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<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2><FONT size=3><FONT face="Times New Roman">"Since
there are plenty of places that already have all the shopping <BR>amenities
available, it seems like if someone is dissatisfied with what the <BR>Palouse
has to offer, they should make a change for themselves, rather than <BR>forcing
everybody else to live with these developments and the consequences <BR>they
will cause."<BR></FONT><BR></FONT>*ATTENTION RESIDENTS OF THE
PALOUSE*<BR><BR>Garrett Clevenger, bug farmer and alleged musician has
now arrived in our neck of the woods and has found it good! We may now trap this
fly in amber lest he be discomfited.<BR><BR>Seriously, are
you actually suggesting that it would be better that life long
residents of the area leave rather than you having to endure a
minor change to the little paradise that you and only you have managed to
discover?</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2></FONT> </DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2>Would you be so good as to provide for us a list
of businesses and the locations where they might exist that
would meet with your approval? Clearly those of us who have lived, worked, and
owned property here and have brought the area up to the standard that
you find so favorable are no longer up to the task.</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2></FONT> </DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2>g</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2></FONT> </DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial><BR><FONT size=2></FONT></FONT> </DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2>----- Original Message ----- </FONT>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2>From: "Garrett Clevenger" <</FONT><A
href="mailto:garrettmc@verizon.net"><FONT face=Arial
size=2>garrettmc@verizon.net</FONT></A><FONT face=Arial size=2>></FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2>To: <</FONT><A
href="mailto:vision2020@moscow.com"><FONT face=Arial
size=2>vision2020@moscow.com</FONT></A><FONT face=Arial size=2>>;
<</FONT><A href="mailto:donovanjarnold2005@yahoo.com"><FONT face=Arial
size=2>donovanjarnold2005@yahoo.com</FONT></A><FONT face=Arial
size=2>></FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2>Sent: Tuesday, March 10, 2009 12:48 PM</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2>Subject: Re: [Vision2020] Walmart Gets Nod for
Starting Work</FONT></DIV></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial><BR><FONT size=2></FONT></FONT></DIV><FONT face=Arial
size=2>> <BR>> Donovan writes:<BR>> <BR>> "I am not complacent
Garrett. Quiet the opposite. I actively support Wal-Mart. I like Wal-Mart and
what it does for people. It gives higher wages and jobs to people. It creates
better working standards for poor production workers. It gives a higher standard
of living for 1/2 the country."<BR>> <BR>> <BR>> Complacent-pleased,
esp. with oneself or one's merits, advantages, situation, etc., often without
awareness of some potential danger or defect; self-satisfied: <BR>> <BR>>
I would say someone who is a walmart fanatic, unwilling or unable to see the
negative affects they have on the whole, is complacent about walmart. It makes
me wonder if Donovan owns stock in walmart, because if you've seen one of their
shareholder meetings, you'll know it does have a religious fervor flavor. They
think they are doing the best thing, and making lots of money on top. They
probably think they do no wrong.<BR>> <BR>> Perhaps I'm an anti-walmart
fanatic, unable to see that walmart in whole is a great thing. Unfortunately,
being a cynic, I have my doubts about that.<BR>> <BR>> Perhaps I'm not as
broad minded as Donovan thinks he is, and thus I am just as complacent and
