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<DIV><FONT face=Arial>So how does "desperate to unload a while elephant," square
with "They want profit, not just to get rid of things?" The two statements seem
to contradict one another.</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial></FONT> </DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial>g</DIV>
<DIV><BR><BR></DIV></FONT>
<BLOCKQUOTE
style="PADDING-RIGHT: 0px; PADDING-LEFT: 5px; MARGIN-LEFT: 5px; BORDER-LEFT: #000000 2px solid; MARGIN-RIGHT: 0px">
<DIV style="FONT: 10pt arial">----- Original Message ----- </DIV>
<DIV
style="BACKGROUND: #e4e4e4; FONT: 10pt arial; font-color: black"><B>From:</B>
<A title=privatejf32@hotmail.com href="mailto:privatejf32@hotmail.com">J
Ford</A> </DIV>
<DIV style="FONT: 10pt arial"><B>To:</B> <A title=vision2020@moscow.com
href="mailto:vision2020@moscow.com">vision2020@moscow.com</A> </DIV>
<DIV style="FONT: 10pt arial"><B>Sent:</B> Thursday, November 01, 2007 12:56
PM</DIV>
<DIV style="FONT: 10pt arial"><B>Subject:</B> Re: [Vision2020] Affordable
Housing</DIV>
<DIV><BR></DIV>They don't want to operate at a loss, either, fella!<BR><BR>Did
you happen to see what happened to the CEO of Merrill/Lynch this week?
He's out due to his taking a gamble on the housing industry and LOOSING big
time - to the tune of BILLIONS of dollars. Not something a bank is
knowingly going to go into nor wish to stay in if they can help it. So
taking a white elephant and un-loading it to the first guy with a buck is not
going to cut it. They want profit, not just to get rid of
things.<BR><BR>And this is NOT affordable housing...it's a "garage sale"
mentality that no one wants. The person buying into such a house is more
encumbered than you realize when they get into such a house. It is NOT
affordable to anyone.<BR><BR>J :]<BR><BR><BR>
<BLOCKQUOTE>
<HR>
From: jampot@roadrunner.com<BR>To: privatejf32@hotmail.com;
vision2020@moscow.com<BR>Date: Thu, 1 Nov 2007 07:37:40 -0700<BR>Subject:
Re: [Vision2020] Affordable Housing<BR><BR>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial>Perhaps you or some other "progressive" would like to
explain the error in my thinking? Goodness knows I'm not a property/finance
expert but, it seems obvious that banks, and more importantly their
shareholders don't need or want liabilities ("white elephants") cluttering
up the P&L statements. As the houses stagnate on the market the price
will drop until it becomes attractive to someone. The very definition of
affordable housing. </FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial></FONT> </DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial>g</FONT></DIV>
<BLOCKQUOTE
style="PADDING-RIGHT: 0px; PADDING-LEFT: 5px; MARGIN-LEFT: 5px; BORDER-LEFT: rgb(0,0,0) 2px solid; MARGIN-RIGHT: 0px">
<DIV
style="FONT: 10pt arial; font-size-adjust: none; font-stretch: normal">-----
Original Message ----- </DIV>
<DIV
style="BACKGROUND: rgb(228,228,228) 0% 50%; FONT: 10pt arial; font-size-adjust: none; font-stretch: normal; -moz-background-clip: -moz-initial; -moz-background-origin: -moz-initial; -moz-background-inline-policy: -moz-initial"><B>From:</B>
<A title=privatejf32@hotmail.com href="mailto:privatejf32@hotmail.com">J
Ford</A> </DIV>
<DIV
style="FONT: 10pt arial; font-size-adjust: none; font-stretch: normal"><B>To:</B>
<A title=vision2020@moscow.com
href="mailto:vision2020@moscow.com">vision2020@moscow.com</A> </DIV>
<DIV
style="FONT: 10pt arial; font-size-adjust: none; font-stretch: normal"><B>Sent:</B>
Thursday, November 01, 2007 6:46 AM</DIV>
<DIV
style="FONT: 10pt arial; font-size-adjust: none; font-stretch: normal"><B>Subject:</B>
Re: [Vision2020] Affordable Housing</DIV>
<DIV><BR></DIV>Yeah - now THERE's some progressive thinking going
on!<BR><BR>"<FONT face=Arial>Wouldn't that be the market sorting it self
out? Doesn't one mans (or banks) "desperate to unload white
elephant" becomes another mans affordable housing?"
