<div dir="ltr" style=""><div>Paul is right, which is why I like concealed carry. You need a permit and some training. Any idiot can open carry.</div><div>Roger<br /><br /><br /><br /><br /></div><div style="padding-left: 5px; margin-left: 5px; border-left-color: rgb(119, 119, 119); border-left-width: 3px; border-left-style: solid;">-----Original Message-----<br />Subject: Re: [Vision2020] A reassuring voice . . .<br />From: "Paul Rumelhart" <paul.rumelhart@gmail.com><br />To: "Gier, Nicholas (ngier@uidaho.edu)" <ngier@uidaho.edu><br />Date: 08/21/14 19:56:46<br /><br /><title></title>
<div dir="ltr">Gun safety is a major concern, as is training. I think we need a lot more of both. I would love to take a class, if someone offered one, that explains the law with regards to home defense and best practices in using, cleaning, and storing firearms.<br /> </div>
<div class="gmail_extra"> <br /><br /><div class="gmail_quote">On Thu, Aug 21, 2014 at 9:30 AM, Gier, Nicholas (<a href="index.html?_n%5Bp%5D%5Bmain%5D=win.main.tree&_n%5Bp%5D%5Bcontent%5D=mail.compose&to=ngier@uidaho.edu">ngier@uidaho.edu</a>) <span dir="ltr"><<a href="index.html?_n%5Bp%5D%5Bmain%5D=win.main.tree&_n%5Bp%5D%5Bcontent%5D=mail.compose&to=ngier@uidaho.edu" target="_blank">ngier@uidaho.edu</a>></span> wrote:<br /><blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin: 0px 0px 0px 0.8ex; padding-left: 1ex; border-left-color: rgb(204, 204, 204); border-left-width: 1px; border-left-style: solid;"><div style="color: rgb(0, 0, 0); font-family: Calibri,Arial,Helvetica,sans-serif; font-size: 12pt; background-color: rgb(255, 255, 255);" dir="ltr"> <div>Hi Paul,<br /></div>
<div><br /></div>
<div>You are absolutely right. That's why I joined the Martin Institute for Peace Studies and Conflict Resolution (now just the Martin Institute), and for 24 years I've devoted all my research to the origins of violence, with an emphasis on religious violence.<br /></div>
<div><br /></div>
<div>But what about nonviolent children picking up guns and shooting themselves and other kids? Or the man in Montana, presumably an upstanding citizen, who shot to death a German exchange student in his garage? Or the presumably upstanding citizen who shot to death a black woman who came to his door early in the morning because her car had broken down. The very presence of excessive firearms, even in a nonviolent society, and even with well intentioned police, will inevitably lead to gun deaths.<br /></div>
<div><br /></div>
<div>Nick<br /></div>
<div style="color: rgb(33, 33, 33);"> <hr style="width: 98%; display: inline-block;">
<div dir="ltr"> <font color="#000000" face="Calibri, sans-serif" style="font-size: 11pt;"><b>From:</b> <a href="index.html?_n%5Bp%5D%5Bmain%5D=win.main.tree&_n%5Bp%5D%5Bcontent%5D=mail.compose&to=vision2020-bounces@moscow.com" target="_blank">vision2020-bounces@moscow.com</a> <<a href="index.html?_n%5Bp%5D%5Bmain%5D=win.main.tree&_n%5Bp%5D%5Bcontent%5D=mail.compose&to=vision2020-bounces@moscow.com" target="_blank">vision2020-bounces@moscow.com</a>> on behalf of Paul Rumelhart <<a href="index.html?_n%5Bp%5D%5Bmain%5D=win.main.tree&_n%5Bp%5D%5Bcontent%5D=mail.compose&to=paul.rumelhart@gmail.com" target="_blank">paul.rumelhart@gmail.com</a>><br /><b>Sent:</b> Thursday, August 21, 2014 8:51 AM<br /><b>To:</b> Tom Hansen​<br /><b>Cc:</b> Moscow Vision 2020<br /><b>Subject:</b> Re: [Vision2020] A reassuring voice . . .</font><div> </div> </div>
<div>
<div dir="ltr"> <div>
<div>Well, I'm glad Nick resisted the urge to grab his .30-06 out of storage and go on a shooting spree. I'm sure the constant psychic pull of the weapon was hard to fight when he was tired or distracted. The whispers, just on the edge of hearing, of "Kill! Kill them all!" were no doubt damn near irresistible in those last few moments before drifting off to sleep.<br /><br /> </div>I'm joking, of course, but this is the crux of it to me: do we really have a gun problem? Or do we have a violence problem? <br /><br /> </div>
