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<DIV>Paul, I never said there should, but possibly your rant isn’t
directed at me, specifically. You come close to the point Pitts makes in
the column and I paraphrase: We rail at Sterling and turn our backs on the
overt racism that permeates our social system and is so terribly obvious when
one considers the outcomes. </DIV>
<DIV> </DIV>
<DIV>Sue</DIV>
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<DIV style="BACKGROUND: #f5f5f5">
<DIV style="font-color: black"><B>From:</B> <A title=godshatter@yahoo.com
href="mailto:godshatter@yahoo.com">Paul Rumelhart</A> </DIV>
<DIV><B>Sent:</B> Sunday, May 04, 2014 9:48 PM</DIV>
<DIV><B>To:</B> <A title=suehovey@moscow.com
href="mailto:suehovey@moscow.com">Sue Hovey</A> ; <A
title=scooterd408@hotmail.com href="mailto:scooterd408@hotmail.com">Scott
Dredge</A> ; <A title=sunilramalingam@hotmail.com
href="mailto:sunilramalingam@hotmail.com">Sunil</A> ; <A
title=vision2020@moscow.com href="mailto:vision2020@moscow.com">viz</A> </DIV>
<DIV><B>Subject:</B> Re: [Vision2020] Political correctness run
amok</DIV></DIV></DIV>
<DIV> </DIV></DIV>
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<DIV class=moz-cite-prefix><BR>Why should there be such real-world consequences
for a conversation he had with his girlfriend that he did not expect to be
broadcast globally? That's the point that I think is being missed in the
race to condemn him for his views. It's not like he said all this at a
press conference.<BR><BR>Not to mention whether or not this reactionary
holier-than-thou attitude I see plastered all over the news actually helps the
situation. If racists could discuss their views without immediate backlash
and real-world consequences, we might be able to have a helpful dialog.
Anyone in power with views that someone somewhere might consider racist are
going to make damn sure they don't get recorded saying anything like that
now. Does that actually help? This reminds me of an NPR segment I
listened to concerning pedophiles who had not acted on any of their impulses
looking for a way to discuss their views without being condemned for them.
Same situation there. Now we are in a situation where a person might have
grown up racist and is struggling with it and now they can't mention it to
anyone or they might lose their job or the prize they earned or fail to get
their next promotion or whatever. How does that actually help?<BR><BR>In
some ways, people are becoming more fundamentalist about this than they are
about religion.<BR><BR>And as for the bell metaphor, sure we can't unring
it. But we could not let it provoke an immediate Pavlovian response in
us.<BR><BR>Paul<BR><BR>On 05/04/2014 08:29 PM, Sue Hovey wrote:<BR></DIV>
<BLOCKQUOTE cite=mid:319ACD3D44684B9289D5089417E0F97B@UserPC type="cite">
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<DIV>Scott,</DIV>
<DIV> </DIV>
<DIV>The whole issue of racism for me is that so very often I need to examine
my own responses. I could take some comfort in the fact that most
of my generation is racist whether we acknowledge it or not. But I
try not to do that. And when I hear someone my age begin a statement
with the assertion, “I’m not racist, but...” I generally conclude they are and
are in a self delusional mode. But as you say, we cannot unring that
bell, so what comes next is a result of what has gone before and there seems
not to be a productive reason to look for a way to rationalize, excuse, or
spring to Sterling’s defense. And certainly I have no desire to do
that. I appreciated Leonard Pitts’ article in today’s
Tribune, in which he discusses the racist comments of Sterling and
Bundy. He concludes with the words, “But many of us don’t really