gc</FONT><BR><BR>J :]<BR><BR><BR>
<BLOCKQUOTE>
<HR>
From: <A
href="mailto:jampot@roadrunner.com">jampot@roadrunner.com</A><BR>To: <A
href="mailto:privatejf32@hotmail.com">privatejf32@hotmail.com</A>; <A
href="mailto:the_ivies3@yahoo.com">the_ivies3@yahoo.com</A>; <A
href="mailto:vision2020@moscow.com">vision2020@moscow.com</A><BR>Subject:
Re: [Vision2020] Affordable Housing<BR>Date: Thu, 1 Nov 2007 06:39:03
-0700<BR><BR>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial>"I believe sooner or later, we will see a bunch of
houses sitting empty with banks desperate to unload a while
elephant."<BR></FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial>Wouldn't that be the market sorting it self out?
Doesn't one mans (or banks) "desperate to unload white
elephant" becomes another mans affordable housing?</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial></FONT> </DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial>g</FONT></DIV>
<BLOCKQUOTE
style="PADDING-RIGHT: 0px; PADDING-LEFT: 5px; MARGIN-LEFT: 5px; BORDER-LEFT: rgb(0,0,0) 2px solid; MARGIN-RIGHT: 0px">
<DIV
style="FONT: 10pt arial; font-size-adjust: none; font-stretch: normal">-----
Original Message ----- </DIV>
<DIV
style="BACKGROUND: rgb(228,228,228) 0% 50%; FONT: 10pt arial; font-size-adjust: none; font-stretch: normal; -moz-background-clip: -moz-initial; -moz-background-origin: -moz-initial; -moz-background-inline-policy: -moz-initial"><B>From:</B>
<A title=privatejf32@hotmail.com
href="mailto:privatejf32@hotmail.com">J Ford</A> </DIV>
<DIV
style="FONT: 10pt arial; font-size-adjust: none; font-stretch: normal"><B>To:</B>
<A title=the_ivies3@yahoo.com href="mailto:the_ivies3@yahoo.com">Tom
Ivie</A> ; <A title=vision2020@moscow.com
href="mailto:vision2020@moscow.com">vision2020@moscow.com</A> </DIV>
<DIV
style="FONT: 10pt arial; font-size-adjust: none; font-stretch: normal"><B>Sent:</B>
Thursday, November 01, 2007 6:15 AM</DIV>
<DIV
style="FONT: 10pt arial; font-size-adjust: none; font-stretch: normal"><B>Subject:</B>
Re: [Vision2020] Affordable Housing</DIV>
<DIV><BR></DIV>The thing is, communities around us are selling houses
at half to one quarter the prices seen in Moscow and renting for far
less than Moscow. The community and developers (yes, they set
the price of the houses they build) need to get together and become
educated in what really sells, how it sells and why it sells.
