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<br>
My argument is not that the Nuart block party should happen because
Jim Wilson is a nice guy. I'd already explained, ad naseum, why I
thought it was acceptable to have a block party on the tenth
anniversary of 9/11.<br>
<br>
We got on to the Jim Wilson discussion because Wayne had used the
phrase "NuArt crackpots", and I was asking why. That's when I
stated that I thought he was nice, respectful, willing to help
others, and sane. That was a statement that people here on the list
apparently could not leave uncontested.<br>
<br>
I really have no argument. Someone posts about how bad Jim Wilson
is because he did something they disagree with, I respond by saying
that he can still be a nice and respectful guy and do something you
disagree with. Differing viewpoints can lead to that outcome. It
appears to me that the main contention here is that there is no room
in your collective world for a Jim Wilson that is a nice guy, since
he opposes you in something. I haven't seen any attempts to
understand why Jim Wilson might have done what he did. I haven't
seen anyone concede that Jim Wilson might have any sort of positive
qualities whatsoever. <br>
<br>
All I've seen is an attempt to beat me over the head with how
horrible Jim Wilson is, apparently because otherwise someone might
actually believe me when I say he's a nice guy. Well, as you've all
no doubt realized already, I have a thick skull. I have talked with
him for quite a while on a few different occasions and I have come
away with an impression of him that is positive. Neither your
concerns about tax exemption nor Wayne's concerns about his
testimony in a child custody case are reversing my impression of
him, mainly because I suspect that the reasons why he did those
things are religious in nature, very likely Bible-based, and this
understandable to me. I may or may not disagree with him (and you)
about those actions, but I understand how he might come by them.
Regardless, he's still a nice guy. <br>
<br>
In my personal opinion, some people on this list should question
whether or not they are obsessing too much about these people.<br>
<br>
Paul<br>
<br>
<br>
On 09/13/2011 11:30 PM, Saundra Lund wrote:
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<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-family:
"Calibri","sans-serif"; color: rgb(31,
73, 125);">Paul & Sunil:<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-family:
"Calibri","sans-serif"; color: rgb(31,
73, 125);"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-family:
"Calibri","sans-serif"; color: rgb(31,
73, 125);">In another post, Paul wrote:<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-family:
"Calibri","sans-serif"; color: rgb(31,
73, 125);">“</span><span style="color: black;">I don't
disagree with you about tax exemption being an outdated
model that should be abolished.”</span><span
style="font-family:
"Calibri","sans-serif"; color: rgb(31,
73, 125);"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-family:
"Calibri","sans-serif"; color: rgb(31,
73, 125);"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-family:
"Calibri","sans-serif"; color: rgb(31,
73, 125);">Ahh – some common ground </span><span
style="font-family: Wingdings; color: rgb(31, 73, 125);">J</span><span
style="font-family:
"Calibri","sans-serif"; color: rgb(31,
73, 125);"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-family:
"Calibri","sans-serif"; color: rgb(31,
73, 125);"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-family:
"Calibri","sans-serif"; color: rgb(31,
73, 125);">Sunil, you asked where I was “going with this,”
and in a nutshell, Paul’s argument that the anti-choice
block party on 9/11 <b>must</b> be OK because Jim Wilson is
“nice” and “respectful” is a non sequitur logical fallacy.<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-family:
"Calibri","sans-serif"; color: rgb(31,
73, 125);"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-family:
"Calibri","sans-serif"; color: rgb(31,
73, 125);">Clearly, I’ve not done a good job of explaining
myself since this seems to have turned into “what a great
guy Jim Wilson is” lovefest. My apologies.<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-family:
"Calibri","sans-serif"; color: rgb(31,
73, 125);"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-family:
