<html><body bgcolor="#FFFFFF"><div>Beck refers to all liberals as communists. </div><div><br></div><div>Roger makes connections between liberals and communists regularly. </div><div><br></div><div>Young had several similar posts on his Facebook page when he ran for state senate.</div><div><br></div><div>And you criticize all my posts. You make it seem like there is something special here but your claims are always the same.</div><div><br></div><div>Do liberals contribute to the negative climate? Of course. It is silly to think that just because I don't say it I don't think it.</div><div><br></div><div>A poster picking out a target who was actually shot is something different.</div><div><br></div><div><br></div><div><br></div><div><br><br><br></div><div><br>On Jan 13, 2011, at 11:56 AM, "the lockshop" <<a href="mailto:lockshop@pull.twcbc.com">lockshop@pull.twcbc.com</a>> wrote:<br><br></div><div></div><blockquote type="cite"><div>
<div><font face="Arial" size="2">As non sequiturs go, a little more out of left
field then usual but what the heck, I'll play along. Who on the right regularly
refers to ALL liberals as nazis and what does it have to do with using
unfortunate current events to tar those with whom you disagree?</font></div>
<div><font face="Arial" size="2"></font> </div>
<div><font face="Arial" size="2">g</font></div>
<blockquote style="PADDING-RIGHT: 0px; PADDING-LEFT: 5px; MARGIN-LEFT: 5px; BORDER-LEFT: #000000 2px solid; MARGIN-RIGHT: 0px">
<div style="FONT: 10pt arial">----- Original Message ----- </div>
<div style="BACKGROUND: #e4e4e4; FONT: 10pt arial; font-color: black"><b>From:</b>
<a title="philosopher.joe@gmail.com" href="mailto:philosopher.joe@gmail.com">Joe
Campbell</a> </div>
<div style="FONT: 10pt arial"><b>To:</b> <a title="jampot@roadrunner.com" href="mailto:jampot@roadrunner.com">Gary Crabtree</a> </div>
<div style="FONT: 10pt arial"><b>Cc:</b> <a title="lockshop@pull.twcbc.com" href="mailto:lockshop@pull.twcbc.com">the lockshop</a> ; <a title="vision2020@moscow.com" href="mailto:vision2020@moscow.com>"><<a href="mailto:vision2020@moscow.com">vision2020@moscow.com</a>></a> </div>
<div style="FONT: 10pt arial"><b>Sent:</b> Thursday, January 13, 2011 9:51
AM</div>
<div style="FONT: 10pt arial"><b>Subject:</b> Re: [Vision2020] A Resolution
for the 112th Congress (after the Tucson Tragedy)</div>
<div><br></div>
<div>There just are no examples of candidates or media figures who regularly
refer to ALL conservatives as Nazis. There are plenty of analogous examples
from the right.<br><br><br></div>
<div><br>On Jan 13, 2011, at 6:04 AM, "Gary Crabtree" <<a href="mailto:jampot@roadrunner.com"><a href="mailto:jampot@roadrunner.com">jampot@roadrunner.com</a></a>>
wrote:<br><br></div>
<div></div>
<blockquote type="cite">
<div>
<div><font face="Calibri" color="#000000">I would have a sliver of respect for
your point if you included so much as a <br>single example of rhetoric that
was not from the the right. To endlessly<br>drone that</font> "it's just as
extreme to say that the volatile political <br>rhetoric of the radical right
and the climate it created, and the Palin poster <br>in particular, had
nothing to do with the shooting." <font face="Calibri" color="#000000">and never
once include<br>one of the multitude of examples that are just as
prevalent on the left.<br>You are clearly trying to paint the maniac as, at
least partially, a product <br>of the right and I'm having none of it so
stop. Really, just stop.</font></div>
<div><font face="Calibri" color="#000000"></font> </div>
<div><font face="Calibri" color="#000000">g</font></div><font face="Calibri" color="#000000"></font>
<div><font face="Calibri" color="#000000"><br><br></font>--------------------------------------------------<br>From:
"Joe Campbell" <<a href="mailto:philosopher.joe@gmail.com"><a href="mailto:philosopher.joe@gmail.com">philosopher.joe@gmail.com</a></a>><br>Sent:
Wednesday, January 12, 2011 8:56 PM<br>To: "Gary Crabtree" <<a href="mailto:jampot@roadrunner.com"><a href="mailto:jampot@roadrunner.com">jampot@roadrunner.com</a></a>><br>Cc:
"the lockshop" <<a href="mailto:lockshop@pull.twcbc.com"><a href="mailto:lockshop@pull.twcbc.com">lockshop@pull.twcbc.com</a></a>>;
<<a href="mailto:vision2020@moscow.com"><a href="mailto:vision2020@moscow.com">vision2020@moscow.com</a></a>><br>Subject:
Re: [Vision2020] A Resolution for the 112th Congress (after the Tucson
Tragedy)<br><br>> What exactly is the moon beam claim? That a "nothing"
claim is<br>> extreme? And please stop with the "wishful thinking" claim,
which is<br>> just repeating the insulting comment that Tom posted from
Rush, that<br>> Democrats wanted this to happen. Have you no decency?
