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<DIV><FONT face="Times New Roman">Education, in itself, is not an indicator of
future wealth.</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face="Times New Roman">I believe "drive" is a far better predictor.
Dave Thomas, founder of Wendy's, was a high school drop out, Bill Gates is a
college drop out. The list can go on and on.</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face="Times New Roman">Most "new" millionaires aren't in suit and tie
professions, they are in the service trades; plumbers, electricians,
contractors, that sort of thing.</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face="Times New Roman">Using your statement of "better" schools,
I shouldn't be able to read or write very well. I should be working a menial job
somewhere, solely because I went to school in one of the poorest school
districts in Arizona and I didn't finish college. Santa Cruz County is the
smallest, and, at that time anyway, the poorest county in the state. The city of
Nogales consistently has one of the highest unemployment rates in the nation.
Drug and alcohol use in school was rampant (I had teachers who came to
class stoned), crime was high, gangs were around, although not as prevalent as
they are now. (I'm sure Keely could add comments on the view people/students in
Tucson took on Nogales.)</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face="Times New Roman">I'm not rich by any means, but I'm not dirt
poor either.</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face="Times New Roman">People who have made their own wealth have one
thing in common, the willingness to put in very long hours, to take risks, to
think outside of the norm and to doggedness to overcome obstacles.</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face="Times New Roman">You rarely ever see them say "Poor me", even
when they fail.</FONT></DIV>
<DIV style="FONT: 10pt Tahoma">
<DIV><BR></DIV>
<DIV style="BACKGROUND: #f5f5f5">
<DIV style="font-color: black"><B>From:</B> <A
title="mailto:lcavener@vandals.uidaho.edu CTRL + Click to follow link"
href="mailto:lcavener@vandals.uidaho.edu">Levi Cavener</A> </DIV>
<DIV><B>Sent:</B> Wednesday, July 30, 2008 9:10 AM</DIV>
<DIV><B>To:</B> <A title=vision2020@moscow.com
href="mailto:vision2020@moscow.com">vision2020@moscow.com</A> </DIV>
<DIV><B>Subject:</B> [Vision2020] FW: The Nation, 6/30/08</DIV></DIV></DIV>
<DIV><BR></DIV>
<DIV style="TEXT-ALIGN: left">
<DIV style="TEXT-ALIGN: left">
<DIV style="TEXT-ALIGN: left">"My premise is that most of those who were "haves"
before the distribution <BR>> would manage to accumulate wealth, becoming
"haves" again.<BR>> Of those who were "have nots" before the distribution,
most would become <BR>> "have nots" again."<BR><BR>But think about the reason
why the previously wealthy would once again become wealthy. Before the
redistribution the wealthy could afford whatever tools they needed (including
tools for their children) such as access to better schools (I'm not dismissing
the public school system, just saying that an elite private school is likely to
produce a better education than the public system could), access to higher and
continuing education for both themselves and their children, as well as previous
on the job experience and knowledge for jobs that pay more such as experience in
being a CEO of a company. Compare this in contrast to the previous
"have-nots" who hypothetically just had wealth redistributed. Upon the
redistribution they have no tools or background experience to advance from aside
from working a low level job in the service industry. Even if they were to
pursue the tools they need to get a job that pays more than the job they
previous had by such means as getting an education or internships they already
start at a disadvantage because the previously wealthy already possess all these
tools. As a result the previous "have-nots" have to play catchup with the
previously wealthy - they are the tortoise in the race of wealth and can only
win if the wealthy (hares) make a mistake that allows them to catch up or pass
them. Assuming this hypothetical wealth redistribution did occur, who
would you expect to become wealthy again? A CEO of a fortune 500 company
or a person who has been flipping burgers? Just a
thought.<BR></DIV><BR> <BR>~Esto Perpetua<BR> <BR>Levi
Cavener</DIV></DIV><BR><BR><BR>
<HR id=stopSpelling>
> From: editor@lataheagle.com<BR>> To: sslund_2007@verizon.net;