unable to see the bigger picture, but I do think I have a good understanding of
human nature. People tend to do what they want to do, regardless of how that
affects other people. Thus the need for regulations and safeguards against
harmful affects.<BR>> <BR>> Walmart is the dominating retail force, and
with their power it seems they do more harm than good. Just the fact that they
probably will help drive down wages, and labor and environmental standards in
the US, seems like that should cause pause, especially for people who are
concerned about illegal labor in the US and the environment. It seems there is
more of chance that US businesses, in order to compete, will hire illegals in
order to pay people comparable wages as walmart pays to its foreign workers
making their cheap stuff.<BR>> <BR>> I don't see why the Waltons and
Walmarts shareholders need to rake in so much money, when they could be paying
their workers more instead. Yes, I understand capitalism and know that is
unlikely under walmart's corporate model, but that does not mean it would be
impossible to spread that wealth out more.<BR>> <BR>> Donovan and I see
this issue completely different. I grew up in a big city, he grew up here. I
don't think he fully appreciates the value of the Palouse as is, and sees more
value in letting superwalmart and Hawkins have their way. Whether that makes one
of us more narrow minded than the other is irrelevant. The facts are what should
matter.<BR>> <BR>> Once superwalmart or Hawkins are here, they are not
going away. This place will be forever changed for everybody. Since there are
plenty of places that already have all the shopping amenities available, it
seems like if someone is dissatisfied with what the Palouse has to offer, they
should make a change for themselves, rather than forcing everybody else to live
with these developments and the consequences they will cause.<BR>> <BR>> I
want to end this by saying that for Donovan to imply that I hate my neighbors
seems to be a rather strong charge. I don't think I hate anybody. I can disagree
with people, and criticize them for making bad decisions, and I can strongly
defend Idaho by trying to prevent another state from using its water, but I
think I'm open minded enough to know I don't know everything. I'm willing to
listen and will change my mind if it seems reasonable.<BR>> <BR>> Him
implying I hate our neighbors in Washington would be like me saying he hates
Moscow businesses because of his willingness to facilitate out of state
competitors. I assume he doesn't hate them, even though it seems his view goes
against the interests of Moscow's businesses.<BR>> <BR>> gclev<BR>>
<BR>> --- On Tue, 3/10/09, Donovan Arnold <</FONT><A
href="mailto:donovanjarnold2005@yahoo.com"><FONT face=Arial
size=2>donovanjarnold2005@yahoo.com</FONT></A><FONT face=Arial size=2>>
wrote:<BR>> <BR>>> From: Donovan Arnold <</FONT><A
href="mailto:donovanjarnold2005@yahoo.com"><FONT face=Arial
size=2>donovanjarnold2005@yahoo.com</FONT></A><FONT face=Arial
size=2>><BR>>> Subject: Re: [Vision2020] Walmart Gets Nod for Starting
Work<BR>>> To: </FONT><A href="mailto:vision2020@moscow.com"><FONT
face=Arial size=2>vision2020@moscow.com</FONT></A><FONT face=Arial size=2>,
</FONT><A href="mailto:garrettmc@verizon.net"><FONT face=Arial
size=2>garrettmc@verizon.net</FONT></A><BR><FONT face=Arial size=2>>>
Date: Tuesday, March 10, 2009, 8:10 AM<BR>>> Garrett writes:<BR>>>
<BR>>> "If Walmart didn't do what they do, others would<BR>>> jump
in because of the complacency of people like<BR>>> Donovan."<BR>>>
<BR>>> I am not complacent Garrett. Quiet the opposite. I
actively<BR>>> support Wal-Mart. I like Wal-Mart and what it does
for<BR>>> people. It gives higher wages and jobs to people. It
creates<BR>>> better working standards for poor production workers.
It<BR>>> gives a higher standard of living for 1/2 the country.
