<html><body><div style="color:#000; background-color:#fff; font-family:tahoma, new york, times, serif;font-size:10pt"><div style="RIGHT: auto"><SPAN style="RIGHT: auto">Sunil,</SPAN></div>
<div style="RIGHT: auto"><SPAN style="RIGHT: auto"></SPAN> </div>
<div style="RIGHT: auto"><SPAN style="RIGHT: auto">I am not a lawyer. But, Abraham Lincoln ordered the killing of US citizens. So did both <SPAN style="RIGHT: auto" id=misspell-1><SPAN style="RIGHT: auto"><SPAN id=misspell-1 class=mark>Roosevelts</SPAN></SPAN></SPAN>, and Washington. So there is precedents for this executive action. </SPAN></div>
<div style="RIGHT: auto"><SPAN style="RIGHT: auto"></SPAN> </div>
<div style="RIGHT: auto"><SPAN style="RIGHT: auto">I don't believe that the Fifth Amendment protecting US citizens can, was intended, or has ever been applied to acts of war against the nation, only domestic acts on US soil. </SPAN></div>
<div style="RIGHT: auto"><SPAN style="RIGHT: auto"></SPAN> </div>
<div style="RIGHT: auto"><SPAN style="RIGHT: auto">My understanding is that if your consort with the enemy, take aim against US Troops, or try to kill US citizens, such as the traitor Al-<SPAN id=misspell-2 class=mark>Awlaki</SPAN>, you have volunteered for a <SPAN style="RIGHT: auto" id=misspell-3><SPAN>significantly</SPAN></SPAN> shorter lifespan. </SPAN></div>
<div style="RIGHT: auto"><SPAN style="RIGHT: auto"></SPAN> </div>
<div style="RIGHT: auto"><SPAN style="RIGHT: auto">There is no plausible alternative to the President's current action with drone attacks against the enemy that would result in a better outcome. </SPAN></div>
<div style="RIGHT: auto"><SPAN style="RIGHT: auto"></SPAN> </div>
<div style="RIGHT: auto"><SPAN style="RIGHT: auto">Donovan J. Arnold</SPAN></div>
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<DIV style="BORDER-BOTTOM: #ccc 1px solid; BORDER-LEFT: #ccc 1px solid; PADDING-BOTTOM: 0px; LINE-HEIGHT: 0; MARGIN: 5px 0px; PADDING-LEFT: 0px; PADDING-RIGHT: 0px; HEIGHT: 0px; FONT-SIZE: 0px; BORDER-TOP: #ccc 1px solid; BORDER-RIGHT: #ccc 1px solid; PADDING-TOP: 0px" class=hr contentEditable=false readonly="true"></DIV><B><SPAN style="FONT-WEIGHT: bold">From:</SPAN></B> Sunil Ramalingam <sunilramalingam@hotmail.com><BR><B><SPAN style="FONT-WEIGHT: bold">To:</SPAN></B> <BR><B><SPAN style="FONT-WEIGHT: bold">Cc:</SPAN></B> vision 2020 <vision2020@moscow.com> <BR><B><SPAN style="FONT-WEIGHT: bold">Sent:</SPAN></B> Wednesday, May 30, 2012 7:51 AM<BR><B><SPAN style="FONT-WEIGHT: bold">Subject:</SPAN></B> Re: [Vision2020] Beating dead horses<BR></FONT></DIV><BR>
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<DIV style="RIGHT: auto" dir=ltr>Tom,<BR><BR>You are right, it is confusing, primarily because it's poorly written. I was thinking of the Al-<SPAN id=misspell-5 class=mark>Awlaki</SPAN> murder when I wrote the first sentence, and am referring specifically to that killing in my first sentence.<BR><BR>The second quote goes to the Obama administration's position (or lie) that it's killing militants with its drone campaign; they can make it because of their expansive definition of 'militants.'<BR><BR>I should be more clear when I write. For clarity's sake, let me say I find both categories of killing disgusting and illegal, and I can't support someone who is doing this.<BR><BR>Sunil<BR><BR>