The housing in Moscow is just ridiculous when you consider other
towns, with larger populations, are seeing houses going for so much
less. I think for a town like ours to have SO many developments
with SO many houses in each one is just short-sighted or no-sighted
and I believe sooner or later, we will see a bunch of houses sitting
empty with banks desperate to unload a while elephant.<BR><BR>I also
believe that if Moscow continues to rely on UI or WSU to be
main-stayers in the employment fields, we will see a major decline not
only in students coming to the area but people staying here. If
the current plans to move the UI colleges to other parts of the state
holds true, it will especially hurt us if we don't do something about
attracting other types of industry to this area.<BR><BR>Its all fine
and well that "New Cities" was accepted by Moscow to be the new vision
of things to come, but nothing is going to really pick the area up
economically if we can't be more supportive in developing business
opportunities rather than housing developments. Can't sell what
people can't pay for due to lack of jobs.<BR><BR>Nor do we need to
continue to allow some groups in Moscow to become/remain tax-exempt
but owning HUGE amounts of commercial properties, yet
service-demanding.<BR><BR>J :]<BR><BR><BR>
<BLOCKQUOTE>
<HR>
Date: Wed, 31 Oct 2007 20:58:17 -0700<BR>From:
the_ivies3@yahoo.com<BR>To: vision2020@moscow.com<BR>Subject: Re:
[Vision2020] Affordable Housing<BR><BR>
<DIV>Hi Donovan,</DIV>
<DIV>I agree with you on this one and as you point out, this was a
problem WAY before our current city council. However, there is
also another element to affordable housing. What I am talking
about is entry level starter homes. Not to blame the
developers, because I don't know that it is their fault, but the
cost of land is not affordable, this gets passed onto the
homebuyer. It is probably a matter of economics that the
developers or builders build $200,000 on up homes on the
property. I don't blame them for wanting to get the most money
out of their investment. The fact is that salaries have not
gone up at even close to the same rate that housing prices
did. There has been a lot of purchasing of homes done in a
manner of creative financing that neither you or I could even try,
but those buying strategies have caused some tapering off in the
housing market as a direct or indirect result. Does that higher
market affect affordable housing? I think it might. But
I don't know how to explain myself on it. Maybe someone can
takeover from here and explain if I am onto something. And the
same is true if I am completely wrong. I don't mind learning
something new.<BR><BR><B><I>Donovan Arnold
<donovanjarnold2005@yahoo.com></I></B> wrote:</DIV>
<BLOCKQUOTE class=EC_EC_EC_replbq
style="PADDING-LEFT: 5px; MARGIN-LEFT: 5px; BORDER-LEFT: rgb(16,16,255) 2px solid">
<DIV>Joe,</DIV>
<DIV> </DIV>
<DIV>While I certainly am not a trained expert, I have had
extensive experience trying to find affordable housing in Moscow
and worked with many others also trying to afford decent housing.
</DIV>
<DIV> </DIV>
<DIV>When I was in the ASUI Senate, one of my living groups was
Family Housing. That caused me to investigate the
situation because of the frequent and prevailing
problems these families had trying to find adequate housing in the
Moscow region. </DIV>
<DIV> </DIV>
<DIV>I also worked with people with disabilities and could not by
law work more than a few hours each week or face losing their
medical care which was paramount for their survival. </DIV>
<DIV> </DIV>
<DIV>In my own personal quest for housing, I also had trouble
finding anything decent and affordable in Moscow. </DIV>
<DIV> </DIV>
<DIV>Here is why I think finding decent housing is unaffordable in
Moscow for many people;</DIV>
<DIV> </DIV>
<DIV>Income restriction. If a couple or two adults make more than
$24,000 gross, combined, they do not qualify for low income
housing. If they do, their rent is still usually about $500-$650 a
month plus utilities. So two people making $24,000, net
$20,000, must spend about $7000 on housing and utilities.