"Calibri","sans-serif"; color: rgb(31,
73, 125);">There’s not a doubt in my mind that I could find
people to say Hitler was a nice guy (he loved dogs, you
know), and bin Laden was a nice guy, and Dick Cheney is a
nice guy . . . or that Jim Wilson is “nice” and
“respectful.”<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-family:
"Calibri","sans-serif"; color: rgb(31,
73, 125);"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-family:
"Calibri","sans-serif"; color: rgb(31,
73, 125);">What I object to is taking those limited personal
anecdotal experiences/opinions to outweigh a larger (IMO)
bad. I don’t give a rip about someone’s opinion of an
individual on an individual basis, but Paul trotted out “Jim
Wilson is a nice & respectful man” as a defense for
CCM’s & the NuArt’s anti-choice block party.<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-family:
"Calibri","sans-serif"; color: rgb(31,
73, 125);"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-family:
"Calibri","sans-serif"; color: rgb(31,
73, 125);">I personally believe that being dishonest isn’t
OK, whether that dishonesty comes in the form of active
lying (commission) or withholding necessary information
(omission). I find “white lies” less offensive than
whoppers, but I do find lying under oath and lying by
religious (of any religion) & political (of any slant)
leaders to be about as bad as it gets as well as morally
indefensible & disgusting.<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-family:
"Calibri","sans-serif"; color: rgb(31,
73, 125);"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-family:
"Calibri","sans-serif"; color: rgb(31,
73, 125);">And, there’s no reason to construct an example
(“If a murderer comes to your door to kill your friend
hiding inside your house, isn’t it OK to lie then?”) to make
this more complex than it is: the dishonesty <b>under oath</b>
by religious leader Jim Wilson was solely to keep a property
tax exemption to which he felt entitled even though he
wasn’t willing to play by the rules required for that
property tax exemption.<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-family:
"Calibri","sans-serif"; color: rgb(31,
73, 125);"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-family:
"Calibri","sans-serif"; color: rgb(31,
73, 125);">IOW, it wasn’t just lying, it was lying to steal
from the rest of us. He <b>wasn’t</b> stealing to feed his
family or to buy medicine for a sick child; he <b>was</b>
lying to keep a comfortable benefit to which his
organization flatly wasn’t entitled, pure & simple.<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-family:
"Calibri","sans-serif"; color: rgb(31,
73, 125);"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-family:
"Calibri","sans-serif"; color: rgb(31,
73, 125);">Nobody forced CCM to ask for a property tax
exemption (and CCM <b>did</b> have to apply for it; it
wasn’t presented on a silver platter unasked for) – if CCM
didn’t want to play by the required rules for getting the <b>privilege</b>
of a property tax exemption, it could have declined that <b>privilege</b>
at any time.<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-family:
"Calibri","sans-serif"; color: rgb(31,
73, 125);"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-family:
"Calibri","sans-serif"; color: rgb(31,
73, 125);">[Note to Sue: some churches actually <b>decline</b>
tax exemption of a federal & state level because those
churches don’t want to be limited by the requirements. It <b>is</b>
possible to do & an excellent – IMHO – example of taking
an ideological high ground. Further, there are churches
& religious institutions who have <b>lost</b> tax
exempt status because they got caught not following the
rules, something we’ll definitely not see more of with the
small but vocal trend that that government is unnecessary.]<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-family:
"Calibri","sans-serif"; color: rgb(31,
73, 125);"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-family:
"Calibri","sans-serif"; color: rgb(31,
73, 125);">But, he didn’t: instead of being <b>honest</b>,
Jim Wilson decided deceit & dishonesty were the way to
go to continue stealing from the taxpayers. Disgusting.<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-family:
"Calibri","sans-serif"; color: rgb(31,