understand what they purport to condemn. Otherwise how could there be
all this noise about that which doesn’t matter and silence about that which
does. Examples to which he pointed: black vs. white prison
sentences for similar crimes, the execution rates of minority males, arrests
based on skin color, the list goes on..... </DIV>
<DIV> </DIV>
<DIV>And thanks for the kudos, deserved or not.</DIV>
<DIV> </DIV>
<DIV>Sue </DIV>
<DIV><BR> </DIV>
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<DIV> </DIV>
<DIV style="BACKGROUND: #f5f5f5">
<DIV style="font-color: black"><B>From:</B> <A title=scooterd408@hotmail.com
href="mailto:scooterd408@hotmail.com" moz-do-not-send="true">Scott Dredge</A>
</DIV>
<DIV><B>Sent:</B> Saturday, May 03, 2014 12:31 AM</DIV>
<DIV><B>To:</B> <A title=suehovey@moscow.com href="mailto:suehovey@moscow.com"
moz-do-not-send="true">Sue Hovey</A> ; <A title=sunilramalingam@hotmail.com
href="mailto:sunilramalingam@hotmail.com" moz-do-not-send="true">Sunil</A> ;
<A title=vision2020@moscow.com href="mailto:vision2020@moscow.com"
moz-do-not-send="true">viz</A> </DIV>
<DIV><B>Subject:</B> RE: [Vision2020] Political correctness run
amok</DIV></DIV></DIV>
<DIV> </DIV></DIV>
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<DIV dir=ltr>Sue,<BR><BR>Kudos to you for not knee jerking like so many others
when anyone cries 'racism' on a list server. I'm not all that thrilled
either about a private conversation being turned into a viral sensation and a
public relations nightmare. But there is no way to unring this bell and
the NBA needs to protect their billion dollar empire so things just move on to
the next phase of issuing the max penalty levied by the NBA (no brainer as
Donovan pointed out) and ultimately forcing Sterling to sell the team.
I'm guessing that V. Stiviano won't be able to find another billionaire sugar
daddy but might be able to land a good size payday for a tell all book.
She might also get a pretty penny for posing in a nudie magazine or
two.<BR><BR>-Scott<BR><BR>
<DIV>
<HR id=stopSpelling>
From: <A class=moz-txt-link-abbreviated
href="mailto:suehovey@moscow.com">suehovey@moscow.com</A><BR>To: <A
class=moz-txt-link-abbreviated
href="mailto:sunilramalingam@hotmail.com">sunilramalingam@hotmail.com</A>; <A
class=moz-txt-link-abbreviated
href="mailto:vision2020@moscow.com">vision2020@moscow.com</A><BR>Date: Fri, 2
May 2014 17:56:51 -0700<BR>Subject: Re: [Vision2020] Political correctness run
amok<BR><BR>
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<DIV>Sure, I know that. And Tinker wasn’t a good example for me to use
for that reason. But, I still think the application of the
principal is the same. Now folks are calling it a privacy issue. That’s
interesting. A goodly number are really selective about what constitutes
a right to privacy. If it’s a woman’s right to choose (for example)
there is no right to privacy, they say. </DIV>
<DIV> </DIV>
<DIV>Sue </DIV>
<DIV> </DIV>
<DIV> </DIV>
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<DIV> </DIV>
<DIV style="BACKGROUND: #f5f5f5">
<DIV><B>From:</B> <A title=sunilramalingam@hotmail.com
href="mailto:sunilramalingam@hotmail.com" moz-do-not-send="true">Sunil</A>
</DIV>
<DIV><B>Sent:</B> Wednesday, April 30, 2014 9:22 AM</DIV>
<DIV><B>To:</B> <A title=vision2020@moscow.com
href="mailto:vision2020@moscow.com" moz-do-not-send="true">vision 2020</A>
</DIV>
<DIV><B>Subject:</B> Re: [Vision2020] Political correctness run
amok</DIV></DIV></DIV>
<DIV> </DIV></DIV>
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<DIV dir=ltr>Sue,<BR><BR>The First Amendment was implicated in Tinker because
the school board is a state actor. It's not implicated here because the NBA is
