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<body class='hmmessage'><div dir='ltr'>'It also has the added benefit of no longer restricting the 2nd amendment
rights of those people on campus (even if it's sanctioned by the
Supremes).'<br><br>IT'S NOT A RESTRICTION OF THE SECOND AMENDMENT RIGHT.<br><br>Sunil<br><br><div><hr id="stopSpelling">Date: Fri, 28 Mar 2014 07:44:27 -0700<br>From: godshatter@yahoo.com<br>Subject: Re: [Vision2020] more guns on campus<br>To: sunilramalingam@hotmail.com; vision2020@moscow.com<br><br><table border="0" cellpadding="0" cellspacing="0"><tbody><tr><td valign="top"><p dir="ltr">Fine. We can limit the 2nd amendment in schools. That doesn't mean it's a good idea. We've had several shooting incidents lately, all in areas where guns are restricted. This would indicate to me, unless I'm being willfully obtuse again, that restrictions on guns in schools isn't helping very much.</p>
<p dir="ltr">In fact, it's definitely possible that the schools were targeted because they were gun free zones. I don't see why allowing responsible gun owners to carry concealed shouldn't be tried. </p>
<p dir="ltr">It also has the added benefit of no longer restricting the 2nd amendment rights of those people on campus (even if it's sanctioned by the Supremes).</p>
<p dir="ltr">Paul</p>
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Sunil <sunilramalingam@hotmail.com>; <br>
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vision 2020 <vision2020@moscow.com>; <br>
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<span style="font-weight:bold;">Subject:</span>
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Re: [Vision2020] more guns on campus <br>
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<span style="font-weight:bold;">Sent:</span>
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Fri, Mar 28, 2014 2:24:46 PM <br>
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<td valign="top"><div dir="ltr">Paul,<br clear="none"><br clear="none">This is one of those times I think you're being intentionally obtuse. Do you know how the legal system works? Do you know that courts interpret the Constitution and the US Supreme Court has the last word? You're an intelligent, college-educated person who I think would know these things, and yet you say what you did below. <br clear="none"><br clear="none">Numerous times people on this listserve have pointed out that rights are not absolute, they are capable of being limited, yet you keep trotting out your tired, wrong argument.<br clear="none"><br clear="none">Here is Justice Scalia from the Heller decision. Go Google it if you don't believe I'm reproducing it accurately:<br clear="none"><br clear="none">'Like most rights, the right secured by the
<a rel="nofollow" shape="rect" class="ecxsubref" target="_blank" href="http://www.law.cornell.edu/supct-cgi/get-const?amendmentii" title="subref">Second Amendment</a>
is not unlimited. From Blackstone through the 19th-century cases,
commentators and courts routinely explained that the right was not a
right to keep and carry any weapon whatsoever in any manner whatsoever
and for whatever purpose. See, <i>e.g.</i>, <i>Sheldon</i>, in 5 Blume 346; Rawle 123; Pomeroy 152–153; Abbott333.