73, 125);"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-family:
"Calibri","sans-serif"; color: rgb(31,
73, 125);">Now, some of you don’t care about lying under
oath or stealing from taxpayers (or perhaps you care but
don’t think it’s a big deal in the scheme of things ) –
that’s fine. I don’t understand that lack of care, just
like I don’t understand lots of things that are important to
me (i.e, a Christian who thinks the separation of church
& state is vital), but variety makes the world go
‘round.<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-family:
"Calibri","sans-serif"; color: rgb(31,
73, 125);"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-family:
"Calibri","sans-serif"; color: rgb(31,
73, 125);">But, don’t expect me to keep silent about it when
someone pulls a non sequitur singing the praises of a local
religious leader I <b>personally</b> know to be a dishonest
thief for whom the ends apparently justify the means,
knowledge that’s available to anyone caring to look at the
facts.<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-family:
"Calibri","sans-serif"; color: rgb(31,
73, 125);"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-family:
"Calibri","sans-serif"; color: rgb(31,
73, 125);">Further, I’ve personally found the NuArt
“ministry” to be anything “respectful” – it isn’t just to
welcome students back to the area but rather to find
converts & like-minded folks. Nothing illegal there,
but let’s be honest about what it is, Paul, instead of
trying to paint it as something it isn’t. And, I certainly
have no problem with like-minded folks finding local
friends.<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-family:
"Calibri","sans-serif"; color: rgb(31,
73, 125);"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-family:
"Calibri","sans-serif"; color: rgb(31,
73, 125);">For those who don’t know, as the manager, Eric
Engerbritson is perhaps the most “public” face of the
NuArt. A few years back (2003 – yup, I’ve still got the
correspondence), we were having a discussion on V2020 about
institutional corporal punishment as practiced by Logos
School. Eric contacted me privately to have a “personal”
discussion about benefits of Logos whacking kids. I very
politely but firmly declined. But, that wasn’t acceptable
to Eric, and he proceeded to email me an essay that easily
is in the Top Five most disturbing local writings I’ve ever
read. When he didn’t hear back from me, that wasn’t good
enough, either – he contacted me yet again. Hardly what I’d
call “respectful.”<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-family:
"Calibri","sans-serif"; color: rgb(31,
73, 125);"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-family:
"Calibri","sans-serif"; color: rgb(31,
73, 125);">Second, I know quite a few gay & lesbian
young people who have more recently been victimized (and I
don’t use that term lightly) by people at the NuArt. “Hate
the sin; love the sinner” only goes so far when they won’t
leave you alone. Frankly, the email & text exchanges
that have been shared with me are <b>clearly</b>
harassment, but I also can’t fault those young people for
not taking legal action. It’s heartbreaking and definitely
<b>not</b> respectful.<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-family:
"Calibri","sans-serif"; color: rgb(31,
73, 125);"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-family:
"Calibri","sans-serif"; color: rgb(31,
73, 125);">Finally, I offered no comment about the NuArt
block party being offensive because it fell on 9/11 because
I personally have found the NuArt anti-choice block party
offensive since the very first one . . . but that wasn’t the
topic. Besides, no one I know has ever described it --
whether it fell on 9/11 or not – as inoffensive until this
thread. After my response to Paul about hypocrisy, someone
on V2020 forwarded my post to someone no longer in the area
who forwarded it to a young woman who is also no longer in
the area who contacted me. This young woman happened across
one of the early anti-choice NuArt block parties when she
was new to the area & in crisis. She was “welcomed”
& encouraged to go to the NuArt for “support.” That
“support” took to form of being “counseled” <b>not</b> to
tell her pro-choice parents of her pregnancy until it was
“too late for them to talk to me about abortion.