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<DIV style="BORDER-BOTTOM: #ccc 1px solid; BORDER-LEFT: #ccc 1px solid; PADDING-BOTTOM: 0px; LINE-HEIGHT: 0; MARGIN: 5px 0px; PADDING-LEFT: 0px; PADDING-RIGHT: 0px; HEIGHT: 0px; FONT-SIZE: 0px; BORDER-TOP: #ccc 1px solid; BORDER-RIGHT: #ccc 1px solid; PADDING-TOP: 0px" class=hr contentEditable=false readonly="true"></DIV>CC: vision2020@moscow.com<BR>From: thansen@moscow.com<BR>Subject: Re: [Vision2020] Beating dead horses<BR>Date: Wed, 30 May 2012 06:31:14 -0700<BR>To: sunilramalingam@hotmail.com<BR><BR>
<DIV>Sunil -</DIV>
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<DIV>I am puzzled a little, honestly, by your comments.</DIV>
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<DIV>Are you addressing "ALL [my emphasis] military age males in a strike zone" or just those that are US citizens (as suggested by your opening sentence)?</DIV>
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<DIV>If the former, I will have more to say. If the latter, I kinda (in spirit) agree with you.<BR><BR>
<DIV><SPAN id=misspell-8 class=mark>Seeya</SPAN> round town, Moscow.</DIV>
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<DIV>Tom Hansen</DIV>
<DIV>Moscow, Idaho</DIV>
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<DIV>"If not us, who?</DIV>
<DIV>If not now, when?"</DIV>
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<DIV>- Unknown</DIV>
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<DIV><BR>On May 30, 2012, at 6:03, Sunil Ramalingam <<A href="mailto:sunilramalingam@hotmail.com" rel=nofollow target=_blank ymailto="mailto:sunilramalingam@hotmail.com">sunilramalingam@hotmail.com</A>> wrote:<BR><BR></DIV>
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<DIV dir=ltr>Chuck (or is it Chick?)<BR><BR>I'm looking for the section in the Constitution that says the President, on his own say so, can kill US citizens, without due process. Where is it?<BR><BR>Here's <SPAN id=misspell-11 class=mark>Greenwald</SPAN> on this issue, yesterday:<BR><BR>http://www.salon.com/2012/05/29/obama_the_warrior/singleton/<BR><BR>Here's something to be proud of: "Mr. Obama embraced a disputed method for counting civilian casualties that did little to box him in. It in effect <B>counts all military-age males in a strike zone as combatants</B>, according to several administration officials, unless there is explicit intelligence posthumously proving them innocent." (From this other <SPAN id=misspell-12 class=mark>Greenwald</SPAN> article yesterday: http://www.salon.com/2012/05/29/militants_media_propaganda/singleton/ )<BR><BR>Yep, if we killed them, they must have been militants, unless someone proves otherwise, after they're
dead. Of course, when we send drones back to kill rescuers and mourners, it may be hard to prove the innocence of the murder victims. And we should believe the state, because <SPAN id=misspell-13 class=mark>Obama's</SPAN> president, right? If he says it, it must be true? How many Obama supporters took the same position when Bush was president?<BR><BR>How can we 'eliminate <SPAN id=misspell-14 class=mark>al</SPAN> <SPAN id=misspell-15 class=mark>Quaeda</SPAN>' when every time we blow up people, we help them recruit?<BR><BR>Sunil<BR><BR>
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<DIV style="BORDER-BOTTOM: #ccc 1px solid; BORDER-LEFT: #ccc 1px solid; PADDING-BOTTOM: 0px; LINE-HEIGHT: 0; MARGIN: 5px 0px; PADDING-LEFT: 0px; PADDING-RIGHT: 0px; HEIGHT: 0px; FONT-SIZE: 0px; BORDER-TOP: #ccc 1px solid; BORDER-RIGHT: #ccc 1px solid; PADDING-TOP: 0px" class=hr contentEditable=false readonly="true"></DIV>Date: Tue, 29 May 2012 16:59:39 -0700<BR>From: donovanjarnold2005@yahoo.com<BR>To: ckovis@turbonet.com<BR>CC: vision2020@moscow.com<BR>Subject: Re: [Vision2020] Beating dead horses<BR><BR>
