this message is intended only for the use of the above named recipient. If
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SPECIAL NOTICE TO CLIENT(S): If you are a client and this email is directed
to you, DO NOT FORWARD to any other party, or you could be waiving the
attorney -client privilege
From: "Jennifer Y. Sohn" <jennifer at sohn-law.com>
Reply-To: WSBA Probate & Trust Listserv <wsbapt at lists.wsbarppt.com>
Date: Friday, March 6, 2015 at 11:16 AM
To: 'WSBA Probate & Trust Listserv' <wsbapt at lists.wsbarppt.com>
Subject: Re: [WSBAPT] Clients want to name children in Health Care Directive
Why can¹t the children be given the final say on whether to pull the plug or
not if that is what the client wants?
From: wsbapt-bounces at lists.wsbarppt.com
[mailto:wsbapt-bounces at lists.wsbarppt.com] On Behalf Of LISA ATKINSON
Sent: Friday, March 6, 2015 10:48 AM
To: wsbapt at lists.wsbarppt.com
Subject: [WSBAPT] Clients want to name children in Health Care Directive
Importance: High
Colleagues,
First time issue for me. Clients, non-native English speakers, want to put
their children's names into a Health Care Directive to require physicians to
consult with and get approval from the children before honoring the terms of
the HCD. I have tried to explain, in many different ways, why this is not
appropriate, but I can't find any legal citation to support my explanation.
Anyone have suggestions? I tried to suggest that under their Health Care
POA, their children have a say in treatment/etc, but that the HCD is to be
their choice.
Please let me know if you have suggestions.
Thanks,
Lisa
Lisa L. Atkinson, Esq.
611 Main Street
Suite B-1
Edmonds, WA 98020
(425) 778-2421
(425) 744-0796 fax
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