lfalen@turbonet.com; kjajmix1@msn.com; vision2020@moscow.com;
thansen@moscow.com<BR>> Date: Tue, 29 Jul 2008 13:07:37 -0700<BR>>
Subject: Re: [Vision2020] The Nation, 6/30/08<BR>> <BR>> As usual, Tom,
fails to grasp the conversation and tries comparing apples to <BR>>
oranges.<BR>> I will simplify it for him.<BR>> Tom, a complete wealth
distribution would begin with everyone on equal <BR>> financial footing. Over
time, the finances of some would improve while for <BR>> others it would
decline.<BR>> My premise is that most of those who were "haves" before the
distribution <BR>> would manage to accumulate wealth, becoming "haves"
again.<BR>> Of those who were "have nots" before the distribution, most would
become <BR>> "have nots" again.<BR>> It is a completely different scenario
than your "stimulus check" example, in <BR>> which there is no "equal
footing" financially.<BR>> <BR>> Got it?<BR>> <BR>>
--------------------------------------------------<BR>> From: "Tom Hansen"
<thansen@moscow.com><BR>> Sent: Tuesday, July 29, 2008 12:36 PM<BR>>
To: <editor@lataheagle.com>; <sslund_2007@verizon.net>; <BR>>
<lfalen@turbonet.com>; <kjajmix1@msn.com>;
<vision2020@moscow.com><BR>> Subject: Re: [Vision2020] The Nation,
6/30/08<BR>> <BR>> > By Kai's commentary, the stimulus checks
distributed these past few months<BR>> > must have created one MAJOR spark
in the economy.<BR>> ><BR>> > Surprise, Kai. It has been shown by
surveys and a multitude of analyses<BR>> > that the "have nots" have used
their stimulus checks on such frivolous<BR>> > items as food, rent, and
bills, while the "haves" . . . well . . . you<BR>> > know.<BR>>
><BR>> > Your thoughts?<BR>> ><BR>> > Tom Hansen<BR>>
> Moscow, Idaho<BR>> ><BR>> >> Human nature is human
nature.<BR>> >> Chances are, most of the "have nots" would blow their
windfall<BR>> > purchasing<BR>> >> things they could have never
afforded before.<BR>> >> Without thinking of the future, many people
would blow right through it.<BR>> >> Once gone, they would wind up
selling many of the things they purchased<BR>> >> because they didn't
save any of it for neccesities.<BR>> >> Many of the "haves" would see
opportunities and try to make the most of<BR>> >> their windfall,
gaining wealth.<BR>> >> It has nothing to do with the "worst" or "best"
in humans. It's just the<BR>> > way<BR>> >> it is.<BR>>
>><BR>> >>
--------------------------------------------------<BR>> >> From:
"Saundra Lund" <sslund_2007@verizon.net><BR>> >> Sent: Tuesday,
July 29, 2008 11:51 AM<BR>> >> To: "'Kai Eiselein, Editor'"
<editor@lataheagle.com>; "'lfalen'"<BR>> >>
<lfalen@turbonet.com>; "'keely emerinemix'"
<kjajmix1@msn.com>;<BR>> >> <vision2020@moscow.com><BR>>
>> Subject: RE: [Vision2020] The Nation, 6/30/08<BR>> >><BR>>
>> > Yes, of course I read it -- did you read the 6/30 The Nation
issue<BR>> > Keely<BR>> >> > mentioned in starting this
topic?<BR>> >> ><BR>> >> > I disagree with the
hypothetical conclusion in your hypothetical<BR>> > scenario.<BR>>
>> > I also don't agree with the inherent assumption of the worst
of<BR>> > humans --<BR>> >> > you sound almost Hobbesian.
Sorry for not making that clear. To<BR>> > expand .<BR>> >> >
.<BR>> >> > .<BR>> >> ><BR>> >> > I think
the odds are good that in a wealth redistribution that some of<BR>> >
the<BR>> >> > "have nots" would cherish the change, manage the money
well, and truly<BR>> >> > remember from whence they came. In a
wealth redistribution, I think<BR>> > the<BR>> >> > odds are
good some of the previous "haves" would have no eye to the<BR>> >
future<BR>> >> > and would soon be penniless . . . and need
assistance.<BR>> >> ><BR>> >> > The difference in my
hypothetical scenario & yours is that there are<BR>> > so<BR>>
>> > many<BR>> >> > more "have nots" than "haves" that the
eventual distribution of the<BR>> >> > redistribution would be
better for the greater good and a net gain in<BR>> >> > quality of
life for more. I'm not willing to assume the worst in a<BR>> >> >
hypothetical based on the self-serving historical behavior of some of<BR>>
> the<BR>> >> > "haves" and their failure to consider a common
good and their fellow<BR>> >> > countrymen.<BR>> >>
><BR>> >> > I like to think we'd have no need to redistribute
wealth if we each<BR>> > helped<BR>> >> > our sisters and
brothers, mothers and fathers, daughters and sons to<BR>> >> >
improve<BR>> >> > their lots in life to the best of our abilities
rather than just what<BR>> > we<BR>> >> > think they deserve.