Really just<br>> stop.<br>> <br>> I'll repeat what I said, again,
so it doesn't get lost in your<br>> continued attempts to distort my
words: It is extreme to say Palin did<br>> it and just as extreme to say
that the climate created by the rhetoric<br>> of the radical right had
nothing to do with the shooting. The truth<br>> lies somewhere in
between. Where? I don't know. I don't need evidence<br>> that he saw the
map to support this claim, just to support the extreme<br>> position you
keep trying to put in my mouth (which I do not hold).<br>> <br>> On
Wed, Jan 12, 2011 at 8:44 PM, Gary Crabtree <<a href="mailto:jampot@roadrunner.com"><a href="mailto:jampot@roadrunner.com">jampot@roadrunner.com</a></a>>
wrote:<br>>> " I think it is just as extreme to say that the volatile
political rhetoric<br>>> of the<br>>> radical right and the
climate it created, and the Palin poster in<br>>>
particular,<br>>> had nothing to do with the shooting.
"<br>>><br>>> I might be willing to accept this if there was
even a shred of evidence<br>>> that the psychopath had seen the map or
paid any attention to right<br>>> wing commentary. So far, the
indications are that he didn't and your<br>>> claims appear to be made
up of moon beams, fairy dust, and a heaping<br>>> shovel full of
wishful thinking<br>>><br>>>
g<br>>><br>>><br>>><br>>>
--------------------------------------------------<br>>> From: "Joe
Campbell" <<a href="mailto:philosopher.joe@gmail.com"><a href="mailto:philosopher.joe@gmail.com">philosopher.joe@gmail.com</a></a>><br>>>
Sent: Wednesday, January 12, 2011 8:28 PM<br>>> To: "the lockshop"
<<a href="mailto:lockshop@pull.twcbc.com"><a href="mailto:lockshop@pull.twcbc.com">lockshop@pull.twcbc.com</a></a>><br>>>
Cc: <<a href="mailto:vision2020@moscow.com"><a href="mailto:vision2020@moscow.com">vision2020@moscow.com</a></a>><br>>>
Subject: Re: [Vision2020] A Resolution for the 112th Congress (after
the<br>>> Tucson Tragedy)<br>>><br>>>> What is the uber
left? What policies do they hold? What are they<br>>>> saying about
Palin that is so egregious? Be specific. Use
quotes.<br>>>><br>>>> I know that I've made some claims
about Palin and the shooter, but<br>>>> most of my claims were
distorted by you and by Roger. I never blamed<br>>>> Palin, for
instance. I certainly never claimed that she was<br>>>> responsible
in any way. It would be an extreme claim to say that she<br>>>> was
an accessory, which I don't believe and never said. But I think
it<br>>>> is just as extreme to say that the volatile political
rhetoric of the<br>>>> radical right and the climate it created,
and the Palin poster in<br>>>> particular, had nothing to do with
the shooting. In between the<br>>>> extreme all and nothing claims
are a variety of more plausible views<br>>>> and I haven't said
which of those I accept because I really don't know<br>>>> what to
say about it.<br>>>><br>>>> You say "Stop trying to
tarnish your ideological 'enemies' with<br>>>> reasons for a event
that just are not there." But this is such a joke<br>>>> it is not
funny. I'm merely asking that Palin and others stop using a<br>>>>
"bullseye" to target their political enemies, that the right
stop<br>>>> referring to everyone on the left as a communist, that
they stop the<br>>>> distortion and the over-the-top rhetoric. That
we realize, as one V<br>>>> post put it, we are hovering around the
same spot on the political<br>>>> compass. Again, there is nothing
radical about any of this and it is<br>>>> precisely the very same
request that you're making. So I find that<br>>>>
ironic!<br>>>><br>>>> Add to this that if I had political
