<html><body style="word-wrap: break-word; -webkit-nbsp-mode: space; -webkit-line-break: after-white-space; ">Ron,<div><br></div><div>WOW! I knew it was bad, but had no idea it was that bad! It is especially interesting to see the "Student Fees" of <span class="Apple-style-span" style="border-collapse: collapse; color: rgb(51, 51, 51); line-height: 13px; "><font class="Apple-style-span" face="Arial" size="3"><span class="Apple-style-span" style="font-size: 12px;">$2,154,873.00 </span></font></span></div><div><font class="Apple-style-span" color="#333333" face="Arial"><span class="Apple-style-span" style="border-collapse: collapse; line-height: 13px;"><br></span></font></div><div><font class="Apple-style-span" color="#333333" face="Arial"><span class="Apple-style-span" style="border-collapse: collapse; line-height: 13px;">Why not give the STUDENTS a say so in those fees, as in should they even be paid? IF there is so much support for these activities, surely individual "school spirit" will come through.</span></font></div><div><font class="Apple-style-span" color="#333333" face="Arial"><span class="Apple-style-span" style="border-collapse: collapse; line-height: 13px;">After all, the popular myth is that EVERYONE wants college athletics! Any one want to guess how that would go?</span></font></div><div><font class="Apple-style-span" color="#333333" face="Arial"><span class="Apple-style-span" style="border-collapse: collapse; line-height: 13px;"><br></span></font></div><div><font class="Apple-style-span" color="#333333" face="Arial"><span class="Apple-style-span" style="border-collapse: collapse; line-height: 13px;">And the "Medical expenses and medical insurance" quarter of a million is interesting. Anyone on the list have an amount of what it costs </span></font></div><div><font class="Apple-style-span" color="#333333" face="Arial"><span class="Apple-style-span" style="border-collapse: collapse; line-height: 13px;">to insure the rest of the entire student body? </span></font></div><div><font class="Apple-style-span" color="#333333" face="Arial"><span class="Apple-style-span" style="border-collapse: collapse; line-height: 13px;"><br></span></font></div><div><font class="Apple-style-span" color="#333333" face="Arial"><span class="Apple-style-span" style="border-collapse: collapse; line-height: 13px;"><br></span></font></div><div><font class="Apple-style-span" color="#333333" face="Arial"><span class="Apple-style-span" style="border-collapse: collapse; line-height: 13px;">And for our legislators on the list, state subsidy for college athletics at the same time we are declaring financial emergencies in education due to budget cuts?</span></font></div><div><font class="Apple-style-span" color="#333333" face="Arial"><span class="Apple-style-span" style="border-collapse: collapse; line-height: 13px;"> Does that really make any sense to you?</span></font></div><span class="Apple-style-span" style="font-family: arial, helvetica, clean, sans-serif; border-collapse: collapse; color: rgb(102, 102, 102); font-size: 12px; line-height: 14px; "><h3 style="margin-top: 0px; margin-right: 0px; margin-bottom: 0px; margin-left: 0px; padding-top: 0px; padding-right: 0px; padding-bottom: 0px; padding-left: 0px; font-size: 11px; font-weight: bold; color: rgb(0, 0, 0); "><br></h3></span><div><br></div><div><br></div><div><br></div><div>--------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------</div><div><br></div><div><br><div><div>On Apr 23, 2010, at 5:29 PM, Ron Force wrote:</div><br class="Apple-interchange-newline"><blockquote type="cite"><span class="Apple-style-span" style="border-collapse: separate; color: rgb(0, 0, 0); font-family: Helvetica; font-size: medium; font-style: normal; font-variant: normal; font-weight: normal; letter-spacing: normal; line-height: normal; orphans: 2; text-align: auto; text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none; white-space: normal; widows: 2; word-spacing: 0px; -webkit-border-horizontal-spacing: 0px; -webkit-border-vertical-spacing: 0px; -webkit-text-decorations-in-effect: none; -webkit-text-size-adjust: auto; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px; "><div><div style="margin-top: 0px; margin-right: 0px; margin-bottom: 0px; margin-left: 0px; font-family: 'times new roman', 'new york', times, serif; font-size: 12pt; "><div style="margin-top: 0px; margin-right: 0px; margin-bottom: 0px; margin-left: 0px; ">The Athletic Department doesn't even come close to breaking even. You can see the financial reports submitted to the NCAA here:<br><br></div><div style="margin-top: 0px; margin-right: 0px; margin-bottom: 0px; margin-left: 0px; font-family: 'times new roman', 'new york', times, serif; font-size: 12pt; "><span><a target="_blank" href="http://www.usatoday.com/sports/college/ncaa-finances.htm">http://www.usatoday.com/sports/college/ncaa-finances.htm</a></span><br><br>In 2008-09 they received the following outside ticket sales, TV, donations, etc in a total budget of $15,126,899:<br><br>Student fees: $2,154,873<br>State support: $3,033,417<br>Direct Institutional Support; $2,460,731<br><br>State support is a line item in the budget from the legislature. Direct institutional support is other funds appropriated internally.