Nor would we likely need government safety nets<BR>> > for<BR>>
>> > so<BR>> >> > many of our unfortunate were it not for
the greed of the "haves."<BR>> >> ><BR>> >> > Altruistic
Pollyanna is a name I'm far more comfortable wearing than<BR>> >
Cynic<BR>> >> > Assuming Greed Trumps Good.<BR>> >>
><BR>> >> ><BR>> >> > -----Original
Message-----<BR>> >> > From: Kai Eiselein, Editor
[mailto:editor@lataheagle.com]<BR>> >> > Sent: Tuesday, July 29,
2008 11:01 AM<BR>> >> > To: Saundra Lund; 'lfalen'; 'keely
emerinemix'; vision2020@moscow.com<BR>> >> > Subject: Re:
[Vision2020] The Nation, 6/30/08<BR>> >> ><BR>> >> > Did
you or did you not read my hypothetical scenario?<BR>> >> ><BR>>
>> > --------------------------------------------------<BR>>
>> > From: "Saundra Lund" <sslund_2007@verizon.net><BR>>
>> > Sent: Tuesday, July 29, 2008 10:56 AM<BR>> >> > To:
"'Kai Eiselein, Editor'" <editor@lataheagle.com>; "'lfalen'"<BR>>
>> > <lfalen@turbonet.com>; "'keely emerinemix'"
<kjajmix1@msn.com>;<BR>> >> >
<vision2020@moscow.com><BR>> >> > Subject: RE: [Vision2020]
The Nation, 6/30/08<BR>> >> ><BR>> >> >> Kai
wrote:<BR>> >> >> "I would venture to hypothesize this: If wealth
were distributed<BR>> > equally<BR>> >> >> to<BR>>
>> >> every person, it would only be a matter of time before there
would be<BR>> > the<BR>> >> >> "haves" and "have nots" once
again."<BR>> >> >><BR>> >> >> Good grief -- what
do you mean "once again"?!?! That's how things<BR>> > are<BR>> >>
>> now<BR>> >> ><BR>> >> >> .<BR>> >>
>> . . hello!<BR>> >> >><BR>> >> >><BR>>
>> >> Saundra Lund<BR>> >> >> Moscow, ID<BR>>
>> >><BR>> >> >> The only thing necessary for the
triumph of evil is for good people<BR>> > to do<BR>> >> >>
nothing.<BR>> >> >> ~ Edmund Burke<BR>> >>
>><BR>> >> >> ***** Original material contained herein is
Copyright 2008 through<BR>> > life<BR>> >> >> plus<BR>>
>> >> 70 years, Saundra Lund. Do not copy, forward, excerpt, or
reproduce<BR>> >> >> outside<BR>> >> >> the Vision
2020 forum without the express written permission of the<BR>> >>
>> author.*****<BR>> >> >><BR>> >>
>><BR>> >> >><BR>> >> >><BR>> >>
> Kai Eiselein<BR>> >> > Editor, Latah Eagle<BR>> >>
><BR>> >> ><BR>> >> Kai Eiselein<BR>> >>
Editor, Latah Eagle<BR>> >><BR>> >>
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>><BR>> ><BR>> ><BR>> > "We're a town of about 23,000
with 10,000 college students. The college<BR>> > students are not very
active in local elections (thank goodness!)."<BR>> ><BR>> > - Dale
Courtney (March 28, 2007)<BR>> ><BR>> ><BR>> >
---------------------------------------------<BR>> > This message was sent
by First Step Internet.<BR>> > http://www.fsr.com/<BR>> ><BR>>
><BR>> Kai Eiselein<BR>> Editor, Latah Eagle <BR>> <BR>>
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<DIV><FONT face="Times New Roman">Kai Eiselein<BR>Editor, Latah
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