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Saundra,<br><br>Fair enough. i understand your point and frustration. I know we can all do more to help each other and pay attention to others, such as car placement. I go through cars being in my snow plowing way, every morning. <br><br>I guess I am one that would rather help out first then, if that doesnt solve it resort to 882-cops. This is why I am volunteering my time through the PCEI to help others that are unable. I too, just like J Ford helps the neighbors out when needed, just like I assume or hope all of us on the V do.<br><br>I am not sure how PCEI filters it's clients to insure an "unable" person, but believe me if I ever find out I am volunteering time to an able bodied person, I'm outta there.<br><br>Take care<br>Matt<br><br><blockquote><hr>Date: Tue, 29 Jan 2008 14:15:18 -0800<br>From: sslund_2007@verizon.net<br>To: mattd2107@hotmail.com; vision2020@moscow.com<br>Subject: Re: [Vision2020] Contractors<br><br>
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<p class="EC_MsoNormal"><span style="font-family: 'Calibri','sans-serif'; color: rgb(31, 73, 125);">Hi
Matt,</span></p>
<p class="EC_MsoNormal"><span style="font-family: 'Calibri','sans-serif'; color: rgb(31, 73, 125);"> </span></p>
<p class="EC_MsoNormal"><span style="font-family: 'Calibri','sans-serif'; color: rgb(31, 73, 125);">Well,
I’m not sure I can agree with you that “we all want clean clear
streets.” <b>I</b> absolutely agree with you, but have you driven
around town lately? As today’s City Press Release posted here on
the Viz highlights, there are more than a few people who haven’t
bothered to move their vehicles so plows can do the job. Perhaps some are
broken down, in which case they shouldn’t be parked on public streets.
Perhaps some owners are out of town, in which case their vehicles shouldn’t
be left parked on public streets, particularly in winter.</span></p>
<p class="EC_MsoNormal"><span style="font-family: 'Calibri','sans-serif'; color: rgb(31, 73, 125);"> </span></p>
<p class="EC_MsoNormal"><span style="font-family: 'Calibri','sans-serif'; color: rgb(31, 73, 125);">Whatever
the various reasons folks have left their cars parked on public streets for
extended periods, it’s created a public safety issue for all of us
attempting to get around whether by walking, biking, or driving.</span></p>
<p class="EC_MsoNormal"><span style="font-family: 'Calibri','sans-serif'; color: rgb(31, 73, 125);"> </span></p>
<p class="EC_MsoNormal"><span style="font-family: 'Calibri','sans-serif'; color: rgb(31, 73, 125);">The
same public safety issues arises when property owners fail to clear their sidewalks.
I’m with you in that I don’t’ think CdA’s 9 AM deadline
is realistic -- what if you shovel at 7 AM before leaving for work and another
2” fall after you’ve left for work?</span></p>
<p class="EC_MsoNormal"><span style="font-family: 'Calibri','sans-serif'; color: rgb(31, 73, 125);"> </span></p>
<p class="EC_MsoNormal"><span style="font-family: 'Calibri','sans-serif'; color: rgb(31, 73, 125);">However,
I absolutely agree with Janesta and others that we need to do more to address
the many, many situations of those who aren’t clearing their sidewalks in
a timely manner.</span></p>
<p class="EC_MsoNormal"><span style="font-family: 'Calibri','sans-serif'; color: rgb(31, 73, 125);"> </span></p>
<p class="EC_MsoNormal"><span style="font-family: 'Calibri','sans-serif'; color: rgb(31, 73, 125);">I
am proud to live in a community that has come up with a solution for the
elderly and differently-abled who aren’t able to clear their own
sidewalks, but what about all the property owners who just don’t seem to
give a darn, putting the safety of the rest of us at risk?</span></p>
<p class="EC_MsoNormal"><span style="font-family: 'Calibri','sans-serif'; color: rgb(31, 73, 125);"> </span></p>
<p class="EC_MsoNormal"><span style="font-family: 'Calibri','sans-serif'; color: rgb(31, 73, 125);">Other
communities have come up with workable solutions – why can’t we?