Fortunately, I didn’t listen to that advice . . . Yes, you
have my permission to relate my experience now that several
years have passed as long as you don’t use my name or
current location since I’m no longer in Pullman.” According
to this young woman, who I’ve spoken to – as well as to her
parents – on the phone, the NuArt gang wouldn’t leave her
alone & she doesn’t want them to know where she is now –
she left the area specifically to get away from them because
they wouldn’t leave her alone. That’s also not what I
consider “respectful.”<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-family:
"Calibri","sans-serif"; color: rgb(31,
73, 125);"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-family:
"Calibri","sans-serif"; color: rgb(31,
73, 125);">So, I’ve <b>always</b> found those anti-choice
block parties offensive & it has nothing to do with this
year’s anti-choice event happening to fall on 9/11, which is
why I didn’t comment on that aspect of the thread. But,
with respect to the anti-choice block party, they’ve jumped
through the appropriate hoops to get whatever permits are
required. If I lived downtown, I’d likely have a different
perspective from a noise standpoint, as I’ve heard from
quite a few people who do live in the area that the noise is
beyond obnoxious. As I’ve told them, their recourse is to
take it up with the City.<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-family:
"Calibri","sans-serif"; color: rgb(31,
73, 125);"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-family:
"Calibri","sans-serif"; color: rgb(31,
73, 125);">Sunil, is that clearer now?<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-family:
"Calibri","sans-serif"; color: rgb(31,
73, 125);"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-family:
"Calibri","sans-serif"; color: rgb(31,
73, 125);">Saundra<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-family:
"Calibri","sans-serif"; color: rgb(31,
73, 125);">Moscow, ID<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-family:
"Calibri","sans-serif"; color: rgb(31,
73, 125);"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-family:
"Calibri","sans-serif"; color: rgb(31,
73, 125);">The only thing necessary for the triumph of evil
is for good people to do nothing.<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-family:
"Calibri","sans-serif"; color: rgb(31,
73, 125);">~ Edmund Burke<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-family:
"Calibri","sans-serif"; color: rgb(31,
73, 125);"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-family:
"Calibri","sans-serif"; color: rgb(31,
73, 125);"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-family:
"Calibri","sans-serif"; color: rgb(31,
73, 125);"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-family:
"Calibri","sans-serif"; color: rgb(31,
73, 125);"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
<div>
<div style="border-right: medium none; border-width: 1pt
medium medium; border-style: solid none none; border-color:
rgb(181, 196, 223) -moz-use-text-color -moz-use-text-color;
padding: 3pt 0in 0in;">
<p class="MsoNormal"><b><span style="font-size: 10pt;
font-family:
"Tahoma","sans-serif";">From:</span></b><span
style="font-size: 10pt; font-family:
"Tahoma","sans-serif";">
<a class="moz-txt-link-abbreviated" href="mailto:vision2020-bounces@moscow.com">vision2020-bounces@moscow.com</a>
[<a class="moz-txt-link-freetext" href="mailto:vision2020-bounces@moscow.com">mailto:vision2020-bounces@moscow.com</a>] <b>On Behalf Of
</b>Sunil Ramalingam<br>
<b>Sent:</b> Monday, September 12, 2011 8:58 PM<br>
<b>Cc:</b> vision 2020<br>
<b>Subject:</b> Re: [Vision2020] Hypocrisy (was RE:
September 11th Memorial Events)<o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
</div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><o:p> </o:p></p>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size: 10pt;
font-family: "Tahoma","sans-serif";">Saundra,<br>
<br>
Where are you going with this? Is it that Paul shouldn't
have a positive view of Jim based on his personal
experience with the man? Do you expect him to change his
views based on your experience with Jim? Or is it that he
shouldn't voice his opinion lest he grow bone-weary of
this thread and these attacks on him?<br>
<br>
I frequently disagree with Paul, but I don't think he's
being passive aggressive here. He just doesn't agree with
you, and amazingly you haven't won him over.<br>
<br>
I know Jim too, not in the context you do. I don't agree
with his religious views. We don't talk politics, but I
have to believe we disagree there too. But based on my
interactions with him, I like him. That's my opinion, and