<span class="Apple-converted-space"> </span><br><br>BSU gets the same state subsidy, and raises about the same from student fees and indirect support, but hey have a $30 million budget. The difference? Three times as much in contributions, six times as much in ticket sales, much more in TV, game guarantees, bowl receipts. licensing revenue, etc.<br><br>Interestingly, Idaho State gets the same state subsidy--the state doesn't play favorites--and comes close in institutional support and student fees. They only have a $10 million total budget.<br><br>Ron Force<br>Moscow Idaho USA<br><br><br><div style="margin-top: 0px; margin-right: 0px; margin-bottom: 0px; margin-left: 0px; font-family: arial, helvetica, sans-serif; font-size: 13px; "><font face="Tahoma" size="2"><hr size="1"><b><span style="font-weight: bold; ">From:</span></b><span class="Apple-converted-space"> </span>lfalen <<a href="mailto:lfalen@turbonet.com">lfalen@turbonet.com</a>><br><b><span style="font-weight: bold; ">To:</span></b><span class="Apple-converted-space"> </span>Wayne Price <<a href="mailto:bear@moscow.com">bear@moscow.com</a>>; Moscow Vision 2020 <<a href="mailto:vision2020@moscow.com">vision2020@moscow.com</a>><br><b><span style="font-weight: bold; ">Sent:</span></b><span class="Apple-converted-space"> </span>Fri, April 23, 2010 4:35:12 PM<br><b><span style="font-weight: bold; ">Subject:</span></b><span class="Apple-converted-space"> </span>Re: [Vision2020] Raise Our Taxes U of I - Seriously Look at HardChoices<br></font><br>Wayne<br>You gave a very thoughtful run down of things to look at. The Athletic Department is important if it brings in more money than it costs. I do question that we are in the right conference, but do not have the answer to that. This is a Land Grant College and we are an agricultural state, so yes we need the Ag College and the Extension Service. There are however some Experimental Stations that could be closed. When that has been tried, there has been an uproar from the communities in which they resided.<br>Roger<br>-----Original message-----<br>From: Wayne Price<span class="Apple-converted-space"> </span><a ymailto="mailto:bear@moscow.com" href="mailto:bear@moscow.com">bear@moscow.com</a><br>Date: Fri, 23 Apr 2010 13:44:17 -0700<br>To: Moscow Vision 2020<span class="Apple-converted-space"> </span><a ymailto="mailto:vision2020@moscow.com" href="mailto:vision2020@moscow.com">vision2020@moscow.com</a><br>Subject: Re: [Vision2020] Raise Our Taxes U of I - Seriously Look at HardChoices<br><br>> The University President announced that there needs to be a new 5 year <span class="Apple-converted-space"> </span><br>> plan (as the old one's five years are up soon).<br>><span class="Apple-converted-space"> </span><br>> I agree when he states that the University cannot be all things to all <span class="Apple-converted-space"> </span><br>> people, and a serious look needs to be made in the matter of what IS <span class="Apple-converted-space"> </span><br>> essential to the University of Idaho and what isn't.<br>> Now, that's where the problems come in and it will boil down to who's <span class="Apple-converted-space"> </span><br>> ox is going to be gored.<br>><span class="Apple-converted-space"> </span><br>> For instance, does a university need an extensive and expensive sports/<span class="Apple-converted-space"> </span><br>> athletic program to be a functional and well recognized place of <span class="Apple-converted-space"> </span><br>> higher education? I've often heard how much the athletic program <span class="Apple-converted-space"> </span><br>> brings into the university, but have never heard IF it is self-<span class="Apple-converted-space"> </span><br>> supporting. Does the state's Land-Grant institution need an <span class="Apple-converted-space"> </span><br>> Agricultural College? A golf course? Women's studies? What about a <span class="Apple-converted-space"> </span><br>> million dollar plus contract for city policing? And the list goes on, <span class="Apple-converted-space"> </span><br>> I'm not singling out those programs alone. Maybe yes we need them, <span class="Apple-converted-space"> </span><br>> maybe no, we don't, but all should be looked at. Nothing should be <span class="Apple-converted-space"> </span><br>> a "sacred cow" and that includes high salaries for faculty as well as <span class="Apple-converted-space"> </span><br>> administration. How many 250k + people can the University support <span class="Apple-converted-space"> </span><br>> without cuts to core functions and values? I don't know, but it should <span class="Apple-converted-space"> </span><br>> be seriously looked at. AND with some serious reforms in the Human <span class="Apple-converted-space"> </span><br>> Resources department, I truly believe that more qualified <span class="Apple-converted-space"> </span><br>> administrators and faculty and staff CAN be found for a lower cost <span class="Apple-converted-space"> </span><br>> than we are currently paying. It's time to SERIOUSLY look outside the <span class="Apple-converted-space"> </span><br>> box for solutions to the tough economic times we are facing now, have <span class="Apple-converted-space"> </span><br>> been facing and will be facing for the near future.