The current system really doesn’t work well, as those of us (including
school children) who are pedestrians in winter are well aware of.</span></p>
<p class="EC_MsoNormal"><span style="font-family: 'Calibri','sans-serif'; color: rgb(31, 73, 125);"> </span></p>
<p class="EC_MsoNormal"><span style="font-family: 'Calibri','sans-serif'; color: rgb(31, 73, 125);">I
have a crappy back and therefore can’t help out with the City of Moscow’s
& PCEI’s wonderful Snow Patrol (<a href="http://www.pcei.org/VolunteerSnow.htm" target="_blank">http://www.pcei.org/VolunteerSnow.htm</a>)
– but kudos to you and others who are helping!</span></p>
<p class="EC_MsoNormal"><span style="font-family: 'Calibri','sans-serif'; color: rgb(31, 73, 125);"> </span></p>
<p class="EC_MsoNormal"><span style="font-family: 'Calibri','sans-serif'; color: rgb(31, 73, 125);">However,
even if I had didn’t have a crappy back, I don’t think I’d be
too interested in spending too much time volunteering to clear sidewalks for
those able-but-unwilling to do the job themselves to help keep the rest of us
safe, you know? Nor am I very interested in having my tax dollars go to
clear the sidewalks of those able-but-unwilling to do the job themselves to
help keep the rest of us safe.</span></p>
<p class="EC_MsoNormal"><span style="font-family: 'Calibri','sans-serif'; color: rgb(31, 73, 125);"> </span></p>
<p class="EC_MsoNormal"><span style="font-family: 'Calibri','sans-serif'; color: rgb(31, 73, 125);">Thus,
it seems to me an infinitely reasonable solution is to have a mechanism in
place to get the flippin’ job done in a timely manner and then bill the
property owner.</span></p>
<p class="EC_MsoNormal"><span style="font-family: 'Calibri','sans-serif'; color: rgb(31, 73, 125);"> </span></p>
<p class="EC_MsoNormal"><span style="font-family: 'Calibri','sans-serif'; color: rgb(31, 73, 125);"> </span></p>
<p class="EC_MsoNormal"><span style="font-family: 'Calibri','sans-serif'; color: rgb(31, 73, 125);">JMHO,</span></p>
<div>
<p class="EC_MsoNormal"><span style="font-size: 11pt; font-family: 'Calibri','sans-serif'; color: rgb(31, 73, 125);">Saundra Lund</span></p>
<p class="EC_MsoNormal"><span style="font-size: 11pt; font-family: 'Calibri','sans-serif'; color: rgb(31, 73, 125);">Moscow, ID</span></p>
<p class="EC_MsoNormal"><span style="font-size: 11pt; font-family: 'Calibri','sans-serif'; color: rgb(31, 73, 125);"> </span></p>
<p class="EC_MsoNormal"><span style="font-size: 11pt; font-family: 'Calibri','sans-serif'; color: rgb(31, 73, 125);">The only thing necessary for the triumph of evil is for good
people to do nothing.</span></p>
<p class="EC_MsoNormal"><span style="font-size: 11pt; font-family: 'Calibri','sans-serif'; color: rgb(31, 73, 125);">~ Edmund Burke</span></p>
<p class="EC_MsoNormal"><span style="font-size: 11pt; font-family: 'Calibri','sans-serif'; color: rgb(31, 73, 125);"> </span></p>
<p class="EC_MsoNormal"><b><span style="font-size: 11pt; font-family: 'Calibri','sans-serif'; color: rgb(31, 73, 125);">***** Original material contained herein is Copyright 2008
through life plus 70 years, Saundra Lund. Do not copy, forward, excerpt,
or reproduce outside the Vision 2020 forum without the express written
permission of the author.*****</span></b></p>
</div>
<p class="EC_MsoNormal"><span style="font-family: 'Calibri','sans-serif'; color: rgb(31, 73, 125);"> </span></p>
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<p class="EC_MsoNormal"><b><span style="font-size: 10pt; font-family: 'Tahoma','sans-serif';">From:</span></b><span style="font-size: 10pt; font-family: 'Tahoma','sans-serif';">
vision2020-bounces@moscow.com [mailto:vision2020-bounces@moscow.com] <b>On
Behalf Of </b>Matt Decker<br>
<b>Sent:</b> Tuesday, January 29, 2008 1:41 PM<br>
<b>To:</b> J Ford; vision2020@moscow.com<br>
<b>Subject:</b> Re: [Vision2020] Contractors</span></p>