Giving them only $6500 a piece to live on for the whole year, not
a fun situation to be in! </DIV>
<DIV> </DIV>
<DIV>Another encroachment is the education exclusion for low
income housing. You cannot be a full time student at UI and
legally live in most low income housing units. Undergraduate
students taking more than 8 credits, or graduate students
taking more than 6 do not qualify for most of the low income
housing units in Moscow. Another person that doesn't qualify is a
student trying to get his or her GED. If they are taking classes
to get a GED, you cannot get into low income housing BECAUSE you
are full time student. </DIV>
<DIV> </DIV>
<DIV>Market rate based low income housing assistance is also
a problem in Moscow. That is where the federal government simply
discounts housing units by about 20% below the market rate. For
example, a housing unit that is a two bedroom, one bath unit on
the open market in Moscow would be about $625. So the rate is
reduced only to about $525 a month. Still unaffordable
because Moscow's housing market is so tight, you cannot get the
rate to be affordable for many Moscow residents. </DIV>
<DIV> </DIV>
<DIV>Next, you also have rent based rent. These units
are limited, hard to get into, and generally places you don't
want to live unless you have absolutely not other choice. </DIV>
<DIV>Unless you are on Section 8, which is hard to get into
and find a place, on want to live in a tiny cramped
noisy studio apartment, you are pretty much screwed
out of a decent affordable housing unit in Moscow.
</DIV>
<DIV> </DIV>
<DIV>I would also like to point out, that the problem with Moscow
housing is that there simply is not enough housing for the
population. Moscow has one of the highest per cap. unit in the
state, over 21,000 people for just 8,000
units. That drives the rent way up. </DIV>
<DIV> </DIV>
<DIV>The people, that I think have the hardest time, are those
that make between $18,000 and $24,000 a year. Because at that
rate, you don't qualify for any type of government assistance, not
housing, not food stamps,not medical care, and very
limited education assistance if any. $18,000-$24,000 is
not enough to pay for housing, food, medical care, transportation,
and other basic needs in Moscow when you have no assistance.
</DIV>
<DIV> </DIV>
<DIV> </DIV>
<DIV>Because of rules and restrictions on low income housing, many
low income housing units sit empty while many who need those
housing units are not allowed in.</DIV>
<DIV> </DIV>
<DIV>My suggestion would be to either change the rules so low
income housing units get filled up, or build so much housing that
the prices fall from competition. </DIV>
<DIV> </DIV>
<DIV>Best,</DIV>
<DIV> </DIV>
<DIV>Donovan</DIV>
<DIV> </DIV>
<DIV> </DIV>
<DIV> </DIV>
<DIV> </DIV>
<DIV> </DIV>
<DIV><BR><BR><B><I>Joe Campbell <joekc@adelphia.net></I></B>
wrote:</DIV>
<BLOCKQUOTE class=EC_EC_EC_replbq
style="PADDING-LEFT: 5px; MARGIN-LEFT: 5px; BORDER-LEFT: rgb(16,16,255) 2px solid">In
her recent letter to the editor, Shelley Bennett writes this
about development:<BR><BR>"... in order to get companies to
locate in Moscow, we also need affordable <BR>housing options
and support services that make living here affordable. The
<BR>actions of the current mayor and many members of the City
Council have <BR>done everything they can over the course of the
last few years to make sure <BR>we do not have affordable
housing options."<BR><BR>I don't know much about affordable
housing. What I do know, I learned from <BR>Aaron Ament, who is
a City Council member, and Bob Stout, who served <BR>longer on
City Council than Tom Lamar. Bob was in favor of affordable
housing, <BR>it was a key issue in his campaign two years ago.
Aaron, too, is in favor of <BR>affordable housing. I have little
reason to believe that Lamar, or Linda Paul, <BR>or Evan Holmes
would not be in favor of affordable housing.<BR><BR>I have two
questions.<BR><BR>Is what Bennett says true? Has the council
made affordable housing options worse?<BR><BR>Doesn't affordable
housing begin at the point of development? <BR><BR>I think so. I
think that the developer has a lot more control over costs
<BR>than any city council, especially if we're restricting
government in the way <BR>that Jeff thinks we should. The
difference in the cost of a single house with <BR>city fees vs.
without them is negligible, I imagine.<BR><BR>But maybe there is
something I'm missing.<BR><BR>Best,
Joe<BR><BR>=======================================================<BR>List
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<BR>mailto:Vision2020@moscow.com<BR>=======================================================<BR></BLOCKQUOTE><BR>
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& Liz Ivie
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