<div dir="ltr"><div><div><div>"Wikipedia?"<br><br>Yes, wikipedia. With links to sources and a full editing history you can peruse. Perfectly acceptable for this kind of thing.<br><br>"Do you realize that private businesses are FAR more capable of intruding into your private affairs than any government agency?"<br><br></div>A private business is incapable of putting a closet in AT&T and recording all phone calls, for example. Except, perhaps, AT&T, I suppose. They also have customers and possibly shareholders to worry about. There are also laws they must follow, not being powerful enough to ignore them on a whim. Besides, there are already tools you can use to mitigate what they can do, such as AdBlock, NoScript, Ghostery, Cookie Monster, Perspectives, Random User Agent Spoofer, and others. All things that, when I described them in earlier posts, you called me "paranoid" for suggesting others use them.<br><br>"Another thing . . .<div><br></div><div>If we were to restrict
government technological capabilities, the potential of foreign
intrusion into our national security, right here in the Great
Forty-eight (the 48 contiguous states), would increase dramatically.
Recent Chinese hacking into a couple banks is an example."</div><br></div>The idea of "restricting government technological capabilities" reminds me that one of the things the NSA is supposed to be doing is working with companies and citizens to protect their data by coming up with standards and protocols that can be used. Instead, they are weakening encryption systems by providing weak random number generators to make it easier for them to hack them, and forcing companies to put in back doors with secret national security letters.<br><br></div><div>The other thing they are supposed to be doing is hacking our enemies systems. Instead they are hacking yours and mine. What they are not supposed to be doing, a la the Fourth Amendment, is searching your data and mine without probable cause and a proper warrant.<br><br></div><div>What does our government do about it? Try to get Snowden and beef up restrictions on whistle blowers.<br><br>Paul<br></div></div><div class="gmail_extra"><br><div class="gmail_quote">On Wed, Oct 15, 2014 at 5:43 PM, Tom Hansen <span dir="ltr"><<a href="mailto:thansen@moscow.com" target="_blank">thansen@moscow.com</a>></span> wrote:<br><blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0 0 0 .8ex;border-left:1px #ccc solid;padding-left:1ex"><div dir="auto"><div><span></span></div><div><div>Wikipedia?</div><div><br></div><div>Do you realize that private businesses are FAR more capable of intruding into your private affairs than any government agency?</div><div><br></div><div>Another thing . . .</div><div><br></div><div>If we were to restrict government technological capabilities, the potential of foreign intrusion into our national security, right here in the Great Forty-eight (the 48 contiguous states), would increase dramatically. Recent Chinese hacking into a couple banks is an example.</div><div><br></div><div>We cannot limit our own defense systems!</div><div><span class=""><br><div><span style="background-color:rgba(255,255,255,0)">Seeya 'round town, Moscow, because . . .</span></div><div><span style="background-color:rgba(255,255,255,0)"><br></span></div><div><span style="background-color:rgba(255,255,255,0)">"Moscow Cares" (the most fun you can have with your pants on)</span></div><div><a href="http://www.moscowcares.com/" style="background-color:rgba(255,255,255,0)" target="_blank"><font color="#000000">http://www.MoscowCares.com</font></a></div><div><span style="background-color:rgba(255,255,255,0)"> </span></div><div><div><span style="background-color:rgba(255,255,255,0)">Tom Hansen</span></div><div><span style="background-color:rgba(255,255,255,0)">Moscow, Idaho</span></div></div><div><span style="background-color:rgba(255,255,255,0)"><br></span></div><div><span style="background-color:rgba(255,255,255,0)">"There's room at the top they are telling you still.</span></div><div><span style="background-color:rgba(255,255,255,0)">But first you must learn how to smile as you kill,</span></div><div><span style="background-color:rgba(255,255,255,0)">If you want to be like the folks on the hill."</span></div><div><span style="background-color:rgba(255,255,255,0)"><br></span></div><div><span style="background-color:rgba(255,255,255,0)">- John Lennon</span></div><div><span style="background-color:rgba(255,255,255,0)"> </span></div></span><div><div class="h5"><div><br>On Oct 15, 2014, at 5:15 PM, Paul Rumelhart <<a href="mailto:paul.rumelhart@gmail.com" target="_blank">paul.rumelhart@gmail.com</a>> wrote:<br><br></div><blockquote type="cite"><div><div dir="ltr"><div><div><div>Read up on the dozens of stories that have come to light
about what data the NSA is collecting. Here is a link listing many of
them in detail with references in a timeline:
