<html><head><meta http-equiv="content-type" content="text/html; charset=utf-8"></head><body dir="auto"><div>During the last presidential debate, Romney stated unequivocally that he supports Obama's use of drones.<br><br><div>Seeya at the polls, Moscow, because . . .</div><div><br></div><div>"Moscow Cares"</div><div><a href="http://www.MoscowCares.com">http://www.MoscowCares.com</a></div><div> </div><div><div>Tom Hansen</div><div>Moscow, Idaho</div><div><br></div><div>"We're a town of about 23,000 with 10,000 college students. The college students are not very active in local elections (thank goodness!)."</div><div><br></div><div>- Dale Courtney (March 28, 2007)</div><div><br></div><div><br></div><div> </div></div></div><div><br>On Oct 25, 2012, at 2:10 PM, Paul Rumelhart <<a href="mailto:godshatter@yahoo.com">godshatter@yahoo.com</a>> wrote:<br><br></div><blockquote type="cite"><div><div style="color:#000; background-color:#fff; font-family:times new roman, new york, times, serif;font-size:12pt">We disagree on a lot of things, but we agree completely on this topic.<br><br>Paul<br><div><span><br></span></div><div><span></span></div><div><br></div> <div style="font-family: times new roman, new york, times, serif; font-size: 12pt;"> <div style="font-family: times new roman, new york, times, serif; font-size: 12pt;"> <div dir="ltr"> <font face="Arial" size="2"> <hr size="1"> <b><span style="font-weight:bold;">From:</span></b> Ted Moffett <<a href="mailto:starbliss@gmail.com">starbliss@gmail.com</a>><br> <b><span style="font-weight: bold;">To:</span></b> Moscow Vision 2020 <<a href="mailto:vision2020@moscow.com">vision2020@moscow.com</a>> <br> <b><span style="font-weight: bold;">Sent:</span></b> Thursday, October 25, 2012 2:08 PM<br> <b><span style="font-weight: bold;">Subject:</span></b> [Vision2020] LA Times: :Third-party debate showcases fresh faces and issues"<br> </font> </div> <br>
<meta http-equiv="x-dns-prefetch-control" content="off"><div id="yiv37727539"><h1><font>Issues addressed in this debate that were not emphasized in the Demopublican/Republicrat debate include legality or wisdom of drone killing, the massive US military budget continuing while domestic needs suffer, NDAA tyranny, the damaging war on drugs and the massive US incarceration rate, anthropogenic climate change, and corporate cash influencing elections. Comparing this debate to the Obama/Romney debate charade, that was sometimes like a mano a mano testosterone verbal battle, rather than a mature discussion of critical issues by two adults, made me wonder why I bothered to even watch those debates.</font></h1>
<div><b>This debate was shown again on C-Span, and appears to be available in full on the C-Span website here:</b></div><div><b><a href="http://www.c-span.org/Events/Third-Party-Presidential-Debate/10737435220/">http://www.c-span.org/Events/Third-Party-Presidential-Debate/10737435220/</a><br>
</b></div><div><b>Listening to this debate offered hope for our democracy, likely a vain hope given the odds against any of these alternative candidates or anyone like them being elected president.</b></div><div>------------------------------------<br>
</div><div><a href="http://www.latimes.com/news/politics/la-pn-third-party-debate-fresh-faces-issues-20121023,0,4056150.story">http://www.latimes.com/news/politics/la-pn-third-party-debate-fresh-faces-issues-20121023,0,4056150.story</a><br>
</div><h1>Third-party debate showcases fresh faces and issues</h1><div><span class="yiv37727539byline">By James Rainey</span>
</div><div class="yiv37727539date"><span class="yiv37727539dateString">October 23, 2012</span><span class="yiv37727539dateTimeSeparator">, </span><span class="yiv37727539timeString">9:55 p.m</span></div><div class="yiv37727539date">Four alternative candidates for president of the United States debated
Tuesday night in Chicago and agreed America needs a good dose of what
they could provide -- clear, straight talk that has not been
market-pasteurized.</div><div class="yiv37727539date">The third-party debate, sponsored by the nonprofit Free and Equal Elections Foundation and streamed online with host <a rel="nofollow" class="yiv37727539taxInlineTagLink" id="yiv37727539PECLB0000005449" title="Larry King" target="_blank" href="http://www.latimes.com/topic/entertainment/television/larry-king-PECLB0000005449.topic">Larry King</a>, offered up a heaping serving of candidates few voters have seen and issues <a rel="nofollow" class="yiv37727539taxInlineTagLink" id="yiv37727539PEPLT007408" title="Barack Obama" target="_blank" href="http://www.latimes.com/topic/politics/government/barack-obama-PEPLT007408.topic">President Obama</a> and <a rel="nofollow" class="yiv37727539taxInlineTagLink" id="yiv37727539PEPLT007376" title="Mitt Romney" target="_blank" href="http://www.latimes.com/topic/politics/government/mitt-romney-PEPLT007376.topic">Mitt Romney</a> have seldom raised -- including drug
legalization, climate change and indefinite holds on citizens suspected of terrorism.<br>
<br> <a rel="nofollow" class="yiv37727539taxInlineTagLink" id="yiv37727539PECLB002602" title="Gary Johnson" target="_blank" href="http://www.latimes.com/topic/politics/government/gary-johnson-PECLB002602.topic">Gary Johnson</a> of the <a rel="nofollow" class="yiv37727539taxInlineTagLink" id="yiv37727539ORGOV000277" title="Libertarian Party" target="_blank" href="http://www.latimes.com/topic/politics/parties-movements/libertarian-party-ORGOV000277.topic">Libertarian Party</a>, <a rel="nofollow" class="yiv37727539taxInlineTagLink" id="yiv37727539PEPLT0008913" title="Jill Stein" target="_blank" href="http://www.latimes.com/topic/politics/government/jill-stein-PEPLT0008913.topic">Jill Stein</a> of the Green Party, <a rel="nofollow" class="yiv37727539taxInlineTagLink" id="yiv37727539PEPLT00008705" title="Rocky Anderson " target="_blank" href="http://www.latimes.com/topic/politics/rocky-anderson--PEPLT00008705.topic">Rocky Anderson</a>