<div>For example, is the problem that abusive husbands are armed and kill their wives, or is the problem that too many husbands are abusive to the point that they will attempt to kill their wives? Shouldn't we work on solving the second problem first?<br /> </div>
<div><br /></div>Paul<br /> </div>
<div class="gmail_extra"> <br /><br /><div class="gmail_quote">On Thu, Aug 21, 2014 at 4:50 AM, Tom Hansen <span dir="ltr"><<a href="index.html?_n%5Bp%5D%5Bmain%5D=win.main.tree&_n%5Bp%5D%5Bcontent%5D=mail.compose&to=thansen@moscow.com" target="_blank">thansen@moscow.com</a>></span> wrote:<br /><blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin: 0px 0px 0px 0.8ex; padding-left: 1ex; border-left-color: rgb(204, 204, 204); border-left-width: 1px; border-left-style: solid;">
<div dir="auto"><div><div><div>
<div>On carrying guns . . .</div>
<div><br /></div>
<div><span><a href="http://www.tomandrodna.com/Soundbites/On_Carrying_Guns.mp3" target="_blank">http://www.tomandrodna.com/Soundbites/On_Carrying_Guns.mp3</a></span></div>
<div><span> </span></div>
<div>Courtesy of the Letters section of today's (August 21, 2014) Moscow-Pullman Daily News with thanks to Nick Gier.</div>
<div><br /></div>
<div>-------------------------------------</div>
<div><br /></div>
<div>
<h1 style="margin: 0px; padding: 0px; outline: 0px; line-height: 34px; font-family: Verdana,Arial,Helvetica,sans-serif; font-size: 30px; font-weight: 400; background-color: rgb(255, 255, 255);"><span style="margin: 0px; padding: 0px; outline: 0px; color: rgb(204, 0, 0); line-height: 38px; font-family: Arial,Helvetica,sans-serif;">His View: The gun-crazed hermit of the Applegate</span></h1>
<div style="margin: 10px 0px 0px; padding: 0px; outline: 0px; float: none !important;"><span><b>Nick Gier</b></span></div>
<div style="margin: 10px 0px 0px; padding: 0px; outline: 0px; float: none !important;"><span>It was the summer of 1960, and I was smitten. Even though a family friend's daughter had a mad crush on me, I had been seduced by something even more alluring and far less complicated than teenage romance.</span></div>
<div style="margin: 10px 0px 0px; padding: 0px; outline: 0px; float: none !important;"><span>I had bought an Army surplus .30-06 Springfield rifle, and I was in love. I spent hard-earned dollars on a new stock and a 3-7x Bausch & Lomb scope. A gunsmith had completely refurbished the bolt action and barrel. This rifle made me feel like a real man for the first time.</span></div>
<div style="margin: 0px; padding: 0px; outline: 0px; float: none !important;"><div style="margin: 10px 0px 0px; padding: 0px; outline: 0px; float: none !important;"><span>In 1962 I graduated fourth in my high school class of 442, and I had earned two scholarships to attend Oregon State University. But I was a loner, had few friends and showed my disgust with modern society at every turn.</span></div></div>
<div style="margin: 0px; padding: 0px; outline: 0px; float: none !important;"><div style="margin: 10px 0px 0px; padding: 0px; outline: 0px; float: none !important;"><span>At the end of the summer, I told my dad that I was going to take my guns and build a hermit's cabin on the Applegate River. When my dad asked me how I was going to make a living, I said I was going to pan for gold. My father, brother and I once had a very good day on the Applegate with our home-made sluice boxes.</span></div></div>
<div style="margin: 0px; padding: 0px; outline: 0px; float: none !important;"><div style="margin: 10px 0px 0px; padding: 0px; outline: 0px; float: none !important;"><span>My dad was never forceful or authoritarian (quite the opposite), but he was still able to persuade me that this was a crazy idea. Was this smart kid just several steps away from becoming a Ted Kaczynski?</span></div></div>
<div style="margin: 0px; padding: 0px; outline: 0px; float: none !important;"><div style="margin: 10px 0px 0px; padding: 0px; outline: 0px; float: none !important;"><span>It was eventually a good woman who made me give up my beloved firearms. When my former Danish wife and I moved to Moscow in 1972, I brought my rifle out from storage to show her. She was not impressed. She told me it was either her or the gun. For 16 years I chose her and a safe home for our wonderful daughter. Homes with guns have far more child deaths.</span></div></div>