<a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Global_surveillance_disclosures_%282013%E2%80%93present%29" target="_blank">https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Global_surveillance_disclosures_%282013%E2%80%93present%29</a>. Be warned, it is a lot of reading. Don't skim over what the UK and other countries are doing, we have deals with them too.<br><br></div>I
can't tell you if any data they have on you is currently being used
against you, since it's all classified. It comes down to trust. I look
through the linked webpage and my trust meter drops to zero. You may
trust our President, and you may believe he has any say over what the
three-letter agencies are doing, but I don't. Even if you do, what if
Jeb Bush gets his job?<br><br></div>I can understand you calling me
"paranoid" before data on the actual initiatives were leaked (I would have phrased it as being "cynical"), but I don't
see how you can now without being almost unbelievably naive.<br><br></div><div>I,
on the other hand, just want to go through life without everything I do
being observed and recorded by a government that is supposed to be
working for me. There is also the thought that because 'Murica is so cool, we actually know what's going on without people being spirited away into the night never to be heard from again (though I'd highly recommend Snowden stay out of reach for another decade or two). We will never know what the Russians (government and/or mafia) are doing, or China, or North Korea, or ISIS or what small bands of black hat hackers are up to. That's why I think we need to encrypt everything and provide anonymous networks for people to use. Not to mention harden everything.<br></div><div><br></div>Paul</div><div class="gmail_extra"><br><div class="gmail_quote">On Wed, Oct 15, 2014 at 4:29 PM, Tom Hansen <span dir="ltr"><<a href="mailto:thansen@moscow.com" target="_blank">thansen@moscow.com</a>></span> wrote:<br><blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0 0 0 .8ex;border-left:1px #ccc solid;padding-left:1ex"><div dir="auto"><div>Prove to me that my personal communications are being closely monitored by a government agency for reasons other that are detrimental to my well being.</div><span><div><br><div><span style="background-color:rgba(255,255,255,0)">Seeya 'round town, Moscow, because . . .</span></div><div><span style="background-color:rgba(255,255,255,0)"><br></span></div><div><span style="background-color:rgba(255,255,255,0)">"Moscow Cares" (the most fun you can have with your pants on)</span></div><div><a href="http://www.moscowcares.com/" style="background-color:rgba(255,255,255,0)" target="_blank"><font color="#000000">http://www.MoscowCares.com</font></a></div><div><span style="background-color:rgba(255,255,255,0)"> </span></div><div><div><span style="background-color:rgba(255,255,255,0)">Tom Hansen</span></div><div><span style="background-color:rgba(255,255,255,0)">Moscow, Idaho</span></div></div><div><span style="background-color:rgba(255,255,255,0)"><br></span></div><div><span style="background-color:rgba(255,255,255,0)">"There's room at the top they are telling you still.</span></div><div><span style="background-color:rgba(255,255,255,0)">But first you must learn how to smile as you kill,</span></div><div><span style="background-color:rgba(255,255,255,0)">If you want to be like the folks on the hill."</span></div><div><span style="background-color:rgba(255,255,255,0)"><br></span></div><div><span style="background-color:rgba(255,255,255,0)">- John Lennon</span></div><div><span style="background-color:rgba(255,255,255,0)"> </span></div></div></span><div><div><div><br>On Oct 15, 2014, at 4:20 PM, Tom Hansen <<a href="mailto:thansen@moscow.com" target="_blank">thansen@moscow.com</a>> wrote:<br><br></div><blockquote type="cite"><div><div><div><span style="background-color:rgba(255,255,255,0)">Simple, Mr. Rumelhart -</span></div><div><span style="background-color:rgba(255,255,255,0)"><br></span></div><div><span style="background-color:rgba(255,255,255,0)">It is my strong opinion that your concern in this matter is based on unsubstantiated paranoia.</span></div><div><span style="background-color:rgba(255,255,255,0)"><br></span></div><div><span style="background-color:rgba(255,255,255,0)">If you could avoid using profanity in a public-forum, we can "have an actual conversation".</span></div><div><span style="background-color:rgba(255,255,255,0)"><br></span></div><div><span style="background-color:rgba(255,255,255,0)">Failing that . . .</span></div><br><div><span style="background-color:rgba(255,255,255,0)">Seeya 'round town, Moscow, because . . .</span></div><div><span style="background-color:rgba(255,255,255,0)"><br></span></div><div><span style="background-color:rgba(255,255,255,0)">"Moscow Cares" (the most fun you can have with your pants on)</span></div><div><a href="http://www.moscowcares.com/" style="background-color:rgba(255,255,255,0)" target="_blank"><font color="#000000">http://www.MoscowCares.com</font></a></div><div><span style="background-color:rgba(255,255,255,0)"> </span></div><div><div><span style="background-color:rgba(255,255,255,0)">Tom Hansen</span></div><div><span style="background-color:rgba(255,255,255,0)">Moscow, Idaho</span></div></div><div><span style="background-color:rgba(255,255,255,0)"><br></span></div><div><span style="background-color:rgba(255,255,255,0)">"There's room at the top they are telling you still.