<br>><span class="Apple-converted-space"> </span><br>><span class="Apple-converted-space"> </span><br>><span class="Apple-converted-space"> </span><br>><span class="Apple-converted-space"> </span><br>><span class="Apple-converted-space"> </span><br>><span class="Apple-converted-space"> </span><br>><span class="Apple-converted-space"> </span><br>><span class="Apple-converted-space"> </span><br>><span class="Apple-converted-space"> </span><br>><span class="Apple-converted-space"> </span><br>> On Apr 23, 2010, at 11:53 AM, Saundra Lund wrote:<br>><span class="Apple-converted-space"> </span><br>> > I dunno, Tom, but perhaps at least one of them would have some <span class="Apple-converted-space"> </span><br>> > ethics and<br>> > not be a liar . . . I'd be willing to pay *more* for that!<br>> ><br>> > I don't know about all three of those named, but I know for a fact <span class="Apple-converted-space"> </span><br>> > that one<br>> > has absolutely no qualms about telling lies when he thinks he can <span class="Apple-converted-space"> </span><br>> > get away<br>> > with it. And for that he's very handsomely compensated with very <span class="Apple-converted-space"> </span><br>> > little in<br>> > the way of job qualifications -- it was one of Tim White's last F-<span class="Apple-converted-space"> </span><br>> > yous to<br>> > the UI. No wonder this country has gone to heck in a hand basket -- <span class="Apple-converted-space"> </span><br>> > we've<br>> > become a society where we think paying big bucks buys top quality when<br>> > that's just not the case, as we've seen at the UI time & time <span class="Apple-converted-space"> </span><br>> > again. When<br>> > will we learn???<br>> ><br>> > I just don't get why people think we should continue to handsomely <span class="Apple-converted-space"> </span><br>> > reward<br>> > dishonest & unethical university administrators . . . .<br>> ><br>> ><br>> ><br>> > Saundra Lund<br>> > Moscow, ID<br>> ><br>> > The only thing necessary for the triumph of evil is for good people <span class="Apple-converted-space"> </span><br>> > to do<br>> > nothing.<br>> > ~ Edmund Burke<br>> ><br>> > ***** Original material contained herein is Copyright 2010 through <span class="Apple-converted-space"> </span><br>> > life plus<br>> > 70 years, Saundra Lund. Do not copy, forward, excerpt, or reproduce <span class="Apple-converted-space"> </span><br>> > outside<br>> > the Vision 2020 forum without the express written permission of the<br>> > author.*****<br>> ><br>> ><br>> ><br>> ><br>> ><br>> ><br>> ><br>> > -----Original Message-----<br>> > From:<span class="Apple-converted-space"> </span><a ymailto="mailto:vision2020-bounces@moscow.com" href="mailto:vision2020-bounces@moscow.com">vision2020-bounces@moscow.com</a><span class="Apple-converted-space"> </span>[mailto:<a ymailto="mailto:vision2020-bounces@moscow.com" href="mailto:vision2020-bounces@moscow.com">vision2020-bounces@moscow.com</a><span class="Apple-converted-space"> </span><br>> > ]<br>> > On Behalf Of Tom Hansen<br>> > Sent: Friday, April 23, 2010 11:34 AM<br>> > To: Mo Hendrickson<br>> > Cc: Moscow Vision 2020<br>> > Subject: Re: [Vision2020] Raise Our Taxes<br>> ><br>> > Very well stated, Mo.<br>> ><br>> > Instead of throwing rocks only to retreat and crawl back under one, <span class="Apple-converted-space"> </span><br>> > how<br>> > about some constructive support?<br>> ><br>> > Do you really think, Roger (?), that those hired to replace Baker, <span class="Apple-converted-space"> </span><br>> > Mues,<br>> > and Daly-Laursen would be willing to accept those duties at a rate <span class="Apple-converted-space"> </span><br>> > less<br>> > than their current positions?<br>> ><br>> > Tom Hansen<br>> > Moscow, Idaho<br>> > UI '96<br>> ><br>> > "The Pessimist complains about the wind, the Optimist expects it to <span class="Apple-converted-space"> </span><br>> > change<br>> > and the Realist adjusts his sails."<br>> ><br>> > - Unknown<br>> ><br>> >><br>> >> "This is provided that they first cut out the fat at the top. At <span class="Apple-converted-space"> </span><br>> >> the UI<br>> >> that means Baker, Mues and Daly-Laursen. "<br>> >><br>> >> So Roger, you would cut these three people. SO you get rid of them, <span class="Apple-converted-space"> </span><br>> >> do you<br>> >> think the university could function without a VP of Finance and a <span class="Apple-converted-space"> </span><br>> >> Provost?