<div>All-</div>
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<div>Given that the statement quoted below suggests that first amendment free speech rights are denied those who don't vote, Garrett's dismay at the current city council's approach to the noise ordinance might not be addressed to Garrett's satisfaction by the incoming city council members:
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<div><a href="http://mailman.fsr.com/pipermail/vision2020/2007-November/049840.html">http://mailman.fsr.com/pipermail/vision2020/2007-November/049840.html</a></div>
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<div>"...those who don't exercise their<br>privilege vote have no right to bitch."</div>
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<div>Dan Carscallen<br>----------------------</div>
<div>As far as where Sunil is "coming from," I don't think Sunil's thoughtful concerns about police over reaching in the application of law is just based on his personal experiences as a defense councilor. Anyone with a firm view of defending free speech, privacy, and property, US Constitutional rights, opposes granting police broad legal powers to restrict speech, invade privacy etc. or engage in harassment, based on their "discretion."
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<div>I have not heard any substantial arguments why a decibel meter is not advisable to measure noise law enforcement is monitoring for restrictive action. As long as the decibel meter is calibrated and used correctly (same issue with radar for speeding), this provides an objective standard for enforcement, avoiding subjective biased or random standards.
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<div>Ted Moffett <br><br> </div>
<div><span class="gmail_quote">On 11/15/07, <b class="gmail_sendername">Dan Carscallen</b> <<a href="mailto:areaman@moscow.com">areaman@moscow.com</a>> wrote:</span>
<blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="PADDING-LEFT: 1ex; MARGIN: 0px 0px 0px 0.8ex; BORDER-LEFT: #ccc 1px solid">
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<div><span><font face="Comic Sans MS" color="#800000">Sunil,</font></span></div>
<div><span><font face="Comic Sans MS" color="#800000"></font></span> </div>
<div><span><font face="Comic Sans MS" color="#800000">Good questions.</font></span></div>
<div><span><font face="Comic Sans MS" color="#800000"></font></span> </div>
<div><span><font face="Comic Sans MS" color="#800000">My understanding, listening to Weaver and Duke, is that the police don't want to become the complaintants, and they don't want to drive around looking for noise. The main idea behind it, I believe, is to allow the police to become the complaintant (signing the ticket) so someone who wishes to remain anonymous can complain about the noise without fear of retribution. According to Liz Brandt, they don't need to set a decibel level to remain legal. I thought that might be a good idea, but that level could change dependent on many factors.
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<div><span><font face="Comic Sans MS" color="#800000"></font></span> </div>
<div><span><font face="Comic Sans MS" color="#800000">You being a counsel for defense, I can see where you are coming from. I think the proper steps are being taken to make this ordinance work for everyone.</font></span>
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<div><span><font face="Comic Sans MS" color="#800000"></font></span> </div>
<div><span><font face="Comic Sans MS" color="#800000">DC</font></span></div></span>
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<div lang="en-us" dir="ltr" align="left"><font face="Tahoma">-----Original Message-----<br><b>From:</b> <a onclick="return top.js.OpenExtLink(window,event,this)" target="_blank" href="mailto:vision2020-bounces@moscow.com">
vision2020-bounces@moscow.com</a> [mailto:<a onclick="return top.js.OpenExtLink(window,event,this)" target="_blank" href="mailto:vision2020-bounces@moscow.com">vision2020-bounces@moscow.com</a>] <b>On Behalf Of </b>Sunil Ramalingam
<br><b>Sent:</b> Wednesday, November 14, 2007 7:28 PM<br><b>To:</b> <a onclick="return top.js.OpenExtLink(window,event,this)" target="_blank" href="mailto:vision2020@moscow.com">vision2020@moscow.com</a><br><b>Subject:</b>
Re: [Vision2020] Noise Ordinance Admin Meeting<br><br></font></div>Dan,<br><br>Before Halloween one of the kids across the alley from us came to our door to give us their number, and let us know they were having a party. He asked me to call him if the noise was a problem, and he would turn down the music.
<br><br>We never heard a thing, but I really appreciated the way he was willing to take steps to keep the party in hand.<br><br>Now let's say the new ordinance gets passed. Even if the neighbors don't complain, are the police going to be able to hand out a citation? And are they going to want to get in the house and start checking IDs? When you give law enforcement 'tools,' they turn into pry bars used to get into homes.
<br><br>Sunil<br><br>> From: <a onclick="return top.js.OpenExtLink(window,event,this)" target="_blank" href="mailto:areaman@moscow.com">areaman@moscow.com</a><br>> To: <a onclick="return top.js.OpenExtLink(window,event,this)" target="_blank" href="mailto:vision2020@moscow.com">
vision2020@moscow.com</a><br>> Date: Wed, 14 Nov 2007 19:21:07 -0800<br>> Subject: Re: [Vision2020] Noise Ordinance Admin Meeting<br>> <br>> Garrett, you ask:<br>> "I am still curious about your views on the NOM, Dan."
<br>> <br>> My view on the noise ordinance is that it is something we need. I agree<br>> with Dan Schmidt that it's a tool law enforcement should be able to use,<br>> since there are gaps in the current ordinance. I will also agree that
<br>> the language is vague and that it makes it hard to enforce. From what I<br>> understood from Liz Brandt, with a few minor tweaks the ordinance will<br>> be workable. I look forward to seeing what Fife comes up with, taking
<br>> into account what Brandt and you have contributed to the conversation.<br>> <br>> DC<br>> <br>> <br>> =======================================================<br>> List services made available by First Step Internet,
<br>> serving the communities of the Palouse since 1994. <br>> <a onclick="return top.js.OpenExtLink(window,event,this)" target="_blank" href="http://www.fsr.net/">http://www.fsr.net</a> <br>> mailto:<a onclick="return top.js.OpenExtLink(window,event,this)" target="_blank" href="mailto:Vision2020@moscow.com">
Vision2020@moscow.com</a><br>> =======================================================<br></blockquote></span></div></div><br>=======================================================<br> List services made available by First Step Internet,
<br> serving the communities of the Palouse since 1994.<br> <a onclick="return top.js.OpenExtLink(window,event,this)" target="_blank" href="http://www.fsr.net/">http://www.fsr.net</a><br> mailto:<a onclick="return top.js.OpenExtLink(window,event,this)" href="mailto:Vision2020@moscow.com">
Vision2020@moscow.com</a><br>=======================================================<br></blockquote></div><br>