motives, what I'd do is keep my<br>>>> mouth shut wrt criticisms of
Palin. What I'd try to do is get her to<br>>>> win the Republican
nomination since she is one of handful of people<br>>>> that Obama
has a chance of beating. She is simply not electable. I<br>>>> hope
she does win the Republican nomination for that very reason
(but<br>>>> she won't). So if I were playing political gamesmanship
I'd keep quiet<br>>>> about her. I wouldn't criticize her. It makes
no sense to criticize<br>>>> her if you're a Democrat and your only
concern is to get Democrats<br>>>> elected. She is the best thing
for the party in years. But I'm out of<br>>>> politics and have
more broad social concerns, like the well being of<br>>>> our
country. I'm using this as an opportunity to try to get the<br>>>>
over-the-top rhetoric to stop.<br>>>><br>>>> Lastly, wrt
to your claims about "surveyor symbols" that is just plain<br>>>>
stupid. I'm not saying you are stupid since I don't think for a
minute<br>>>> that you believe that story. So the fact that I don't
believe it can't<br>>>> be a slight against me. No one believes
that story, and we're not all<br>>>> members of the uber left. Even
the folks telling that story don't<br>>>> believe
it.<br>>>><br>>>> Here's a nice article on the
issue.<br>>>><br>>>><br>>>> <a href="http://voices.washingtonpost.com/fact-checker/2011/01/gunsights_or_surveyor_symbols.html"></a><a href="http://voices.washingtonpost.com/fact-checker/2011/01/gunsights_or_surveyor_symbols.html"><a href="http://voices.washingtonpost.com/fact-checker/2011/01/gunsights_or_surveyor_symbols.html">http://voices.washingtonpost.com/fact-checker/2011/01/gunsights_or_surveyor_symbols.html</a></a><br>>>><br>>>>
At the end of this article there is a comment from Palin
herself,<br>>>> tweeted after the election: "Remember months ago
'bullseye' icon used<br>>>> 2 target the 20 Obamacare-lovin'
incumbent seats? We won 18 out of 20<br>>>> (90% success
rate;T'aint bad)."<br>>>><br>>>> Nothing about surveying
here from the horses mouth. Try explaining<br>>>> this! Or better
yet, try dropping this stupid fairytale altogether. NO<br>>>> one
is buying it.<br>>>><br>>>> On Wed, Jan 12, 2011 at 5:25
PM, the lockshop <<a href="mailto:lockshop@pull.twcbc.com"><a href="mailto:lockshop@pull.twcbc.com">lockshop@pull.twcbc.com</a></a>><br>>>>
wrote:<br>>>>> The symbol means here, this place, this location
on the map. In other<br>>>>> words<br>>>>> this is a
district where we would like a Republican to be in office.
Sort<br>>>>> of<br>>>>> like X marks the spot. Why
the uber left keeps trying to make this<br>>>>>
tragedy<br>>>>> about Sarah and the right is really an unsavory
mystery. The shooter was<br>>>>> crazy. Stop trying to tarnish
your ideological "enemies" with reasons for<br>>>>>
a<br>>>>> event that just are not
there.<br>>>>><br>>>>> g<br>>>>> -----
Original Message ----- From: "Joe Campbell"<br>>>>> <<a href="mailto:philosopher.joe@gmail.com"><a href="mailto:philosopher.joe@gmail.com">philosopher.joe@gmail.com</a></a>><br>>>>>
To: <<a href="mailto:nickgier@roadrunner.com"><a href="mailto:nickgier@roadrunner.com">nickgier@roadrunner.com</a></a>><br>>>>>
Cc: <<a href="mailto:vision2020@moscow.com"><a href="mailto:vision2020@moscow.com">vision2020@moscow.com</a></a>><br>>>>>
Sent: Wednesday, January 12, 2011 4:46 PM<br>>>>> Subject: Re:
[Vision2020] A Resolution for the 112th Congress (after
the<br>>>>> Tucson
Tragedy)<br>>>>><br>>>>><br>>>>> Another
question: What possible meaning or significance could
surveyor<br>>>>> symbols have? Why that
symbol?<br>>>>><br>>>>> On Wed, Jan 12, 2011 at 4:26