</span></div><div><span style="background-color:rgba(255,255,255,0)">But first you must learn how to smile as you kill,</span></div><div><span style="background-color:rgba(255,255,255,0)">If you want to be like the folks on the hill."</span></div><div><span style="background-color:rgba(255,255,255,0)"><br></span></div><div><span style="background-color:rgba(255,255,255,0)">- John Lennon</span></div><div><span style="background-color:rgba(255,255,255,0)"> </span></div></div><div><br>On Oct 15, 2014, at 4:08 PM, Paul Rumelhart <<a href="mailto:paul.rumelhart@gmail.com" target="_blank">paul.rumelhart@gmail.com</a>> wrote:<br><br></div><blockquote type="cite"><div><div dir="ltr"><div>You know, I would be happy to have an actual conversation about this with you. However, if all you are going to do is be a dick, then I don't see that actually working out.<br></div><div><br>Paul<br></div></div><div class="gmail_extra"><br><div class="gmail_quote">On Wed, Oct 15, 2014 at 3:48 PM, Tom Hansen <span dir="ltr"><<a href="mailto:thansen@moscow.com" target="_blank">thansen@moscow.com</a>></span> wrote:<br><blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0 0 0 .8ex;border-left:1px #ccc solid;padding-left:1ex"><div dir="auto"><div><image2.png><span><br><br><div><span style="background-color:rgba(255,255,255,0)">Seeya 'round town, Moscow, because . . .</span></div><div><span style="background-color:rgba(255,255,255,0)"><br></span></div><div><span style="background-color:rgba(255,255,255,0)">"Moscow Cares" (the most fun you can have with your pants on)</span></div><div><a href="http://www.moscowcares.com/" style="background-color:rgba(255,255,255,0)" target="_blank"><font color="#000000">http://www.MoscowCares.com</font></a></div><div><span style="background-color:rgba(255,255,255,0)"> </span></div><div><div><span style="background-color:rgba(255,255,255,0)">Tom Hansen</span></div><div><span style="background-color:rgba(255,255,255,0)">Moscow, Idaho</span></div></div><div><span style="background-color:rgba(255,255,255,0)"><br></span></div><div><span style="background-color:rgba(255,255,255,0)">"There's room at the top they are telling you still.</span></div><div><span style="background-color:rgba(255,255,255,0)">But first you must learn how to smile as you kill,</span></div><div><span style="background-color:rgba(255,255,255,0)">If you want to be like the folks on the hill."</span></div><div><span style="background-color:rgba(255,255,255,0)"><br></span></div><div><span style="background-color:rgba(255,255,255,0)">- John Lennon</span></div><div><span style="background-color:rgba(255,255,255,0)"> </span></div></span></div><div><div><div><br>On Oct 15, 2014, at 2:56 PM, Paul Rumelhart <<a href="mailto:paul.rumelhart@gmail.com" target="_blank">paul.rumelhart@gmail.com</a>> wrote:<br><br></div><blockquote type="cite"><div><div dir="ltr">Except that, thanks to Snowden, we *know* that they are actually out to get us.<br></div><div class="gmail_extra"><br><div class="gmail_quote">On Wed, Oct 15, 2014 at 2:55 PM, Moscow Cares <span dir="ltr"><<a href="mailto:moscowcares@moscow.com" target="_blank">moscowcares@moscow.com</a>></span> wrote:<br><blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0 0 0 .8ex;border-left:1px #ccc solid;padding-left:1ex"><div dir="auto"><div>Paranoia . . . self-destroya !</div><div><br><div><span style="background-color:rgba(255,255,255,0)">Seeya 'round town, Moscow, because . . .</span></div><div><span style="background-color:rgba(255,255,255,0)"><br></span></div><div><span style="background-color:rgba(255,255,255,0)">"Moscow Cares" (the most fun you can have with your pants on)</span></div><div><a href="http://www.moscowcares.com/" style="background-color:rgba(255,255,255,0)" target="_blank"><font color="#000000">http://www.MoscowCares.com</font></a></div><div><span style="background-color:rgba(255,255,255,0)"> </span></div><div><div><span style="background-color:rgba(255,255,255,0)">Tom Hansen</span></div><div><span style="background-color:rgba(255,255,255,0)">Moscow, Idaho</span></div></div><div><span style="background-color:rgba(255,255,255,0)"><br></span></div><div><span style="background-color:rgba(255,255,255,0)">"There's room at the top they are telling you still.</span></div><div><span style="background-color:rgba(255,255,255,0)">But first you must learn how to smile as you kill,</span></div><div><span style="background-color:rgba(255,255,255,0)">If you want to be like the folks on the hill."