<br>> >> Do you know what the expense is for running executive searches? Two <span class="Apple-converted-space"> </span><br>> >> of<br>> >> the three positions would be refilled, probably at a higher salary <span class="Apple-converted-space"> </span><br>> >> line,<br>> >> due to market salary increases. Yes I think that administrators <span class="Apple-converted-space"> </span><br>> >> make a<br>> >> lot more than anyone should get paid, but at the same time that is <span class="Apple-converted-space"> </span><br>> >> the way<br>> >> the system is set up. It is not unique to UI. So your idea to save<br>> >> money would probably end up costing the university MORE money.<br>> >><br>> >> I know that you have ties to the College of Ag, and yes they are in a<br>> >> particularly tough place financially. But the whole of the UI is <span class="Apple-converted-space"> </span><br>> >> hurting.<br>> >> Your ideas seem to have a trend towards take from somewhere else <span class="Apple-converted-space"> </span><br>> >> and fix<br>> >> Ag, well when you take from somewhere that has nothing you end up <span class="Apple-converted-space"> </span><br>> >> hurting<br>> >> that department or college. Offices across campus are one deep, <span class="Apple-converted-space"> </span><br>> >> everyone<br>> >> is doing more and not getting paid for the extra duties. It is <span class="Apple-converted-space"> </span><br>> >> time to be<br>> >> creative about how to raise monies, to recruit students, and create a<br>> >> sustainable working environment. That will not happen if we are all <span class="Apple-converted-space"> </span><br>> >> so<br>> >> focused on our own special interest.<br>> >><br>> >> I think there are some folks on this list with such animosity <span class="Apple-converted-space"> </span><br>> >> towards UI<br>> >> that they refuse to see any good and only find the negative. From <span class="Apple-converted-space"> </span><br>> >> where I<br>> >> sit, there are wonderful, fabulous, and amazing things happening at <span class="Apple-converted-space"> </span><br>> >> this<br>> >> university at ALL levels top to bottom, that some folks just don't <span class="Apple-converted-space"> </span><br>> >> see.<br>> >> Yes money is tight and things suck in a lot of departments and <span class="Apple-converted-space"> </span><br>> >> colleges,<br>> >> try and find some positive in all of this. Living in the negative <span class="Apple-converted-space"> </span><br>> >> is a<br>> >> miserable way to live. But hey that's your choice.<br>> >><br>> >> -Mo<br>> ><br>> > =======================================================<br>> > List services made available by First Step Internet,<br>> > serving the communities of the Palouse since 1994.<br><span>> > <span class="Apple-converted-space"> </span><a target="_blank" href="http://www.fsr.net">http://www.fsr.net</a></span><br>> > mailto:<a ymailto="mailto:Vision2020@moscow.com" href="mailto:Vision2020@moscow.com">Vision2020@moscow.com</a><br>> > =======================================================<br>> ><br>> > =======================================================<br>> > List services made available by First Step Internet,<br>> > serving the communities of the Palouse since 1994.<br>> > <span class="Apple-converted-space"> </span><a href="http://www.fsr.net" target="_blank">http://www.fsr.net</a><br>> > mailto:<a ymailto="mailto:Vision2020@moscow.com" href="mailto:Vision2020@moscow.com">Vision2020@moscow.com</a><br>> > =======================================================<br>><span class="Apple-converted-space"> </span><br>> =======================================================<br>> List services made available by First Step Internet,<span class="Apple-converted-space"> </span><br>> serving the communities of the Palouse since 1994. <span class="Apple-converted-space"> </span><br>> <span class="Apple-converted-space"> </span><a href="http://www.fsr.net" target="_blank">http://www.fsr.net</a> <span class="Apple-converted-space"> </span><br>> mailto:<a ymailto="mailto:Vision2020@moscow.com" href="mailto:Vision2020@moscow.com">Vision2020@moscow.com</a><br>> =======================================================<br><br>=======================================================<br>List services made available by First Step Internet,<span class="Apple-converted-space"> </span><br>serving the communities of the Palouse since 1994. <span class="Apple-converted-space"> </span><br> <span class="Apple-converted-space"> </span><a href="http://www.fsr.net" target="_blank">http://www.fsr.net</a> <span class="Apple-converted-space"> </span><br> mailto:<a ymailto="mailto:Vision2020@moscow.com" href="mailto:Vision2020@moscow.com">Vision2020@moscow.com</a><br>=======================================================<br></div></div></div><br></div></span><br class="Apple-interchange-newline"></blockquote></div><br></div></body></html>