<html><head><meta http-equiv="content-type" content="text/html; charset=utf-8"></head><body dir="auto"><div>This is long but let me make clear that there is a considerable difference between the view that we shouldn't impinge on rights on a whim and the view I was criticizing. I think we're all in agreement that whims won't do it.<br><br>On Jan 19, 2013, at 7:21 PM, Paul Rumelhart <<a href="mailto:godshatter@yahoo.com">godshatter@yahoo.com</a>> wrote:<br><br></div><div><span></span></div><blockquote type="cite"><div>
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Let's see. <br>
<br>
1. When the Constitution was written, we'd just finished a war in
which we rebelled against those in authority and claimed our
independence as a nation for ourselves.<br>
<br>
2. Shortly after that, we wrote our own Constitution, which
describes the ways in which government is limited. No more royal
decrees for us.<br>
<br>
3. When adding the Bill of Rights, the restriction against
infringing on our right to bear arms was added as the second such
amendment, right after freedom of speech.<br>
<br>
4. One assumes from this that the right to bear arms was indeed
important to our forefathers. And not because they wanted us to
hunt.<br>
<br>
Given all that, I think it's reasonable to assume that the right
in question shouldn't be infringed upon on a whim. Events like
Newtown are rare, and each one gets splashed across the news for a
month or more because it's very dramatic. I don't like seeing
children die either, but reducing magazine sizes to 10 rounds and
removing scary-looking rifles while leaving just-as-functional
rifles alone isn't going to stop the next spree shooting, even if
it actually makes it's way into law. Klebold was on this tenth
10-round magazine when he killed himself. This guy that did
Newtown would have had just as easy access to his mothers AR-15,
since there is no way in hell they will pass something that will
make people have to turn them in. An ineffective law passed only
because people are riled up about kids getting shot isn't worth
weakening the 2nd amendment, in my opinion.<br>
<br>
I can get behind better background checks, well thought-out
restrictions on people suspected of being mentally ill (that's a
whole other can of worms when we are talking about people's
rights, but we should start the conversation), better data
collection, and incentives to keep weapons secured and safe.
Banning assault weapons, though, is a farce. It's a political
ploy that's using people's fear and anger to pass something that
makes it look like they are doing something that will help.<br>
<br>
I'm not a member of the NRA, and I think they go way overboard
sometimes. Still, I haven't seen them or anyone else trying to
claim that gun ownership should be unrestricted. We already have
gun registration, background checks, cooling off periods, and
restrictions against actual assault weapons (i.e. fully automatic
weapons).<br>
<br>
Paul<br>
<br>
On 01/19/2013 02:01 PM, Joe Campbell wrote:<br>
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<blockquote cite="mid:CA+fbP8xro7ZU8V2nAfqGCG9ao6iu9xSdk_7xUwR3nHeFUQ_Okg@mail.gmail.com" type="cite">How is the second amendment under threat?<br>
<br>
The NRA interpretation of the 2nd amendment is absurd. It is in
fact so absurd that neither you nor anyone else would try to
defend it in a public setting. Which is why this post will be
followed by silence from you and others.<br>
<br>
The idea that the right to own guns is UNRESTRICTED is absurd. NO
rights are unrestricted. If speech can be restricted, then so can
the sale and purchase of guns. And speech is and can be
restricted.<br>
<br>
If the NRA position has something to do with RIGHTS, then you
should be able to name another right that is similarly
unrestricted. But you can't. The NRA position has nothing to do
with rights. It has to do with gun sales.<br>
<br>
<div class="gmail_quote">On Sat, Jan 19, 2013 at 11:11 AM, Paul
Rumelhart <span dir="ltr"><<a moz-do-not-send="true" href="mailto:godshatter@yahoo.com" target="_blank">godshatter@yahoo.com</a>></span>
wrote:<br>
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<div><br>
The nerve of those people! Having a rally in support of
one of the amendments to the Constitution! How
despicable! How un-American!<br>
<br>
Paul<br>
<br>
On 01/19/2013 09:32 AM, <a moz-do-not-send="true" href="mailto:rhayes@frontier.com" target="_blank">rhayes@frontier.com</a>
wrote:<br>
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<blockquote type="cite">
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<div><span>Happy Gun Violence day today everyone! Hope
you have a bang!</span></div>
<div><br>
</div>
<div style="font-family:verdana,helvetica,sans-serif;font-size:12pt">
<div style="font-family:times new roman,new