<div style="margin: 0px; padding: 0px; outline: 0px; float: none !important;"><div style="margin: 10px 0px 0px; padding: 0px; outline: 0px; float: none !important;"><span>Armed homes are not safe for women, either. A recent study concluded women were eight times more likely to be killed in the home by abusive armed men.</span></div></div>
<div style="margin: 0px; padding: 0px; outline: 0px; float: none !important;"><div style="margin: 10px 0px 0px; padding: 0px; outline: 0px; float: none !important;"><span>A fully armed citizenry, as well as militarized police and criminal gangs, have made parts of our cities into war zones.</span></div></div>
<div style="margin: 0px; padding: 0px; outline: 0px; float: none !important;"><div style="margin: 10px 0px 0px; padding: 0px; outline: 0px; float: none !important;"><span>Denmark's gun death rate of 1.45 per 100,000 stands in stark contrast to the U.S. at 10.2, but some say it is a small price to pay for the freedom to pack heat. For every Dane who kills himself with a gun, there are six Americans who go out in glory with their handy firearms.</span></div></div>
<div style="margin: 0px; padding: 0px; outline: 0px; float: none !important;"><div style="margin: 10px 0px 0px; padding: 0px; outline: 0px; float: none !important;"><span>Why is the gun death rate so low for the heavily armed Swiss (3.84) and Finns (3.64), but so high for Americans (10.2)? Maybe it is the effeminate lederhosen and the family saunas that allow the Swiss and the Finns to kill each other less frequently.</span></div></div>
<div style="margin: 0px; padding: 0px; outline: 0px; float: none !important;"><div style="margin: 10px 0px 0px; padding: 0px; outline: 0px; float: none !important;"><span>The Aussies' low gun death rate (1.25) is no doubt due to feminizing everything from "waste tidies" to my "barbie." A real man would bellow "garbage can" and my "grill." There have been no mass killings in Australia since strict gun laws were passed by a conservative government in 1996.</span></div></div>
<div style="margin: 0px; padding: 0px; outline: 0px; float: none !important;"><div style="margin: 10px 0px 0px; padding: 0px; outline: 0px; float: none !important;"><span>Does having Mounties enforce the law (from horses rather than armored personnel carriers) lead to lower gun death rates in Canada (1.25)? Unarmed English Bobbies (there's that diminutive again) have swat team back-up, but you rarely ever see them.</span></div></div>
<div style="margin: 0px; padding: 0px; outline: 0px; float: none !important;"><div style="margin: 10px 0px 0px; padding: 0px; outline: 0px; float: none !important;"><span>Along with the English, the police in Wales, Scotland, Ireland, Iceland, Switzerland and Norway do not carry weapons. Fewer guns evidently leads to more trust and, ironically, better security.</span></div></div>
<div style="margin: 0px; padding: 0px; outline: 0px; float: none !important;"><div style="margin: 10px 0px 0px; padding: 0px; outline: 0px; float: none !important;"><span>Scotland has an amazingly low 0.25 gun deaths per 100,000, so it must be those kilts with no underpants. Is a William Wallace mooning more intimidating than brandishing an AR-15?</span></div></div> </div>
<div><br /></div>
<div>-------------------------------------<br /><br /><div><span>Seeya 'round town, Moscow, because . . .</span></div>
<div><span><br /></span></div>
<div><span>"Moscow Cares"</span></div>
<div><a href="http://www.moscowcares.com/" target="_blank"><font color="#000000">http://www.MoscowCares.com</font></a></div>
<div><span><font color="#888888"><span> </span></font></span></div>
<div>
<div><span><span>Tom Hansen</span></span></div>
<div><span>Moscow, Idaho</span></div> </div>
<div> </div> </div> </div></div></div></div>
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