For example, the majority of the 19th-century courts to consider the
question held that prohibitions on carrying concealed weapons were
lawful under the
<a rel="nofollow" shape="rect" class="ecxsubref" target="_blank" href="http://www.law.cornell.edu/supct-cgi/get-const?amendmentii" title="subref">Second Amendment</a> or state analogues. See, <i>e.g.</i>, <i>State</i> v. <i>Chandler</i>, 5 La. Ann., at 489–490; <i>Nunn</i> v. <i>State</i>,
1 Ga., at 251; see generally 2 Kent *340, n. 2; The American Students’
Blackstone 84, n. 11 (G. Chase ed. 1884). <b>Although we do not undertake
an exhaustive historical analysis today of the full scope of the
<a rel="nofollow" shape="rect" class="ecxsubref" target="_blank" href="http://www.law.cornell.edu/supct-cgi/get-const?amendmentii" title="subref">Second Amendment</a>
, nothing in our opinion should be taken to cast doubt on longstanding
prohibitions on the possession of firearms by felons and the mentally
ill, or laws forbidding the carrying of firearms in sensitive places
such as schools and government buildings, or laws imposing conditions
and qualifications on the commercial sale of arms.<a rel="nofollow" shape="rect" name="26ref" target="_blank" href="http://www.law.cornell.edu/supct/html/07-290.ZO.html#26"><sup>26</sup></a>'</b> (emphasis added)<br clear="none"><br clear="none">UI policies did not limit the Second Amendment rights of students or others entering the campus. You are wrong when you make that argument. Allowing guns on campus does not protect Second Amendment rights. The new law is a product of the 'More guns everywhere is better' faith. If you want to argue that faith, go ahead. But don't make the Second Amendment argument, not unless you also want to argue that you have the right to yell 'Fire' in a cinema. Then you can be wrong about the first two amendments.<br clear="none"><br clear="none">Sunil<br clear="none"><br clear="none"><div><div class="ecxyqt4626829288" id="ecxyqtfd07064"><hr id="ecxstopSpelling">Date: Fri, 28 Mar 2014 07:12:53 -0700<br clear="none">From: godshatter@yahoo.com<br clear="none">Subject: Re: [Vision2020] more guns on campus<br clear="none">To: sunilramalingam@hotmail.com; vision2020@moscow.com<br clear="none"><br clear="none"><table border="0" cellpadding="0" cellspacing="0"><tbody><tr><td colspan="1" rowspan="1" valign="top"><p dir="ltr">What else is needed? The Constitution is the only reason the government exists, without it no other laws are valid. We can't just ignore it because the current meme is "guns are bad".</p>
<p dir="ltr">Paul</p>
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<span style="font-weight:bold;">From:</span>
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Sunil <sunilramalingam@hotmail.com>; <br clear="none">
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<span style="font-weight:bold;">To:</span>
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vision 2020 <vision2020@moscow.com>; <br clear="none">
<b>
<span style="font-weight:bold;">Subject:</span>
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Re: [Vision2020] more guns on campus <br clear="none">
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<span style="font-weight:bold;">Sent:</span>
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Fri, Mar 28, 2014 3:22:07 AM <br clear="none">
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<table border="0" cellpadding="0" cellspacing="0"><tbody><tr><td colspan="1" rowspan="1" valign="top"><div dir="ltr">I don't say it that way because I want to be accurate. <br clear="none"><br clear="none">What's your basis for saying the universities' policies are "unneeded restrictions on a students' Consitutionally-guaranteed right to bear arms."? I hope you're not going to just paste in the 2nd Amendment and nothing else, but I'm pretty sure that's exactly what you're going to do.<br clear="none"><br clear="none">Sunil<br clear="none"><br clear="none"><div class="ecxyqt5152716804" id="ecxyqt78427"><div><hr id="ecxstopSpelling">Date: Thu, 27 Mar 2014 16:56:22 -0700<br clear="none">From: godshatter@yahoo.com<br clear="none">Subject: Re: [Vision2020] more guns on campus<br clear="none">To: sunilramalingam@hotmail.com; vision2020@moscow.com<br clear="none"><br clear="none"><div style="color:#000;background-color:#fff;font-family:HelveticaNeue, Helvetica Neue, Helvetica, Arial, Lucida Grande, sans-serif;font-size:10pt;">Instead of phrasing it as "taking away the Universities' ability to regulate guns on campus", why not phrase it "removing unneeded restrictions on a students' Consitutionally-guaranteed right to bear arms"? That's where I was coming from. There is no right specifically designated in the Constitution relating to cell phone usage or computer games or eating in class, unless I missed an amendment somewhere. That's the difference.