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<DIV><FONT size=2>Here's the problem:</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT size=2></FONT> </DIV>
<DIV><FONT size=2>Some of us on the mountain have security devices
intended to detect trespassers, and the after dark measures designed
to discourage them may be quite draconian. Because of certain incidents,
anyone trespassing in our neighborhood after dark is not likely to appreciate
the attention they will receive from many of my neighbors.</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT size=2></FONT> </DIV>
<DIV><FONT size=2>I will be glad to do my census duty, and I am
not anti-federal government, I just do not want to have trespassers, and then
have to deal with the consequences. Let the census taker (or anyone
else) call for permission first, and then set a time for a
visit.</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT size=2></FONT> </DIV>
<DIV><FONT size=2>Not all Boundary County residents (or former residents) or
even most are rightwing psychopaths. But we do believe in privacy and the
right to secure our homes from unwanted threats and pests. I lived one
mile from the Canadian border as a child. We, and almost all our
neighbors, fired at border jumpers trying to steal vehicles, etc on more than
one occasion.</FONT></DIV>
<DIV> </DIV>
<DIV><FONT size=2></FONT> </DIV>
<DIV><FONT size=2>W.</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT size=2></FONT> </DIV>
<DIV><FONT size=2></FONT> </DIV>
<BLOCKQUOTE
style="BORDER-LEFT: #000000 2px solid; PADDING-LEFT: 5px; PADDING-RIGHT: 0px; MARGIN-LEFT: 5px; MARGIN-RIGHT: 0px">
<DIV style="FONT: 10pt arial">----- Original Message ----- </DIV>
<DIV
style="FONT: 10pt arial; BACKGROUND: #e4e4e4; font-color: black"><B>From:</B>
<A title=thansen@moscow.com href="mailto:thansen@moscow.com">Tom Hansen</A>
</DIV>
<DIV style="FONT: 10pt arial"><B>To:</B> <A title=rforce2003@yahoo.com
href="mailto:rforce2003@yahoo.com">Ron Force</A> </DIV>
<DIV style="FONT: 10pt arial"><B>Cc:</B> <A title=vision2020@moscow.com
href="mailto:vision2020@moscow.com">vision2020@moscow.com</A> </DIV>
<DIV style="FONT: 10pt arial"><B>Sent:</B> Friday, January 22, 2010 12:18
PM</DIV>
<DIV style="FONT: 10pt arial"><B>Subject:</B> Re: [Vision2020] 2010
Census</DIV>
<DIV><BR></DIV>I'd rather be a pop-up target on a rifle range than a census
taker (or<BR>ANYBODY, for that matter, with ties to the government) in
Boundary County.<BR><BR>Does the phrase "Randy Weaver - Ruby Ridge - August
1992" ring any bells?<BR><BR><A
href="http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ruby_Ridge">http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ruby_Ridge</A><BR><BR>Remember
that FLDS (Fundamentalist Church of Latter Day Saints) compound<BR>in Texas
that drew national attention concerning the children on
that<BR>compound.<BR><BR>Well, there is a splinter group of the FLDS organized
right ther outside<BR>of Naples, Idaho.<BR><BR><A
href="http://www.komonews.com/news/local/39696072.html">http://www.komonews.com/news/local/39696072.html</A><BR><BR>Any
V-peeps interested in going door-to-door in Boundary County for
the<BR>census? I'm sure there are a few vacancies.<BR><BR>Tom
Hansen<BR>Moscow, Idaho<BR><BR>> Google "census takers trespass" for an
eyefull-there's some real nutters<BR>> out there. I'd think twice about
signing up to be a "gum'ent snooper".<BR>> The Boundary County
Commissioners discussed this, here's their minutes:<BR>><BR>><BR>>
Commissioners<BR>> discussed census<BR>> takers and the issue of
trespassing. Boundary County has received one<BR>> complaint<BR>> on the
issue of census takers and trespassing. Attorney Robinson said<BR>>
Bonner<BR>> County has had numerous complaints on this topic. Bonner
County's<BR>> Sheriff and<BR>> Board of Commissioners initially said if
the property owners had "no<BR>> trespassing" signs, the Sheriff could have
had those visitors cited and<BR>> Attorney<BR>> Robinson said you can't
do that as there is a federal statute that<BR>> people shall<BR>>
cooperate with census workers. The Census Act doesn't say that people<BR>>
have the<BR>> right to trespass. Attorney Robinson said he conducted some
research and<BR>> there<BR>> are two cases in Idaho and he sent the
information to Prosecutor Jack<BR>> Douglas.<BR>> Attorney Robinson said
there is no trespass even if there is a "no<BR>> trespassing"<BR>> sign
when you approach a person's place, whether it is a respectful<BR>> visitor
or<BR>> someone with other legitimate purposes. These are legitimate
approaches<BR>> by such<BR>> people as mail carriers, newspapers
carriers, census workers, utility<BR>> workers,<BR>> and neighbors or
friends. If someone comes to the driveway of a house<BR>> just as a<BR>>
friend would, by law that is not a trespass. Attorney Robinson said he<BR>>
has heard<BR>> stories of people jumping over fences, checking out
outbuildings, etc.<BR>> Commissioner Dinning questioned if a census taker
comes to his house and<BR>> knocks<BR>> on his door and he tells them to
go away yet they continue to stay, is<BR>> that a<BR>> violation. It was
said that people are getting upset about the census<BR>> GIS<BR>>
workers. It was said that these workers are pre-census workers.