not a state actor.<BR><BR>Sunil<BR><BR>
<DIV>
<HR id=ecxstopSpelling>
From: <A class=moz-txt-link-abbreviated
href="mailto:suehovey@moscow.com">suehovey@moscow.com</A><BR>To: <A
class=moz-txt-link-abbreviated
href="mailto:scooterd408@hotmail.com">scooterd408@hotmail.com</A>; <A
class=moz-txt-link-abbreviated
href="mailto:vision2020@moscow.com">vision2020@moscow.com</A><BR>Date: Tue, 29
Apr 2014 16:09:39 -0700<BR>Subject: Re: [Vision2020] Political correctness run
amok<BR><BR>
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<DIV>But in Tinker v. Des Moines SD the issue was all about 1st Amendment
Rights and did not involve government censorship or prosecution...made clear
in the case...nevertheless the ruling was her first amendment rights “did not
stop at the school house door.” </DIV>
<DIV>sue h </DIV>
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<DIV> </DIV>
<DIV style="BACKGROUND: #f5f5f5">
<DIV><B>From:</B> <A title=scooterd408@hotmail.com
href="mailto:scooterd408@hotmail.com" moz-do-not-send="true">Scott Dredge</A>
</DIV>
<DIV><B>Sent:</B> Tuesday, April 29, 2014 3:50 PM</DIV>
<DIV><B>To:</B> <A title=vision2020@moscow.com
href="mailto:vision2020@moscow.com" moz-do-not-send="true">viz</A> </DIV>
<DIV><B>Subject:</B> Re: [Vision2020] Political correctness run
amok</DIV></DIV></DIV>
<DIV> </DIV></DIV>
<DIV
style='FONT-SIZE: small; TEXT-DECORATION: none; FONT-FAMILY: "Calibri"; FONT-WEIGHT: normal; COLOR: #000000; FONT-STYLE: normal; DISPLAY: inline'>
<DIV dir=ltr>Donald Sterling's First Amendment rights are fully intact as he's
not facing censorship from the government and he's also not facing prosecution
for what he said in private. Apparently on the same tape, Sterling said
'I love black people', but the conversation needs to be taking in totality and
full context and not reduced, as usual, to only a few sound bytes that
resonate with Tom Hansen rendering a verdict & decree.<BR><BR>Also
interesting to note is that the NAACP was planning to give Sterling a 2nd
lifetime achievement award on May 15th. Sterling received his first
NAACP award 5 years ago.<BR><BR><A
href="http://ftw.usatoday.com/2014/04/donald-sterling-naacp-award"
target=_blank
moz-do-not-send="true">http://ftw.usatoday.com/2014/04/donald-sterling-naacp-award</A><BR><BR>All
of this is so...what's the right phrase...black and white?<BR><BR>-Scott<BR>
<DIV>
<DIV>
<DIV><SPAN> </SPAN></DIV></DIV>
<DIV><BR>On Apr 29, 2014, at 3:19 PM, "Sue Hovey" <<A
href="mailto:suehovey@moscow.com"
moz-do-not-send="true">suehovey@moscow.com</A>> wrote:<BR><BR></DIV>
<BLOCKQUOTE>
<DIV>
<DIV dir=ltr>
<DIV style="FONT-SIZE: 12pt; FONT-FAMILY: 'Calibri'; COLOR: #000000">
<DIV>Frankly, I think he’s a “dirty old man” with a great looking young
woman friend, and his prejudices and bigotry extend far beyond what he has
just said. Even so, it would seem to me he has a First Amendment
right to say what he thinks. Not knowing what the bylaws of the NBA
say to this issue, I do wonder how they can ban him from games when he owns
the team, and I imagine the courts will be asked to resolve that issue. If
the KKK has a First Amendment right to march down the streets of American
cities (and I don’t argue they do) then maybe Magic Johnson should just have
to “suck it up.” I believe the First Amendment is precious...and
yes, there are consequences for speech that harms, but we have to be very
wary of consequences for something that is purely speech and not overt
behavior, which is discrimination and often illegal. </DIV>
<DIV> </DIV>
<DIV>Perhaps the NBA could look into the Cliven Bundy case and remove him
from his ranch just as Sterling has been removed from the Arena. Well
maybe their bylaws don’t extend that far. Damn.
