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True, Saundra, but without wingnuts, right-wing talk radio would cease to exist, and Mr. Liddy would be forced to, ohhhhh, I don't know -- work as a Wal-Mart greeter or something.<br><br>Keely<br>http://keely-prevailingwinds.blogspot.com/<br><br><br><hr>Date: Fri, 19 Sep 2008 10:10:29 -0700<br>From: sslund_2007@verizon.net<br>Subject: RE: [Vision2020] Bill Ayers & Barack Obama<br>To: kjajmix1@msn.com; joekc@roadrunner.com<br>CC: vision2020@moscow.com<br><br>
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<p class="EC_MsoNormal"><span style="font-family: 'Calibri','sans-serif'; color: rgb(31, 73, 125);">Keely,</span></p>
<p class="EC_MsoNormal"><span style="font-family: 'Calibri','sans-serif'; color: rgb(31, 73, 125);"> </span></p>
<p class="EC_MsoNormal"><span style="font-family: 'Calibri','sans-serif'; color: rgb(31, 73, 125);">I
absolutely second your questioning of Mr. Crabtree’s claim that Liddy has
gone on to live a decent life. Only last week, he was <b>continuing</b>
to spread the bald-faced lie that Obama isn’t a US citizen, and he’s
been right there <b>all along</b> preying on fear by spreading the malicious
lie that Obama is Muslim.</span></p>
<p class="EC_MsoNormal"><span style="font-family: 'Calibri','sans-serif'; color: rgb(31, 73, 125);"> </span></p>
<p class="EC_MsoNormal"><span style="font-family: 'Calibri','sans-serif'; color: rgb(31, 73, 125);">The
man is willing to tell outright lies to advance his own political agenda, which
is hardly what I’d call living a “decent life;’ rather, on my
scale, that puts him with amoral scum and wingnuts.</span></p>
<p class="EC_MsoNormal"><span style="font-family: 'Calibri','sans-serif'; color: rgb(31, 73, 125);"> </span></p>
<p class="EC_MsoNormal"><span style="font-family: 'Calibri','sans-serif'; color: rgb(31, 73, 125);"> </span></p>
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<p class="EC_MsoNormal"><span style="font-size: 11pt; font-family: 'Calibri','sans-serif'; color: rgb(31, 73, 125);">Saundra Lund</span></p>
<p class="EC_MsoNormal"><span style="font-size: 11pt; font-family: 'Calibri','sans-serif'; color: rgb(31, 73, 125);">Moscow, ID</span></p>
<p class="EC_MsoNormal"><span style="font-size: 11pt; font-family: 'Calibri','sans-serif'; color: rgb(31, 73, 125);"> </span></p>
<p class="EC_MsoNormal"><span style="font-size: 11pt; font-family: 'Calibri','sans-serif'; color: rgb(31, 73, 125);">The only thing necessary for the triumph of evil is for good
people to do nothing.</span></p>
<p class="EC_MsoNormal"><span style="font-size: 11pt; font-family: 'Calibri','sans-serif'; color: rgb(31, 73, 125);">~ Edmund Burke</span></p>
<p class="EC_MsoNormal"><span style="font-size: 11pt; font-family: 'Calibri','sans-serif'; color: rgb(31, 73, 125);"> </span></p>
<p class="EC_MsoNormal"><b><span style="font-size: 11pt; font-family: 'Calibri','sans-serif'; color: rgb(31, 73, 125);">***** Original material contained herein is Copyright 2008
through life plus 70 years, Saundra Lund. Do not copy, forward, excerpt,
or reproduce outside the Vision 2020 forum without the express written
permission of the author.*****</span></b></p>
</div>
<p class="EC_MsoNormal"><span style="font-family: 'Calibri','sans-serif'; color: rgb(31, 73, 125);"> </span></p>
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<p class="EC_MsoNormal"><b><span style="font-size: 10pt; font-family: 'Tahoma','sans-serif';">From:</span></b><span style="font-size: 10pt; font-family: 'Tahoma','sans-serif';">