</span></div><div><span style="background-color:rgba(255,255,255,0)"><br></span></div><div><span style="background-color:rgba(255,255,255,0)">- John Lennon</span></div><div><span style="background-color:rgba(255,255,255,0)"> </span></div></div><div><div><div><br>On Oct 15, 2014, at 2:46 PM, Paul Rumelhart <<a href="mailto:paul.rumelhart@gmail.com" target="_blank">paul.rumelhart@gmail.com</a>> wrote:<br><br></div><blockquote type="cite"><div><div dir="ltr"><div>I think "cdn" is an abbreviation for "content delivery network". <br><br></div>However, I do think the NSA is scanning everything, regardless.<br></div><div class="gmail_extra"><br><div class="gmail_quote">On Wed, Oct 15, 2014 at 2:05 PM, Kenneth Marcy <span dir="ltr"><<a href="mailto:kmmos1@frontier.com" target="_blank">kmmos1@frontier.com</a>></span> wrote:<br><blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0 0 0 .8ex;border-left:1px #ccc solid;padding-left:1ex">
<div bgcolor="#FFFFFF" text="#000000">
<br>
<div>On 10/15/2014 8:35 AM, Tom Hansen
wrote:<br>
</div>
<blockquote type="cite">
<div><span></span></div>
<div>
<div><br>
</div>
<div><font style="background-color:rgba(255,255,255,0)" color="#000000"><a href="http://www.ktvb.com/media/cinematic/video/15790544/representative-district-1-debate-2014/" style="background-color:rgba(255,255,255,0)" target="_blank">http://www.ktvb.com/media/cinematic/video/15790544/representative-district-1-debate-2014/</a></font></div>
<div> <br>
</div>
</div>
</blockquote>
<br>
Question: Why does KTVB, owned by an American company, covering an
American news story, choose to arrange its public news feeds in such
a way that they flow through Canada on their way from KTVB to
American viewers? Because the news feeds flow through a foreign
country, Canada, they are automatically scanned and tracked by the
NSA. Why do KTVB and its owners require NSA participation in their
news delivery?<br>
<br>
If you are unaware of what I am writing about, just download and
install the software package NoScript into your browser, then look
at what processes want to run when you click on the link above.<br>
<br>
<br>
Ken<br>
<br>
</div>
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</div></blockquote><blockquote type="cite"><div><span>=======================================================</span><br><span> List services made available by First Step Internet,</span><br><span> serving the communities of the Palouse since 1994.</span><br><span> <a href="http://www.fsr.net" target="_blank">http://www.fsr.net</a></span><br><span> <a href="mailto:Vision2020@moscow.com" target="_blank">mailto:Vision2020@moscow.com</a></span><br><span>=======================================================</span></div></blockquote></div></div></div></blockquote></div><br></div>
</div></blockquote><blockquote type="cite"><div><span>=======================================================</span><br><span> List services made available by First Step Internet,</span><br><span> serving the communities of the Palouse since 1994.</span><br><span> <a href="http://www.fsr.net" target="_blank">http://www.fsr.net</a></span><br><span> <a href="mailto:Vision2020@moscow.com" target="_blank">mailto:Vision2020@moscow.com</a></span><br><span>=======================================================</span></div></blockquote></div></div></div></blockquote></div><br></div>
</div></blockquote><blockquote type="cite"><div><span>=======================================================</span><br><span> List services made available by First Step Internet,</span><br><span> serving the communities of the Palouse since 1994.</span><br><span> <a href="http://www.fsr.net" target="_blank">http://www.fsr.net</a></span><br><span> <a href="mailto:Vision2020@moscow.com" target="_blank">mailto:Vision2020@moscow.com</a></span><br><span>=======================================================</span></div></blockquote></div></blockquote><blockquote type="cite"><div><span>=======================================================</span><br><span> List services made available by First Step Internet,</span><br><span> serving the communities of the Palouse since 1994.</span><br><span> <a href="http://www.fsr.net" target="_blank">http://www.fsr.net</a></span><br><span> <a href="mailto:Vision2020@moscow.com" target="_blank">mailto:Vision2020@moscow.com</a></span><br><span>=======================================================</span></div></blockquote></div></div></div></blockquote></div><br></div>
</div></blockquote><blockquote type="cite"><div><span>=======================================================</span><br><span> List services made available by First Step Internet,</span><br><span> serving the communities of the Palouse since 1994.</span><br><span> <a href="http://www.fsr.net" target="_blank">http://www.fsr.net</a></span><br><span> <a href="mailto:Vision2020@moscow.com" target="_blank">mailto:Vision2020@moscow.com</a></span><br><span>=======================================================</span></div></blockquote></div></div></div></div></div></blockquote></div><br></div>