I realize people I often agree with on various issues will
disagree with me. That's okay, we don't have to agree on
everything. You don't like him, and that's your opinion. I
can live with that.<br>
<br>
Sunil<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<div>
<div class="MsoNormal" style="text-align: center;"
align="center"><span style="font-size: 10pt; font-family:
"Tahoma","sans-serif";">
<hr id="stopSpelling" size="2" width="100%"
align="center"></span></div>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="margin-bottom: 12pt;"><span
style="font-size: 10pt; font-family:
"Tahoma","sans-serif";">From: <a
moz-do-not-send="true"
href="mailto:v2020@ssl1.fastmail.fm">v2020@ssl1.fastmail.fm</a><br>
To: <a moz-do-not-send="true"
href="mailto:godshatter@yahoo.com">godshatter@yahoo.com</a>;
<a moz-do-not-send="true" href="mailto:deco@moscow.com">deco@moscow.com</a><br>
Date: Mon, 12 Sep 2011 11:26:32 -0700<br>
CC: <a moz-do-not-send="true"
href="mailto:Vision2020@moscow.com">Vision2020@moscow.com</a><br>
Subject: Re: [Vision2020] Hypocrisy (was RE: September
11th Memorial Events)<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size: 10pt;
font-family:
"Calibri","sans-serif"; color:
rgb(31, 73, 125);">So, Paul, let’s get right down to
brass tacks instead of your passive-aggressive
patronizing BS that I suspect I’m not the only one
bone-weary of. Simple answer: yes or no. </span><span
style="font-size: 10pt; font-family:
"Tahoma","sans-serif";"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size: 10pt;
font-family:
"Calibri","sans-serif"; color:
rgb(31, 73, 125);"> </span><span style="font-size:
10pt; font-family:
"Tahoma","sans-serif";"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size: 10pt;
font-family:
"Calibri","sans-serif"; color:
rgb(31, 73, 125);">Is it your position, then, that if
the only way the head of a non-profit group like Jim
Wilson (or Doug Wilson or Roy Atwood, for that matter)
can keep the group’s tax exempt status is by being a
deceitful, dishonest, disingenuous liar (either by
omission or commission) <b>year after year after year</b>
to the “secular government,” appropriate descriptions
of that same person are “nice” and “respectful”?</span><span
style="font-size: 10pt; font-family:
"Tahoma","sans-serif";"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size: 10pt;
font-family:
"Calibri","sans-serif"; color:
rgb(31, 73, 125);"> </span><span style="font-size:
10pt; font-family:
"Tahoma","sans-serif";"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size: 10pt;
font-family:
"Calibri","sans-serif"; color:
rgb(31, 73, 125);">And, as was pointed out to me by an
offlist correspondent, if Jim Wilson would give you
the shirt off his back, remember it’s the <b>taxpayers</b>
who are paying for it, not Jim Wilson.</span><span
style="font-size: 10pt; font-family:
"Tahoma","sans-serif";"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size: 10pt;
font-family:
"Calibri","sans-serif"; color:
rgb(31, 73, 125);"> </span><span style="font-size:
10pt; font-family:
"Tahoma","sans-serif";"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size: 10pt;
font-family:
"Calibri","sans-serif"; color:
rgb(31, 73, 125);">Like it or not, Paul, tax exemption
– property or otherwise -- is a <b>privilege</b>
granted by the government in exchange for an agreement
by the exempt entity to abide by the rules -- it’s not
a right. Frankly, I think it’s an outdated model that
needs to be abolished because rampant abuse has been
proven time and again, both locally and around the
nation. Too, tax exemption dates back to a time when
the “greater good” works were done, for the most part,
in the home community – that’s clearly not the case
now.</span><span style="font-size: 10pt; font-family:
"Tahoma","sans-serif";"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size: 10pt;
font-family:
"Calibri","sans-serif"; color:
rgb(31, 73, 125);"> </span><span style="font-size:
10pt; font-family:
"Tahoma","sans-serif";"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size: 10pt;
font-family:
"Calibri","sans-serif"; color:
rgb(31, 73, 125);">Personally, I’m tickled pink that
some jurisdictions (Illinois & California are two)
are taking a <b>hard look</b> at property tax
exemptions – Idaho really should follow suit rather
than gutting education, going after services that help
the elderly & disabled stay in their communities
with decent qualities of life, providing basic
assistance to the working poor and economically
disadvantaged among us . . . and subsidizing the
disastrous efforts of big business. I think most
folks would be absolutely shocked at how much giving
away property tax exemptions costs our communities.