vision2020-bounces@moscow.com [mailto:vision2020-bounces@moscow.com] <b>On
Behalf Of </b>keely emerinemix<br>
<b>Sent:</b> Friday, September 19, 2008 8:51 AM<br>
<b>To:</b> g. crabtree; joekc@roadrunner.com<br>
<b>Cc:</b> vision2020<br>
<b>Subject:</b> Re: [Vision2020] Bill Ayers & Barack Obama</span></p>
</div>
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<p class="EC_MsoNormal"> </p>
<p class="EC_MsoNormal" style="margin-bottom: 12pt;"><span style="font-size: 10pt; font-family: 'Tahoma','sans-serif';">Liddy's been living "a decent
life"? Coaching gun owners to shoot federal agents? Crowing
about target practice with Bill and Hillary pictures? <br>
<br>
For that matter, and on a much less serious note, answering virtually
every radio show "how are you?" with "potent and
virile"? He may have served his time, but I think that "decent
life" has yet to be fulfilled in the G-man.<br>
<br>
Keely<br>
http://keely-prevailingwinds.blogspot.com/<br>
<br>
<br>
> From: jampot@roadrunner.com<br>
> To: joekc@roadrunner.com<br>
> Date: Fri, 19 Sep 2008 06:26:19 -0700<br>
> CC: vision2020@moscow.com<br>
> Subject: Re: [Vision2020] Bill Ayers & Barack Obama<br>
> <br>
> I know a bit about American history and Watergate in particular. Are you <br>
> trying to tell me that Watergate was all about G. Gordon Liddy? Liddy was
a <br>
> minor player in the Watergate scandal, a foot soldier who ended up bearing
<br>
> the brunt of the punishment for people above him. John Dean, A Watergate <br>
> principal who has been held up on this forum as a man whose opinion is <br>
> worthy of respectful consideration, had far more to do with Watergate and <br>
> it's subsequent cover up then Liddy ever did. Liddy readily admitted that <br>
> he did the crime, he did the time, he paid his debt to society and has
gone <br>
> on to lead a decent life. That McCain should have to move heaven and earth
<br>
> to disassociate himself from the man seems unreasonable.<br>
> <br>
> g<br>
> <br>
> <br>
> ----- Original Message ----- <br>
> From: <joekc@roadrunner.com><br>
> To: "g. crabtree" <jampot@roadrunner.com><br>
> Cc: "vision2020" <vision2020@moscow.com><br>
> Sent: Thursday, September 18, 2008 6:38 PM<br>
> Subject: Re: [Vision2020] Bill Ayers & Barack Obama<br>
> <br>
> <br>
> > You are twisting the argument. No one is sticking up for Ayers. The
point <br>
> > is that if Ayers matters<br>
> > to Obama's reputation, Liddy should matter to McCain's. Another point
is <br>
> > that, relatively speaking,<br>
> > Ayers is not worse than Liddy and Liddy is not better than Ayers. I
think <br>
> > Liddy is far worse.<br>
> ><br>
> > Watergate revealed a much deeper threat to American democracy. The
simple <br>
> > fact is that Nixon<br>
> > cheated in a broad number of ways. Cheated in winning the
presidential <br>
> > election. Look up "Watergate," do a bit of research, and
learn something <br>
> > about American history. Are you trying to<br>
> > tell me that that Nixon resigned the presidency merely because of an <br>
> > unsuccessful burglary?<br>
> ><br>
> > What does democracy stand for if not for fair elections for the
presidency <br>
> > of the US, where the<br>
> > people may be certain that the choice is the product of their will
and not <br>
> > the will of a select few?<br>