</DIV>
<DIV> </DIV>
<DIV>Sue H. </DIV>
<DIV> </DIV>
<DIV> </DIV>
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<DIV> </DIV>
<DIV style="BACKGROUND: #f5f5f5">
<DIV><B>From:</B> <A title=rforce2003@yahoo.com
href="mailto:rforce2003@yahoo.com" moz-do-not-send="true">Ron Force</A>
</DIV>
<DIV><B>Sent:</B> Tuesday, April 29, 2014 2:14 PM</DIV>
<DIV><B>To:</B> <A title=moscowlocksmith@gmail.com
href="mailto:moscowlocksmith@gmail.com" moz-do-not-send="true">Gary
Crabtree</A> ; <A title=godshatter@yahoo.com
href="mailto:godshatter@yahoo.com" moz-do-not-send="true">Paul Rumelhart</A>
</DIV>
<DIV><B>Cc:</B> <A title=Vision2020@moscow.com
href="mailto:Vision2020@moscow.com" moz-do-not-send="true">Vision 2020</A>
</DIV>
<DIV><B>Subject:</B> Re: [Vision2020] Political correctness run
amok</DIV></DIV></DIV>
<DIV> </DIV></DIV>
<DIV
style='FONT-SIZE: small; TEXT-DECORATION: none; FONT-FAMILY: "Calibri"; FONT-WEIGHT: normal; COLOR: #000000; FONT-STYLE: normal; DISPLAY: inline'>
<DIV
style="FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: helveticaneue, helvetica
neue, helvetica, arial,
lucida grande,
sans-serif; COLOR: #000; BACKGROUND-COLOR: #fff">
<DIV><SPAN>It wasn't just "black people" dude, it was Magic
Johnson!</SPAN></DIV>
<DIV> </DIV>
<DIV>Ron Force <BR>Moscow Idaho USA</DIV>
<DIV class=ecxyahoo_quoted style="DISPLAY: block">
<DIV
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<DIV dir=ltr><FONT size=2 face=Arial>On Tuesday, April 29, 2014 1:59 PM,
Gary Crabtree <<A href="mailto:moscowlocksmith@gmail.com"
moz-do-not-send="true">moscowlocksmith@gmail.com</A>>
wrote:<BR></FONT></DIV>
<BLOCKQUOTE
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<DIV class=ecxy_msg_container>
<DIV id=ecxyiv1557467982>
<DIV dir=ltr>
<DIV>The guy should be thanking his lucky stars that he wasn't illegally
taped stating that he believed that marriage should be between a man and a
women exclusively. They would be calling for a total confiscation of all
his worldly goods and a summary execution.</DIV>
<DIV> </DIV>
<DIV>g</DIV></DIV>
<DIV class=ecxyiv1557467982gmail_extra><BR><BR>
<DIV class=ecxyiv1557467982gmail_quote>On Tue, Apr 29, 2014 at 12:48 PM,
Paul Rumelhart <SPAN dir=ltr><<A href="mailto:godshatter@yahoo.com"
rel=nofollow target=_blank
moz-do-not-send="true">godshatter@yahoo.com</A>></SPAN> wrote:<BR>
<BLOCKQUOTE class=ecxyiv1557467982gmail_quote
style="PADDING-LEFT: 1ex; MARGIN: 0px 0px 0px 0.8ex; BORDER-LEFT: #ccc 1px solid">Donald
Sterling has now been banned for life from games and practices by the
NBA and fined $2.5 million dollars. Why? Because he was recorded
saying bad things about black people in a PRIVATE conversation he was
having with his girlfriend. One that was very likely recorded
illegally. Does this strike anyone here as being over-the-top? Or
am I the only one not on the "OMG! He said bad things about black
people!" bandwagon?<BR><BR>I hate that we have become a nation of
nattering
ninnies.<BR><BR>Paul<BR><BR><BR>=======================================================<BR>List
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