I’ve heard rumors of a movement in the southern part
of the state advocating that as a part of the NPO
& religious property tax exemption process, clear
public disclosure should be required of the financial
loss to the taxing jurisdiction & that information
should be freely available at assessor offices, in
person & online. Personally, I don’t think it’s
likely to be successful because we have too many in
government who represent their churches rather than <b>all</b>
of their constituents, but maybe I’ll be proven
wrong. Idaho has turned giving away <b>taxpayer</b>
money to cronies into a high art form and at great
cost – and waste – to the taxpayers. Huh – what a
surprise in a red state . . . not.</span><span
style="font-size: 10pt; font-family:
"Tahoma","sans-serif";"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size: 10pt;
font-family:
"Calibri","sans-serif"; color:
rgb(31, 73, 125);"> </span><span style="font-size:
10pt; font-family:
"Tahoma","sans-serif";"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size: 10pt;
font-family:
"Calibri","sans-serif"; color:
rgb(31, 73, 125);"> </span><span style="font-size:
10pt; font-family:
"Tahoma","sans-serif";"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size: 10pt;
font-family:
"Calibri","sans-serif"; color:
rgb(31, 73, 125);">Saundra Lund</span><span
style="font-size: 10pt; font-family:
"Tahoma","sans-serif";"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size: 10pt;
font-family:
"Calibri","sans-serif"; color:
rgb(31, 73, 125);">Moscow, ID</span><span
style="font-size: 10pt; font-family:
"Tahoma","sans-serif";"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size: 10pt;
font-family:
"Calibri","sans-serif"; color:
rgb(31, 73, 125);"> </span><span style="font-size:
10pt; font-family:
"Tahoma","sans-serif";"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size: 10pt;
font-family:
"Calibri","sans-serif"; color:
rgb(31, 73, 125);">The only thing necessary for the
triumph of evil is for good people to do nothing.</span><span
style="font-size: 10pt; font-family:
"Tahoma","sans-serif";"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size: 10pt;
font-family:
"Calibri","sans-serif"; color:
rgb(31, 73, 125);">~ Edmund Burke</span><span
style="font-size: 10pt; font-family:
"Tahoma","sans-serif";"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size: 10pt;
font-family:
"Calibri","sans-serif"; color:
rgb(31, 73, 125);"> </span><span style="font-size:
10pt; font-family:
"Tahoma","sans-serif";"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
<div>
<div style="border-right: medium none; border-width: 1pt
medium medium; border-style: solid none none;
border-color: rgb(181, 196, 223) -moz-use-text-color
-moz-use-text-color; padding: 3pt 0in 0in;">
<p class="MsoNormal"><b><span style="font-size: 10pt;
font-family:
"Tahoma","sans-serif";">From:</span></b><span
style="font-size: 10pt; font-family:
"Tahoma","sans-serif";"> Paul
Rumelhart <a moz-do-not-send="true"
href="mailto:[mailto:godshatter@yahoo.com]">[mailto:godshatter@yahoo.com]</a>
<br>
<b>Sent:</b> Sunday, September 11, 2011 3:13 PM<br>
<b>To:</b> Saundra Lund; 'Art Deco'<br>
<b>Cc:</b> <a moz-do-not-send="true"
href="mailto:Vision2020@moscow.com">Vision2020@moscow.com</a><br>
<b>Subject:</b> Re: Hypocrisy (was RE: September
11th Memorial Events)<o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
</div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size: 10pt;
font-family:
"Tahoma","sans-serif";"> <o:p></o:p></span></p>
<div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="background: none repeat
scroll 0% 0% white;"><span style="font-size: 10pt;
font-family:
"Tahoma","sans-serif"; color:
black;">Aren't all churches, all across the
country, tax exempt?</span><span style="font-size:
10pt; font-family:
"Tahoma","sans-serif";"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="background: none repeat
scroll 0% 0% white;"><span style="font-size: 10pt;
font-family:
"Tahoma","sans-serif"; color:
black;"> </span><span style="font-size: 10pt;
font-family:
"Tahoma","sans-serif";"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="background: none repeat
scroll 0% 0% white;"><span style="font-size: 10pt;
font-family:
"Tahoma","sans-serif"; color:
black;">I don't know what you're referring to when
you say he lied under oath, so I really can't
comment on it.</span><span style="font-size: 10pt;