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<DIV><SPAN>Mr. <SPAN id=misspell-17 class=mark>Kovis</SPAN>,</SPAN></DIV>
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<DIV><SPAN>It concerns me that you don't know the difference between an opinion <SPAN id=yiv1502175285ecxmisspell-1><SPAN>piece</SPAN></SPAN> and an <SPAN id=yiv1502175285ecxmisspell-2><SPAN>article </SPAN></SPAN>strictly written with</SPAN></DIV>
<DIV class=yiv1502175285ecxMsoNormal><SPAN style="FONT-FAMILY: Tahoma; COLOR: black; FONT-SIZE: 10pt">empirical </SPAN>facts backed by several sources for accuracy. One is subjective, and the other is objective.</DIV>
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<DIV><SPAN>You can post 100s of opinion pieces by anti-war, anti-Obama, or anti-current US policy writers, it doesn't substantiate your claims that Obama is targeting innocent civilians.</SPAN></DIV>
<DIV><SPAN></SPAN> </DIV>
<DIV><SPAN>"When he applies his <SPAN id=yiv1502175285ecxmisspell-1 class=yiv1502175285mark><SPAN id=misspell-18 class=mark>lawyering</SPAN></SPAN> skills to <SPAN id=yiv1502175285ecxmisspell-2 class=yiv1502175285mark><SPAN id=misspell-19 class=mark>counterterrorism</SPAN></SPAN>, it is usually to enable, not constrain, his ferocious campaign against Al <SPAN id=yiv1502175285ecxmisspell-3 class=yiv1502175285mark><SPAN id=misspell-20 class=mark>Qaeda</SPAN></SPAN> -<FONT color=#ff0000> </FONT><FONT color=#ff0000>even when it comes to killing an American cleric in Yemen, a decision that Mr. Obama told colleagues was "an easy one."</FONT></SPAN></DIV>
<DIV><SPAN><FONT color=#ff0000></FONT></SPAN> </DIV>
<DIV><SPAN><FONT><FONT color=#000000>This is not the full truth, which makes it a lie. </FONT><A href="http://www.nytimes.com/2012/05/29/world/obamas-leadership-in-war-on-al-qaeda.html" rel=nofollow target=_blank><FONT color=#000000>If you read the article which the opinion writer is <SPAN id=yiv1502175285ecxmisspell-7><SPAN>referring</SPAN></SPAN> to</FONT></A><FONT color=#000000>, you would see that Obama has only targeted 15 Yemen with American ties, all plotting an attack on American soil. It doesn't matter if someone is a cleric from <FONT color=#0066cc><FONT color=#000000><SPAN id=yiv1502175285ecxmisspell-4 class=yiv1502175285mark><SPAN id=misspell-21 class=mark>Mukalla</SPAN></SPAN>, Yemen</FONT>, <FONT color=#000000>or </FONT></FONT>Moscow, Russia, or Moscow, Idaho, if they are plotting to kill Americans in the United States or elsewhere, I say more power to the President to bring a drone plane down on
their head.</FONT></FONT></SPAN></DIV>
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<DIV><SPAN>It appears to me, you reject any policy the US has of eliminating Al <SPAN id=yiv1502175285ecxmisspell-5 class=yiv1502175285mark><SPAN id=misspell-22 class=mark>Qaeda</SPAN></SPAN>, an organization that <SPAN id=yiv1502175285ecxmisspell-10><SPAN>plotted</SPAN></SPAN>, funded, and executed 3,000 American civilians, including children, and would do it again given a chance. </SPAN></DIV>
<DIV><SPAN><FONT color=#ff0000></FONT></SPAN> </DIV>
<DIV><SPAN><FONT color=#000000>Donovan J. Arnold</FONT></SPAN></DIV>