<br clear="none"><br clear="none">Paul<br clear="none"><div><span><br clear="none"></span></div><div><br clear="none"></div> <div style="font-family:HelveticaNeue, Helvetica Neue, Helvetica, Arial, Lucida Grande, sans-serif;font-size:10pt;"> <div style="font-family:HelveticaNeue, Helvetica Neue, Helvetica, Arial, Lucida Grande, sans-serif;font-size:12pt;"> <div dir="ltr"> <hr size="1"> <font face="Arial" size="2"> <b><span style="font-weight:bold;">From:</span></b> Sunil <sunilramalingam@hotmail.com><br clear="none"> <b><span style="font-weight:bold;">To:</span></b> vision2020@moscow.com <br clear="none"> <b><span style="font-weight:bold;">Sent:</span></b> Thursday, March 27, 2014 2:00 PM<br clear="none"> <b><span style="font-weight:bold;">Subject:</span></b> Re: [Vision2020] more guns on campus<br clear="none"> </font> </div> <div class="ecxy_msg_container"><br clear="none"><div id="ecxyiv6525843847"><style><!--
--></style><div><div dir="ltr">Paul, <br clear="none"><br clear="none">In all seriousness, what is your point regarding amendments and the new Idaho law taking away the universities' ability to regulate guns on campus? <br clear="none"><br clear="none">Sunil<br clear="none"><br clear="none"><hr>Date: Thu, 27 Mar 2014 08:46:55 -0700<br clear="none">From:
godshatter@yahoo.com<br clear="none">To: rhayes@frontier.com; vision2020@moscow.com<br clear="none">Subject: Re: [Vision2020] more guns on campus<br clear="none"><br clear="none"><div class="ecxyiv6525843847yqt5032194442" id="ecxyiv6525843847yqt78651"><div style="color:#000;background-color:#fff;font-family:HelveticaNeue, Helvetica Neue, Helvetica, Arial, Lucida Grande, sans-serif;font-size:10pt;">Did they add some new amendments to the Constitution I'm unaware of?<br clear="none"><br clear="none">Paul<br clear="none"><div><span><br clear="none"></span></div><div><br clear="none"></div> <div style="font-family:HelveticaNeue, Helvetica Neue, Helvetica, Arial, Lucida Grande, sans-serif;font-size:10pt;"> <div style="font-family:HelveticaNeue, Helvetica Neue, Helvetica, Arial, Lucida Grande, sans-serif;font-size:12pt;"> <div dir="ltr"> <hr size="1"> <font face="Arial" size="2"> <b><span style="font-weight:bold;">From:</span></b>
"rhayes@frontier.com" <rhayes@frontier.com><br clear="none"> <b><span style="font-weight:bold;">To:</span></b> "vision2020@moscow.com" <vision2020@moscow.com> <br clear="none"> <b><span style="font-weight:bold;">Sent:</span></b> Thursday, March 27, 2014 8:29 AM<br clear="none"> <b><span style="font-weight:bold;">Subject:</span></b> [Vision2020]
more guns on campus<br clear="none"> </font> </div> <div class="ecxyiv6525843847ecxy_msg_container"><br clear="none"><div id="ecxyiv6525843847ecxyiv3865986523"><div><div style="color:#000;background-color:#fff;font-family:HelveticaNeue, Helvetica Neue, Helvetica, Arial, Lucida Grande, sans-serif;font-size:14pt;"><div><span>I was speaking with some of my professor friends yesterday. I asked, "If you are allowed to make classroom rules such as no cell phones, no computer games, no eating, how is it that you won't be able to say "no guns in my classroom?" I suggested going to the union and having a statewide walkout. Instead, two of these friends, who are extremely capable and long term professors said they are applying for posts in other states. For them, this is the straw (disrespect) that is breaking the camel's back.<br clear="none"></span></div><div><br clear="none"></div> <div style="font-family:HelveticaNeue, Helvetica Neue, Helvetica, Arial, Lucida Grande, sans-serif;font-size:14pt;"> <div style="font-family:HelveticaNeue, Helvetica Neue, Helvetica, Arial, Lucida Grande, sans-serif;font-size:12pt;"> <div class="ecxyiv6525843847ecxyiv3865986523y_msg_container"> <hr size="1"><font face="Arial" size="2"><b><span style="font-weight:bold;"></span></b></font><br clear="none"></div> </div> </div> </div></div></div><br clear="none">=======================================================<br clear="none"> List services made available by First Step Internet,<br clear="none"> serving the communities of the Palouse since 1994.<br clear="none"> <a rel="nofollow" shape="rect" target="_blank" href="http://www.fsr.net/">http://www.fsr.net</a><br clear="none"> mailto:<a rel="nofollow" shape="rect" target="_blank">Vision2020@moscow.com</a><br clear="none">=======================================================<br clear="none"><br clear="none"></div> </div> </div>
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