font-family:
"Tahoma","sans-serif";"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="background: none repeat
scroll 0% 0% white;"><span style="font-size: 10pt;
font-family:
"Tahoma","sans-serif"; color:
black;"> </span><span style="font-size: 10pt;
font-family:
"Tahoma","sans-serif";"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="background: none repeat
scroll 0% 0% white;"><span style="font-size: 10pt;
font-family:
"Tahoma","sans-serif"; color:
black;">Anyway, my apologies for noticing the
guy's positive qualities.</span><span
style="font-size: 10pt; font-family:
"Tahoma","sans-serif";"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="background: none repeat
scroll 0% 0% white;"><span style="font-size: 10pt;
font-family:
"Tahoma","sans-serif"; color:
black;"> </span><span style="font-size: 10pt;
font-family:
"Tahoma","sans-serif";"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="background: none repeat
scroll 0% 0% white;"><span style="font-size: 10pt;
font-family:
"Tahoma","sans-serif"; color:
black;">Paul</span><span style="font-size: 10pt;
font-family:
"Tahoma","sans-serif";"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="background: none repeat
scroll 0% 0% white;"><span style="font-size: 10pt;
font-family:
"Tahoma","sans-serif"; color:
black;"> </span><span style="font-size: 10pt;
font-family:
"Tahoma","sans-serif";"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
<div>
<div>
<div class="MsoNormal" style="text-align: center;
background: none repeat scroll 0% 0% white;"
align="center"><span style="font-size: 10pt;
font-family:
"Arial","sans-serif"; color:
black;">
<hr size="1" width="100%" align="center"></span></div>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="margin-bottom: 12pt;
background: none repeat scroll 0% 0% white;"><b><span
style="font-size: 10pt; font-family:
"Arial","sans-serif";
color: black;">From:</span></b><span
style="font-size: 10pt; font-family:
"Arial","sans-serif"; color:
black;"> Saundra Lund <<a
moz-do-not-send="true"
href="mailto:v2020@ssl1.fastmail.fm">v2020@ssl1.fastmail.fm</a>><br>
<b>To:</b> 'Paul Rumelhart' <<a
moz-do-not-send="true"
href="mailto:godshatter@yahoo.com">godshatter@yahoo.com</a>>;
'Art Deco' <<a moz-do-not-send="true"
href="mailto:deco@moscow.com">deco@moscow.com</a>><br>
<b>Cc:</b> <a moz-do-not-send="true"
href="mailto:Vision2020@moscow.com">Vision2020@moscow.com</a><br>
<b>Sent:</b> Sunday, September 11, 2011 12:38 PM<br>
<b>Subject:</b> Hypocrisy (was RE: September
11th Memorial Events)<br>
<br>
</span><span style="font-size: 10pt; font-family:
"Tahoma","sans-serif";"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
<div id="ecxyiv176036632">
<div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="background: none
repeat scroll 0% 0% white;"><span
style="font-size: 10pt; font-family:
"Arial","sans-serif";
color: rgb(31, 73, 125);">In part, Paul
wrote:</span><span style="font-size: 10pt;
font-family:
"Tahoma","sans-serif";"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="background: none
repeat scroll 0% 0% white;"><span
style="font-size: 10pt; font-family:
"Arial","sans-serif";
color: rgb(31, 73, 125);">“</span><span
style="font-size: 10pt; font-family:
"Tahoma","sans-serif";
color: black;">I know Jim Wilson
personally. He's an extremely nice and
respectful individual, and (despite not
agreeing with him on matters of faith) is
as sane as anyone on this list. He's the
kind of guy that would give you the shirt
off his back if he thought you needed it
more than he. If he thinks a certain way
about something, it's because that's his
honest interpretation from reading his
Bible.”</span><span style="font-size:
10pt; font-family:
"Tahoma","sans-serif";"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="background: none
repeat scroll 0% 0% white;"><span
style="font-size: 10pt; font-family:
"Arial","sans-serif";
color: rgb(31, 73, 125);"> </span><span
style="font-size: 10pt; font-family:
"Tahoma","sans-serif";"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="background: none
repeat scroll 0% 0% white;"><span
style="font-size: 10pt; font-family:
"Arial","sans-serif";
color: rgb(31, 73, 125);">Huh – you must
know a different Jim Wilson than do I
because I personally don’t give a rip how
“nice” or “respectful” someone may be if
honesty & integrity are lacking, as is
the case with Jim Wilson wanting a free