<BR>>> <BR>>> I know you don't see it that way. But the reality
is,<BR>>> Wal-Mart pays a higher wage than Win-Co. It highers
people<BR>>> that would otherwise be unemployed. It offers lower
prices<BR>>> so poor families can afford to have things they would
never<BR>>> otherwise have, such as unused clothing and needed<BR>>>
medications. <BR>>> <BR>>> I can tell that you have a very limited
understanding of<BR>>> how the market place works. You don't understand
why<BR>>> Wal-Mart cannot raise its wages. You don't
understand<BR>>> how profit and production works. You have a narrow view
of<BR>>> things. <BR>>> <BR>>> You can hate your neighbors,
and deny them water. But I<BR>>> don't think you will be successful in
stopping you<BR>>> neighbor from getting water, or from others helping
others<BR>>> and improving the quality of life for everyone, as
Wal-Mart<BR>>> does. <BR>>> <BR>>> Best Regards,<BR>>>
<BR>>> Donovan <BR>>> <BR>>> --- On Mon, 3/9/09, Garrett
Clevenger<BR>>> <</FONT><A href="mailto:garrettmc@verizon.net"><FONT
face=Arial size=2>garrettmc@verizon.net</FONT></A><FONT face=Arial size=2>>
wrote:<BR>>> From: Garrett Clevenger <</FONT><A
href="mailto:garrettmc@verizon.net"><FONT face=Arial
size=2>garrettmc@verizon.net</FONT></A><FONT face=Arial size=2>><BR>>>
Subject: Re: [Vision2020] Walmart Gets Nod for Starting<BR>>>
Work<BR>>> To: </FONT><A href="mailto:vision2020@moscow.com"><FONT
face=Arial size=2>vision2020@moscow.com</FONT></A><FONT face=Arial size=2>,
</FONT><A href="mailto:donovanjarnold2005@yahoo.com"><FONT face=Arial
size=2>donovanjarnold2005@yahoo.com</FONT></A><BR><FONT face=Arial
size=2>>> Date: Monday, March 9, 2009, 6:03 PM<BR>>> <BR>>>
Donovan writes:<BR>>> <BR>>> "I am not aware of any job that Moscow
is willing to<BR>>> accept unless it is<BR>>> not supported by
taxes."<BR>>> <BR>>> <BR>>> I'm not quite sure how to
interpret that, but it seems<BR>>> like it would be an<BR>>>
exaggeration any way you might read it.<BR>>> <BR>>> Yeah, Donovan,
I hate jobs. Nobody should work. We all<BR>>> should just do
nothing,<BR>>> and wait for Walmart to bail us out.<BR>>>
<BR>>> <BR>>> But seriously...<BR>>> <BR>>> Walmart is
just the biggest exploiter. Obviously the way<BR>>> things are set up
with<BR>>> trade laws and the like, corporations are given more
value<BR>>> over people, and are<BR>>> basically able to do what
they want if they convince the<BR>>> powers that be how good<BR>>>
they are. If Walmart didn't do what they do, others<BR>>> would jump in
because of<BR>>> the complacency of people like Donovan. I'm
sure<BR>>> Walmart does some good, but<BR>>> I doubt it outweighs
the negative effect they have.<BR>>> <BR>>> You have every right to
spend your money at Walmart. That<BR>>> doesn't mean<BR>>> those of
us who are concerned about the Walmart affect are<BR>>> going to roll
over<BR>>> and let them build where ever they want. It seems
that<BR>>> those who do speak out<BR>>> probably will make Walmart
do more good stuff than if<BR>>> nobody said anything, at<BR>>> the
very least.<BR>>> <BR>>> The Waltons could easily raise the salaries
of their<BR>>> employees, instead of<BR>>> raking it in themselves.
After all, its their employees who<BR>>> keep their operation<BR>>>
going. It reminds me of WSU's President Floyd who makes<BR>>> over
$600,000 per<BR>>> year, while the people who do the work to keep WSU
going<BR>>> make a whole lot less,<BR>>> and have to worry about
salary freezes and job cuts.<BR>>> It's totally out of<BR>>>
balance.<BR>>> <BR>>> Walmart is responsible for about 10% of the US
trade<BR>>> deficit with China.<BR>>> "Wal-Mart alone is responsible
for the loss of nearly<BR>>> 200,000 U.S. jobs due<BR>>> to its own
growing trade deficits with China" from<BR>>> </FONT><A
href="http://www.epi.org/publications/entry/ib235/"><FONT face=Arial
size=2>http://www.epi.org/publications/entry/ib235/</FONT></A><FONT face=Arial
size=2> (all kinds of<BR>>> interesting info is<BR>>> found
there)<BR>>> <BR>>> The more we import, the more jobs we lose.