PM, <<a href="mailto:nickgier@roadrunner.com"><a href="mailto:nickgier@roadrunner.com">nickgier@roadrunner.com</a></a>>
wrote:<br>>>>>><br>>>>>> A note to Roger and
Gary:<br>>>>>><br>>>>>> When Democrats start
calling for "Second Amendment" solutions, then I<br>>>>>>
will<br>>>>>> consider your losing battle to make Democrats
more violent.<br>>>>>><br>>>>>> If Palin meant
those to be surveyor symbols, why did she accompany
the<br>>>>>> map<br>>>>>> with the tweet
"Don't Retreat, Reload"? Could it be that the
webmaster<br>>>>>> couldn't find the cross-hairs symbol that
he really intended and
needed?<br>>>>>><br>>>>>>
Nick<br>>>>>><br>>>>>> A RESOLUTION FOR THE
112TH CONGRESS<br>>>>>><br>>>>>> Whereas, the
Pima County Sheriff rightly said that violent rhetoric
has<br>>>>>>
consequences;<br>>>>>><br>>>>>> Whereas,
abortion clinic doctors were marked with cross-hairs and
“four<br>>>>>> doctors, two clinic employees, a security
guard, and a clinic escort<br>>>>>>
were<br>>>>>>
killed”;<br>>>>>><br>>>>>> Whereas, GOP Senate
candidate Sharon Angle and Tea Party leaders<br>>>>>>
declared<br>>>>>> that a “Second Amendment” solution may be
necessary for the Obama<br>>>>>>
administration;<br>>>>>><br>>>>>> Whereas, in
November of 2009 a person brought a handgun to one of
now<br>>>>>> critically wounded Rep. Gabriel Giffords’
community gatherings;<br>>>>>><br>>>>>>
Whereas, GOP Vice-Presidential candidate Sarah Palin targeted
22<br>>>>>> Democratic seats with a symbol that Giffords, a
gun owner, took as<br>>>>>> cross-hairs (the map was followed
by a tweet that said “Don’t Retreat,<br>>>>>>
Reload”);<br>>>>>><br>>>>>> Whereas, Gifford’s
opponent Jesse Kelley asked supporters to "shoot a<br>>>>>>
fully automatic M16" to "get on target" and help "remove
Gabrielle<br>>>>>>
Giffords";<br>>>>>><br>>>>>> Whereas, on Fox
Business News Sarah Palin offered praise for Kelly:
"I<br>>>>>> don't feel worthy to lace his combat
boots";<br>>>>>><br>>>>>> Whereas, on January
12, 2011 four GOP leaders in Arizona, criticized as<br>>>>>>
McCain supporters, resigned after violent threats from Tea
Party<br>>>>>>
activists;<br>>>>>><br>>>>>> Whereas,
Giffords’ office was vandalized right after she voted for
the<br>>>>>> Affordable Health Care
Act;<br>>>>>><br>>>>>> Whereas, the U.S. lags
other industrialized countries in mental health<br>>>>>>
services, and Arizona ranks second to last in the
U.S.;<br>>>>>><br>>>>>> Whereas, repeal of the
Affordable Health Care Act has no chance of<br>>>>>>
passing<br>>>>>>
Congress;<br>>>>>><br>>>>>> Whereas,
Americans, sometime by polls of 2-1, support major aspects
of<br>>>>>> the<br>>>>>> Affordable Health
Care Act;<br>>>>>><br>>>>>> Therefore Be it
Resolved that the repeal of the Affordable Health
Care<br>>>>>> Act<br>>>>>> be
withdrawn;<br>>>>>><br>>>>>> Be It Further
Resolved that more funds be provided for mental
health<br>>>>>>
treatment;<br>>>>>><br>>>>>> And May It
Further Resolved that all Americans stop demonizing
their<br>>>>>> political and religious opponents and refrain
from using violent<br>>>>>> rhetoric<br>>>>>>
about them.<br>>>>>><br>>>>>> And Finally May
It Be Resolved that on the eve of the MLK Holiday
all<br>>>>>> Americans attempt to embrace the ethics of
non-violence that Martin<br>>>>>>
Luther<br>>>>>> King drew from Mahatma Gandhi and his own
Christian faith.<br>>>>>><br>>>>>>
=======================================================<br>>>>>>
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=======================================================<br>>>>><br>>>>>
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