tax ride & expecting government –
which means you & me -- to pay for his
ride. My friends will remember how
completely shocked & disappointed I
was that Wilson had no difficulty being
dishonest under oath. Pathetic.</span><span
style="font-size: 10pt; font-family:
"Tahoma","sans-serif";"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="background: none
repeat scroll 0% 0% white;"><span
style="font-size: 10pt; font-family:
"Arial","sans-serif";
color: rgb(31, 73, 125);"> </span><span
style="font-size: 10pt; font-family:
"Tahoma","sans-serif";"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="background: none
repeat scroll 0% 0% white;"><span
style="font-size: 10pt; font-family:
"Arial","sans-serif";
color: rgb(31, 73, 125);">Personally, I
don’t think it’s OK to be disingenuous –
at best – just to stick the rest of us
with CCM’s tax bill, and I don’t think God
thinks it’s OK, either. Lying, cheating,
stealing – or being intentionally obtuse
-- are OK as long as long as you’re
ripping off those who don’t share a
particular faith, eh? Not in my faith,
and not in my world, it isn’t.</span><span
style="font-size: 10pt; font-family:
"Tahoma","sans-serif";"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="background: none
repeat scroll 0% 0% white;"><span
style="font-size: 10pt; font-family:
"Arial","sans-serif";
color: rgb(31, 73, 125);"> </span><span
style="font-size: 10pt; font-family:
"Tahoma","sans-serif";"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="background: none
repeat scroll 0% 0% white;"><span
style="font-size: 10pt; font-family:
"Arial","sans-serif";
color: rgb(31, 73, 125);">Hypocrisy is
hypocrisy is hypocrisy, and we know that
it pains you, Paul, but it’s even more
reprehensible when it comes from so-called
“religious leaders” like Jim Wilson.</span><span
style="font-size: 10pt; font-family:
"Tahoma","sans-serif";"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="background: none
repeat scroll 0% 0% white;"><span
style="font-size: 10pt; font-family:
"Arial","sans-serif";
color: rgb(31, 73, 125);"> </span><span
style="font-size: 10pt; font-family:
"Tahoma","sans-serif";"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="background: none
repeat scroll 0% 0% white;"><span
style="font-size: 10pt; font-family:
"Arial","sans-serif";
color: rgb(31, 73, 125);"> </span><span
style="font-size: 10pt; font-family:
"Tahoma","sans-serif";"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="background: none
repeat scroll 0% 0% white;"><span
style="font-size: 10pt; font-family:
"Arial","sans-serif";
color: rgb(31, 73, 125);">Saundra Lund</span><span
style="font-size: 10pt; font-family:
"Tahoma","sans-serif";"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="background: none
repeat scroll 0% 0% white;"><span
style="font-size: 10pt; font-family:
"Arial","sans-serif";
color: rgb(31, 73, 125);">Moscow, ID</span><span
style="font-size: 10pt; font-family:
"Tahoma","sans-serif";"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="background: none
repeat scroll 0% 0% white;"><span
style="font-size: 10pt; font-family:
"Arial","sans-serif";
color: rgb(31, 73, 125);"> </span><span
style="font-size: 10pt; font-family:
"Tahoma","sans-serif";"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="background: none
repeat scroll 0% 0% white;"><span
style="font-size: 10pt; font-family:
"Arial","sans-serif";
color: rgb(31, 73, 125);">The only thing
necessary for the triumph of evil is for
good people to do nothing.</span><span
style="font-size: 10pt; font-family:
"Tahoma","sans-serif";"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="background: none
repeat scroll 0% 0% white;"><span
style="font-size: 10pt; font-family:
"Arial","sans-serif";
color: rgb(31, 73, 125);">~ Edmund Burke</span><span
style="font-size: 10pt; font-family:
"Tahoma","sans-serif";"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
</div>
</div>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="margin-bottom: 12pt;
background: none repeat scroll 0% 0% white;"><span
style="font-size: 10pt; font-family:
"Tahoma","sans-serif";
color: black;"> </span><span style="font-size:
10pt; font-family:
"Tahoma","sans-serif";"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
</div>
</div>
</div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size: 10pt;
font-family: "Tahoma","sans-serif";"><br>
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