of the Justice Party and Virgil Goode of the Constitution Party may not
win huge votes Nov. 6, but they rocked a Chicago hotel ballroom and the
social media landscape, which buzzed with commentary about their
conversation.</div><div class="yiv37727539date">“You’re all Don Quixotes in a way,” King, the former CNN host, said at
the end of the 90-minute session, “but the windmills have a way of
stopping and we have a way of saluting you just for getting into the
fray.”<br> <br> The encounter had a quirky charm, featuring opening
statements hastily inserted after the candidates had already answered
their first question (supplied via social media). It also featured the
affable King, an eminence in this setting, who put up with none of the
filibustering that the two big-party candidates foisted on the
moderators of the major televised debates. <br> <br> The four candidates
were united on several issues -- their disdain for the influence of
money in politics, their opposition to massive defense spending and
foreign wars, and their determination to cut executive power that allows
the indefinite detention of Americans in the war on terror.<br> <br>
Johnson, the Libertarian former governor of New Mexico, said corporate
money had gotten so bad in politics that candidates should be required
to wear <a rel="nofollow" class="yiv37727539taxInlineTagLink" id="yiv3772753915039007" title="NASCAR" target="_blank" href="http://www.latimes.com/topic/sports/auto-racing/nascar-15039007.topic">NASCAR</a>-style jackets to show all their corporate sponsors.<br> <br>
On defense, the liberal Stein said she would ban all drone strikes and
Johnson said he would cut defense spending by 43% (to 2003 levels). The
conservative Goode, a former congressman from Virginia who has the
rough-boned look of a Civil War officer, concurred, saying: “The United
States should stop trying to be the overseer of the world. That would
save us billions and billions of dollars.”</div><div class="yiv37727539date">Anderson, former mayor of Salt Lake City and an outspoken liberal, called the <a rel="nofollow" class="yiv37727539taxInlineTagLink" id="yiv37727539EVGAP00024" title="National Defense Authorization Act" target="_blank" href="http://www.latimes.com/topic/unrest-conflicts-war/defense/national-defense-authorization-act-EVGAP00024.topic">National Defense Authorization Act</a>
that allows detention of citizens “the very definition of tyranny.” No
one on stage disagreed. The act has been supported by both <a rel="nofollow" class="yiv37727539taxInlineTagLink" id="yiv37727539ORGOV0000005" title="Democratic Party" target="_blank" href="http://www.latimes.com/topic/politics/parties-movements/democratic-party-ORGOV0000005.topic">Democrats</a> and <a rel="nofollow" class="yiv37727539taxInlineTagLink" id="yiv37727539ORGOV0000004" title="Republican Party" target="_blank" href="http://www.latimes.com/topic/politics/parties-movements/republican-party-ORGOV0000004.topic">Republicans</a> in Congress.<br>
<br>
The “transpartisan” debate was not all a love-in, though. Johnson said
he would get rid of federal college loans, which he said had contributed
to the artificially high price of education. The Green Party’s Stein
said she favored free college for all modeled on the post-<a rel="nofollow" class="yiv37727539taxInlineTagLink" id="yiv37727539EVHST00000110" title="World War II (1939-1945)" target="_blank" href="http://www.latimes.com/topic/unrest-conflicts-war/wars-interventions/world-war-ii-%281939-1945%29-EVHST00000110.topic">World War II</a>
GI Bill. Rebutted Johnson: “Free comes with a cost. Free is spending
more money than you take in…. Free has gotten us to the point we are
going to experience a monetary collapse in this country.”<br> <br> Goode
had some of the most dramatic prescriptions. He said he would instantly
balance the federal budget with massive cuts and not tax increases. He
said he would block all green card admissions of immigrants to the U.S.
until the unemployment rate dropped below 5%. “We need jobs in America
for U.S. citizens first,” Goode said, acknowledging that many in the
crowd would not like what he had to say.<br> <br> Everyone but Goode
agreed that the U.S. should legalize marijuana. The three -- Stein,
Johnson and Anderson -- said the criminalization of the drug had led to
massive imprisonment rates that far outstrip the rest of the world's,
and huge costs that cannot be sustained. The three also bemoaned the
total lack of attention to climate change in the main presidential
contest. Anderson called it "a greater long-term risk to the United
States than terrorism."<br> <br> In the last of six questions, the four
were asked what one amendment they would like to make to the U.S.
Constitution. The two small-government candidates -- Johnson and Goode
-- said they would impose term limits on Congress, assessing that the
change would get lawmakers to focus more on policy and less on
reelection. Stein advocated a change to limit spending by corporations
in elections. Anderson said he had “already written” an amendment that
-- like the scuttled Equal Rights Amendment -- would give equal
protection under the law to women, and also to people regardless of
their sexual orientation.</div><div class="yiv37727539date">Campaign professionals have said that a vote for one of the four would
be wasted because it would only take away from one of the sure winners,
Obama or Romney. But Johnson disputed that notion in his closing
statement.<br> <br> “Wasting your vote is voting for somebody you don’t
believe in,” Johnson said. “I am asking everyone watching this
nationwide to waste your vote on me … and then I’m the next president of
the United States.”</div><div class="yiv37727539date">------------------------------------------</div><div class="yiv37727539date">Vision2020 Post: Ted Moffett<br></div>
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