york,times,serif;font-size:12pt">
<div dir="ltr"> <font face="Arial"> <b><span style="font-weight:bold">From:</span></b> <a moz-do-not-send="true" href="mailto:vision2020-request@moscow.com" target="_blank">"vision2020-request@moscow.com"</a>
<a moz-do-not-send="true" href="mailto:vision2020-request@moscow.com" target="_blank"><vision2020-request@moscow.com></a><br>
<b><span style="font-weight:bold">To:</span></b>
<a moz-do-not-send="true" href="mailto:vision2020@moscow.com" target="_blank">vision2020@moscow.com</a> <br>
<b><span style="font-weight:bold">Sent:</span></b>
Saturday, January 19, 2013 6:06 AM<br>
<b><span style="font-weight:bold">Subject:</span></b>
Vision2020 Digest, Vol 79, Issue 205<br>
</font> </div>
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Today's Topics:<br>
<br>
1. Saturday is "National Gun Appreciation Day"
(Ron Force)<br>
2. Re: Saturday is "National Gun Appreciation Day"
(Tom Hansen)<br>
3. Caturday (January 19, 2013) (Tom Hansen)<br>
<br>
<br>
----------------------------------------------------------------------<br>
<br>
Message: 1<br>
Date: Fri, 18 Jan 2013 20:40:44 -0800 (PST)<br>
From: Ron Force <<a moz-do-not-send="true" href="mailto:rforce2003@yahoo.com" target="_blank">rforce2003@yahoo.com</a>><br>
To: Moscow Vision2020 <<a moz-do-not-send="true" href="mailto:vision2020@moscow.com" target="_blank">vision2020@moscow.com</a>><br>
Subject: [Vision2020] Saturday is "National Gun
Appreciation Day"<br>
Message-ID:<br>
<<a moz-do-not-send="true" href="mailto:1358570444.77938.YahooMailNeo@web162701.mail.bf1.yahoo.com" target="_blank">1358570444.77938.YahooMailNeo@web162701.mail.bf1.yahoo.com</a>><br>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1"<br>
<br>
<a moz-do-not-send="true" href="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5fWHFMQ8Wlk" target="_blank">http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5fWHFMQ8Wlk</a><br>
<br>
?<br>
Ron Force<br>
Moscow Idaho USA<br>
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Message: 2<br>
Date: Fri, 18 Jan 2013 20:59:17 -0800<br>
From: Tom Hansen <<a moz-do-not-send="true" href="mailto:thansen@moscow.com" target="_blank">thansen@moscow.com</a>><br>
To: Ron Force <<a moz-do-not-send="true" href="mailto:rforce2003@yahoo.com" target="_blank">rforce2003@yahoo.com</a>><br>
Cc: Moscow Vision2020 <<a moz-do-not-send="true" href="mailto:vision2020@moscow.com" target="_blank">vision2020@moscow.com</a>><br>
Subject: Re: [Vision2020] Saturday is "National Gun
Appreciation Day"<br>
Message-ID: <<a moz-do-not-send="true" href="mailto:CD416371-3602-4B0A-8D55-2B2508E88FB8@moscow.com" target="_blank">CD416371-3602-4B0A-8D55-2B2508E88FB8@moscow.com</a>><br>
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<br>
<br>
<br>
Gun Rally Planned This Weekend in Coeur d'Alene<br>
<a moz-do-not-send="true" href="http://tinyurl.com/agnm5kj" target="_blank">http://tinyurl.com/agnm5kj</a><br>
<br>
COEUR D'ALENE, Idaho (AP) - Gun advocates in
northern Idaho are planning a rally and encouraging
participants to openly carry weapons as allowed by
Idaho law.<br>
<br>
The Coeur d'Alene Press reports (<a moz-do-not-send="true" href="http://bit.ly/WdqSJr" target="_blank">http://bit.ly/WdqSJr</a>) that the
Second Amendment rally and gun appreciation event is
planned for 1 p.m. Saturday at Black Sheep Sporting
Goods in Coeur d'Alene.<br>
<br>
Organizers say guest speakers include state
lawmakers.<br>
<br>
--------------------------------------<br>
<br>
Seeya round town, Moscow, because . . .<br>
<br>
"Moscow Cares"<br>
<a moz-do-not-send="true" href="http://www.MoscowCares.com" target="_blank">http://www.MoscowCares.com</a><br>
<br>
Tom Hansen<br>
Moscow, Idaho<br>
<br>
"There's room at the top they are telling you still
<br>
But first you must learn how to smile as you kill <br>
If you want to be like the folks on the hill."<br>
<br>
- John Lennon<br>
<br>
<br>
On Jan 18, 2013, at 8:40 PM, Ron Force <<a moz-do-not-send="true" href="mailto:rforce2003@yahoo.com" target="_blank">rforce2003@yahoo.com</a>>
wrote:<br>
<br>
> <a moz-do-not-send="true" href="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5fWHFMQ8Wlk" target="_blank">http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5fWHFMQ8Wlk</a><br>
> <br>
> Ron Force<br>
> Moscow Idaho USA<br>
>
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Message: 3<br>
Date: Sat, 19 Jan 2013 06:06:20 -0800<br>
From: Tom Hansen <<a moz-do-not-send="true" href="mailto:thansen@moscow.com" target="_blank">thansen@moscow.com</a>><br>
To: Moscow Vision 2020 <<a moz-do-not-send="true" href="mailto:vision2020@moscow.com" target="_blank">vision2020@moscow.com</a>><br>
Subject: [Vision2020] Caturday (January 19, 2013)<br>
Message-ID: <</div></div></div></blockquote></div></blockquote></div></blockquote></div></blockquote></body></html>