That's the<BR>>> bottom line. You get<BR>>> more cheap stuff (with a
higher probability that it's<BR>>> toxic), but you drive<BR>>> down
wages in the US while losing the manufacturing base.<BR>>> That seems
incredibly<BR>>> short-sighted.<BR>>> <BR>>> So I could say
Walmart promoters hate good-paying American<BR>>> jobs and want us
all<BR>>> to be paid meager wages, but I'm sure that would be
an<BR>>> exageration, too.<BR>>> <BR>>> I don't blame Walmart
for what they are doing. They are<BR>>> just using<BR>>> capitalism
and the political system to become more<BR>>> profitable. Shareholders
are<BR>>> responsible for steering their behavior, but it is
the<BR>>> people who shop at<BR>>> Walmart who in essence vote to
support Walmart, and give<BR>>> them a green light to<BR>>> continue
to grow in what seems like at any cost.<BR>>> <BR>>> The economic
fiasco we face didn't start in a vacuum.<BR>>> It's all a<BR>>>
reflection of living beyond our means, and specific trade<BR>>> policies
that tilted<BR>>> the balance towards the rich. It's consumers,
though,<BR>>> who drove it home, and<BR>>> now everybody will pay.
Promoting Walmart will only make<BR>>> things worse.<BR>>>
<BR>>> gclev<BR>>> <BR>>> <BR>>> <BR>>> --- On
Mon, 3/9/09, Donovan Arnold<BR>>> <</FONT><A
href="mailto:donovanjarnold2005@yahoo.com"><FONT face=Arial
size=2>donovanjarnold2005@yahoo.com</FONT></A><FONT face=Arial size=2>>
wrote:<BR>>> <BR>>> > From: Donovan Arnold<BR>>>
<</FONT><A href="mailto:donovanjarnold2005@yahoo.com"><FONT face=Arial
size=2>donovanjarnold2005@yahoo.com</FONT></A><FONT face=Arial
size=2>><BR>>> > Subject: Re: [Vision2020] Walmart Gets Nod
for<BR>>> Starting Work<BR>>> > To: </FONT><A
href="mailto:vision2020@moscow.com"><FONT face=Arial
size=2>vision2020@moscow.com</FONT></A><FONT face=Arial size=2>, </FONT><A
href="mailto:garrettmc@verizon.net"><FONT face=Arial
size=2>garrettmc@verizon.net</FONT></A><BR><FONT face=Arial size=2>>> >
Date: Monday, March 9, 2009, 5:44 PM<BR>>> > Garrett,<BR>>> >
<BR>>> > Wal-Mart isn't exploiting anyone anymore than<BR>>>
anyone<BR>>> > else. All your crap is made in China, not just
the<BR>>> stuff you<BR>>> > pull off the Wal-Mart shelf. Wal-Mart
doesn't<BR>>> pollute<BR>>> > anymore than any other business.
Wal-mart pays the<BR>>> same or<BR>>> > better than other
retailers. <BR>>> > <BR>>> > The fact that Wal-Mart sales are
increasing as people<BR>>> get<BR>>> > poor should tell you how
vital is in providing jobs<BR>>> and<BR>>> > services to the poor
and disadvantaged than anyone<BR>>> else. <BR>>> > <BR>>>
> Wal-Mart isn't perfect. I don't think any<BR>>> business<BR>>>
> is. But it doesn't do anything its competition<BR>>> > doesn't do.
It does lots of good things as well,<BR>>> such as<BR>>> >
providing jobs, affordable goods, jobs for people<BR>>> others<BR>>>
> won't hire, it has drastically reduced the costs<BR>>> of
over<BR>>> > 200 prescription medications to $4, it helped
find<BR>>> 1000s of<BR>>> > missing and lost children, It donates
billions to<BR>>> charitable<BR>>> > causes. It doesn't waste
millions on luxury for<BR>>> > managers. <BR>>> > <BR>>>
> Tryng to blame Wal-Mart for Chinese labor laws and US<BR>>>
trade<BR>>> > agreements with China is misguided. If
Wal-Mart<BR>>> stopped<BR>>> > buying from China the conditions
in China would<BR>>> worsen, not<BR>>> > better, and Wal-Mart's
competitors would gladly<BR>>> use<BR>>> > those same factories
to eventually drive Wal-Mart out<BR>>> of<BR>>> > business.