> > Do you think that Barry Bonds deserves the home run king crown if it
turns <br>
> > out that he took<br>
> > steroids? No. He cheated. At the very least, Nixon cheated in his
second <br>
> > presidential bid, cheated<br>
> > in an election for the president of the US. He won unfairly and Liddy
<br>
> > helped.<br>
> ><br>
> > And Ayers did not get off scot free. The charges were dropped. Why? <br>
> > Prosecutorial misconduct.<br>
> ><br>
> > --<br>
> > Joe Campbell<br>
> ><br>
> > ---- "g. crabtree" <jampot@roadrunner.com> wrote:<br>
> >> I guess since the argument being put forward is that Ayers should
be <br>
> >> given a<br>
> >> bye because he didn't really cause any harm, the same slack needs
to be<br>
> >> granted to Mr. Liddy. After all, the Watergate break in was
unsuccessful <br>
> >> and<br>
> >> the burglars (a fairly incompetent bunch) were all arrested. So,
since no<br>
> >> presidential campaign was hijacked and no vote was taken out of
the hands <br>
> >> of<br>
> >> the people it seems to me that you are holding G.Gordon to a much
higher<br>
> >> standard. At the very least Ayers committed an act of gross
vandalism and<br>
> >> reckless endangerment and got off Scot free. Liddy was complicit
in a <br>
> >> failed<br>
> >> break in and did five and a half years. He did the crime and he
did the<br>
> >> time. Throwing in some silly disclaimer whenever his name comes
up seems <br>
> >> as<br>
> >> daft and unnecessary as saying "setting off bombs designed
to maximize<br>
> >> injury and death in public places is a very, very bad thing.<br>
> >><br>
> >> g<br>
> >> ----- Original Message ----- <br>
> >> From: <joekc@roadrunner.com><br>
> >> To: "vision2020" <vision2020@moscow.com><br>
> >> Sent: Thursday, September 18, 2008 7:20 AM<br>
> >> Subject: Re: [Vision2020] Bill Ayers & Barack Obama<br>
> >><br>
> >><br>
> >> > What would be worse: a terrorist from another land blowing
up some<br>
> >> > buildings or a terrorist from<br>
> >> > another land hijacking a presidential campaign and ensuring
that one<br>
> >> > candidate wins over<br>
> >> > another? I think that hijacking a presidential campaign is
about the <br>
> >> > worst<br>
> >> > thing that anyone can<br>
> >> > do in a democracy. I'm a bit shocked that not everyone sees
it this <br>
> >> > way.<br>
> >> > Like Donovan I'm no fan<br>
> >> > of Ayers but to post anything on this topic without
condemning Liddy <br>
> >> > seems<br>
> >> > to be an insult to our<br>
> >> > form of government. Why not at least throw in a "Oh, by
the way taking <br>
> >> > the<br>
> >> > vote for president out<br>
> >> > of the people and putting it into the hands of a few is a
very, very <br>
> >> > bad<br>
> >> > thing."<br>
> >> ><br>
> >> > --<br>
> >> > Joe Campbell<br>
> >> ><br>
> >> > ---- "g. crabtree" <jampot@roadrunner.com>
wrote:<br>
> >> >> Read what I wrote. I did not claim that he killed
anyone. I said that <br>
> >> >> the<br>
> >> >> act of setting off explosives wrapped in nails in public
places is <br>
> >> >> akin<br>
> >> >> to attempted murder. If I light your apartment building
on fire and, <br>
> >> >> by<br>
> >> >> the grace of God, no one is injured or killed am I
mearly guilty of<br>
> >> >> failure to obtain a permit for an open burn?<br>
> >> >><br>
> >> >> g<br>
> >> >> ----- Original Message ----- <br>
> >> >> From: Donovan Arnold<br>
> >> >> To: Andreas Schou ; vision2020 ; g. crabtree<br>
