<html><body bgcolor="#FFFFFF"><div>No, Saundra.</div><div><br></div><div>I DID NOT mean to offend anybody. I assumed that you knew me better than that. My reference was simply, and clearly, related to sexual orientation, hence the eighth and ninth words in my posting.</div><div><br></div><div>My apologies for not being clear enough.</div><div><br><div>Seeya round town, Moscow.</div><div><br></div><div>Tom Hansen</div><div>Moscow, Idaho</div><div> </div><div>"We're a town of about 23,000 with 10,000 college students. The college students are not very active in local elections (thank goodness!)."</div><div><br></div><div>- Dale Courtney (March 28, 2007)</div><div> </div></div><div><br>On Aug 28, 2012, at 8:40 PM, "Saundra Lund" <<a href="mailto:v2020@ssl1.fastmail.fm">v2020@ssl1.fastmail.fm</a>> wrote:<br><br></div><div></div><blockquote type="cite"><div><div class="WordSection1"><p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D">In part, Tom wrote:<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D">“</span>I'm guessin' that statistics, based on the sexual orientation of those women who done had abortions, would show that the percentage attributable to lesbians would be like really, really negligible (teentsy-weentsy).”<o:p></o:p></p><p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D"><o:p> </o:p></span></p><p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D">Tom, knowing you, I’m sure you didn’t mean to be offensive, but to be clear:<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D"><o:p> </o:p></span></p><p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D">Lesbian & bisexual girls and women don’t have a magic amulet that protects them from sexual crimes including rape and incest that can result in unwanted pregnancies.<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D"><o:p> </o:p></span></p><p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D">Similarly, lesbian & bisexual women who have planned pregnancies don’t have a magic amulet that protects their fetuses from catastrophic birth defects that may make termination necessary.<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D"><o:p> </o:p></span></p><p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D">And, lesbian & bisexual women who have planned pregnancies aren’t immune to the health consequences were pregnancy termination may be necessary for their health.<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D"><o:p> </o:p></span></p><p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D">IOW, the numbers of lesbian & bisexual girls & women who may need safe access to pregnancy termination most definitely <b><u>isn’t</u></b> really, really, negligible.<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D"><o:p> </o:p></span></p><p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D"><o:p> </o:p></span></p><p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D"><o:p> </o:p></span></p><p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D">Saundra<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D">Moscow, ID<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D"><o:p> </o:p></span></p><p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D">Atrocities are no less atrocities when they occur in laboratories and are called research.<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D">~ George Bernard Shaw<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D"><o:p> </o:p></span></p><p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D"><o:p> </o:p></span></p><p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D"><o:p> </o:p></span></p><div><div style="border:none;border-top:solid #B5C4DF 1.0pt;padding:3.0pt 0in 0in 0in"><p class="MsoNormal"><b><span style="font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Tahoma","sans-serif"">From:</span></b><span style="font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Tahoma","sans-serif""> <a href="mailto:vision2020-bounces@moscow.com">vision2020-bounces@moscow.com</a> [mailto:vision2020-bounces@moscow.com] <b>On Behalf Of </b>Tom Hansen<br><b>Sent:</b> Tuesday, August 28, 2012 9:07 AM<br><b>To:</b> Scott Dredge<br><b>Cc:</b> viz<br><b>Subject:</b> Re: [Vision2020] The one argument I can make in favor of being 'pro-life'<o:p></o:p></span></p></div></div><p class="MsoNormal"><o:p> </o:p></p><div><p class="MsoNormal">Gollllleeee, gee, Mr. Dredge . . . <o:p></o:p></p></div><div><p class="MsoNormal"><o:p> </o:p></p></div><div><p class="MsoNormal">I'm guessin' that statistics, based on the sexual orientation of those women who done had abortions, would show that the percentage attributable to lesbians would be like really, really negligible (teentsy-weentsy).