Wal-Mart is working within the system that<BR>>> the US<BR>>> >
and China has created. <BR>>> > <BR>>> > Your opposition to
Wal-Mart has not stopped them. It<BR>>> has<BR>>> > only just
moved the jobs, taxes, and resources to<BR>>> Pullman,<BR>>> >
because they know Wal-Mart is actually more of a<BR>>>
blessing<BR>>> > than curse despite its problems. <BR>>> >
<BR>>> > I think it is the intention of some of Moscow's<BR>>>
> residents to drive all the jobs it can over to Pullman<BR>>>
or<BR>>> > out of Moscow. I am not aware of any job that
Moscow<BR>>> is<BR>>> > willing to accept unless it is not
supported by taxes.<BR>>> <BR>>> > <BR>>> > Best
Regards,<BR>>> > <BR>>> > Donovan<BR>>> >
<BR>>> > --- On Mon, 3/9/09, Garrett Clevenger<BR>>> >
<</FONT><A href="mailto:garrettmc@verizon.net"><FONT face=Arial
size=2>garrettmc@verizon.net</FONT></A><FONT face=Arial size=2>>
wrote:<BR>>> > From: Garrett Clevenger <</FONT><A
href="mailto:garrettmc@verizon.net"><FONT face=Arial
size=2>garrettmc@verizon.net</FONT></A><FONT face=Arial size=2>><BR>>>
> Subject: [Vision2020] Walmart Gets Nod for Starting<BR>>>
Work<BR>>> > To: </FONT><A href="mailto:vision2020@moscow.com"><FONT
face=Arial size=2>vision2020@moscow.com</FONT></A><BR><FONT face=Arial
size=2>>> > Date: Monday, March 9, 2009, 11:00 AM<BR>>> >
<BR>>> > Donovan satirizes:<BR>>> > <BR>>> > "Now is
the time to demand impossible standards<BR>>> of<BR>>> >
employers, and be as<BR>>> > picky as possible about the kind of jobs
we<BR>>> want."<BR>>> > <BR>>> > <BR>>> > Yes,
let's bend over backwards for the Waltons.<BR>>> Instead<BR>>> >
of them relying on<BR>>> > cheap labor in China, let's give them cheap
labor<BR>>> here<BR>>> > in Moscow! We need<BR>>> > the
jobs, after all, and who cares if we pollute the<BR>>> water<BR>>>
> manufacturing cheap<BR>>> > stuff. At least Americans won't put
toxins in<BR>>> stuff<BR>>> > they'll sell to<BR>>> >
other Americans, right? We'll keep stuff even<BR>>> cheaper<BR>>>
> saving on fuel costs<BR>>> > since we won't have to transport it
half way round<BR>>> the<BR>>> > world.<BR>>> >
<BR>>> > Yes, I want Walmart to keep growing and growing
until<BR>>> all<BR>>> > that's left are<BR>>> > Walmart
stores because their quality is sooo good, I<BR>>> > don't really
want<BR>>> > accountability, and I love the Waltons so much I
think<BR>>> they<BR>>> > deserve a few more<BR>>> >
billion dollars. Who needs to make more than a couple<BR>>>
bucks<BR>>> > a day, anyway?<BR>>> > <BR>>> >
<BR>>> > But seriously...<BR>>> > <BR>>> > Walmarts
sales are up 6.5% compareded to last year.<BR>>> The<BR>>> >
irony is, as people get<BR>>> > poorer, they need cheaper things, and
they're less<BR>>> > likely to care why things<BR>>> > are so
cheap, and who's making the majority of the<BR>>> $$$.<BR>>> > A
terrible downward<BR>>> > spiral.<BR>>> > <BR>>> >
Many people don't know or care that the family who<BR>>> owns<BR>>>
> Walmart is one of<BR>>> > the richest families on the planet. As
of last<BR>>> September, 4<BR>>> > of the top 10
riches<BR>>> > Americans are Waltons on Forbes Riches Americans
list,<BR>>> with<BR>>> > a total net worth of<BR>>> >
almost $100 billion.<BR>>> > <BR>>> > According to<BR>>>
><BR>>> </FONT><A
href="http://www.forbes.com/lists/2008/54/400list08_Jim-Walton_JI38.html"><FONT
face=Arial