> >> >> Sent: Wednesday, September 17, 2008 11:46 PM<br>
> >> >> Subject: Re: [Vision2020] Bill Ayers & Barack Obama<br>
> >> >><br>
> >> >><br>
> >> >> Gary,<br>
> >> >><br>
> >> >> I don't condone the actions of Ayers. But he never
killed <br>
> >> >> anyone.<br>
> >> >> To say he did is an incorrect statement. If you can
demonstrate to me <br>
> >> >> (an<br>
> >> >> online article etc.) he killed someone, I will accept
your statement <br>
> >> >> as<br>
> >> >> fact. Otherwise, I say your judgment and understanding
on this matter <br>
> >> >> is<br>
> >> >> deeply in question.<br>
> >> >><br>
> >> >> Best Regards,<br>
> >> >><br>
> >> >> Donovan<br>
> >> >><br>
> >> >> --- On Wed, 9/17/08, g. crabtree
<jampot@roadrunner.com> <br>
> >> >> wrote:<br>
> >> >><br>
> >> >> From: g. crabtree <jampot@roadrunner.com><br>
> >> >> Subject: Re: [Vision2020] Bill Ayers & Barack Obama<br>
> >> >> To: donovanjarnold2005@yahoo.com, "Andreas
Schou"<br>
> >> >> <ophite@gmail.com>, "vision2020"
<vision2020@moscow.com><br>
> >> >> Date: Wednesday, September 17, 2008, 5:30 AM<br>
> >> >><br>
> >> >><br>
> >> >> "Are you insinuating that Bill Ayers tried to kill
people?"<br>
> >> >><br>
> >> >> No, I am not insinuating I am saying it flat out.
Placing <br>
> >> >> anti<br>
> >> >> personnel bombs in public places is attempted murder.
When the vermin <br>
> >> >> in<br>
> >> >> Baghdad or Sader City or Fallujah set of IED's they
don't know the <br>
> >> >> names<br>
> >> >> of those they are attempting to murder and maim. Is it
your contention<br>
> >> >> that they are not trying to kill people?<br>
> >> >><br>
> >> >> g<br>
> >> >> ----- Original Message ----- <br>
> >> >> From: Donovan Arnold<br>
> >> >> To: Andreas Schou ; vision2020 ; g. crabtree<br>
> >> >> Sent: Wednesday, September 17, 2008 1:42 AM<br>
> >> >> Subject: Re: [Vision2020] Bill Ayers & Barack Obama<br>
> >> >><br>
> >> >><br>
> >> >><br>
> >> >> "No small accomplishment. Oh yeah, he has never<br>
> >> >> attempted to slaughter soldiers and police via the
cowardly practice <br>
> >> >> of<br>
> >> >> hiding and detonating explosives wrapped in nails."<br>
> >> >><br>
> >> >> Are you insinuating that Bill Ayers tried to kill<br>
> >> >> people? I am no fan of Ayers. But I think you are off
base saying he<br>
> >> >> killed, or even attempted to kill people. If you think
this, please<br>
> >> >> provide us with the names of people Ayers attempted to
kill, or who he<br>
> >> >> killed.<br>
> >> >><br>
> >> >> The people that McCain worked for between 1979 and <br>
> >> >> 1992<br>
> >> >> harmed more people than Ayers.<br>
> >> >><br>
> >> >> Best Regards,<br>
> >> >><br>
> >> >> Donovan<br>
> >> >><br>
> >> >> --- On Tue, 9/16/08, g. crabtree<br>
> >> >> <jampot@roadrunner.com> wrote:<br>
> >> >><br>
> >> >> From: g. crabtree <jampot@roadrunner.com><br>
> >> >> Subject: Re: [Vision2020] Bill Ayers & Barack <br>
> >> >> Obama<br>
> >> >> To: "Andreas Schou" <ophite@gmail.com>, <br>
> >> >> "vision2020"<br>
> >> >> <vision2020@moscow.com><br>
> >> >> Date: Tuesday, September 16, 2008, 7:24 PM<br>
> >> >><br>
> >> >><br>
> >> >> So what's your problem with the G-Man? The guy did his
time in <br>
> >> >> anything<br>
> >> >> but<br>
> >> >> country club conditions until your hero, James Earl
Carter, commuted <br>
> >> >> his<br>
> >> >> sentence. He never ratted out his associates and he's
managed to <br>
> >> >> support<br>