</div>
</div>
<p class="EC_MsoNormal"> </p>
<p class="EC_MsoNormal" style="margin-bottom: 12pt;"><span style="font-size: 10pt; font-family: 'Tahoma','sans-serif';">J,<br>
<br>
Try having a conversation w/o harping on someone you disagree with for once
will ya.<br>
<br>
To fine people for not being done by 9 am regardless, to me, is too harsh
of a rule. There are too many what ifs. How can you justify making a cop or
firefighter get paid help because he/she is out protecting YOU. Or how can you
have it in your heart to make the guy clearing the streets and sidewalks of the
snow, that the cops have to pay for, pay an extra $500 a month. <br>
<br>
Look we all want clean clear streets. In my opinion fining the bajesus out of
those who cannot do it is not the right solution. So let's quite the belittling
and come to a solution, if this current one is not working for you.<br>
<br>
Maybe juveniles on probation is a good start.<br>
<br>
Or you can donate your time to help clean some these sidewalks. Talk to Kit
Craine for info. She got me started on it.<br>
<br>
Matt</span></p>
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</span></div>
<p class="EC_MsoNormal" style="margin-bottom: 12pt;"><span style="font-size: 10pt; font-family: 'Tahoma','sans-serif';">From: privatejf32@hotmail.com<br>
To: vision2020@moscow.com<br>
Date: Tue, 29 Jan 2008 07:01:38 -0800<br>
Subject: Re: [Vision2020] Contractors<br>
<br>
Ok, so there is State-wide example precedent for this type of thing. I
like the sound of your example, Janesta. Wonder if ANYone in the City is
willing to comment or even DO something positive to resolve the issue......<br>
<br>
Matt - whatever. <br>
<br>
When you own property, being out of town or being at work still means its up to
you, the property owner responsible party, to make sure things get done.
I suppose if someone working on your property slips and breaks an arm while
you're gone due to your not making a needed repair, your "not responsible
as I was at work or out of town" defense would work? Nope. <br>
<br>
There are a lot of "out-of-town" owners with property in Moscow -
they hire property managers who are supposed to - ahem - "manage" the
property and make sure things get done. <br>
<br>
J :]<br>
<br>
</span></p>
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</span></div>
<p class="EC_MsoNormal" style="margin-bottom: 12pt;"><span style="font-size: 10pt; font-family: 'Tahoma','sans-serif';">Date: Mon, 28 Jan 2008 22:56:57 -0800<br>
From: janesta@gmail.com<br>
To: mattd2107@hotmail.com<br>
CC: vision2020@moscow.com; privatejf32@hotmail.com<br>
Subject: Re: [Vision2020] Contractors</span></p>
<div>
<p class="EC_MsoNormal"><span style="font-size: 10pt; font-family: 'Tahoma','sans-serif';">In
Couer d' Alene, if the walks aren't cleared by 9:00 am, and kept clear, the
city will do it, and fine the property owner $100.00. If the fine isn't paid,
it is attached as a lien on their property.</span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="EC_MsoNormal"><span style="font-size: 10pt; font-family: 'Tahoma','sans-serif';"> </span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="EC_MsoNormal"><span style="font-size: 10pt; font-family: 'Tahoma','sans-serif';">Put
the kids on probation to work. It is a tangible way to know they have completed
the job. If the snow hasn't been removed, the job isn't done.</span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="EC_MsoNormal"><span style="font-size: 10pt; font-family: 'Tahoma','sans-serif';"> </span></p>
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<div>
<p class="EC_MsoNormal"><span style="font-size: 10pt; font-family: 'Tahoma','sans-serif';">I
respectfully disagree with you, Matt. The buck stops with the owner of the
property. Why should I get injured due to the neglance of a property owner?