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<DIV style="BORDER-BOTTOM: #ccc 1px solid; BORDER-LEFT: #ccc 1px solid; PADDING-BOTTOM: 0px; LINE-HEIGHT: 0; PADDING-LEFT: 0px; PADDING-RIGHT: 0px; HEIGHT: 0px; FONT-SIZE: 0px; BORDER-TOP: #ccc 1px solid; BORDER-RIGHT: #ccc 1px solid; PADDING-TOP: 0px" class=yiv1502175285hr></DIV><B><SPAN style="FONT-WEIGHT: bold">From:</SPAN></B> Chuck <SPAN id=misspell-23 class=mark>Kovis</SPAN> <ckovis@turbonet.com><BR><B><SPAN style="FONT-WEIGHT: bold">To:</SPAN></B> Donovan Arnold <donovanjarnold2005@yahoo.com> <BR><B><SPAN style="FONT-WEIGHT: bold">Cc:</SPAN></B> "vision2020@moscow.com" <vision2020@moscow.com> <BR><B><SPAN style="FONT-WEIGHT: bold">Sent:</SPAN></B> Tuesday, May 29, 2012 4:32 PM<BR><B><SPAN style="FONT-WEIGHT: bold">Subject:</SPAN></B> Beating dead horses<BR></FONT></DIV><BR>
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<DIV class=yiv1502175285ecxyiv916931653indent>From the New York Times via Reader Supported News:<BR></DIV>
<DIV class=yiv1502175285ecxyiv916931653indent>"In interviews with The New York Times, three dozen of his current and former advisers described Mr. <SPAN id=yiv1502175285ecxmisspell-7 class=yiv1502175285mark><SPAN id=misspell-24 class=mark>Obama's</SPAN></SPAN> evolution since taking on the role, without precedent in presidential history, of personally overseeing the shadow war with Al <SPAN id=yiv1502175285ecxmisspell-8 class=yiv1502175285mark><SPAN id=misspell-25 class=mark>Qaeda</SPAN></SPAN>. They describe a paradoxical leader who shunned the legislative deal-making required to close the detention facility at <SPAN id=yiv1502175285ecxmisspell-9 class=yiv1502175285mark><SPAN id=misspell-26 class=mark>Guantánamo</SPAN></SPAN> Bay in Cuba, but approves lethal action without hand-wringing. While he was adamant about narrowing the fight and improving relations with the Muslim world, he has followed the metastasizing enemy into new and dangerous
lands. When he applies his <SPAN id=yiv1502175285ecxmisspell-10 class=yiv1502175285mark><SPAN id=misspell-27 class=mark>lawyering</SPAN></SPAN> skills to <SPAN id=yiv1502175285ecxmisspell-11 class=yiv1502175285mark><SPAN id=misspell-28 class=mark>counterterrorism</SPAN></SPAN>, it is usually to enable, not constrain, his ferocious campaign against Al <SPAN id=yiv1502175285ecxmisspell-12 class=yiv1502175285mark><SPAN id=misspell-29 class=mark>Qaeda</SPAN></SPAN> -<FONT color=#ff0000> </FONT><FONT color=#ff0000>even when it comes to killing an American cleric in Yemen, a decision that Mr. Obama told colleagues was "an easy one."<FONT color=#000000> " (My emphasis)<BR></FONT></FONT></DIV>
<DIV class=yiv1502175285ecxyiv916931653indent><FONT color=#ff0000><FONT color=#000000>I opposed Democrat Lyndon Johnson and the Vietnam War. I oppose Democrat Barack Obama and the Iraq, Afghanistan, Libya, and Iran Wars. When you have a constitutional law professor saying that it is "an easy one" to kill a fellow U.S. citizen without what passes now days for "due process," don't expect me to go along with it. I find it disgusting that more people in this country don't have the guts to put a stop to this at the ballot box. As a country, we will never learn, when a former <SPAN id=yiv1502175285ecxmisspell-13 class=yiv1502175285mark><SPAN id=misspell-30 class=mark>SDS'er</SPAN></SPAN> is an apologist for a President who says the decision to kill a fellow human being and fellow American citizen is easy. Chuck <SPAN id=misspell-31 class=mark>Kovis</SPAN><BR></FONT></FONT></DIV>
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