> >> >> himself and his family as an ex-con. No small
accomplishment. Oh yeah, <br>
> >> >> he<br>
> >> >> has never attempted to slaughter soldiers and police via
the cowardly<br>
> >> >> practice of hiding and detonating explosives wrapped in
nails. All <br>
> >> >> things<br>
> >> >> considered, I know that I would much rather associate
with a man who<br>
> >> >> served<br>
> >> >> his time and was released from prison than an
unrepentant attempted<br>
> >> >> murderer<br>
> >> >> whose only regret is that he couldn't cause more carnage
and mayhem. <br>
> >> >> Of<br>
> >> >> course that's just me.<br>
> >> >><br>
> >> >> g<br>
> >> >> ----- Original Message ----- <br>
> >> >> From: "Andreas Schou" <ophite@gmail.com><br>
> >> >> To: "vision2020" <vision2020@moscow.com><br>
> >> >> Sent: Tuesday, September 16, 2008 6:32 PM<br>
> >> >> Subject: [Vision2020] Bill Ayers & Barack Obama<br>
> >> >><br>
> >> >><br>
> >> >> > They both knew each other. They were both appointed
to co-chair an<br>
> >> >> > education panel by Mayor Daley, and the prior state
Senator from<br>
> >> >> > Obama's seat introduced him at Bill Ayers' house.
No large,<br>
> >> >> ongoing<br>
> >> >> > connection. But here's the thing:<br>
> >> >> ><br>
> >> >> > Why isn't John McCain's friendship with G. Gordon
Liddy a campaign<br>
> >> >> > issue? Is there any defensible reason for treating
Liddy like a<br>
> >> >> > rehabilitated member of the community, rather than
as a threat to <br>
> >> >> > the<br>
> >> >> > Republic? If so, why?<br>
> >> >> ><br>
> >> >> > -- ACS<br>
> >> >> ><br>
> >> >> >
=======================================================<br>
> >> >> > List services made available by First Step
Internet,<br>
> >> >> > serving the communities of the Palouse since 1994.<br>
> >> >> > http://www.fsr.net<br>
> >> >> > mailto:Vision2020@moscow.com<br>
> >> >> >
=======================================================<br>
> >> >> ><br>
> >> >><br>
> >> >><br>
> >> >> =======================================================<br>
> >> >> List services made available by First Step Internet,<br>
> >> >> serving the communities of the Palouse since 1994.<br>
> >> >> http://www.fsr.net<br>
> >> >> mailto:Vision2020@moscow.com<br>
> >> >> =======================================================<br>
> >> >><br>
> >> >><br>
> >> >><br>
> >> >> =======================================================<br>
> >> >> List services made available by First Step Internet,<br>
> >> >> serving the communities of the Palouse since 1994.<br>
> >> >> http://www.fsr.net<br>
> >> >> mailto:Vision2020@moscow.com<br>
> >> >> =======================================================<br>
> >> >><br>
> >> ><br>
> >> > =======================================================<br>
> >> > List services made available by First Step Internet,<br>
> >> > serving the communities of the Palouse since 1994.<br>
> >> > http://www.fsr.net<br>
> >> > mailto:Vision2020@moscow.com<br>
> >> > =======================================================<br>
> >> ><br>
> >><br>
> >><br>
> ><br>
> > <br>
> <br>
> <br>
> =======================================================<br>
> List services made available by First Step Internet, <br>
> serving the communities of the Palouse since 1994. <br>
> http://www.fsr.net <br>
> mailto:Vision2020@moscow.com<br>
> =======================================================</span></p>
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