<table cellspacing="0" cellpadding="0" border="0" ><tr><td valign="top" style="font: inherit;">Gary,<br><br>I disagree, I think you are aware of what a job entails when you accept it. If you don't want to do certain parts of the job, don't take it, or shut up and do the job. <br><br>If someone thinks it is immoral to serve a Black person, Muslim, Jew, Atheist, Christian, or Gay person, should the pharmacist be allowed to follow their conscious, or should they be told to do the job, or take a hike? Or course not. People except, and should be expected to get treatment and service for things that are legal and offered at that place. <br><br>It is not the JOB of people to be making moral judgments for others, just themselves. If they are in a job that requires them to do things they disagree with, they should not be in that job. Go do something else. <br><br>Best Regards,<br><br>Donovan<br><br>--- On <b>Sat, 2/28/09, g. crabtree
<i><jampot@roadrunner.com></i></b> wrote:<br><blockquote style="border-left: 2px solid rgb(16, 16, 255); margin-left: 5px; padding-left: 5px;">From: g. <span>crabtree</span> <jampot@roadrunner.com><br>Subject: Re: [Vision2020] <span>Obama</span> to Rescind Conscience Rule<br>To: donovanjarnold2005@yahoo.com, vision2020@moscow.com, garrettmc@verizon.net<br>Date: Saturday, February 28, 2009, 3:33 PM<br><br><div id="yiv1894708741">
<style></style>
<div><font size="2" face="Arial">"...<font size="3" face="Times New Roman">a doctor,
lawyer, teacher, banker, and others, everyday do crap at their jobs they have
moral problems with. That is the challenge in life, live and not commit sins
against the others. You cannot pick and choose the treatment you want to give
and withhold based on your feelings about a situation you know little or nothing
about."</font></font></div>
<div><font size="2" face="Arial"><font size="3" face="Times New Roman"></font></font> </div>
<div><font size="2" face="Arial"><font size="3" face="Times New Roman">This is
incorrect in several respects. Many doctors decide that they would prefer to be
pediatricians and do not treat adults. Many doctors decide to be plastic
surgeons and do not treat enlarged prostates. Some specialize in the brain and
do not become podiatrists. In the same way many doctors decide that they want to
respect and prolong life and do not become abortionists. The idea that just
because you are an M.D. you must perform procedures that are abhorrent is
nonsense.</font></font></div>
<div><font size="2" face="Arial"></font> </div>
<div><font size="2" face="Arial"><font size="3" face="Times New Roman">Were a
doctor hired to work at a hospital whose policy was to provide life ending
procedures to the pre-born and refused, that might be one thing but,
at many hospitals, particularly religiously affiliated institutions performing
infanticide</font> <font size="3" face="Times New Roman">or euthanasia is not
part of their mission statement. A doctor might well base his decision to work
at such an institution on just that policy and to penalize them for that
decision is, again, nonsense.</font></font></div>
<div><font size="2" face="Arial"><font size="2" face="Arial"></font></font> </div>
<div><font size="2" face="Arial"><font size="3" face="Times New Roman">I
suppose I can understand a person not wanting to have to deal with the
consequences of their bad actions but to force another to aid and abet you
against their will and under threat of government sanction is beyond nonsense,
its unconscionable.</font></font></div>
<div><font size="2" face="Arial"><font size="3" face="Times New Roman"></font></font> </div>
<div><font size="2" face="Arial"><font size="3" face="Times New Roman">g</font></font></div>
<div><font size="2" face="Arial"><br></font></div><font size="2" face="Arial"></font>
<blockquote style="border-left: 2px solid rgb(0, 0, 0); padding-right: 0px; padding-left: 5px; margin-left: 5px; margin-right: 0px;">
<div style="font-family: arial; font-style: normal; font-variant: normal; font-weight: normal; font-size: 10pt; line-height: normal; font-size-adjust: none; font-stretch: normal;">----- Original Message ----- </div>
<div style="background: rgb(228, 228, 228) none repeat scroll 0% 0%; -moz-background-clip: -moz-initial; -moz-background-origin: -moz-initial; -moz-background-inline-policy: -moz-initial; font-family: arial; font-style: normal; font-variant: normal; font-weight: normal; font-size: 10pt; line-height: normal; font-size-adjust: none; font-stretch: normal;"><b>From:</b>
<a rel="nofollow" title="donovanjarnold2005@yahoo.com" target="_blank" href="mailto:donovanjarnold2005@yahoo.com">Donovan Arnold</a> </div>
<div style="font-family: arial; font-style: normal; font-variant: normal; font-weight: normal; font-size: 10pt; line-height: normal; font-size-adjust: none; font-stretch: normal;"><b>To:</b> <a rel="nofollow" title="vision2020@moscow.com" target="_blank" href="mailto:vision2020@moscow.com">vision2020@moscow.com</a> ; <a rel="nofollow" title="garrettmc@verizon.net" target="_blank" href="mailto:garrettmc@verizon.net">garrettmc@verizon.net</a> </div>
<div style="font-family: arial; font-style: normal; font-variant: normal; font-weight: normal; font-size: 10pt; line-height: normal; font-size-adjust: none; font-stretch: normal;"><b>Sent:</b> Saturday, February 28, 2009 11:53
AM</div>
<div style="font-family: arial; font-style: normal; font-variant: normal; font-weight: normal; font-size: 10pt; line-height: normal; font-size-adjust: none; font-stretch: normal;"><b>Subject:</b> Re: [Vision2020] Obama to
Rescind Conscience Rule</div>
<div><br></div>
<table border="0" cellpadding="0" cellspacing="0">
<tbody>
<tr>
<td valign="top">Garret,<br><br>I believe that abortion is murder in the
eyes of God. It is the intentional taking of a developing life. I think
any woman that has an abortion should feel more guilty of that than a
person who commits accidential manslaughter. They should be highly
discouraged from having an abortion because they will have to live with
that decision for the rest of their life. <br><br>Having said that
though. I don't think a fetus can be considered a person according to
the law. It isn't something the law can touch. It is kind of like hating
your neighbor, abandoning you elderly parents, or not obeying God. It
may be evil and wrong, but you really cannot make it illegal or force
people to behave the way you want. <br><br>I think someone that has more
children than they can provide for should be charged with child abuse
and neglect. A farmer that doesn't feed this cattle and horses goes to
jail, so should parents. <br><br>I don't agree with the conscious rule.
