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<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2>This could well be the oddest post I have ever
responded to.</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2></FONT> </DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2>The disposition of the bet is clear. Mr. Hansen
knows it, Mr. Arnold knows it, the list in its majority knows it. Since you are
indicating a willingness to negotiate your own opinion on the matter, you must
know it as well. Did you truly imagine that I might have had any
strong feelings with regard to the wagers outcome? Really?</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2></FONT> </DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2></FONT> </DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2>g</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2></FONT> </DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2>----- Original Message ----- </FONT>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2>From: "Joe Campbell" <</FONT><A
href="mailto:joekc@adelphia.net"><FONT face=Arial
size=2>joekc@adelphia.net</FONT></A><FONT face=Arial size=2>></FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2>To: "g. crabtree" <</FONT><A
href="mailto:jampot@roadrunner.com"><FONT face=Arial
size=2>jampot@roadrunner.com</FONT></A><FONT face=Arial size=2>></FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2>Cc: "Donovan Arnold" <</FONT><A
href="mailto:donovanjarnold2005@yahoo.com"><FONT face=Arial
size=2>donovanjarnold2005@yahoo.com</FONT></A><FONT face=Arial size=2>>;
<</FONT><A href="mailto:vision2020@moscow.com"><FONT face=Arial
size=2>vision2020@moscow.com</FONT></A><FONT face=Arial size=2>></FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2>Sent: Friday, October 26, 2007 6:27 PM</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2>Subject: Re: [Vision2020] Sub-minimum
wage</FONT></DIV></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial><BR><FONT size=2></FONT></FONT></DIV><FONT face=Arial
size=2>I responded to Donovan but neglected to hit 'reply all' so it is stuck in
his mailbox.<BR><BR>The main point of that post concerns your quote:<BR><BR>"To
belittle is to insult no matter how you slice it." -- Gary Crabtree<BR><BR>I
think you're forced with a dilemma. Either you admit that the GMA is the party
of hate <BR>or you admit that Donovan did not win the bet.<BR><BR>If, as you
suggest, belittling is insulting, then you insult people regularly. In every one
of <BR>your posts you belittle. At least this much is true: In every one of your
posts to me, you <BR>belittle me. Even in this post, where you're
nice-on-the-whole, you throw in a 'Mr. <BR>Campbell.' I've told you on a number
of occasions that I don’t like that label yet you <BR>persist. Maybe I'm soft
and 'Mr. Campbell' isn't an insult. But there is no question that <BR>you
belittle me by calling me 'Mr. Campbell' and by your general comments about my
<BR>job as a philosopher -- which is really a criticism of the academy as a
whole. If making <BR>fun of someone's name and someone’s job is not belittling,
I'm not sure what is.<BR><BR>If belittling is insulting, then you insult on an
everyday basis. Given that you accept the <BR>quote above, you seem to think
insulting is fine, acceptable behavior. And so do the other <BR>GMA candidates
and members. None of them have mentioned that insulting my job, <BR>calling me
by a name that I don't like is insulting and beyond bounds. Thus, the GMA
<BR>thinks that it is fine to insult people as long as they don't share their
political views. <BR><BR>This is just the politics of hate. If what you say
above is correct, then the GMA endorses <BR>the politics of hate -- the politics
of Wilson, etc.<BR><BR>The choice is yours. Either what Hansen says was an
insult, because it was belittling, and <BR>Donovan wins the bet AND the GMA
practices the politics of hate. Or what you said <BR>was wrong, belittling is
not insulting, and Donovan has not yet won the bet.<BR><BR>The choice is
yours.<BR><BR>Best, Joe<BR><BR>---- "g. crabtree" <</FONT><A
href="mailto:jampot@roadrunner.com"><FONT face=Arial
size=2>jampot@roadrunner.com</FONT></A><FONT face=Arial size=2>> wrote:
<BR><BR>=============<BR>But someone as rude and insulting as Mr. Campbell does?
I guess there's no standard like a double standard.<BR><BR>But enough of this
fractious back and forth, in the spirit of reasoned discourse as exemplified by
Mr. Harkins and Mr. Livingston, I suggest that we abandon searching for
differences and identify the small areas where our thoughts overlap. It appears
that at the very least we are in agreement that the post that kicked off this
"discussion" did contain a gratuitous insult to Mr. Arnold. From such an
insignificant seed may future understanding blossom!<BR><BR>g<BR>----- Original
Message ----- <BR>From: "Joe Campbell" <</FONT><A
href="mailto:joekc@adelphia.net"><FONT face=Arial
size=2>joekc@adelphia.net</FONT></A><FONT face=Arial size=2>><BR>To: "Donovan
Arnold" <</FONT><A href="mailto:donovanjarnold2005@yahoo.com"><FONT
face=Arial size=2>donovanjarnold2005@yahoo.com</FONT></A><FONT face=Arial
size=2>><BR>Cc: <</FONT><A href="mailto:vision2020@moscow.com"><FONT
face=Arial size=2>vision2020@moscow.com</FONT></A><FONT face=Arial
size=2>><BR>Sent: Thursday, October 25, 2007 11:29 PM<BR>Subject: Re:
[Vision2020] Sub-minimum wage<BR><BR><BR>> Someone who is as rude and
insulting as Crabtree has no right lecturing <BR>> others. That was the
point.<BR>> <BR>> --<BR>> Joe Campbell<BR>> <BR>> "To belittle is
to insult no matter how you slice it." -- Gary Crabtree<BR>> <BR>> ----
Donovan Arnold <</FONT><A href="mailto:donovanjarnold2005@yahoo.com"><FONT
face=Arial size=2>donovanjarnold2005@yahoo.com</FONT></A><FONT face=Arial
size=2>> wrote: <BR>> <BR>> =============<BR>>
Joe,<BR>> <BR>> I think you are missing Gary's point.
Hansen made an bet he would not insult people anymore. Gary never made that
agreement. <BR>> <BR>> Best,<BR>>
<BR>> Donovan<BR>> <BR>> Joe Campbell
<</FONT><A href="mailto:joekc@adelphia.net"><FONT face=Arial
size=2>joekc@adelphia.net</FONT></A><FONT face=Arial size=2>>
wrote:<BR>> I just love how Crabtree is so quick to note insults coming
from his opponents <BR>> but so blind when he delivers them himself!<BR>>
<BR>> The constant application of such double-standards and lack of
self-awareness <BR>> from the NSA/CC/GMA crowd makes me sick.<BR>>
<BR>> Joe Campbell<BR>> <BR>> ------------------------------ <BR>>
<BR>> Message: 2 <BR>> Date: Thu, 25 Oct 2007 07:32:44 -0700 <BR>>
From: "g. crabtree" <BR>> Subject: Re: [Vision2020] Sub-minimum wage <BR>>
To: "Tom Hansen" , , <BR>> "'Donovan Arnold'" <BR>> Message-ID:
<</FONT><A href="mailto:03a901c81713$e8b8c5e0$6401a8c0@gmc"><FONT face=Arial
size=2>03a901c81713$e8b8c5e0$6401a8c0@gmc</FONT></A><FONT face=Arial size=2>>
<BR>> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" <BR>> <BR>> Wiggle
& squirm. An insult doesn't have <BR>> to be something as blatant as
"Gary, you <BR>> ignorant slut..." To belittle is to insult <BR>> no
matter how you slice it. Don't worry, <BR>> I don't think that anyone reading
this <BR>> will be surprised by your evasion. The <BR>> surprise would
have been had you not. <BR>> <BR>> g <BR>> <BR>>
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