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<div class="moz-cite-prefix">On 7/28/2013 10:53 AM, Scott Dredge
wrote:<br>
</div>
<blockquote cite="mid:BLU175-W2245044126FF651751382DE4540@phx.gbl"
type="cite">
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<div dir="ltr">Hi all,<br>
<br>
I haven't followed the brouhaha regarding immigration reform.</div>
</blockquote>
<br>
It's not a new type of issue; similar situations have persisted for
millennia.<br>
<br>
<blockquote cite="mid:BLU175-W2245044126FF651751382DE4540@phx.gbl"
type="cite">
<div dir="ltr">What exactly are the problems that are at issue?</div>
</blockquote>
<br>
Just the usual greedy, illogical, control freaks unable to respect
for what they are differences they perceive in others, and
attempting to arrange situations so that the others will continue to
be subservient to, if not outright dependent upon, the continuation
of a dominance relationship by the majority. The problem is the
control freaks lack of imagination concerning how society could be
improved with a regularized and regulated system of individual
passages back and forth across multiple-port legal membranes to
achieve higher qualities of individual lives and collective social
functions.<br>
<br>
Obviously there are differences among those who wish to become legal
citizens. Some are more intelligent, better educated, and have
higher ambitions for themselves within the society they seek to
join. Others are not so bright, not so well educated, and may be
illiterate not only in the language of the nation's majority, but in
their mother's native language as well. Some of them may have
participated in criminal activities, and, knowing their limitations
to work within legitimate society, even if they were legal, may have
the idea that criminal activities may be more profitable for them
than whatever legitimate work they might be able to or allowed to
do.<br>
<br>
The facts of the matter include that millions of such individuals
are already within the country, and are highly unlikely to magically
disappear. Our society must find a set of ways to deal with the
challenges they present, and achieve over time not only some degree
of legitimization of their existence, but also recognition of their
abilities, and where and how those abilities may be of use to the
society of which they wish to be a part. It's too expensive to try
to just throw them out, and, even if it weren't too expensive, it
just won't work anyway. Their natural survival instincts will draw
them toward concentrations of resources. We need to regulate
equitably access to those resources for all our benefits now, and in
the future, when they may be in the majority, and with historical
memories as long as ours.<br>
<br>
<blockquote cite="mid:BLU175-W2245044126FF651751382DE4540@phx.gbl"
type="cite">
<div dir="ltr">We already have a vast array of student and work
visas that could be leveraged IMO.</div>
</blockquote>
<br>
Student and work visas may have places in the world, but they are
not substitutes for recognizing and solving social issues that are
orders of magnitude larger and more complicated than various
visa-regulated opportunities.<br>
<br>
<blockquote cite="mid:BLU175-W2245044126FF651751382DE4540@phx.gbl"
type="cite">
<div dir="ltr">Beyond that, it's obvious that the more immigrants
that achieve full citizenship will be voting for the Democrats.</div>
</blockquote>
<br>
They may be voting for Democrats for a generation or two, but after
they have achieved some degree of success, and have some assets and
positions and social standing to lose, they may become as
conservative as any of the existing right-wingers.<br>
<br>
<blockquote cite="mid:BLU175-W2245044126FF651751382DE4540@phx.gbl"
type="cite">
<div dir="ltr">Thus, a good middle ground would be a path to Green
Card which provides most rights except for voting rights. Green
Carders might like that even better since they'd not need to be
burdened by the civic duty of sitting on a jury.<br>
</div>
</blockquote>
<br>
So, when the local constabulary detains a recent immigrant, with or
without probable cause, a jury without recent immigrant
participation has how much chance of being perceived as a just,
equitable representation of peers?<br>
<br>
<br>
Ken<br>
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