If you cannot do the job, quit, that is what the rest of us have to do.
Does a banker say, "Hey, it is against the Bible to charge such an
interest rate." Bullshit, a doctor, lawyer, teacher, banker, and others,
everyday do crap at their jobs they have moral problems with. That is
the challenge in life, live and not commit sins against the others. You
cannot pick and choose the treatment you want to give and withhold based
on your feelings about a situation you know little or nothing about.
<br><br><br><pre>"That being the case, it seems wise to ensure women have access to abortions that are<br>as safe as possible."<br><br>Two points, one, it is impossible for it to be safe because it is terminating a life. That is the<br>opposite of safe. <br><br>Second, when people are not ensured to have access to life saving <br>procedures which they have no<br> control over or decision in, such as certain<br>operations and treatments, why should a woman have access to a voluntary<br>procedure which most people object to wanting to pay or participate in? If she<br>wants to pay for the procedure herself, that is her body, we cannot stop it, but<br>why should I have to pay for it, and make sure she can get one on my dime?<br><br>I agree with you about birth control. I think that everyone should be given education<br>about birth control. The government should not hide information. <br><br>Best Regards,<br><br>Donovan<br></pre><br><br><br>---
On <b>Sat, 2/28/09, Garrett Clevenger
<i><garrettmc@verizon.net></i></b> wrote:<br>
<blockquote style="border-left: 2px solid rgb(16, 16, 255); padding-left: 5px; margin-left: 5px;">From:
Garrett Clevenger <garrettmc@verizon.net><br>Subject:
[Vision2020] Obama to Rescind Conscience Rule<br>To:
vision2020@moscow.com<br>Date: Saturday, February 28, 2009, 11:14
AM<br><br><pre>The right of woman to be able to terminate a pregnancy she is unwilling or<br>unable to see through trumps the right of a fetus. That may seem harsh and I<br>would never encourage a woman to have an abortion. The fact is, having an<br>abortion is probably the hardest decision a woman will ever make. You can make<br>them feel guilty about that, and perhaps some will choose not to have an<br>abortion, but there will always be some who decide to have an abortion. That<br>being the case, it seems wise to ensure women have access to abortions that are<br>as safe as possible.<br><br>According to http://wuphysicians.wustl.edu/dept.aspx?PageID=8&ID=35,<br>between 10% to 50% or more of pregnancies end in spontaneous abortion. That<br>being the case, the argument that God wants all pregnant women to give birth<br>becomes ridiculous. Why would there be such a high miscarriage rate if that were<br>so?<br><br>It's ironic that many of the
same<br> people against abortion also promote<br>abstinence-only sex ed, or try to limit access to birth control, which makes me<br>think they aren't too interested in reducing unwanted pregnancies, but<br>mostly in promoting the idea that woman are baby-making machines.<br><br>Which brings us to the woman who recently had octuplets. Does she have the<br>right to have 8 babies at once when taxpayers are going to be paying up to $1<br>million a piece for their post-natal care, particularly when she already has 6<br>kids, particularly when she is a single mom, particularly when she is<br>emotionally unstable? Does the fertility doctor who implanted those 8 embryos in<br>her have the right to do so, particularly knowing the woman's issues?<br><br>There are too many kids born into irresponsible households, leading to all<br>kinds of problems down the road that society as a whole will have to deal with.<br>It only makes sense that if there are some who see
that they<br> won't be able<br>to responsibly care for that child, or that their pregnancy will lead to health<br>issues for the woman, that they should be given a safe way to terminate their<br>pregnancy. That is a personal decision that government should keeps its nose out<br>of apart from ensuring that doctors are allowed to do their job.<br><br>Until all adults are given equal rights to live as they see fit, extending<br>rights to fetuses seems hypocritical since some peoples' rights are thought<br>by some to be a little more special than other peoples rights. <br><br>This issue is yet again another example of religious people trying to force<br>their views on everybody else. There is a reason it is illegal to pass religious<br>laws, and we need to ensure fanatics don't violate our Constitution.<br><br>Saying all this, I have to wonder if the 'conscience rule' as I<br>understand it, is a big deal. Isn't preventing people from expressing
their<br>religious views<br> all illegal, too?<br><br>I'm not too keen on government restricting that right, nor am I keen on<br>government forcing people to do things they aren't morally inclined to do.<br><br>gclev<br><br><br><br>g writes:<br><br>"Looks as though the right to kill the unborn trumps another's right<br>to <br>conduct their business as they, in accordance with their conscience and <br>their morals, deem appropriate.<br><br>I guess some peoples rights are a little more special than other peoples <br>rights."<br><br>=======================================================<br> List services made available by First Step Internet, <br> serving the communities of the Palouse since 1994. <br> http://www.fsr.net <br> mailto:Vision2020@moscow.com<br>=======================================================<br></pre></blockquote></td></tr></tbody></table><br>
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