Taking care of the sidewalks is part of the responsibility of being a property
owner.</span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="EC_MsoNormal"><span style="font-size: 10pt; font-family: 'Tahoma','sans-serif';"> </span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="EC_MsoNormal"><span style="font-size: 10pt; font-family: 'Tahoma','sans-serif';">Also,
Matt, I appreciate your gracious offer to shovel my walks last week...
*smile* I don't have any sidewalks, other than a short three foot walk to the
gravel alley.</span></p>
</div>
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<p class="EC_MsoNormal"><span style="font-size: 10pt; font-family: 'Tahoma','sans-serif';"> </span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="EC_MsoNormal"><span style="font-size: 10pt; font-family: 'Tahoma','sans-serif';">Janesta<br>
<br>
</span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="EC_MsoNormal"><span class="EC_ececgmailquote"><span style="font-size: 10pt; font-family: 'Tahoma','sans-serif';">On 1/28/08, <b>Matt Decker</b> <<a href="mailto:mattd2107@hotmail.com">mattd2107@hotmail.com</a>> wrote:</span></span><span style="font-size: 10pt; font-family: 'Tahoma','sans-serif';"> </span></p>
<div>
<p class="EC_MsoNormal" style="margin-bottom: 12pt;"><span style="font-size: 10pt; font-family: 'Tahoma','sans-serif';">I think going down this road can lead to a
whole new can of worms. If we start doing contractor work for snow, then whats
next? <br>
<br>
Maybe I can start billing the city for plowing my street. <br>
<br>
I believe if the people in town need help with the sidewalks, just ask. Many
out there will help. No need to fine people who in most cases can't do it or
are out of town.<br>
<br>
2 cents<br>
<span class="EC_ececsg">Matt</span></span></p>
<div class="EC_MsoNormal" style="text-align: center;" align="center"><span class="EC_ececad"><span style="font-size: 10pt; font-family: 'Tahoma','sans-serif';">
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</span></span></div>
<p class="EC_MsoNormal"><span class="EC_ececad"><span style="font-size: 10pt; font-family: 'Tahoma','sans-serif';">From: <a href="mailto:privatejf32@hotmail.com">privatejf32@hotmail.com</a></span></span><span style="font-size: 10pt; font-family: 'Tahoma','sans-serif';"><br>
<span class="EC_ececad">To: <a href="mailto:vision2020@moscow.com">vision2020@moscow.com</a></span><br>
<span class="EC_ececad">Date: Mon, 28 Jan 2008 19:39:08 -0800</span><br>
<span class="EC_ececad">Subject: [Vision2020] Contractors</span> </span></p>
<div>
<p class="EC_MsoNormal" style="margin-bottom: 12pt;"><span style="font-size: 10pt; font-family: 'Tahoma','sans-serif';"><br>
<br>
<span class="EC_ecece">I know this won't solve the issue today, but has the City or
County ever thought about having contractors on retainer, so that if a problem
area sidewalk owner/responsible party refuses to or is slow to clean it off,
the contractor is brought in to do the cleaning off and then the
owner/responsible party is fined for the work done? If there isn't
anything like that now on the books, is there a possibility to consider it in
the future, like for next year?</span><br>
<br>
<span class="EC_ecece">Comments????</span><br>
<br>
<span class="EC_ecece">J :]</span></span><span class="EC_ecece"></span></p>
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