<o:p></o:p></p></div><div><p class="MsoNormal"><o:p> </o:p></p></div><div><p class="MsoNormal" style="margin-bottom:12.0pt">You are now free to slam me, but use some imagination and don't talk 'bout how you're gonna kick (or is "kiss" more accurate) my ass, ok?<o:p></o:p></p><div><p class="MsoNormal">Seeya round town, Moscow.<o:p></o:p></p></div><div><p class="MsoNormal"><o:p> </o:p></p></div><div><p class="MsoNormal">Tom Hansen<o:p></o:p></p></div><div><p class="MsoNormal">Moscow, Idaho<o:p></o:p></p></div><div><p class="MsoNormal"> <o:p></o:p></p></div><div><p class="MsoNormal">"We're a town of about 23,000 with 10,000 college students. The college students are not very active in local elections (thank goodness!)."<o:p></o:p></p></div><div><p class="MsoNormal"><o:p> </o:p></p></div><div><p class="MsoNormal">- Dale Courtney (March 28, 2007)<o:p></o:p></p></div><div><p class="MsoNormal"> <o:p></o:p></p></div></div><div><p class="MsoNormal" style="margin-bottom:12.0pt"><br>On Aug 28, 2012, at 8:56 AM, Scott Dredge <<a href="mailto:scooterd408@hotmail.com"><a href="mailto:scooterd408@hotmail.com">scooterd408@hotmail.com</a></a>> wrote:<o:p></o:p></p></div><blockquote style="margin-top:5.0pt;margin-bottom:5.0pt"><div><div><p class="MsoNormal" style="margin-bottom:12.0pt">Your concern about women aborting babies based on sexual orientation, race, and / or gender sets up a false dilemma. Pro-choicers tend not to discriminate against people based on those listed traits and thus are much less likely to abort due to them. Pro-lifers who tend to more conservative and are more likely to discriminate in society based on gay, race, gender, religion, etc. will not abort for any reason. <br><br>And my point that is backed by statistical fact is that women who are self-described 'pro-life', and thus are against abortions for themselves and others, are roughly 9 times less likely to be faced themselves with the decision of choosing (even though they believe that they should have no choice in the matter) to carry a Down's Syndrome pregnancy to full term. If women have a 9x factor less of having a Down's pregnancy by being self-described 'pro-life', then it gives pause for thought.<br><br>-Scott<o:p></o:p></p><div><div class="MsoNormal" align="center" style="text-align:center"><hr size="2" width="100%" align="center" id="stopSpelling"></div><p class="MsoNormal" style="margin-bottom:12.0pt">Date: Tue, 28 Aug 2012 04:11:35 -0700<br>From: <a href="mailto:donovanjarnold2005@yahoo.com"><a href="mailto:donovanjarnold2005@yahoo.com">donovanjarnold2005@yahoo.com</a></a><br>Subject: Re: [Vision2020] The one argument I can make in favor of being 'pro-life'<br>To: <a href="mailto:scooterd408@hotmail.com"><a href="mailto:scooterd408@hotmail.com">scooterd408@hotmail.com</a></a>; <a href="mailto:vision2020@moscow.com"><a href="mailto:vision2020@moscow.com">vision2020@moscow.com</a></a><o:p></o:p></p><div><div><p class="MsoNormal" style="background:white"><span style="font-family:"Arial","sans-serif";color:black">Sounds like genocide of people with <span class="mark">Down's</span> Syndrome. How sad. I use to help a young woman with <span class="mark">Down's</span> live independently. She was a sweet kind angel with not a evil cell in her. How people can destroy such angels from heaven is beyond me. I worry they abort babies they think will be gay, or because of their race, or gender. <o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class="MsoNormal" style="background:white"><span style="font-family:"Arial","sans-serif";color:black"> <o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class="MsoNormal" style="background:white"><span style="font-family:"Arial","sans-serif";color:black">As to your theory, Scott. I think that a pro-life woman is more like to have a baby with <span class="mark">Down's</span> because a pro-choice woman would be far more likely to abort it. Older women are also statistically more likely to have a baby with <span class="mark">Down's</span> and older women are statistically more likely to be pro-life