size=2>http://www.forbes.com/lists/2008/54/400list08_Jim-Walton_JI38.html</FONT></A><BR><FONT
face=Arial size=2>>> > <BR>>> > Wal-Mart is the world's
largest retailer: 7,300<BR>>> stores,<BR>>> > 2 million
employees<BR>>> > serve 200 million customers. Sales: $378
billion<BR>>> > <BR>>> > <BR>>> > Walmart may provide
jobs in their ever-expanding<BR>>> business,<BR>>> > and insure
we have<BR>>> > cheap stuff, but at what cost?<BR>>> >
<BR>>> > In order for the Waltons to become
super-billionaires,<BR>>> most<BR>>> > other people
are<BR>>> > losing out. There is a finite amount of wealth
and<BR>>> > resources, so to think that<BR>>> > the Waltons
could amass such wealth without causing<BR>>> other<BR>>> >
people to loss money<BR>>> > is idiotic.<BR>>> > <BR>>>
> Someone has to pay for their billions, and while they<BR>>>
may<BR>>> > provide cheap stuff<BR>>> > for the poor people
they exploit, they are causing an<BR>>> > unsustainable
trade<BR>>> > deficit supporting foreign companies that have
lax<BR>>> labor<BR>>> > and environmental laws<BR>>> >
who sell to Walmart toxic toys and food that Walmart<BR>>>
then<BR>>> > pushes on to poor<BR>>> > Americans who in turn
help cause the downfall of<BR>>> smaller,<BR>>> > family-owned
and<BR>>> > independent stores, who can't sell as cheap
stuff<BR>>> > because they don't<BR>>> > have the buying
power, they actually try to pay their<BR>>> > employees a living
wage<BR>>> > and they don't have the political clout to
gain<BR>>> > tax-breaks from towns so<BR>>> > desperate to
create jobs and have cheap stuff that<BR>>> they are<BR>>> >
willing to sacrifice<BR>>> > downtowns to the holy Walton empire who
will then be<BR>>> able<BR>>> > to hire Americans<BR>>>
> because in order to compete with foreign labor we now<BR>>>
are<BR>>> > willing to work for<BR>>> > nothing in polluted
environments. Who needs high<BR>>> standards,<BR>>> >
anyway!<BR>>> > <BR>>> > I can accept that if you don't know
that the<BR>>> Waltons<BR>>> > are exploiting people<BR>>>
> to make their billions you might support them, but if<BR>>> >
you're smart enough to<BR>>> > put two and two together and give your
money to<BR>>> Walmart,<BR>>> > you are culpable in<BR>>>
> allowing Walmart to continue to drive American wages<BR>>>
down,<BR>>> > and possibly lower<BR>>> > our labor and
environmental standards in order to<BR>>> compete.<BR>>> >
<BR>>> > It seems rather selfish that in order to maintain<BR>>>
access to<BR>>> > addictive cheap<BR>>> > stuff some would
sacrifice the overall security of our<BR>>> > country. Thus why
the<BR>>> > rich get richer, and the poor get poorer. <BR>>> >
<BR>>> > Fight for the right of poor people to have access
to<BR>>> cheap<BR>>> > stuff with one hand,<BR>>> >
drive the stake into the heart of poor people with the<BR>>> > other.
How ironic!<BR>>> > <BR>>> > Now is exactly the time to start
building the<BR>>> foundation of<BR>>> > a new
economic<BR>>> > model, not continue to pour trillions into
what<BR>>> obviously<BR>>> > is a discredited<BR>>> >
system with Walmart leading the charge. (Charge it to<BR>>> > future
generations, that<BR>>> > is...)<BR>>> > <BR>>> >
gclev<BR>>> > <BR>>> > <BR>>> > <BR>>>
><BR>>>
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href="mailto:Vision2020@moscow.com"><FONT face=Arial
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