Attorney<BR>> Robinson said if someone says to go away they may be
violating the<BR>> federal<BR>> statute as it says you will cooperate.
Attorney Robinson informed Chief<BR>> Deputy<BR>> Prosecutor Sarah Jane
Hallock that he sent Prosecutor Douglas some Idaho<BR>> cases.<BR>>
Attorney Robinson relayed the case numbers to her. Attorney Robinson<BR>>
said one of<BR>> the cases includes the language and the various people
that someone<BR>> could<BR>> anticipate coming onto properties. Having a
GIS reader shouldn't make a<BR>> difference. These census takers have no
business running through<BR>> someone's back<BR>> field or buildings,
but they can approach the house. Commissioner<BR>> Dinning said<BR>>
since the census is next year, how can this be a census worker.
Attorney<BR>> Robinson said these people are census workers and his office
has checked<BR>> on<BR>> that. They are clearly there on behalf of the
census takers, according<BR>> to<BR>> Attorney Robinson.<BR>><BR>>
Ron Force<BR>> Moscow ID
USA<BR>><BR>><BR>><BR>><BR>><BR>>
________________________________<BR>> From: Kenneth Marcy <<A
href="mailto:kmmos1@verizon.net">kmmos1@verizon.net</A>><BR>> To: <A
href="mailto:vision2020@moscow.com">vision2020@moscow.com</A><BR>> Sent:
Fri, January 22, 2010 11:00:36 AM<BR>> Subject: Re: [Vision2020] 2010
Census<BR>><BR>> On Friday 22 January 2010 09:42:17 Art Deco
wrote:<BR>>> press.docOur property is posted to keep out a number of
pests<BR>>> including hunters, salespeople, missionaries,
religious<BR>>> psychopaths, criminals, nosey parkers/porkers,
etc.<BR>>><BR>>> Can a criminal trespass action be brought against
census takers who<BR>>> violate the trespassing laws?<BR>><BR>> I
suppose some windmill-tilting lawyer could file such a case, but I<BR>>
would not hold much hope for it going very far. Remember that the<BR>>
authority for the federal census specified in the US constitution,<BR>> and
there are additional federal statutes requiring citizens to<BR>>
participate in the census. So a trespassing case against a census<BR>>
worker carrying out census taking duties would seem to have a low<BR>>
probability of success given the strong federal mandate for the<BR>>
census.<BR>><BR>> On the other hand, if the federal administrative rules
under which the<BR>> census is conducted extend guidelines to census
workers about which<BR>> practical situations may be excused from that
particular census<BR>> worker's visit, that's another matter. In other
words, if the feds<BR>> say "We won't push this particular case," that's
OK, because it's the<BR>> fed's initiative. But if some citizen decides the
feds don't need to<BR>> count anyone at that residence, and the feds do
want to count in that<BR>> residence, then the citizen is at a considerable
disadvantage.<BR>><BR>> It may be that there are some citizens who might
need, in fact, might<BR>> foolishly prefer, that the individual civilian
census worker driving<BR>> a hybrid be replaced by a fully-armored Humvee
with half a dozen<BR>> fully-armed special forces personnel, just to get
the point across<BR>> that the census data will be collected, whether or
not the citizen<BR>> happens to be having a bad-hair day. Fortunately for
all of us, there<BR>> are statistically more accurate census estimating
techniques that do<BR>> not require such military participation in
census-taking, or give the<BR>> opportunity for foolish bravado given such
stronger data requests.<BR>><BR>><BR>> Ken<BR>><BR>>
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