as well. <o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class="MsoNormal" style="background:white"><span style="font-family:"Arial","sans-serif";color:black"> <o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class="MsoNormal" style="background:white"><span style="font-family:"Arial","sans-serif";color:black">Donovan J. Arnold<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class="MsoNormal" style="background:white"><span style="font-family:"Arial","sans-serif";color:black"><o:p> </o:p></span></p></div><div><div><div><p class="MsoNormal" style="background:white"><b><span style="font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif";color:black">From:</span></b><span style="font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif";color:black"> Scott Dredge <<a href="mailto:scooterd408@hotmail.com"><a href="mailto:scooterd408@hotmail.com">scooterd408@hotmail.com</a></a>><br><b>To:</b> viz <<a href="mailto:vision2020@moscow.com"><a href="mailto:vision2020@moscow.com">vision2020@moscow.com</a></a>> <br><b>Sent:</b> Monday, August 27, 2012 10:25 PM<br><b>Subject:</b> [Vision2020] The one argument I can make in favor of being 'pro-life'</span><span style="color:black"><o:p></o:p></span></p></div><p class="MsoNormal" style="background:white"><span style="color:black"><o:p> </o:p></span></p><div id="ecxyiv730716377"><div><div><p class="MsoNormal" style="background:white"><span style="color:black">I loved the stats Dale posted on his site. For instance, he had polling data that showed with some kooky accounting that 'The majority of Americans are pro-life'. Shortly thereafter, he had a post titled 'Search and Destroy' which showed that 92% of <span class="mark">Down's</span> Syndrome pregnancies are aborted. So let's say that both of these statistics are roughly accurate, but for crunching numbers more quickly let's say:<o:p></o:p></span></p><ul type="disc"><li class="MsoNormal" style="color:black;mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto;mso-list:l0 level1 lfo1;background:white">50% of American women are pro-life and the other 50% are pro-choice<o:p></o:p></li><li class="MsoNormal" style="color:black;mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto;mso-list:l0 level1 lfo1;background:white">90% of <span class="mark">Down's</span> Syndrome pregnancies are aborted (assume all these abortions are by self described 'pro-choice' women)<o:p></o:p></li><li class="MsoNormal" style="color:black;mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto;mso-list:l0 level1 lfo1;background:white">10% of <span class="mark">Down's</span> Syndrome pregnancies are carried to term (assume all these births are by hard core pro-life women who are also NOT pro-choice for other women)<o:p></o:p></li></ul><p class="MsoNormal" style="margin-bottom:12.0pt;background:white"><span style="color:black"><br><br>Clearly these numbers show that that by being 'pro-life', a woman SIGNIFICANTLY reduces her risk of having a <span class="mark">Down's</span> Syndrome pregnancy. I welcome any / all comments to blow holes in my theory.<br><br><br><br>-Scott<o:p></o:p></span></p></div></div></div><p class="MsoNormal" style="margin-bottom:12.0pt;background:white"><span style="color:black"><br>=======================================================<br>List services made available by First Step Internet,<br>serving the communities of the <span class="mark">Palouse</span> since 1994.<br> <a href="http://www.fsr.net/"><a href="http://www.fsr.net/">http://www.fsr.net/</a></a><br> <span class="mark">mailto</span>:<a href="mailto:Vision2020@moscow.com"><a href="mailto:Vision2020@moscow.com">Vision2020@moscow.com</a></a><br>=======================================================<o:p></o:p></span></p></div></div></div></div></div></div></blockquote><blockquote style="margin-top:5.0pt;margin-bottom:5.0pt"><div><p class="MsoNormal">=======================================================<br>List services made available by First Step Internet,<br>serving the communities of the Palouse since 1994.<br> <a href="http://www.fsr.net"><a href="http://www.fsr.net">http://www.fsr.net</a></a><br> <a href="mailto:Vision2020@moscow.com"><a href="mailto:Vision2020@moscow.com">mailto:Vision2020@moscow.com</a></a><br>=======================================================<o:p></o:p></p></div></blockquote></div></div></blockquote></body></html>